NBP part II

allanpkr · 18-12-2019 11:28am

MajesticDonkey wrote: »

No need to get so f**king defensive. The way I read your question was that you were specifically asking Marlow, which he will never see. Obviously anyone else is free to answer it.

whooaa there hoss, very aggressive? i wasnt being defensive, i was just explaining ,why, even though marlow has me blocked, i still posted question, as i felt you needed explanation. although why you did i dont know? but if i upset you with my reply , my profound apologies for upsetting you , especially in this time of year , goodwill to all men .. and ladies of course. have a merry xmas and may your god go with you.

Mortelaro · 18-12-2019 11:32am

allanpkr wrote: »

yes i know he has me blocked, but my question is still there, isnt it ..? do you not wonder how he knows its at least 61? maybe not , maybe you dont question anything that doesnt make sense. thats no problem.....NOW back to my question........??

Maybe he counted at least 61 ?

Anyway,will call my local T.D

Marlow · 18-12-2019 11:50am

Mortelaro wrote: »

Maybe he counted at least 61 ?

Anyway,will call my local T.D

It's based on a mapping exercise with the NBP premise data and the results we arrived at.

/M

allanpkr · 18-12-2019 11:51am

Mortelaro wrote: »

Maybe he counted at least 61 ?

Anyway,will call my local T.D

fair enough, he may have sat down and enlarged map for more detail then proceeded to go over said map and checked every house near blue,amber until he counted to 61. yes he could have done that i suppose. maybe he did . i just wondered if there was any other way to do it?

fergus1001 · 18-12-2019 1:25pm

allanpkr wrote: »

fair enough, he may have sat down and enlarged map for more detail then proceeded to go over said map and checked every house near blue,amber until he counted to 61. yes he could have done that i suppose. maybe he did . i just wondered if there was any other way to do it?

Using ARCgis or similar would churn that out to you very quickly

The Cush · 18-12-2019 4:21pm

clohamon wrote: »

Things promised and not done yet:
Publication of the NBP contract

Publication of the NBP roll-out schedule

Publication of the submissions to the final mapping consultation.

Publication of the EC’s NBP State Aid approval document (dependent on DCCAE consent).

Usual DCCAE form is to release contentious stuff on the eve of a Dáil recess or major holiday period.

Submissions and other docs published - https://www.dccae.gov.ie/en-ie/communications/consultations/Pages/Conclusion-of-NBP-Mapping-Exercise.aspx

allanpkr · 18-12-2019 4:24pm

fergus1001 wrote: »

Using ARCgis or similar would churn that out to you very quickly

thks looked at arcgis , very intrresting i was wondering if marlow would be kind enough to put up mapping he used. as i would love to see how accurate it is before i tnink of purchasing said app.

The Cush · 18-12-2019 4:42pm

clohamon wrote: »

Things promised and not done yet:
Publication of the NBP contract

Publication of the NBP roll-out schedule

Publication of the submissions to the final mapping consultation.

Publication of the EC’s NBP State Aid approval document (dependent on DCCAE consent).

One further item to add to the list

- Publication of the National Broadband Plan Bill

It purpose is to provide statutory powers in relation to the National Broadband Plan.

fergus1001 · 18-12-2019 5:45pm

allanpkr wrote: »

thks looked at arcgis , very intrresting i was wondering if marlow would be kind enough to put up mapping he used. as i would love to see how accurate it is before i tnink of purchasing said app.

its a computer program and very advanced

allanpkr · 18-12-2019 10:22pm

fergus1001 wrote: »

its a computer program and very advanced

yes but how accurate

allanpkr · 19-12-2019 8:22am

allanpkr wrote: »

yes but how accurate

i ask this cause 61+ maybe more doesnt seem all that accurate. and as these mapping analysis programs i would imagine are accurate , im wondering if marlow would share the mapping he came up with. we could then send that to dccae. also it would be interesting to see ourselves. to see how many anomolies there are on the dccae map.

clohamon · 19-12-2019 9:31am

From the "Summary of Findings" in Mondays's release of consultation feedback.

https://www.dccae.gov.ie/documents/2019%20NBP%20Mapping%20Consultation%20Summary%20of%20Findings.pdf

7.2 The Updated Intervention Area
From an original Intervention Area of circa 536k the following changes have therefore been made in the updated NBP Map:
􏰂 an addition of 36.8k of the 46k Purple premises to the Intervention Area (i.e. not including Purple premises which can continue to be excluded from the Intervention Area in light of the submissions from eir and SIRO)

􏰂 an addition of 600 individual premises to the Intervention Area following submissions from consumers

􏰂 an addition of 1.3k premises no longer being passed by eir as part of its 300k rural rollout

