Water charges for excessive usage

charlie14

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

The second word in the first sentence mentions ‘installing’.

Have you a link substantiating the figures you put out there by any chance.

Four years after the demise of water charges and metering I really have no interest in going into a new year doing the equivalent of two bald men fighting over how many teeth a comb has.


Especially not with people who were backing every utterance from Irish Water and Fine Gael as if it was divine wisdom.
People who were happy for everyone to pay for water over an allocation of 30,000 liters who are now complaining about an allocation of 213,000 liters on the basis we should waste another fortune to meter more households and apartments for the collection of pennies.


If you are really interested in how much the metering Fine Gael wet dream wasted tax payers money to date and how much it will cost to meter the rest of the household plus all the apartments, I suggest you ask Irish Water.As you have been such a champion of them I`m sure they will tell you.


Don`t hold your breath waiting for an answer though.
They are having a little siesta until 2022 working on the fantasy of how they are going to charge for exceeding allowances.

Brendan Bendar

charlie14 wrote: »

Four years after the demise of water charges and metering I really have no interest in going into a new year doing the equivalent of two bald men fighting over how many teeth a comb has.


Especially not with people who were backing every utterance from Irish Water and Fine Gael as if it was divine wisdom.
People who were happy for everyone to pay for water over an allocation of 30,000 liters who are now complaining about an allocation of 213,000 liters on the basis we should waste another fortune to meter more households and apartments for the collection of pennies.


If you are really interested in how much the metering Fine Gael wet dream wasted tax payers money to date and how much it will cost to meter the rest of the household plus all the apartments, I suggest you ask Irish Water.As you have been such a champion of them I`m sure they will tell you.


Don`t hold your breath waiting for an answer though.
They are having a little siesta until 2022 working on the fantasy of how they are going to charge for exceeding allowances.

Only thing I am concerned about is accuracy, throwing out figures off the top of ones head does not really conform to accuracy.

McMurphy

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Only thing I am concerned about is accuracy, throwing out figures off the top of ones head does not really conform to accuracy.

Isn't that what Irish water was at from pretty much its inception though?

charlie14

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Only thing I am concerned about is accuracy, throwing out figures off the top of ones head does not really conform to accuracy.

You had no problem with Irish Water`s makey up figures on everything from the cost of consultants at the outset until their multiple figures of the average daily consumption from their meter readings, how many actually paid, the daily millions in EU fines and everything in between.


Eurostat didn`t have a problem though.

Unlike yourself they saw right through the sham.

Brendan Bendar

McMurphy wrote: »

Isn't that what Irish water was at from pretty much its inception though?

Let’s stick to the actual issue under discussion.

Benedict

It's kind of sad in a way. IW have now said that there would be no charges for "excessive use" until 2023 "at the earliest". By then, presumably, they plan to have the troops geared up for a full frontal assault on the metered homes while the unmetered homes sit back and enjoy the drama.

Benedict

Benedict wrote: »

It's kind of sad in a way. IW have now said that there would be no charges for "excessive use" until 2023 "at the earliest". By then, presumably, they plan to have the troops geared up for a full frontal assault on the metered homes while the unmetered homes sit back and enjoy the drama.

Or, maybe they’ll finish metering after the GE and THEN start charging for excessive use. After all, that’s what you wanted. EVERY household to have its own meter.

Happy New Year

McMurphy

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Let’s stick to the actual issue under discussion.

The discussion has been focusing on how Irish water, under FGs direction made things up as it went from calamity to calamity, and inevitably ended up obsolete.

If you have issues with what I posted let's discuss that, but I think you'll find I was spot on.

Benedict

The only hope now for IW getting public support is to come out with their hands up and say "Sorry, we admit we got it wrong and we will begin all over again".

If they don't do that, in 2026 people will be reading "IW have now decided not to charge for excessive use until at least 2029".

Just admit defeat and start again.

Benedict

Benedict wrote: »

The only hope now for IW getting public support is to come out with their hands up and say "Sorry, we admit we got it wrong and we will begin all over again".

If they don't do that, in 2026 people will be reading "IW have now decided not to charge for excessive use until at least 2029".

Just admit defeat and start again.

Please explain how this might pan out?

Snow Garden

Benedict wrote: »

The only hope now for IW getting public support is to come out with their hands up and say "Sorry, we admit we got it wrong and we will begin all over again".

