Random EV thoughts.....

MightyMunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118223137#Comment_118223137

I think there's way too much emphasis on the charging network from non EV drivers. People are used to having to refuel their cars on the road all the time. Home charging removes that requirement for over 90% of trips for most people. And the supercharging network is coming along nicely for.longer trips 😉

innrain

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118223681#Comment_118223681

It is for efficiency. There are ways of changing that. Tesla aero are removable covers for example.

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118223681#Comment_118223681

You mean every new car right? 😜

Most popular selling cars for the past few years have been mid size SUVs, Nissan quashqai, Hyundai Tucson, Kia Sportage and VW Tiguan all top the lists of cars sold

Since EVs are new to most brand, they're focusing on the most popular and profitable segments where they know they'll sell

As for the chunky wheels, I guess that's just a way of upselling people to a more expensive car

zg3409

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118223689#Comment_118223689

As an EV driver I need to use the public charging network from time to time. West Dublin is a disaster with queues at all 50kW+ chargers on a Sunday morning. One charger had 4 cars, one charging. Now Blanchardstown was out if action for weeks due to upgrades, but even then all chargers near Dublin airport at full all day with new EV Taxis filling up. As an EV owner I advise others to not buy an EV until public charging improves and there is no sign of that happening as ratio of chargers to cars is getting worse. We need 3 times as many 50kW+ chargers now, far more for the needs of future years. NI is a total disaster with 50kW chargers broken for years, some no CCS. Having to queue for an unknown amount of time, while the car charging is unoccupied, takes the shine off your day and car type decision.

cannco253

https://twitter.com/OspreyCharging/status/1464248216195682307

So canopies for the units not for the users? It's a start I suppose, maybe eCar could consider it...in about 10 years time....

JohnC.

Those look hilariously useless. They won’t even do anything for the units, never mind the users.

liamog

Having faffed about with a charger in the rain, even this small cover will help. We just need to make sure it never rains and is windy on the same day!

NIMAN

Anyone on here got 2 EV/PHEV in the household?

Wondering how you handle charging?

Do you have 2 chargers? Or do they share a charger?

slave1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118234306#Comment_118234306

Yep, 2 EV for a few years, have single charger and external 3pin socket. Thought was, the 3pin could be used if charger in use, turns out we’ve never once had a clash, just a quick chat as to what car needs charging is all.

zg3409

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118234306#Comment_118234306

You can load share 2 chargers, if you set timers right one car will get priority. Actual suitability depends on cars and miles covered per day. You won't get the grant for second charger so most granny charge second car will less needs. If you have night rate you need to set timers in car and granny charging only puts in about 2kW per hour, so you may get limited energy overnight.

NIMAN

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118235164#Comment_118235164

Yeah thats what I was thinking. If you have 2 cars and you charge overnight to avail of the cheap rate, you can't charge both during the night.

kanuseeme

I seen a charger bollard on adverts that has 2 sockets , only 3.6 kw each, but it would allow 32 kWh into each car @ night rate electricity prices.

slave1

If you are dropping to 16amp charging you really have to question that, you are losing 7.4kW into one car which you need to think about. Remember you can get 2.2kW from a 3pin socket, is the gain to 3.6kW really worth it at the sacrifice of losing 7.4kW charging capability?

zg3409

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118238181#Comment_118238181

Many cars have the option to lower charging speed so you could lower the speed on the one which needs less charge. With load sharing the car that starts first will get maximum power, the car that starts second will get what's left, so by timing start times you can ensure one car will get priority.

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118234306#Comment_118234306

We've had 2 EVs for a number of years now, it's pretty rare that we ever use a full battery on both cars in one day, and when we do it's even more unlikely that both cars will need a full charge the next day. With that in mind we just have one charger and a coiled cable that can reach both cars. Majority of the time we only need to plug in one car, sometimes we'll put one on for a short while before switching to make sure we're covered. Majority of the charging therefore happens during night rate, but I'm not going to grumble if every so often we spend an extra €1 to make sure a day is covered.

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118234306#Comment_118234306

2 EVs here (Leaf & ID.4) with 2 chargers, EO Mini & Zappi

Setup is that they share a 40A breaker and the Zappi monitors the load on that circuit using a CT clamp

Zappi has a 32A limit set and the Leaf only charges at 16A. So if both cars are charging the Zappi will reduce to 16A to stay within the limit.

At other times the Zappi will run up to 32A if available

FYI, the latest EO Mini has load sharing capability via the addon ALM module. Mine is the older version which doesn't support that and the original plan had been to replace the Leaf and EO Mini with the ID.4 and Zappi. Then we kept the Leaf and needed 2 chargers

Also to be fair, the number of instances where we needed to charge both cars has so far been 2 times. Other times we've only needed to charge 1 at a time. We'll see what winter brings with more potential consumption and more charging needed

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118238733#Comment_118238733

Who did that setup for you and how much did it cost?

When we move house I intend to have 2 EVs (and possibly move my van to EV in future) so would like that sort of setup

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118239162#Comment_118239162

I bought the chargers myself, so just got an electrician to install it. I'd recommend the crowd who did the Zappi addition, will PM details.

