Random EV thoughts.....

unkel

Proper real world test

All cars were pretty much brand new, except the Tesla Model X and Model S, they used older cars with smaller & degraded batteries. Interestingly, if they had used all 2020 / 2021 cars, then the only cars that would have made it home with no charging at all would have been the Tesla Model S and Model 3, possibly even the Model X too

B!gD0g543

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

Phew grant should be €0

but at least it's being cut for the Range Rover's, because Range Rover buyers really needed that €5k knocked off the asking price...

I think you could actually say the same for every Tesla vehicle!

cannco253

Dartz launches Freze Nikrob as "cheapest EV in the EU"

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/dartz-launches-freze-nikrob-cheapest-ev-eu

"A base-model price of €9999 (£8668) makes the Nikrob around €2500 cheaper than the new Dacia Spring Electric, which was also claimed to be the cheapest electric car on sale in Europe."

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.bloombergquint.com/business/ford-vw-battery-supplier-said-to-reach-deal-to-avoid-import-ban

I'd say there's a lot of relieved people in Ford and VW at the moment

unkel

the_amazing_raisin wrote: »

https://www.bloombergquint.com/business/ford-vw-battery-supplier-said-to-reach-deal-to-avoid-import-ban

I'd say there's a lot of relieved people in Ford and VW at the moment

I wonder what POTUS threatened them with

the_amazing_raisin

unkel wrote: »

I wonder what POTUS threatened them with

Probably told them he'd pull all the American troops out of South Korea if SKI pulled out of Georgia

It was a fairly ridiculous one to begin with, companies poach knowledgeable people from each other all the time. Only difference here was that SK were fairly blatant about it and got caught. They were likely always going to settle, but I think LG were stringing it along for all it was worth

I'd say VW's recent power day played into both company's thinking as well. Apparently VW execs weren't too happy about two of their suppliers playing silly buggers and didn't consult them about their whole standard battery cell thing

When VW said they were building 6 battery plants in Europe to supply their EVs, and specifically mentioned Northvolt as partners without mentioning SK or LG, then I imagine people got nervous in both the Korean companies and they decided to go for a settlement quickly

Maybe I'm reading too much between the lines, but the order of events was interesting

liamog

Maybe LG just won the contract for the US Post new electric fleet.

liamog

Probably the ID.5 announcing soon

https://twitter.com/volkswagen/status/1381607494015934469

ELM327

Is that the remade VW bus?

liamog

It's the coupe version of the ID.4

cannco253

Could be the ID.6

https://www.autoevolution.com/news/2022-volkswagen-id6-family-sized-crossover-teased-seats-7-people-159113.html

slave1

Isn't great for us early adopters to see what's available nowadays, they were always a year or two away and now we're in the thick of it

Black_Knight

slave1 wrote: »

Isn't great for us early adopters to see what's available nowadays, they were always a year or two away and now we're in the thick of it

There's always something better a year or 2 away. I enjoyed my ioniq while I had it, delighted I made the switch when I did. The opportunity to get an ID.4 came my way, so I took it. So far it suits us perfectly, so it'll be many years before we change it. ID.5, or 6 or Buzz don't interest me.

Getting tired of the S already?

the_amazing_raisin

slave1 wrote: »

Isn't great for us early adopters to see what's available nowadays, they were always a year or two away and now we're in the thick of it

It does feel like there's a tsunami of new EVs coming out in the next 12 months.


Great for consumer choice, as long as you like compacts SUVs :rolleyes:

slave1

Black_Knight wrote: »

There's always something better a year or 2 away. I enjoyed my ioniq while I had it, delighted I made the switch when I did. The opportunity to get an ID.4 came my way, so I took it. So far it suits us perfectly, so it'll be many years before we change it. ID.5, or 6 or Buzz don't interest me.

Getting tired of the S already?

Perhaps getting tired of the Leaf but hard to argue with a car in perfect nick and perfectly suited for the trips around the town, basically PV powered nowadays also.
Nope, not tiring of the S, not getting an opportunity do drive it much but that's out of my hands

the_amazing_raisin

slave1 wrote: »

Perhaps getting tired of the Leaf but hard to argue with a car in perfect nick and perfectly suited for the trips around the town, basically PV powered nowadays also.
Nope, not tiring of the S, not getting an opportunity do drive it much but that's out of my hands

Yeah my wife is taking my Leaf on a temporary basis when I get my ID.4


The plan is that she's going to save for a newer car for herself and then we'll sell the Leaf


I'm hoping she'll get an EV for her next car as frankly she doesn't drive very far and can use the ID.4 for the odd time she travels long distance


