Boss reads personal texts on company phone

nitpick man

Hi all am wondering what to do in this situation. I feel my privacy has been invaded. I am looking for advice before I approach boss.

Story goes. On Friday gone my boss needed to use my van ..a company van for the day. I had inadvertently left my company phone in the van. When I received the phone back at the end of the day I noticed that text messages had been read . 2 messages both from my mother which had been sent throughout the day . I only noticed this late into the evening . So I went into phone usage and find that my phone had screen time of 35 mins. Within those 35 mins . 9min in text . 11 mins on mails and rest On other apps and photos .
We all have same passcodes on the company phones.

Does he not need my permission to check his company phone that he provided to me for use.

He had a chance to say something when he handed phone back but never said anything.

Mod: not sure if this fits topic .. couldn’t find work issues

listermint

It's a company Device he needs no permission I'm Afraid.

I'd suggest not using it for personal stuff at all , also don't leave it around if you don't want the owner of it to open it

Chancer3001

Company devices are for company use. Why dont ya have your own phone ?

iamwhoiam

Why is your mother texting a company phone ?

The Specialist

Yeah a company phone is a company phone, you should have no expectation for privacy while using it. Leave personal calls and stuff to your own mobile.

Clareman

If anything you could get in trouble for misuse of company resources for using a company phone for personal use

nitpick man

Yeah I figured as much . Mother not well and easier for her to contact me. We see what Monday brings when he confronts me over all my messages . I know he be jumping for joy when he mentions to me why is someone texting you saying they got some weed to sell. 😬

usernamegoes

It's not as simple as people are suggesting here. They perhaps need to read:

Art 29 WP Opinion 2/2017 on data processing at work, Opinion 8/2001 on the processing of personal data in the employment context, Working Document on the surveillance of electronic communications in the workplace (WP 55)

lawred2

nitpick man wrote: »

Hi all am wondering what to do in this situation. I feel my privacy has been invaded. I am looking for advice before I approach boss.

Story goes. On Friday gone my boss needed to use my van ..a company van for the day. I had inadvertently left my company phone in the van. When I received the phone back at the end of the day I noticed that text messages had been read . 2 messages both from my mother which had been sent throughout the day . I only noticed this late into the evening . So I went into phone usage and find that my phone had screen time of 35 mins. Within those 35 mins . 9min in text . 11 mins on mails and rest On other apps and photos .
We all have same passcodes on the company phones.

Does he not need my permission to check his company phone that he provided to me for use.

He had a chance to say something when he handed phone back but never said anything.

Mod: not sure if this fits topic .. couldn’t find work issues

Why are you using the company phone for personal stuff?

lawred2

usernamegoes wrote: »

It's not as simple as people are suggesting here. They perhaps need to read:

Art 29 WP Opinion 2/2017 on data processing at work, Opinion 8/2001 on the processing of personal data in the employment context, Working Document on the surveillance of electronic communications in the workplace (WP 55)

Lol yeah... I'll just go have a look now

"personal texts on a company phone" is the equivalent of "personal conversation over the intercom"

usernamegoes

lawred2 wrote: »

Lol yeah... I'll just go have a look now

Yeah, thought this was a legal discussion forum. Seems its a make-snarky-comments-without-any-legal-basis-and-mock-people-trying-to-help-the-OP.

hairyprincess

Do you have a personal phone?

hullaballoo

Moderator as above, this is legal discussion. Legal issues to be discussed, engaged with. Not lolled at.

nitpick man

hairyprincess wrote: »

Do you have a personal phone?

No I don’t .

Atlantic Dawn

What's the history of the phone number was it originally yours or the company you work for?

lawred2

usernamegoes wrote: »

Yeah, thought this was a legal discussion forum. Seems its a make-snarky-comments-without-any-legal-basis-and-mock-people-trying-to-help-the-OP.

Yeah ok... Fair enough but I might have expected 'help' to include a link, extract and maybe a summary of a legal text to help the OP.

If the OP is not boned up on legalese then maybe a post without anything else isn't much help at all.

antodeco

What does the company handbook say in relation to company equipment? Normally there's a part that mentions what the company can/can't do.