If they don't do that, in 2026 people will be reading "IW have now decided not to charge for excessive use until at least 2029".

Just admit defeat and start again.

They should have listened to Alan Dukes in 2015...

"A glorious, god-awful mess has been made of Irish Water, we've ended up with a system now that no rational person would have invented if they had sat down to put this kind of system together. The hope must be that it will work lamely until some sort of coherent system is put in place."

charlie14

Deleted User wrote: »

Or, maybe they’ll finish metering after the GE and THEN start charging for excessive use. After all, that’s what you wanted. EVERY household to have its own meter.

Happy New Year

Seeing out the old and welcoming the new with your tipple of choice is an old tradition.
Unfortunately taking it too far will leave you welcoming the new in an altered state of consciousness.

charlie14

charlie14 wrote: »

Seeing out the old and welcoming the new with your tipple of choice is an old tradition.
Unfortunately taking it too far will leave you welcoming the new in an altered state of consciousness.

Thankfully that isn’t a problem as I slept through the dawning of the new decade and awoke refreshed and ready for an interesting year ahead.

charlie14

Benedict wrote: »

The only hope now for IW getting public support is to come out with their hands up and say "Sorry, we admit we got it wrong and we will begin all over again".

If they don't do that, in 2026 people will be reading "IW have now decided not to charge for excessive use until at least 2029".

Just admit defeat and start again.

Irish Water could flagellate in public and nobody would care.


The simple fact is that Fine Gael had one chance of getting it right and they blew it so spectacularly there isn`t a hope of a second chance for generations.


This whole exceeding allowances talk now, like everything else with the shambles, was nothing more than another scam attempting to get public support from those with meters to demand all others are metered.


When it came to metering both Irish Water and their masters, Fine Gael, treated the intelligence of the Irish public with contempt. And they are still doing it.
Nobody believes this latest is just about charging pennies for overuse.



They had 4 years to figure out a way of charging for usage over the allocation and could not come up with a means of doing it.
To now attempt to have people believe that in 4 years time they will have found a magic formula from the fairies is going beyond contempt for peoples intelligence,

charlie14

Deleted User wrote: »

Thankfully that isn’t a problem as I slept through the dawning of the new decade and awoke refreshed and ready for an interesting year ahead.

In which case that fantasy dream you had is still with you.
Enjoy it while you can.
You will be back to reality soon.
Fine Gael`s metering wet dream is dead and buried along with a vast pile of very expensive meters.

McMurphy

charlie14 wrote: »

In which case that fantasy dream you had is still with you.
Enjoy it while you can.
You will be back to reality soon.
Fine Gael`s metering wet dream is dead and buried along with a vast pile of very expensive meters.

The awarding of the meters contract to siteserv is still under an investigation, and similarly, it's becoming more and more apparent that the national broadband contract (unbelievably, Dennis O'Brien again) will end up the subject of a lengthy and costly investigation, that will make many legal professionals extremely wealthy - and no one currently in power, and therefore to blame will ever be held accountable.

FGs new motto could be - "Saving Private O'Brien"

Brendan Bendar

charlie14 wrote: »

In which case that fantasy dream you had is still with you.
Enjoy it while you can.
You will be back to reality soon.
Fine Gael`s metering wet dream is dead and buried along with a vast pile of very expensive meters.

Not as expensive as some people who thought they could get away with pumping out vacuous figures though.

RTE might think the whole country is asleep but those who get up early are not.

Not a good idea to try to ‘run one past’ over a holiday period.

Can end in tears.

charlie14

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Not as expensive as some people who thought they could get away with pumping out vacuous figures though.

RTE might think the whole country is asleep but those who get up early are not.

Not a good idea to try to ‘run one past’ over a holiday period.

Can end in tears.

After all the years you spent on the mega threads and the four years since defending the cluster fcuk, you now appear to have become an expert on how much of taxpayers money was wasted.



Rather than questioning and jibbing at others figures, lets hear yours on exactly how much it has cost to date.

charlie14

McMurphy wrote: »

The awarding of the meters contract to siteserv is still under an investigation, and similarly, it's becoming more and more apparent that the national broadband contract (unbelievably, Dennis O'Brien again) will end up the subject of a lengthy and costly investigation, that will make many legal professionals extremely wealthy - and no one currently in power, and therefore to blame will ever be held accountable.