􏰂 the removal of 35k Amber premises now passed by eir with FTTH

􏰂 the removal of 1.3k Amber premises now passed by SIRO with FTTH

fergus1001 · 19-12-2019 10:57am

allanpkr wrote:

thks looked at arcgis , very intrresting i was wondering if marlow would be kind enough to put up mapping he used. as i would love to see how accurate it is before i tnink of purchasing said app.

as said to you before by other users Marlow has you blocked so he cannot see any of your posts, your litteraly talking to a brick wall

allanpkr · 19-12-2019 12:03pm

fergus1001 wrote: »

as said to you before by other users Marlow has you blocked so he cannot see any of your posts, your litteraly talking to a brick wall

wow you guys have a bee in your bonnet . as said by me before im not talking to brickwall . marlow doesnt get notifications . but last time he answered my question. so in a round about way he gets my question.however i said my question is open to aanyone to answer. why you guys get upset is beyond me , and rather sad. now when in future i ask a question , ignore it ,answer it, but try not to waste your timr telling me marlow cant see it, durrrrrrrrrr.
btw my point on anomilies on nbp map is valid. propriotary applications like arc im sure can tell you how many houses are on border of amber/blue , but it cant tell you if a broadband supplier will not connect which houses or not. you would have to put in that stat yourself. again im not just questioning marlow. if people on here put a stat down as if its a fact, and stat i feel is questionable i will , question it. as i hope any person would. world is full of fake info needs to be called out.
now im not saying marlow is incorrect, hence why i asked if he would kindly upload the mapping or other stat where he got it from. i do hope this doesnt ruffle any feathers. we shall see.

Tommy Lagahan · 19-12-2019 12:37pm

clohamon wrote: »

From the "Summary of Findings" in Mondays's release of consultation feedback.

https://www.dccae.gov.ie/documents/2019%20NBP%20Mapping%20Consultation%20Summary%20of%20Findings.pdf

Wonder have they updated the online map for this?

ArrBee · 19-12-2019 1:08pm

fergus1001 wrote: »

as said to you before by other users Marlow has you blocked so he cannot see any of your posts, your litteraly talking to a brick wall

Except as people keep replying to him, Marlow sees his questions via the replies.

You are, in effect, delivering the message on his behalf - circumventing Marlow's block!

allanpkr · 19-12-2019 2:04pm

ArrBee wrote: »

Except as people keep replying to him, Marlow sees his questions via the replies.

You are, in effect, delivering the message on his behalf - circumventing Marlow's block!

aaahh at last , someone gets it.

clohamon · 19-12-2019 3:17pm

Tommy Lagahan wrote: »

Wonder have they updated the online map for this?

The openeir fill-in is definitely there on the main map.
It doesn't look like the individual blue area complaints have been updated yet. This complaint sees no change on the map.
There seems to be some changes to the purple map which also show up on the main map
Hard to tell with the 300K fails and the SIRO extras.

BobMc · 19-12-2019 3:43pm

stupid question i'm guessin the purple/pink areas are part of NBI ? is my reading

Gonzo · 19-12-2019 3:48pm

the purple/red dots seem to be in urban areas, are those premises failing to get FTTH installed?

purpleisafruit · 19-12-2019 3:59pm

Spoke to a guy this morning in my village pulling Fibre through the estate for openeir. Confirmed it will be FTTH connections that they're extending from a rural fibre run 1.7km away. Still showing as Amber on the NBP map which is obviously not correct.

Johnboy1951 · 19-12-2019 6:07pm

purpleisafruit wrote: »

Spoke to a guy this morning in my village pulling Fibre through the estate for openeir. Confirmed it will be FTTH connections that they're extending from a rural fibre run 1.7km away. Still showing as Amber on the NBP map which is obviously not correct.

For clarity ..... you say that openeir are extending their FTTH network into the NBP/NBI area and this is something new in this locale?

plodder · 19-12-2019 8:07pm

allanpkr wrote: »

i ask this cause 61+ maybe more doesnt seem all that accurate. and as these mapping analysis programs i would imagine are accurate , im wondering if marlow would share the mapping he came up with. we could then send that to dccae. also it would be interesting to see ourselves. to see how many anomolies there are on the dccae map.

Could be wrong, but I don't really see how any software package could identify these anomalies. If there are 61+ identified, then maybe it's because the property owners have identified them themselves by checking their Eircodes on the govt. broadband checker - in which case the real number of would probably be vastly higher.

I see something about 600 properties being identified in this way from a post above. How do we know the real number isn't 6,000 or 60,000? The number obviously begins with 6 though ..:pac:

allanpkr · 20-12-2019 12:15am

plodder wrote: »

Could be wrong, but I don't really see how any software package could identify these anomalies. If there are 61+ identified, then maybe it's because the property owners have identified them themselves by checking their Eircodes on the govt. broadband checker - in which case the real number of would probably be vastly higher.

