Europe for Europeans

Liberta Per Gli Ultra

Stephen15 wrote: »

They have to be ethnically Irish

Which version of "ethnically Irish" are we talking about here? Scandi style (ginger hair, pale skin, afraid of the sun, etc.) or "Black Irish" (darker hair, able to tan like a normal person). Any chance you could see your way to letting in some Portuguese or Italian women, for the sake of the gene pool? They'd probably be nominally catholic if that helps.

ILoveYourVibes

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

The latest I see for France is about 9%. France doesn’t ask these questions in the census.

Of of the problems with your response is that I now have to sound like an islamophobe, while I have no real hostility to that religion.

However there are two demographic forces that will mean these figures will change. Continued immigration and higher birth rates for Muslims in France.

Good report from pew here.

If you have no hostility to the religion why would you mind if france became 90% muslim tomorrow?

By the way the muslim birth rate is like 3.1 children per woman. The non muslim in europe is 2.1 per woman. With the highest being in France and Ireland.

Muslims cherish family and children. Generally European western society doesn't as much.

You reap from your values as a society. Both the good and the bad.

Franz Von Peppercorn II

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

If you have no hostility to the religion why would you mind if france became 90% muslim tomorrow?

I wouldn’t. If I lived in France I’d just become Muslim albeit a secular leaning one. I’d miss pubs but as a straight guy it wouldn’t be that much of a chore. Merely pointing to the demographics.

By the way the muslim birth rate is like 3.1 children per woman. The non muslim in europe is 2.1 per woman. With the highest being in France and Ireland.

The non Muslim figure there is wrong. Most European countries (across all faiths) are well below replacement. Which means an exponential fall in their population. Anything above 2.1 is an exponential increase.

Muslims cherish family and children. Generally European western society doesn't as much.

Hard to know what that means. I mean Europeans often spoil their children. Clearly they aren’t having that many though.

You reap from your values as a society. Both the good and the bad.

Indeed.

Franz Von Peppercorn II

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote:

I wouldn’t. If I lived in France I’d just become Muslim albeit a secular leaning one. I’d miss pubs but as a straight guy it wouldn’t be that much of a chore. Merely pointing to the demographics.

Wut?

ILoveYourVibes

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

The non Muslim figure there is wrong. Most European countries (across all faiths) are well below replacement. Which means an exponential fall in their population. Anything above 2.1 is an exponential increase.






Indeed.

Well then they need replacement then don't they?

Franz Von Peppercorn II

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Wut?

Not sure what’s not to understand. The thought experiment was “what if Europe/France became Islamic”. My answer is that it wouldn’t affect me all that much.

Franz Von Peppercorn II

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote:

Not sure what’s not to understand. The thought experiment was “what if Europe/France became Islamicâ€. My answer is that it wouldn’t affect me all that much.

If Sharia law was brought into France you don't think it would change your life?

Ok then.

ILoveYourVibes

Deleted User wrote: »

If Sharia law was brought into France you don't think it would change your life?

Ok then.

I wouldn't mind living in Dubai.

4068ac1elhodqr

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

The Muslim population of Germany is 5% .

For the 2050 (Medium migration) estimate, it will be 10.6%

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

The Muslim population of France is 7%.

2050 estimate is 17.4%

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

The Muslim population of Sweden is about 8 %

2050 estimate is 20.5%, with the higher estimate at 30.6%...

Franz Von Peppercorn II

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Well then they need replacement then don't they?

I do think modern western thought is suicidal to some extent. Our secular priests are the academics who have largely abandoned defending western culture at best, and are actively hostile to it at worst. A culture whose elites don’t defend it isn’t viable.

And Europe does need immigrants. Otherwise the population in some countries could half.

My guess is we will end up in a situation where an eventual alliance will form between Christian and other conservatives and Islamic voters, and I would expect that then liberalism will start being hostile to Islam but not before. Also liberalism will reverse.

there are some flash points already like the Birmingham school anti LGBT education protests.

(By the way. My feeling on that is that the schools should be sensitive to the local populations beliefs).

Sawduck

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If Sharia law was brought into France you don't think it would change your life?

Ok then.

I ignore Christian rules so I will also ignore muslin rules so it's fun either way, bring it on

Franz Von Peppercorn II

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote:

(By the way. My feeling on that is that the schools should be sensitive to the local populations beliefs).

That's a very good point.

