Doubling of Stockholm murder rate attributed immigration

Timberrrrrrrr

Blueshoe wrote: »

Nothing is free. There is no such thing as government money. It is all tax payers money. And I don't recall anyone asking the taxpayer if they wanted their hard earned spent looking after people who come from Africa or the middle East.

There are plenty of issues facing tax contributing people that require funding. No shortage of issues

Nobody asks if you would like your tax spent on

*Smokers
*Alcoholics
*Drug Addicts
*Obese people

Yet billions gets spent treating people for these lifestyle choices (yes i know not all obese people choose to be obese).

You don't get to choose where tax money gets spent.

Blueshoe

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Nobody asks if you would like your tax spent on

*Smokers
*Alcoholics
*Drug Addicts
*Obese people

Yet billions gets spent treating people for these lifestyle choices (yes i know not all obese people choose to be obese).

You don't get to choose where tax money gets spent.

Are you saying that

Smokers
Alcoholics
Drug addicts
Obese people

Are not taxpayers? Or Irish?

Wouldn't they be part of the issues we have in Ireland that tax payers money should be put to?

Timberrrrrrrr

Blueshoe wrote: »

Are you saying that

Smokers
Alcoholics
Drug addicts
Obese people

Are not taxpayers? Or Irish?

Wouldn't they be part of the issues we have in Ireland that tax payers money should be put to?

You're saying all of them are?

MrFresh

Richard Hillman wrote: »

It could do. You shut down immigration from non assimilated regions and make it more accessible to nations that can assimilate.

You said Europe has gone for Afghans, Somali's, Eritreans, North Africans. Are you claiming that is what is happening or are you just flinging nonsense and hoping some dope will believe it?

Richard Hillman

Richard Hillman wrote: »

Then you have Chinese, South East Asians, Filipinos that would like to come to Europe. They have excellent form in emigrating and becoming functional members of society. There are Russians, Ukrainians, Belarusians who would be delighted to come into the EU to work regular jobs.

So why on earth has Europe gone for Afghans, Somali's, Eritreans, North Africans etc? What f**king planet were they on when they thought that would work, when there were much superior candidates from culturally compatible nations?

It makes no sense. Absolutely zero.

What are you talking about? It's not like Bord Failte are touting for business in Northern Africa when they should be looking for migrants from 'good' countries. That's before we even get into the absurd claim that Chinese people are great at adapting to the host countries' norms and cultures. They are notorious for setting up their own ghettos and running their own black market, prostitution rings, trafficking in practically every city they've ever had a major presence in.

You help the poor and the needy, you don't say "well actually, some of your countrymen are scumbags so we're not taking you in". Undocumented mass immigration is not the answer. But neither is picking and choosing people like you're going through an Argos catalogue.

Migrants should be screened and vetted, provided with enough basic needs to survive until they can return to their own country and the point earlier about zero tolerance of criminal behaviour is a very valid one. Any sign of criminal activity and you're out the door, no exceptions.

meeeeh

MrFresh wrote: »

You said Europe has gone for Afghans, Somali's, Eritreans, North Africans. Are you claiming that is what is happening or are you just flinging nonsense and hoping some dope will believe it?

That post was actually so stupid I just thought to myself don't bother.

1123heavy

meeeeh wrote: »

That post was actually so stupid I just thought to myself don't bother.

He's anti muslim and doing everything he can to show he is without actually saying it directly. That explains it

Richard Hillman

MrFresh wrote: »

You said Europe has gone for Afghans, Somali's, Eritreans, North Africans. Are you claiming that is what is happening or are you just flinging nonsense and hoping some dope will believe it?

It is widely believed that allowing so much migration from the 3rd World was to address the birth rate and alleviate the pension issue. What I am saying is that if this is the case, why did they turn to countries who have horrendous records of integration and not just turned to the Americas and Eastern Asian, who would settle in a lot more easily.

What has essentially happened was that countries opened their doors without consultation to the public and instead of aleviating the pension issue, they have made it worse. Europe now has millions of first generation immigrants from the 3rd World, who I presume the vast majority of them want to work but nobody wants to hire them. Whereas if they had opened up legal migration from the Americas and the Far East, Europe would have ended up with people who employers would have been more likely to employ and would have addressed the birth rate.

If a Mexican or an Eritrean rocks up at a cleaning company in Sweden, no experience, very little Swedish, 99 times out of 100 the employer goes for the Mexican. They know full well that the Mexican has a better shot and settling into the work place better.

This whole thing has been the greatest misjudgement of public sentiment in the history of our planet.

Richard Hillman

1123heavy wrote: »

He's anti muslim and doing everything he can to show he is without actually saying it directly. That explains it

I would descriminate against a lot of Christian countries too. Sierra Leone, Liberia, Zimbabwe, Mozambique etc. Whilst I would be open to having Muslim majority countries like Azerbaijan, Lebanon, UAE, Qatar, Bahrain.

meeeeh

Richard Hillman wrote: »

If a Mexican or an Eritrean rocks up at a cleaning company in Sweden, no experience, very little Swedish, 99 times out of 100 the employer goes for the Mexican. They know full well that the Mexican has a better shot and settling into the work place better.