I see something about 600 properties being identified in this way from a post above. How do we know the real number isn't 6,000 or 60,000? The number obviously begins with 6 though ..:pac:

my point exactly about software packages. thank you.

purpleisafruit · 20-12-2019 8:32am

Johnboy1951 wrote: »

For clarity ..... you say that openeir are extending their FTTH network into the NBP/NBI area and this is something new in this locale?

The left end of the black line is centre of village. They've extending the fibre cabling 1.7km along the road from the last blue dot. This screenshot is from the NBP map and OpenEir don't mention it on their maps either yet in spite of an update a week ago there.
Within 300m radius of the left end of black line, there are about 100 houses that at least 90% are using a wisp right now. It's all new build so younger families so I imagine uptake will be very high.

ArrBee · 20-12-2019 11:59am

purpleisafruit wrote: »

The left end of the black line is centre of village. They've extending the fibre cabling 1.7km along the road from the last blue dot. This screenshot is from the NBP map and OpenEir don't mention it on their maps either yet in spite of an update a week ago there.
Within 300m radius of the left end of black line, there are about 100 houses that at least 90% are using a wisp right now. It's all new build so younger families so I imagine uptake will be very high.

If I understand you correctly this is exactly what I thought would happen.
Eir will move in quickly to to complete the runs that they strategically left as nonsensical pockets of unconnected houses very close to their fiber roll out.
This is why I think I might get a connection "soon". Eir will get to me quicker than NBI.

Johnboy1951 · 20-12-2019 12:01pm

purpleisafruit wrote: »

The left end of the black line is centre of village. They've extending the fibre cabling 1.7km along the road from the last blue dot. This screenshot is from the NBP map and OpenEir don't mention it on their maps either yet in spite of an update a week ago there.
Within 300m radius of the left end of black line, there are about 100 houses that at least 90% are using a wisp right now. It's all new build so younger families so I imagine uptake will be very high.

That is behaviour I was concerned about, although not really unexpected.
I believe I even mentioned it in an old post ..... how openeir could muck up the NBP roll out by taking the next lot of lowest hanging fruit.
Openeir can easily commercially compete with NBI in those areas given the constraints of the agreement, on NBI.

I hope this behaviour does not wreck the NBP !

db · 20-12-2019 12:31pm

ArrBee wrote: »

If I understand you correctly this is exactly what I thought would happen.
Eir will move in quickly to to complete the runs that they strategically left as nonsensical pockets of unconnected houses very close to their fiber roll out.
This is why I think I might get a connection "soon". Eir will get to me quicker than NBI.

I am in a similar situation - 21 houses on a 1km stretch of road between 2 runs of eir fibre. if eir do fill in a lot of these gaps will it not save a lot of cost to NBP to run parallel fibre to the end of the eir run before reaching the NBP houses?

ArrBee · 20-12-2019 2:48pm

db wrote: »

I am in a similar situation - 21 houses on a 1km stretch of road between 2 runs of eir fibre. if eir do fill in a lot of these gaps will it not save a lot of cost to NBP to run parallel fibre to the end of the eir run before reaching the NBP houses?

I dont have an answer to that.
There might be different ways for that situation to be handled based on what is in the NBP contract.

a few possibilities in general though.
1. NBI is allowed to compete as Eir have encroached into the Intervention Area.
2. NBI are not allowed to compete.
-and are paid compensation by the Gov/Tax payer
-the Gov/tax payer reduces the total cost accordingly
3. Eir have some penalty for encroaching. (I doubt there is a mechanism for this to happen - but considerign they needed some form of approval to take the 300k out of the IA originally, maybe there is some consequence that can be applied for poaching more?)

westyIrl · 20-12-2019 3:10pm

ArrBee wrote: »

3. Eir have some penalty for encroaching. (I doubt there is a mechanism for this to happen - but considerign they needed some form of approval to take the 300k out of the IA originally, maybe there is some consequence that can be applied for poaching more?)

I think the only mechanism in place presently is that NBI can draw from a capped €480m fund that allows for 'commercial operator encroachment'. I've always thought this value may be unrealistically low as if OpenEir did indeed decide to go head to head with NBI, there would be only one obvious winner. OpenEir would also have a heads up about NBI deployment plans when the NBI publish approx connection dates for premises. Theoretically, OpenEir could leverage this head start by connecting up houses at the end of fiber runs while NBI are simultaneously commencing their build out from the local exchange to service these same houses. As unlikely as that is to actually occour wholesale across the country, it would be a very effective move by OpenEir to derail NBI when they know the insurance policy for NBI in this regard is at most €480m before shareholders would have to fork out. If OpenEir increase their FTTH push into the intervention area in the coming months, it would be a strong indication of their intentions. Just my two cents...

Jim

NBP part II

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