It's easy to throw shame onto Muslims for protesting about the teaching of homosexuality. But I would be first in line to denounce my child's school for promoting gender fluidity or non-binary celebration.

4068ac1elhodqr

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

And Europe does need immigrants. Otherwise the population in some countries could half.

The EU has a pool of about 1/2bn, with free movement of people and so on. Any EU country 'halfing' in population anytime soon, is pure science fiction.

Automation replacement will slurp up many/most of the unskilled job roles, mass inward migration of the low/un-skilled is really not needed and illogical.

Sawduck

Sawduck wrote:

I ignore Christian rules so I will also ignore muslin rules so it's fun either way, bring it on

Fun until you are killed for disobedience.

Franz Von Peppercorn II

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If Sharia law was brought into France you don't think it would change your life?

Ok then.

It would, but I’m a straight guy so not that much. We are a long way from that though. It was a thought experiment.

ILoveYourVibes

ILoveYourVibes wrote:

I wouldn't mind living in Dubai.

Off you pop so. Islamic countries are horrific if you are used to Western values. Unless of course you think that holiday resorts in Dubai are representative of Islamic Sharia law

Franz Von Peppercorn II

Mariah Better Repellent wrote: »

The EU has a pool of about 1/2bn, with free movement of people and so on. Any EU country 'halfing' in population anytime soon, is pure science fiction.

Well the anytime soon is a qualifier but it’s inevitable that a population with a TFR of say 1.5 will half over time. About two or so generations. I’ll let the workings out as an exercise.

Automation replacement will slurp up many/most of the unskilled job roles, mass inward migration of the low/un-skilled is really not needed and illogical.

Now that is science fiction.

4068ac1elhodqr

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

Now that is science fiction.

Circa 40% of all current roles will be replaced via automation, by 2030-35.
Suggest you educate yourself on these forecasts.

In manufacturing, 1.0 automated/robotic process will result in a factor of 1.6 human redundency.

Now if you consider unskilled uneducated illiterate young males, that figure will be approaching the much, much higher percentiles.

Franz Von Peppercorn II

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

(By the way. My feeling on that is that the schools should be sensitive to the local populations beliefs).

Talking about that:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jul/03/birmingham-primary-school-to-resume-modified-lgbt-lessons

Modified lessons which take the sensibility of the local religious populations into account.

There lies the future.

yoke

Still waters wrote: »

You should take a breather, you've over 3000 posts in less than 10 weeks, you're simply spamming threads at this stage, or at the very least learn to multi quote, no offence

Still waters wrote: »

I don't believe I attacked you personally, just your posting style, i don't agree/disagree with your posts, i just think to myself someone with a posting history such as yours with nearly 50 posts a day is simply jumping on threads because they can, it disrupts the flow of threads if 1 or 2 posters dominate the way you do, i dont mean any offense but when i see your name in a thread i just bypass it because of all the repetitive posts. Again i apologise and don't mean any offense

You should take a breather, you've nearly the same number of posts I have in 11 years in only half a year, you're simply spamming threads at this stage, or at the very least learn to make an actual point, no offence

Wibbs

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I wouldn't mind living in Dubai.

Dubai is a shiny kip built on oil and slavery.

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

Talking about that:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jul/03/birmingham-primary-school-to-resume-modified-lgbt-lessons

Modified lessons which take the sensibility of the local religious populations into account.

There lies the future.

And it was the past here not so long ago.

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

Now that is science fiction.

It most certainly isn't F. It's likely to cause a massive shift in how humanity and society operates, not far off the shifts that occurred after the industrial revolution. And no, people won't "simply retrain" to take advantage. The skills required in new tech are too complex and require too much time to acquire and far fewer people are required in the first place. It's not like say when the railways started to replace the canals. A man who dug canals could pick up his tools and learn to cut tracks in the landscape the next day. It's not like when blacksmiths and farriers could leave horses behind and walk into the Ford Motor company and start on the production line. With the level of automation we're taking about, the production line will be automated. And unlike previous shifts in production and work this tech is not just replacing human muscle power, it's replacing human brain power, which will lead to unexpected consequences. Take a hospital as an example. The "easiest" job to replace or massively reduce the need for are the doctors, the nurses and porters are safer from replacement.

Countries and the environment(the single biggest impact an individual will have on the environment is having a child) will weather the automation revolution best if they have lower populations. This drive to have more kids and get more people in is there to feed our current consumerist model and the financial boom/bust cycle. That's it. By every other metric lower population densities are the positive.