Seanieke

Every one of us in work that has a work phone also has a personal phone.
I don't ask for or know anyones personal number. They're for their own personal use just as much as the work phone is just for work use.

usernamegoes

lawred2 wrote: »

Yeah ok... Fair enough but I might have expected 'help' to include a link, extract and maybe a summary of a legal text to help the OP.

If the OP is not boned up on legalese then maybe a post without anything else isn't much help at all.

I'll be happy to post links later but I'm on my phone. I get that the OP may not be a lawyer, but I didn't want to post nothing and let him think everyone telling him he was wrong were 100 per cent correct. It's much more complicated than he was led to believe.

nitpick man

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

What's the history of the phone number was it originally yours or the company you work for?

Number belongs to company. I’m sure i will get the boot anyway. My own fault. I know .. plenty people will thrive on it.

usernamegoes

nitpick man wrote: »

Number belongs to company. I’m sure i will get the boot anyway. My own fault. I know .. plenty people will thrive on it.

OP if you get the boot and are inclined to take it further, speak to a solicitor. They will advise you of how workplace surveillance should be done and of your rights to a private life and personal data under ECHR and EU Charter of Fundamental Rights.

I posted some papers earlier and while they are a little legal they are not overly complicated. I can't post links right now but you could google them if interested.

Just because it's work property doesn't mean you have no privacy rights.

Zillah

nitpick man wrote: »

I know he be jumping for joy when he mentions to me why is someone texting you saying they got some weed to sell. ��

You gave your drug dealer the number to your company phone? I'd fire you just for having such appalling judgement.

Miike

I think the weed thing is where you're going to get shot into the foot to be honest. Never use a company phone as a personal one even if others in the company set that precedent as you don't own the phone or whats on it; that belongs to the company. Depending on company policy you might be able to navigate around this though and I'd study your employee handbook. I know where I'm working the order for someone to read/ recover whats on the phone or contained within emails has to be authorised by high level management, after a request has been put in to do so.

Clareman

You're not going to get fired, I'd imagine nothing will be said about it, just remember that if the phone is paid for by work then it's their property and they can do with it as they see fit, for example if you decide to go on holidays for 2 weeks they could tell you to give it to someone else while you're away, in the real world though with business plans normally being unlimited use or plans most work places turn a blind eye to personal use of a phone.

Your original Op asked for advice before you approach the boss, my advice would be not to approach the boss and put it down as a life lesson, if you really are worried about your privacy get a personal phone. I have 2 phones, 1 for work and 1 for personal, being able to ignore the work phone when I'm not working is well worth the €25 a month I pay Virgin Media

Vetch

usernamegoes wrote: »

It's not as simple as people are suggesting here. They perhaps need to read:

Art 29 WP Opinion 2/2017 on data processing at work, Opinion 8/2001 on the processing of personal data in the employment context, Working Document on the surveillance of electronic communications in the workplace (WP 55)

A summary of these documents is that people can have a reasonable expectation of privacy at work. Monitoring of devices should normally be notified to employees. Employees are often permitted to use company devices for a reasonable level of personal use.

What the company policies say is also relevant though eg some workplaces may ban personal use, so you need to read the policies and your contract, which may also say something about drugs.

nitpick man

Zillah wrote: »

You gave your drug dealer the number to your company phone? I'd fire you just for having such appalling judgement.

Looks like you’ve already answered your own question.
He’s my friend getting it from a drug dealer so technically yeah. Because your so technical . I know the impact it will have. I’ve already admitted that. Your post does not help .

nitpick man

nitpick man wrote: »

Looks like you’ve already answered your own question.
He’s my friend getting it from a drug dealer so technically yeah. Because your so technical . I know the impact it will have. I’ve already admitted that. Your post does not help .

Ps . I thanked your post because it’s obvious what could happen. No hard feelings

nitpick man

Clareman wrote: »

You're not going to get fired, I'd imagine nothing will be said about it, just remember that if the phone is paid for by work then it's their property and they can do with it as they see fit, for example if you decide to go on holidays for 2 weeks they could tell you to give it to someone else while you're away, in the real world though with business plans normally being unlimited use or plans most work places turn a blind eye to personal use of a phone.



Your original Op asked for advice before you approach the boss, my advice would be not to approach the boss and put it down as a life lesson, if you really are worried about your privacy get a personal phone. I have 2 phones, 1 for work and 1 for personal, being able to ignore the work phone when I'm not working is well worth the €25 a month I pay Virgin Media

I 100% agree with you . Whatever the outcome is will be a life lesson. As for getting a personal phone I must invest in one.