FGs new motto could be - "Saving Private O'Brien"

The on-going court case on Digicel is still making legal professionals extremely wealth at taxpayers expense, but that will be small change compared to the cost to the taxpayer if that case goes against the state.
From the findings of the Moriarty Tribunal on the awarding of that contract by FG too O`Brien it`s difficult to see any other outcome.


Yet FG continue to feed him of the Irish taxpayers teat.
It`s almost as if they believe we are all responsible for him losing 500M on Irish News and Media due of his childish spite against the O`Reilly`s

Benedict

From the Irish Times 17 July '19
"Unmetered households, which are identified as having excessive use will be charged at the €500 cap unless a meter is installed. These households account for 45 per cent of Irish Water’s 1.6 million residential customers. In such cases, Irish Water will identify district meter areas where there appears to be excess use and dispatch crews to determine households which appeared to be using above normal levels of consumption. They would then have either a meter or flow monitoring device installed."

It's quite extraordinary that a prestigious paper like the IT should be taking this stuff seriously. But they actually appear to believe that IW could charge a home E500 for using one litre of water above the quota unless they agree to having a meter installed. Did nobody tell them you can't get a meter installed for love nor money? They don't do installations any more! Where is the research? Do they also believe that the Earth is flat?

Brendan Bendar

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

I’m afraid you have misunderestimated me John.

I won’t be paying unless and until the billing regime is fair and equitable.

Unlike yourself, and I do accept that an almighty bollox was made of IW,but I haven’t the blind faith in the Local Authorities to produce anything either on time or in an efficient cost effective manner.

John, I have seen way too much of those semi states, councils, public service and other state bodies to have any faith in them,and to trust them to reform the water system here.

How was it allowed to get so outdated and dilapidated in the first place John.

Who was in charge then.

You see folk who champion ‘general taxation’ as the bullhorn leaders blared out were well aware that this would impact only very slightly on their core support base.

It was when the unit came to outside Their Door :eek:jaaaysus what’s this lads, that the trouble began.

Don’t think that the Brenner didn’t know what was going on John, no sign of any Pauline conversion here, bro.

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Bottom line dude,is that potable water costs money to produce, the system is in flitters, hasn’t been updated for decades, everybody needs to contribute if we are to avoid these boil water episodes.

There was an almighty bollox made of this from day one, the bullhorn brigade saw the chance and saw that their support base suddenly felt the slates being lifted.

Everybody needs to contribute dude, this tax the rich crap won’t wash.

charlie14 wrote: »

After all the years you spent on the mega threads and the four years since defending the cluster fcuk, you now appear to have become an expert on how much of taxpayers money was wasted.



Rather than questioning and jibbing at others figures, lets hear yours on exactly how much it has cost to date.

Defending!

You have quite a short memory my friend, if that’s “defending”.

charlie14

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Defending!

You have quite a short memory my friend, if that’s “defending”.

Accepting a might bollox was made of the omnishambles 4 years after it was halted when you are still campaigning for metering to continue on a

half assed excuse of exceeding allowances does not cut it with me I`m afraid.
Neither does it that after questioning figures when challenged to produce your own an attempt at distraction.


If you are not willing to admit you do not have the vaguest idea how much money was squandered then produce the figures.

Brendan Bendar

[QUOTE=Brendan Bendar;111710442]I’m afraid you are not getting the nuance of my point of view Charles.

I couldn’t give a flying fuuuhrke how water usage is measured only that it’s measured in the same way for all domestic users.

Surely that’s not too difficult a concept to comprehend C.

I mean, do people have different electricity meters for domestic use ?

I mean they can hitch up a dray horse to my inlet pipe and charge me the cubic meterage of his piss over a standard time x the literage of liquid intake once they hook a dray to all comparable domestic dwellings.

It’s that simple dude.[/QUOTE]

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Don’t think so Charles, I think it was an earlier poster.

I don’t think any party would stupid enough to “continue metering domestic households” as you say, I don’t think that’s on the cards at a all.

My point was that any party who tries to stiff those with meters and ignore others will be destroyed, and I see it ,just will not get off the ground.

That was generally my point, hope that clears things up.

charlie14 wrote: »

Accepting a might bollox was made of the omnishambles 4 years after it was halted when you are still campaigning for metering to continue on a

half assed excuse of exceeding allowances does not cut it with me I`m afraid.
Neither does it that after questioning figures when challenged to produce your own an attempt at distraction.