Something like an E-Up or Dacia Spring EV or a Zoe would suit her fine, but frankly it's hard to justify the expense of a new car when there's nothing wrong with the Leaf and it's got enough range and space for her needs

unkel

Go on lads, you need something newer for your better halves. I'll buy the Leaf off ya for €2k

(only half joking - my eldest is nearly 17 and we need something for her and her younger siblings to learn to drive in)

serox_21

this is a even smaller car (I think 2 seats) with only 13Kwh battery. really a joke for 10k price.

unkel

+1

That's a cheap re-badged Chinese EV, costing just GBP3k in the home market. Unless it's officially classified as a quadricycle like those cheap slow toy cars popular in France as they can be driven by 14 year olds and people with driving disqualifications, I can't see it being road legal either

AndyBoBandy

unkel wrote: »

(only half joking - my eldest is nearly 17 and we need something for her and her younger siblings to learn to drive in)

I'm still 11 years off my son driving, but have come to the conclusion that he'll be learning to drive in an automatic EV..

for some reason I always had notions of wanting him to learn like me (and probably all of us), in a car with a manual gearbox.... whereas now, in reality I know he won't even be learning in a car with an ICE....

unkel

This is it, mine have no interest in classic cars and even today you can pick up a very cheap EV that costs half nothing to own (no more than a €100 petrol or diesel banger), so there is very little reason not to just learn to drive in an automatic. And plenty of benefits as it is so much easier if you don't have to get into the whole gears and clutch thing that 20th centuries cars had

ELM327

You can now get a cheap leaf for 4k. In a couple of years this will be sub 2k. Same for a Zoe (but they have battery lease or a price premium).
A leaf 24 is a perfect car for a teenager to learn in. No power, no range LOL

unkel

ELM327 wrote: »

A leaf 24 is a perfect car for a teenager to learn in. No power, no range LOL

Plenty power, away from the lights quicker than a boy racer in his TDI / 520d

But yeah, perfect learner car, cheap to buy, cheap to own and fuel, little to zero to go wrong and maintain and relatively cheap in insurance and also a good size. Not too small, but also not huge and very powerful like my Model S (I won't even ask my insurer for a quote with her as a learner added)

the_amazing_raisin

Just watched Bjorn's 1000km challenge with the ID.3 77kWh version

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPE8CPmC96s

Final time was 10:20, 25 mins slower than the Model 3 Performance on the same route with similar weather

It's an interesting result I think because the Model 3's peak charging power is much higher (200kW I think?) and is more efficient, but for all that it was only 25 mins faster

I think it shows that if there's a decent HPC network to back it up, then there are alternatives to Tesla for travelling long distances in an EV

unkel

Pretty decent time. A bit slower than Model 3 LR AWD would be in similar circumstances and only a slightly cheaper EV. Also a 4 seater only. I don't feel the higher end VW ID.3 cars are good value for money. The lower end ones sure are if you can live with the poor spec.

the_amazing_raisin

unkel wrote: »

Pretty decent time. A bit slower than Model 3 LR AWD would be in similar circumstances and only a slightly cheaper EV. Also a 4 seater only. I don't feel the higher end VW ID.3 cars are good value for money. The lower end ones sure are if you can live with the poor spec.

Yeah the ID.3 definitely needs an upgrade on the interior. There's a 5 seater version coming soon, and VW's CEO has said he wants to update the interior


But, if you need the range and don't have Tesla money, then it's probably the only option


I could see it being popular as a company vehicle for mobile workers

unkel

the_amazing_raisin wrote: »

But, if you need the range and don't have Tesla money, then it's probably the only option

But that's my point, I don't know about the prices here, but the Norway prices in Nyland's spreadsheet show the ID.3 77kWh (422k NOK) to be only slightly cheaper than the Tesla Model 3 LR AWD (450k NOK)

The Tesla is a full size bigger and a lot more car for the money. Performance, AWD, SuC network, it's on a different planet. If the VW was 300k, then sure it's a lot cheaper. But it isn't.

Silent Running

unkel wrote: »

Pretty decent time. A bit slower than Model 3 LR AWD would be in similar circumstances and only a slightly cheaper EV. Also a 4 seater only. I don't feel the higher end VW ID.3 cars are good value for money. The lower end ones sure are if you can live with the poor spec.

Slightly cheaper?

The LR model 3 with metallic and alloys is over €61K.
The ID.3 Tour with Metallic and alloys is €41.

Only if you're one of the 1% is that slightly cheaper.

I don't feel that the Tesla would be good value for money, but I'm not in love with Elon, so there's that.

unkel

I'm only going by Nyland's spreadsheet with Norwegian prices. So here they are €41k and €61k? On the road? Then yeah, obviously that's a lot cheaper and the_amazing_raisin's point stands!

ELM327

That's some delta, 20k!