Now my reason to all on wondering why I don’t have a personal phone...
I often get emails texts regarding work out of hours and have good communication with the company. I am not the type of person that switches off from work the minute I’m off the clock. I often responded to text and mails 4-5hrs after working hours when I’m not obligated too but I do . It’s easier for me to just to have one phone.

The high horse brigade

I don't take a company phone, I take a SIM and use my own dual SIM phone. I religiously turn my work SIM off every day after work and turn it on again in the morning. I have a separate email app for work and if I get emails in the evening I mostly ignore them and if i don't and draft a reply I always schedule it to send at 8AM

Charmeleon

A lot of jobs are advertised with a company mobile phone being a perk, therefore of benefit to you. Funny how employers think they can then go on to do what they want with personal data when it suits them. The first few replies are ridiculous. If you have a reasonable expectation of privacy you should not have your phone searched unless there was a prior specified reason. Unless your employee handbook specifically says your phone and/or laptop can be searched at random. In that case get your own phone and turn your work phone off as soon as you clock off and not until your work hours begin.

For a start now, I personally would wipe the phone, just in case monitoring apps were installed while it was out of your possession. Unless of course they told you monitoring or policy profiles were pre-installed. Most small companies aren’t that savvy though. If the matter of any personal information obtained from the phone ever comes up, I would check with a solicitor. Don’t listen to the opinions of employers, they commonly assume if they are paying you you and your data are practically their property.

nitpick man

The high horse brigade wrote: »

I don't take a company phone, I take a SIM and use my own dual SIM phone. I religiously turn my work SIM off every day after work and turn it on again in the morning. I have a separate email app for work and if I get emails in the evening I mostly ignore them and if i don't and draft a reply I always schedule it to send at 8AM

Me doing this would not benefit my Boss . I know I’m not obliged too but can’t help being a teamplayer as we a small company of approx 10 .
I should switch off work more often .

Andrew00

Did he find any porn or filth

Sir Oxman

nitpick man wrote: »

Me doing this would not benefit my Boss . I know I’m not obliged too but can’t help being a teamplayer as we a small company of approx 10 .
I should switch off work more often .

Do you have a contract AND a company handbook?

And yes, no one should work after hours for any company unless you are paid for it - trust me, I know only too well.

Miike

nitpick man wrote: »

Me doing this would not benefit my Boss . I know I’m not obliged too but can’t help being a teamplayer as we a small company of approx 10 .
I should switch off work more often .

You might actually be fine. Smaller companies are more willing to overlook **** like this imho.

the14thwarrior

hard luck. on being caught, by a noisy boss, bit sneaky that but you'll know next time.
seemed to spend a lot of time looking for things. huh. interesting.

say nothing till you need to.
its a bit of a pain in the arse carrying two phones but i think its best.
i carry two phones.
fingers crossed they say nothing.
sorry about your mammy.

sorry about the common sense thread and nothing to offer you on the law and data business.

oh deny the weed thing. say its code for something or other. sure what can he prove? deny deny deny deny..... and deny again.

nitpick man

Andrew00 wrote: »

Did he find any porn or filth

Doesn’t interest me at all. I’m past all that . No interest in social media and rarely use it for that. I don’t be having time in work to be looking at the web . Work is work and has to be done . If I caught you on a job on your phone when the job is not finished.. I’d have words with you .. plenty time for that after job is done.

ted1

Chancer3001 wrote: »

Company devices are for company use. Why dont ya have your own phone ?

Not if they allow personal usage. My previous contract had it written in thstvphibes could be used for personal use.
My current contract asks us to pay 8 euro if want to use them fir personal use

nitpick man

ted1 wrote: »

Not if they allow personal usage. My previous contract had it written in thstvphibes could be used for personal use.
My current contract asks us to pay 8 euro if want to use them fir personal use

I might make this suggestion to him if anything arises . I know he would rather and beneficial to him for me take calls out of hours.
It’s just the drugs txt that is kinda worrying me as I like the job but better paid jobs out there.
If he askes I’ll be honest and say yes I was and am smoking weed on my weeks holiday at I’m currently on . What is the difference if I go to Amsterdam all week and get blazed.
This also posses a problem because I’m too honest.

nitpick man

And yes ... I’m using my work phone as I type.