If you are not willing to admit you do not have the vaguest idea how much money was squandered then produce the figures.

Not having a good start to the decade Cha.

Taking a bit of a beating here.:D

charlie14

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

[QUOTE=Brendan Bendar;111710442]I’m afraid you are not getting the nuance of my point of view Charles.

I couldn’t give a flying fuuuhrke how water usage is measured only that it’s measured in the same way for all domestic users.

Surely that’s not too difficult a concept to comprehend C.

I mean, do people have different electricity meters for domestic use ?

I mean they can hitch up a dray horse to my inlet pipe and charge me the cubic meterage of his piss over a standard time x the literage of liquid intake once they hook a dray to all comparable domestic dwellings.

It’s that simple dude.

Not having a good start to the decade Cha.

Taking a bit of a beating here.:D[/QUOTE]


How so
I`m just waiting on your figures while you are vigorously flitting around attempting to distract.


If you haven`t a clue as to the amount of taxpayers money wasted on the Fine Gael wet dream then admit it.
Otherwise lets see them.

NovemberWren

McMurphy wrote: »

The awarding of the meters contract to siteserv is still under an investigation, and similarly, it's becoming more and more apparent that the national broadband contract (unbelievably, Dennis O'Brien again) will end up the subject of a lengthy and costly investigation, that will make many legal professionals extremely wealthy - and no one currently in power, and therefore to blame will ever be held accountable.

FGs new motto could be - "Saving Private O'Brien"

yes, it think that is correct. And the Actavo (Denis O'Brien's new company?) that are putting in the 'fibre splicing' (on ESB poles?), have printed on the vans 'working on behalf of SIRO, ESB, Vodafone'.

are the water meters and ESB meters in some way aligned?

charlie14

NovemberWren wrote: »

yes, it think that is correct. And the Actavo (Denis O'Brien's new company?) that are putting in the 'fibre splicing' (on ESB poles?), have printed on the vans 'working on behalf of SIRO, ESB, Vodafone'.

are the water meters and ESB meters in some way aligned?

The alignment people should really be worried about is the on-going one between Denis O`Brien and Fine Gael.

And yes Actavo is a Denis O`Brien company. Previously known as Siteserv.

Brendan Bendar

charlie14 wrote: »

Not having a good start to the decade Cha.

Taking a bit of a beating here.:D

How so
I`m just waiting on your figures while you are vigorously flitting around attempting to distract.


If you haven`t a clue as to the amount of taxpayers money wasted on the Fine Gael wet dream then admit it.
Otherwise lets see them.[/QUOTE]

Distract!!

Just driving a ‘coach and four’ through your fake news posts a chara.

Unlike yourself, I never threw around figures I couldn’t back up .

You are beginning to sound like the Rise/Solidarity crowd now trying to target people for ‘telling lies’.

Saying it as it is.

Benedict

People with meters could be vulnerable to criminals if IW computers are hacked. This is a worrying piece of news which has not emerged until recently. If no water is being used in No 47 Anywhere Avenue, it means one thing. There's nobody at home.

Hopefully, IW have good security systems in place to protect the data collected from their "customers".

But I wouldn't bet on it!

This could prove to be yet another worry that metered folk have - but unmetered folk don't!

Benedict

Benedict wrote: »

People with meters could be vulnerable to criminals if IW computers are hacked. This is a worrying piece of news which has not emerged until recently. If no water is being used in No 47 Anywhere Avenue, it means one thing. There's nobody at home.

Hopefully, IW have good security systems in place to protect the data collected from their "customers".

But I wouldn't bet on it!

This could prove to be yet another worry that metered folk have - but unmetered folk don't!

Source?

charlie14

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

How so
I`m just waiting on your figures while you are vigorously flitting around attempting to distract.


If you haven`t a clue as to the amount of taxpayers money wasted on the Fine Gael wet dream then admit it.
Otherwise lets see them.

Distract!!

Just driving a ‘coach and four’ through your fake news posts a chara.

Unlike yourself, I never threw around figures I couldn’t back up .

You are beginning to sound like the Rise/Solidarity crowd now trying to target people for ‘telling lies’.

Saying it as it is.[/QUOTE]


You contested that FG`s vainglorious mater metering wet dream has not cost less than 1 Billion euro with nothing to back that up.

Either put the money where your mouth is and produce your figures rather than posting inane drivel and bluster, or admit you haven`t a clue.