Still waters

yoke wrote: »

You should take a breather, you've nearly the same number of posts I have in 11 years in only half a year, you're simply spamming threads at this stage, or at the very least learn to make an actual point, no offence

No offence taken.

suicide_circus

Kivaro wrote: »

This is actually how the asylum/refugee process should work. And if it did work like that, I'd say it would get almost universal support here in Ireland. If you are a genuine refugee, we will shelter you and feed you.

However, how many asylum seekers coming to Ireland are fleeing life endangering situations? The overwhelming vast majority of them are economic migrants. If they are really fleeing for their lives, they would seek sanctuary in the first safe country. But this is not happening for our asylum seekers. Nope, they are traversing across the continent from places like Georgia, Albania, and further afield from Pakistan and Nigeria to gain access to the paradise that is the Irish Welfare System.

The EU has willingly and knowingly blurred the lines between economic migrant and what should be the sacrosanct status of "asylum".

seasidedub

Harry Palmr wrote: »

seasidedub wrote: »

He's right. In my opinion.

Why is "nationalism" wrong? Almost all countries including our own specifically celebrate it on days such as Easter Sunday - the festivities are even attended by the arch wizard of multiculturalism himself Micky D. We are taught to be proud of our nation, culture etc. Then on the other hand, told to accept diversity and multiculturalism. I don't think you can have it both ways to be honest.

Do we really want Ireland to be a really multi ethnic Ireland? Like really? I'm not talking about better ethnic restaurants, I mean a country where it wouldn't really be "irish" anymore, but a mix.

Is that what we really want? I'm not so sure. Generally, I go to places like Portugal or Estonia or other countries to see and experience the culture, language, food etc. Sure, you can go to certain places like New York to experience multiculturalism, but generally I go to France to eat French food and see how the French live.

We like to think that everyone "integrates" and becomes part of the new country but while that may have been true of immigrants in the past, now there's cheap travel, phone calls, internet, satellite tv in the home language etc, and people increasingly stay in their own groups. The nhs in the UK spends 50 million a year on translators - often for people 20 years in the country.

What are actually seeing are fractured societies where people work together because they must, but otherwise settle in their own groups.

The lack of self awareness is just a sight to behold. Imagine if the Irish went over to the UK and didn't integrate? County Kilburn anyone? Brent? the Republic of Digbeth? Remember when RTE wanted to start a satellite channel for the immigrant population, the save RTE LW campaign to help keep the Irish in touch? Any of this ring any bells?

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/rt%C3%A9-to-launch-diaspora-tv-service-in-uk-1.903922

A NEW television service aimed at Irish emigrants in Britain will be on air by early next year, it is expected to be announced today.
The service, which has a working title of Diaspora TV, is likely to be a hybrid of RTÉ One and RTÉ 2 with some additional programming from TG4. The Six Oneand 9pm news will be carried live. Minister for Communications Eamon Ryan is due to make the announcement today to coincide with St Patrick's Day.
The new service to Britain will be a satellite service and is part of a wider international service being developed by RTÉ.

http://savertelongwaveradio.com/

Independent Senator Billy Lawless has called on RTÉ to retain
its UK long-wave radio service for Irish emigrants.
He told the Seanad on Feb 2nd 2017 that the service was due to be abolished some time this year. “There are more than 600,000 Irish-born emigrants living in the UK, with many of its older members forced out of Ireland in the 1950s with little education and no prospects of work at home,’’ said Mr Lawless. He said a survey, carried out by the Social Policy Research Centre at Middlesex University London a year ago, revealed 92 per cent of respondents listened every day or most days. Some 44 per cent listened in the car or in another vehicle, he said.

Older age groups
“Unsurprisingly, it was the so-called older age groups who did not access the service on digital radio platforms, on a laptop or digital TV,’’ Mr Lawless said. He urged Minister of State for Foreign Affairs Joe McHugh to “implore RTÉ management to reconsider this ageist and discriminatory cut” to its long-wave service. “Nobody is trying to halt the digitalisation of our media or impede RTÉ in its process of modernisation,’’ Mr Lawless said. Mr McHugh said a survey in the United Kingdom had revealed 72 per cent of listeners were over 60, while 68 per cent were born in Ireland and 62 per cent retired.

What's your point here? Because as far as I'm reading, it proves mine.