This whole thing has been the greatest misjudgement of public sentiment in the history of our planet.

Any research to support that?

1123heavy

Richard Hillman wrote: »

It is widely believed that allowing so much migration from the 3rd World was to address the birth rate and alleviate the pension issue. What I am saying is that if this is the case, why did they turn to countries who have horrendous records of integration and not just turned to the Americas and Eastern Asian, who would settle in a lot more easily.

This still baffles me. Who "turned to" what countries? It is not how immigration works, not even close. You imply our ministers went to The Congo, Nigeria etc and said 'look, we need some immigrants, any recommendations?' - it would be laughable if it weren't so sad.

I know many north africans who came to Ireland during the 70s and 80s and have been here ever since. They constitute a large portion of some of the first north africans to arrive on Irish shores. However they were sent to study aircraft engineering with Aer Lingus, whatever happened with the course i don't know, their home airlines cancelled on them and they had made their lives here already, met local women and what have ye. They're now in their 60s+ and each doing their own thing.

Immigration takes many forms and the stories are far and wide, however i have never for the life of me heard of our government going to Africa and asking for immigrants.

Ted Johnson

Anyone want to tell me what these migrants bring to Europe, apart from crime, terrorism and social problems?

If you're going to say 'they do the jobs the natives won't' then give list of these jobs please.

You don't pick and choose who turns up at your border seeking asylum. That's not how it works, have you taken leave of your senses or what? To use your analogy from a few posts back, how many Mexicans are fleeing their country compared to Eritreans?

Ulysses Gaze

Ted Johnson wrote: »

Anyone want to tell me what these migrants bring to Europe, apart from crime, terrorism and social problems?

If you're going to say 'they do the jobs the natives won't' then give list of these jobs please.

They are here to pay for our pensions. Apparently.

meeeeh

Ted Johnson wrote: »

Anyone want to tell me what these migrants bring to Europe, apart from crime, terrorism and social problems?

If you're going to say 'they do the jobs the natives won't' then give list of these jobs please.

I came accross quite a few Pakistani doctors but I have absolutely no intention to try to explain to you why you can't make blanket statements about any nationality. Especially as Irish person with the discrimination Irish experienced.

MrFresh

Richard Hillman wrote: »

It is widely believed that allowing so much migration from the 3rd World was to address the birth rate and alleviate the pension issue. What I am saying is that if this is the case, why did they turn to countries who have horrendous records of integration and not just turned to the Americas and Eastern Asian, who would settle in a lot more easily.

What has essentially happened was that countries opened their doors without consultation to the public and instead of aleviating the pension issue, they have made it worse. Europe now has millions of first generation immigrants from the 3rd World, who I presume the vast majority of them want to work but nobody wants to hire them. Whereas if they had opened up legal migration from the Americas and the Far East, Europe would have ended up with people who employers would have been more likely to employ and would have addressed the birth rate.

If a Mexican or an Eritrean rocks up at a cleaning company in Sweden, no experience, very little Swedish, 99 times out of 100 the employer goes for the Mexican. They know full well that the Mexican has a better shot and settling into the work place better.

This whole thing has been the greatest misjudgement of public sentiment in the history of our planet.

You said it was the case, not if it was the case. You're saying there is some kind of government conspiracy to import immigrants from countries where they are what, more fertile, more sexually active? I'm sure it is widely believed, so are flat earth theory and anti vax claims.

Kivaro

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

They are here to pay for our pensions. Apparently.

With almost 60% of Africans in Ireland not working then we need to look at a Plan B.

Boxing.Fan

Kivaro wrote: »

With almost 60% of Africans in Ireland not working then we need to look at a Plan B.

Is this a fact?

Ted Johnson

meeeeh wrote: »

I came accross quite a few Pakistani doctors but I have absolutely no intention to try to explain to you why you can't make blanket statements about any nationality. Especially as Irish person with the discrimination Irish experienced.

And the boys who wash up in Italy? Our come in through Greece? What are they bringing to the party?

And nice try with the "you're Irish' line. Gave me a laugh.

Cordell

meeeeh wrote: »

I came accross quite a few Pakistani doctors but I have absolutely no intention to try to explain to you why you can't make blanket statements about any nationality. Especially as Irish person with the discrimination Irish experienced.

Well, that's interesting, I also know some highly skilled ones, not doctors but engineers (yes, that doctors and engineer tripe has some truth to it). They came here legally with a heap of paperwork required to be able to work (and practice medicine if they are doctors). But, when some other Pakistanis seek asylum, they are fleeing persecution. What is is, they persecute only low skilled people over there? Or should we call them all what they actually are, economic migrants? Since when honesty became such a problem?

1123heavy

Ted Johnson wrote: »

And the boys who wash up in Italy? Our come in through Greece? What are they bringing to the party?

And nice try with the "you're Irish' line. Gave me a laugh.

I'm willing to bet a significant number of immigrants to Ireland have contributed more to society than you could ever wish to. Go to any hospital and see where a number of the top surgeons and specialists (who may one day save your life) have come from. What they pay in tax alone is more than what most home grown Irish people likely earn in salary.

You asked what immigrants have done for Ireland, you were given your answer.

Why are you now trying to divert attention to Italy and Greece?

4068ac1elhodqr

meeeeh wrote: »

I came accross quite a few Pakistani doctors but I have absolutely no intention to try to explain to you why you can't make blanket statements about any nationality.

Agree, but you still study statistics, many of which highlight current trends, and potential problems, that need addressing. That's the whole point of information and data/stats, to help prevent and solve issues.

From the artice:https://www.thejournal.ie/sweden-shootings-gangs-increase-4711474-Jul2019/

In Stockholm the first six months of the year have seen as many killings as the whole of 2018.... The most badly affected areas are the capital Stockholm, and Malmo and Gothenburg, but violence has also started to spread to medium-sized cities...... Most of the shooters and victims are unemployed young men with immigrant backgrounds, under 30 years of age, living in disadvantaged neighbourhoods and often without a high school diploma... struggling with the language (Swedish)...

Btw, the occasional Pakistani Doctor that you may have come across is rarely a females (often discouraged from entering higher education). It also raises seperate issues with brain drain, and resource loss, from where they might be needed the most, for their own personal gain.

Blueshoe

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

They are here to pay for our pensions. Apparently.

What about the stat that shows 60% of Nigerians here are unemployed? We are paying them. Lol. What a country

Blueshoe

1123heavy wrote: »

I'm willing to bet a significant number of immigrants to Ireland have contributed more to society than you could ever wish to. Go to any hospital and see where a number of the top surgeons and specialists (who may one day save your life) have come from. What they pay in tax alone is more than what most home grown Irish people likely earn in salary.

You asked what immigrants have done for Ireland, you were given your answer.

Why are you now trying to divert attention to Italy and Greece?

All migrants are top level surgeons!! Stop the lights

Boxing.Fan

Blueshoe wrote: »

What about the stat that shows 60% of Nigerians here are unemployed? We are paying them. Lol. What a country

Is there a link where I can view the statistics on that, i dont doubt but I'd like to see it in black and white.

Blueshoe

Boxing.Fan wrote: »

Is there a link where I can view the statistics on that, i dont doubt but I'd like to see it in black and white.

Can't link a pdf.

Google UCD.ie working papers African unemployed

meeeeh

Cordell wrote: »

Well, that's interesting, I also know some highly skilled ones, not doctors but engineers (yes, that doctors and engineer tripe has some truth to it). They came here legally with a heap of paperwork required to be able to work (and practice medicine if they are doctors). But, when some other Pakistanis seek asylum, they are fleeing persecution. What is is, they persecute only low skilled people over there? Or should we call them all what they actually are, economic migrants? Since when honesty became such a problem?

Where did I say there are no economic migrants but there are not only economic migrants. I don't what are you suggesting, to let everyone who shows up drown or die of hunger so Muslims won't be comming. Those people have to be processed and then eithere sent back or kept here.

I never said all immigration is good or that we should open our borders but things are far more complex than one sentence solutions offfered here. And when someone opens thread full of wishful thinking that crime statistics in Sweden ard terrible and then it turns out they are less terrible than lets say Ireland. But that's not relevant because only statistics which suit anti Muslim sentiment count. Or when people claim Italy is in trouble because of current immigrants then I agree we don't need uneducated immigrants because we have plenty of ignorant people here.

I'm actually leaving this thread because frankly some of the stuff is a bit too dumb for me.

MrFresh

Cordell wrote: »

Well, that's interesting, I also know some highly skilled ones, not doctors but engineers (yes, that doctors and engineer tripe has some truth to it). They came here legally with a heap of paperwork required to be able to work (and practice medicine if they are doctors). But, when some other Pakistanis seek asylum, they are fleeing persecution. What is is, they persecute only low skilled people over there? Or should we call them all what they actually are, economic migrants? Since when honesty became such a problem?

Are you asking of low skilled and poor people are more likely to face persecution than rich professionals?

4068ac1elhodqr

meeeeh wrote: »

I came accross quite a few Pakistani doctors but I have absolutely no intention to try to explain to you why you can't make blanket statements about any nationality.

Maybe complain about the UK's ONS for publishing data this week, putting Pakistani earners at the 2nd lowest, bearing in mind some are good Doctors, that raise the median up higher than what it would otherwise be.



More highly skilled Chinese and Indians please.

Strazdas

Blueshoe wrote: »

What about the stat that shows 60% of Nigerians here are unemployed? We are paying them. Lol. What a country

That doesn't mean 60% of Nigerians are signing on. A person cannot just arrive in from Africa, head straight to Social Welfare and apply for jobseekers payments. They would have to be living and working (ie. paying taxes) in Ireland for several years before being even entitled to the dole.