I already had the EO Mini with the isolator, so the labour cost of adding the Zappi was only 3 hours, €135

Can't remember how much the original install was, but it pretty much used up the €600 grant. Had to come 12 metres from the CU as taking from the meter box wasn't allowed at the time. Hopefully you can take from the meter and it'll be much simpler and cheaper

Here's some pictures of the setup

You can see the CT clamp in the last picture around the live input to both chargers (bit tricky with the wires bundled up but you get the idea)

That CT is wired back to CT2 input on the Zappi which is set with a 32A limit

It's worth saying that if you got 2 Zappis then they can use their internal CTs to monitor current and you won't need the external CT

I think EO and Wallbox can also do the same, but they might need addon modules. Possibly still cheaper than a Zappi though, they're not exactly cheap

ELM327

Thanks for the details and photos. That's exactly the sort of thing I had in mind.

We likely wont be moved till Jan/Feb at this stage but I havent claimed the grant on her Ioniq or (obviously) at the new place, so I will get the EO mini with the grant and then buy the Zappi and get the installer to put in a similar setup - unless of course software enhancements render it moot in the interim.

Good to see experience of someone who has 2 EVs and 2 chargers. We live in rural meath and are moving to another address in rural meath, where every "nip to the shops" is a 30km+ round trip. We'll need 2 chargers if we are to move to 2+ EVs.

Reading your comment, I think two Zappi would be the best setup but would have to price it. Seems to be between 800-1k per charger net of the grant.

V2 Zappi 7kW Tethered EV Charger – Solar2Power

Zappi Tethered EV Charger - Voltaic Energy Systems

the_amazing_raisin

Yeah they're not cheap unfortunately, I got mine direct from MyEnergi before Brexit happened so might have saved a few euros there. Still cost the guts of €1k

I also got the hub and a Harvi which added some cost. I'd recommend getting the hub as it allows you to update the firmware easily. Mine needed a firmware update to get the load balancing working properly

If you EO is new enough, it might be able to work with their load management module. Mine is from early 2018 and predates that feature, so it didn't have the wiring ports for the load balancer. It might be a cheaper option than the Zappi if going untethered. I wanted a tethered charger and the Zappi has much nicer cable management IMO

slave1

If you are looking at Zappi then I assume you are looking at solar, could be an idea to wait until doing your final solar bartering and get the Charge Point install "thrown in"

ELM327

Yes solar would also be on the roadmap too.

Would love to have two tethered chargers at home, solar and storage so that we're load balancing and only consuming night time electricity to charge the car/s.

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118239988#Comment_118239988

That's the dream alright, throw in V2G from the cars to keep you going on cloudy days

KCross

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118239744#Comment_118239744

That's exactly the sort of thing I had in mind.

I didnt think you'd want an overall limit of 32A. On another thread you were discussing having 11kW and increasing fuses etc. amazing_raisin's setup is two charge points but limited to a max of 32A between the two.

I would have expected that your ideal is to have two load sensing charge points and set the grid limit, not the charge point limit, and then you can theoretically charge both cars at 32A each, assuming your main fuse is 80A+.

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118240979#Comment_118240979

Not sure I'd go right to 64A, might not be much to spare for the house and that fuse has to be replaced by the ESB, it can't just be reset

But yes, if you're taking the cable from the meter box then you could just take 2 cables each wjtb a dedicated breaker

You could do a similar setup to mine and have 2 Zappis witb a group limit, or have a Zappi monitoring the other charger. You could configure the group limit to something like 50A, so you'll still get around 4kW even if the other charger is pulling the full 7kW, and still have plenty leftover for the house

With 2 Zappis they have more advanced options for load balancing, they can divide the available power equally or one can be given priority over the other to give a guaranteed amount of power to one

KCross

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118242088#Comment_118242088

Not sure I'd go right to 64A, might not be much to spare for the house and that fuse has to be replaced by the ESB, it can't just be reset

Thats why I said "assuming your main fuse is 80A+". That would be enough to have both charging at full tilt with enugh to spare for background house load.

If you only have a normal supply and a 60A fuse then, yes, you'd grid limit to 60A but the concept is the same in any case as the load sensing charge points will reduce to whatever level is required to protect the fuse, whatever rating it has. i.e. I'd advocate for using the grid limit, not the group limit.

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118242104#Comment_118242104

I still wouldn't go to the fuse limit personally, AFAIK those are quick blow fuses so they won't tolerate going over the limit for a few seconds. And it takes a few seconds for the load balancing to kick in and reduce current

16A leftover could be pushed over the edge by immersion or power shower. Better to leave a gap so that as the power from the house ramps up the load balancing has a chance to reduce the charging speed without going over the fuse limit

graememk

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118242171#Comment_118242171

Don't you have a fuse/mcb after the main esb fuse?

It will be at least a b curve mcb which only instantly trips at 3-5 times the rated current, c type is 5-10 times

They can handle more than the rated load for a while, plenty of time for the zappi to throttle back.

KCross

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118242171#Comment_118242171

I think you are missing my point. Based on what ELM has said on other threads I think he should be looking at a setup that involves using the grid limit not your setup which uses a group limit.

And the fuses will easily handle a few seconds at their rating, no problem, and you can of course set the grid limit to a few amps below the rating to give buffer... which they do recommend, so no argument with you there.

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118240979#Comment_118240979

Yes it's more the setup I was talking about rather than the specific limit.

I think what I will end up doing is getting a load balanced setup like the above, as well as expand my fuse to 80 from the normal 60. That would allow 2*32a chargers with 16a left for the house and the ability to automatically reduce charging speed if the house demand exceeds 16a