Thanks for all the reply’s
It’s nice to know there’s a place where one can be knocked down only to be picked back up over and over again.
A reality check never hurts. It only hurts because you don’t own it.

The high horse brigade

nitpick man wrote: »

Me doing this would not benefit my Boss . I know I’m not obliged too but can’t help being a teamplayer as we a small company of approx 10 .
I should switch off work more often .

You're too soft. As my Dad said work for free and you'll always be busy! It's actually outlawed in France, companies are not allowed to send employees emails or contact them out of work hours unless they are willing to pay overtime

Wanderer78

The high horse brigade wrote: »

You're too soft. As my Dad said work for free and you'll always be busy! It's actually outlawed in France, companies are not allowed to send employees emails or contact them out of work hours unless they are willing to pay overtime

germany was trying to pass a similar bill not too long ago

dudara

Any monitoring of communications conducted by an employer should be necessary, legitimate and proportionate. Yes, it’s a company device, but you still have a right to privacy, which must be balanced against the need to run the business.

Any decent company will have an Acceptable Use Policy which tells you how much personal use you can make of company devices. In this day, it’s not unreasonable to allow employees some personal use, but it does depend on the industry and security requirements of the employer.

IMO, reading your messages with your mother was not required, and was unnecessary. Question is though, if you want complain?

Dyr

usernamegoes wrote: »

OP if you get the boot and are inclined to take it further, speak to a solicitor. They will advise you of how workplace surveillance should be done and of your rights to a private life and personal data under ECHR and EU Charter of Fundamental Rights.

I posted some papers earlier and while they are a little legal they are not overly complicated. I can't post links right now but you could google them if interested.

Just because it's work property doesn't mean you have no privacy rights.

This guy is correct. I'm a few years out of date but employees had (from recollection) a reasonable expectation to privacy in the workplace regardless of company policy. AFAIK that's been codified in law in the interim.

GerardKeating

nitpick man wrote: »

Does he not need my permission to check his company phone that he provided to me for use.

Most companies would cover them selves with specific company policy on the matter and bring to your attention that company phone/email is not confidtential, and they reserve the right to monitor, but it's only "good practice" to have a policy, not an absolute legal requirement.

nitpick man

GerardKeating wrote: »

Most companies would cover them selves with specific company policy on the matter and bring to your attention that company phone/email is not confidtential, and they reserve the right to monitor, but it's only "good practice" to have a policy, not an absolute legal requirement.



Your mother is selling you weed?

Excuse me .. if you read the whole topic. How you concluded my mother sells weed. If you don’t mind please just leave advice and not accusations

GerardKeating

nitpick man wrote: »

Excuse me .. if you read the whole topic. How you concluded my mother sells weed. If you don’t mind please just leave advice and not accusations

You stated

nitpick man wrote: »

2 messages both from my mother which had been sent throughout the day .

nitpick man wrote: »

I know he be jumping for joy when he mentions to me why is someone texting you saying they got some weed to sell. ��

so i made a joke, sorry.

nitpick man

GerardKeating wrote: »

You stated





so i made a joke, sorry.

I did say from a friend somewhere in a post. By the way you took snips of post does look that way.
You don’t work for the sun newspaper by any chance. Lol. Only joking

GerardKeating

nitpick man wrote: »

I did say from a friend somewhere in a post. By the way you took snips of post does look that way.
You don’t work for the sun newspaper by any chance. Lol. Only joking

Well, i am looking for a new career, might try working for the sun, Does not look like it take much talent...

nitpick man

GerardKeating wrote: »

Well, i am looking for a new career, might try working for the sun, Does not look like it take much talent...

I’ll keep you all posted on the outcome on Monday..

Fakediamond

Chancer3001 wrote: »

Company devices are for company use. Why dont ya have your own phone ?

I have a phone provided by my job. Free calls and texts 24/7. I’ve had it for years and use it for everything. I really don’t see the need to be carrying around 2 phones. Most of my colleagues are the same

I’ll be honest that I didn’t know my employer could look at the messages. If they ever did, most of us would be sacked as we’re not exactly complimentary about the management :pac: