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Water charges for excessive usage

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    #332
    Tommy Kelly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 416 ✭✭Tommy Kelly


    Benedict wrote: »
    Just because they're "allowed" to put them into apartments, doesn't mean they will install them? They can't because they can't figure out how to do it!


    Don't forget there are many homes which were willing to accept meters but IW eventually got fed up installing them and just decided to stop! These home-owners were out at their front gates saying "Give us a meter" and IW said "Sorry, we're not installing them any more".



    IW went home in a sulk. The whole thing is mad!

    There are crews the lenght & breath of the country installing meters for those that request a meter as well as replacing / upgrading fire hydrants and identifying / repairing leaks on domestic properties.


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    #333
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,970 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Tommy Kelly wrote: »
    I think the first fix sheme is a great service. The customers that have leaks on their property do as well. Especially if the leak is near the boundary wall of their houses which a large majority of them are, at the point of entry.

    In this instance, it is not their property.

    The "customer" for the first fix scheme is the local authority.

    If it is a struggle to fix their properties then we might as well give up.


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    #334
    Tommy Kelly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 416 ✭✭Tommy Kelly


    Boggles wrote: »
    In this instance, it is not their property.

    The "customer" for the first fix scheme is the local authority.

    If it is a struggle to fix their properties then we might as well give up.

    It won't be a struggle. But not everything is straight forward. People & certain situations can make things more difficult. It's pretty much the same in every job.


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    #335
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,970 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Tommy Kelly wrote: »
    There are crews the lenght & breath of the country installing meters for those that request a meter as well as replacing / upgrading fire hydrants and identifying / repairing leaks on domestic properties.

    It was my understanding domestic metering was suspended completely?


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    #336
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,970 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Tommy Kelly wrote: »
    It won't be a struggle. But not everything is straight forward. People & certain situations can make things more difficult. It's pretty much the same in every job.

    A Local Authority house would be far more straight forward than an awkward private dwelling.


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    #337
    blackcard
    Registered Users Posts: 3,937 ✭✭✭blackcard


    Boggles wrote: »
    blackcard wrote: »
    New legislation is being brought in which will allow Irish Water to install meters in apartments. Not sure how that works.

    Really? Have you a link for that? Don't see why they would need legislation.

    Did the regulator not tell Irish Water to cease metering and make it voluntary as it was costing too much and taking needed revenue away from fixing the actual problems?

    Was this ignored?
    If you Google 'Water meter apartments ' it will bring you to the Irish Water website which refers to the legislation.
    The utilities regulator has approved the proposal for charging for excessive usage so that is probably why there is no issue with metering apartments


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    #338
    Tommy Kelly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 416 ✭✭Tommy Kelly


    Boggles wrote: »
    It was my understanding domestic metering was suspended completely?

    There are plenty of people requesting that they have a metered supply installed. Especially those that are on shared supply as in one meter measuring the water consumption for several different dwellings / properties.

    You'd be surprised how many people monitor their own water usuage via the meter. As they don't want water being wasted via leaks etc.

    Like I said before if there are no plumbing issues in your house and there is no leak between the boundary box and the point of entry well then you'd have absolutely nothing to worry about re: charges.

    Internal plumbing issues / external leaks between the boundary box and the point of entry will be flagged pretty much at a drop of a hat via what's called a CFA (constant flow alarm) Customers will be contacted straight away.


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    #339
    blackcard
    Registered Users Posts: 3,937 ✭✭✭blackcard


    Tommy Kelly wrote: »
    blackcard wrote: »
    New legislation is being brought in which will allow Irish Water to install meters in apartments. Not sure how that works.

    Internal meters can be attached to the mains / pipe that supplies the cold water tap.

    Many commercial businesses have internal water meters.
    Yeah, I imagine that they will only install individual meters for apartments where a bulkmeter shows serious usage in the apartment block


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    #340
    Brendan Bendar
    Registered Users Posts: 19,377 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    In the words of Conor McGregor 'you'll do nothin'.

    How do you come to that conclusion, at a matter of interest?


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    #341
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Brendan Bendar wrote:
    How do you come to that conclusion, at a matter of interest?


    The lack of protest around the majority of austerity measures imposed, you march against the water charges B or did you take to Social Media and sneer the protesters as many did?


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    #342
    Brendan Bendar
    Registered Users Posts: 19,377 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    The lack of protest around the majority of austerity measures imposed, you march against the water charges B or did you take to Social Media and sneer the protesters as many did?

    There are more ways to tackle issues than by ‘marching’ my friend.

    What ‘austerity measures’ do you feel we’re not adequately opposed as a matter of interest?


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    #343
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Brendan Bendar wrote:
    There are more ways to tackle issues than by ‘marching’ my friend.
    True, non payment was infinitely far more effective.
    Brendan Bendar wrote:
    What ‘austerity measures’ do you feel we’re not adequately opposed as a matter of interest?
    The only measure I saw that was opposed was the household charge. I don't remember any other protests maybe you could enlighten if I'm incorrect. It seems to me middle Ireland just rolled over as they will again.


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    #344
    MacDanger
    Registered Users Posts: 2,569 ✭✭✭MacDanger


    ChikiChiki wrote: »
    The main reason for the water charge protests from a few years ago was the blatant corruption and cronyism that was going on. People were not going to pay for that.

    It was never about paying for water for the majority of the protesters most of whom would have no issue paying for usage. I was proud that day over 100,000 people walked through the city centre.

    Hmmm, so how come the protests stopped once having to pay for water stopped? Did the "blatant corruption and cronyism" stop once bills were not longer being issued?


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    #345
    MacDanger
    Registered Users Posts: 2,569 ✭✭✭MacDanger


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    Ah, good. That's okay I already do. I thought they were looking for money for something I already pay for. Phew.

    Where do you think the money for replacing the water pipes should come from?


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    #346
    Tommy Kelly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 416 ✭✭Tommy Kelly


    Boggles wrote: »
    A Local Authority house would be far more straight forward than an awkward private dwelling.

    Doesn't make a difference really if the occupier makes threats as into what will be done to you if set foot inside the boundary wall. Like I said that was the only time that has ever happened me in approx 2000 jobs to date. People are always polite and helpful. Partuculary the farming community as they are actually paying for what they use / flows through their metered feed.


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    #347
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,970 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Put Ireland's water is owned by the people of Ireland, and will never be privatised in the Constitution, then I'll pay.

    Until then, not a penny.

    You'd imagine that would be a high priority given it was one of the key recommendations of the Water Committee back in 2017.

    For some reason though Fine Gael decided that our Blasphemy laws needed amending before it.

    Strange one.


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    #348
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Tommy Kelly wrote:
    Doesn't make a difference really if the occupier makes threats as into what will be done to you if set foot inside the boundary wall. Like I said that was the only time that has ever happened me in approx 2000 jobs to date. People are always polite and helpful. Partuculary the farming community as they are actually paying for what they use.

    The farming community are a commercial enterprise just like any other for profit business.


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    #349
    Tommy Kelly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 416 ✭✭Tommy Kelly


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    The farming community are a commercial enterprise just like any other for profit business.

    Your're a wealth of knowedge again today.


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    #350
    Brendan Bendar
    Registered Users Posts: 19,377 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    True, non payment was infinitely far more effective.


    The only measure I saw that was opposed was the household charge. I don't remember any other protests maybe you could enlighten if I'm incorrect. It seems to me middle Ireland just rolled over as they will again.

    I was wondering what other “austerity measures” did you think should have been opposed.

    Sorry if I was unclear on that.


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    #351
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Tommy Kelly wrote:
    Your're a wealth of knowedge again today.


    Almost as relevant as your comment yesterday. Farmers are a business or do you disagree with one sector paying commercial charges. Which are an allowable business expense.


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    #352
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,970 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Tommy Kelly wrote: »
    Doesn't make a difference really if the occupier makes threats as into what will be done to you if set foot inside the boundary wall.

    In terms of getting it fixed, of course it does.

    IF the property is owned by the local authority, they have the legal right to fix it.

    IF the property is owned privately and that person won't let Irish Water in, then that is in all likely hood have to go to court, therefore far more awkward.


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    #353
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Brendan Bendar wrote:
    Sorry if I was unclear on that.


    I answered what you asked, no point reframing the question if you didn't like my reply.


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    #354
    Benedict
    Registered Users Posts: 684 ✭✭✭Benedict


    The fact remains that if you are one of the following IW customers: (1) Protestor who wouldn't allow installation (2) No meter because they stopped installing before they got to you (3) Live in an apartment complex.

    None of the above 3 categories will have a quota imposed.

    All other categories will have a quota imposed on penalty of a fine or jail if you don't pay the fine.

    This is unfair and legally unsustainable and will be challenged in the courts.

    It discriminates against one section of the community in favour of another section which will benefit at their expense.

    IW are wasting time and money on this plan because it cannot succeed.


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    #355
    Brendan Bendar
    Registered Users Posts: 19,377 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    Brendan Bendar wrote: »
    There are more ways to tackle issues than by ‘marching’ my friend.

    What ‘austerity measures’ do you feel we’re not adequately opposed as a matter of interest?
    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    True, non payment was infinitely far more effective.


    The only measure I saw that was opposed was the household charge. I don't remember any other protests maybe you could enlighten if I'm incorrect. It seems to me middle Ireland just rolled over as they will again.
    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    I answered what you asked, no point reframing the question if you didn't like my reply.

    I afraid you didn’t, but if you can’t name any that’s fair enough


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    #356
    Brendan Bendar
    Registered Users Posts: 19,377 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    Benedict wrote: »
    The fact remains that if you are one of the following IW customers: (1) Protestor who wouldn't allow installation (2) No meter because they stopped installing before they got to you (3) Live in an apartment complex.

    None of the above 3 categories will have a quota imposed.

    All other categories will have a quota imposed on penalty of a fine or jail if you don't pay the fine.

    This is unfair and legally unsustainable and will be challenged in the courts.

    It discriminates against one section of the community in favour of another section which will benefit at their expense.

    IW are wasting time and money on this plan because it cannot succeed.

    Yes indeed Mr B, like we said, this one in its present state will…not…run.

    As Alex Ferguson used to say.”.make no mistake aboot thaa”


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    #357
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Brendan Bendar wrote:
    I afraid you didn’t, but if you can’t name any that’s fair enough


    I answered to what I felt you asked, not my fault if you wish to revisit my answer and revise your question.


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    #358
    Fanny Wank
    Registered Users Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭Fanny Wank


    Household charge was opposed until it was handed to revenue. Then the people who claimed they'd never pay, would go to prison etc did pay

    Same will happen if water charges are reintroduced. There'll be noise until there's actual consequences of not paying. Then people will pay

    If it really was a "protest" that "enough was enough" then people also would have stopped paying motor tax etc.

    Irony was that most people I know who complained "I already pay for water" are huge net benefactors of the state


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    #359
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,970 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Fanny **** wrote: »
    Household charge was opposed until it was handed to revenue. Then the people who claimed they'd never pay, would go to prison etc did pay

    Same will happen if water charges are reintroduced. There'll be noise until there's actual consequences of not paying. Then people will pay

    If it really was a "protest" that "enough was enough" then people also would have stopped paying motor tax etc.

    Irony was that most people I know who complained "I already pay for water" are huge net benefactors of the state

    Revenue have all ready stated they will not touch "utilities". Why would they?

    Irish Water have an agreed funding model going forward.

    Charges are not coming back for the foreseeable and if they do it won't have anything to do with Revenue.

    The stick of charging for excess is based on conservation and not revenue raising, but is probably unworkable.


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    #360
    Fanny Wank
    Registered Users Posts: 1,288 ✭✭✭Fanny Wank


    Boggles wrote: »
    Revenue have all ready stated they will not touch "utilities". Why would they?

    Irish Water have an agreed funding model going forward.

    Charges are not coming back for the foreseeable and if they do it won't have anything to do with Revenue.

    I never said Revenue would - I said *if* charges are reintroduced there will be consequences of non-payment and people will pay.


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    #361
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Fanny **** wrote:
    I never said Revenue would - I said *if* charges are reintroduced there will be consequences of non-payment and people will pay.


    What consequences?


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