Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours 2019/2020

deaddonkey15

micks_address wrote: »

Jose was right when he said lukaku was better than rashford as a number 9. Still don't think lukaku or rashford are good enough to get the job done..martial isn't the answer either.. we have a great keeper, good back four, pogba and James..everyone else just isn't good enough..Mata, matic, lingard, mctominnay, Fred, Pereira.. rashford..
Greenwood it's to early to judge him..

It was interesting seeing garragher almost defend the team today saying he felt Liverpool were similar till suaraz came in..

Rashford has had five seasons now...he's not going to get any better..

We need at least three quality players to get us more goals ASAP...which is probably next summer...don't think ole will be there till end of the season... putting someone else in now would make no difference..we need a creative midfielder and a 30 goal a season man up front..

I don't think anything is overreacting or new... It was a bad risk to sell lukaka without a replacement.. evn though I hated him he'd score enough goals to keep us scratching about the top four... If we can't breakdown the likes of Astana then it's going to be a long season

He's had 3 full seasons.

This team hasn't got a goalscorer. Damn, if only we could have seen that when the transfer window was still open. This is such a surprise and a shock how our season is going so far.

Who knew? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Strumms

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

He's had 3 full seasons.

He’s not going to get any better either way.

deaddonkey15

Strumms wrote: »

He’s not going to get any better either way.

A bit early to say for a player who is still only 21.

He is only 21 to say he cant get any better is being ridiculous.

There is a long list of things you could say about him, not good enough now to be a starter, not worth his wages etc but he can still improve

Rayne Wooney

Strumms wrote: »

He’s not going to get any better either way.

I’m not going to write off a 21 year old.

The fact is his performance level right now is worth around half what we’re paying him and that probably isn’t going to change in the next couple of years. He is midtable standard.

If he does improve it’ll more than likely be in 3-5 years time and even then how good he gets is anyone’s guess, it could be Rooney or it could be Welbeck.

I’d love to know who was involved in giving him such a silly contract and putting so much expectation on him, and the thought process behind it.

Ninthlife

Ole has said he would be ruthless, he would play attacking on the front foot football Great but apart from a few matches Im still waiting

Young - still being selected to play even with Dalot there fit. We all know what Young can and cant do. I dont care if he is club captain, hes had his time over 5 managers

Matic - still playing despite a decline on his performances and very slow with the ball. Again there are younger hungrier options

Mata - lovely guy but was bought by Moyes played under Van Gaal and Jose. Gomes possibly a natural succesor and available but yet Mata gets 80 mins.

I get playing experienced players but theyve all not set the world alight under the last few manageral regimes so why persist?

Strumms

Deleted User wrote: »

He is only 21 to say he cant get any better is being ridiculous.

There is a long list of things you could say about him, not good enough now to be a starter, not worth his wages etc but he can still improve

Is he going to improve to the level whereby he can perform consistently, contribute consistently, influence games and results consistently ? Even allowing for being 21 I don’t see that ability in Rashford.

beno619

As one of the people that made the most noise about about Lukaku leaving you can blame Rashford for days like today, Aguero and Kane would have been anonymous too.

Someone mentioned Aubameyang earlier, we’d all be here debating how crap he was for us wondering how he’d turned things around so quickly at inter.

Cantona's Collars

How bad is it that Fred came on and created most chances or Mata who was sh1te had most shots.
Even the general thread is full of concern about us. Are we now more to be pitied than laughed at?

Robson99

What do we expect with a middle 3 of Matic, McTominay and Mata....absolute rubbish middle of the park

Cantona's Collars

Robson99 wrote: »

What do we expect with a middle 3 of Matic, McTominay and Mata....absolute rubbish middle of the park

More pedestrian than College Green on car free day.

Cantona's Collars

https://twitter.com/SkySportsStatto/status/1175431183666176006

Liam O

[Deleted User] wrote: »

This team hasn't got a goalscorer. Damn, if only we could have seen that when the transfer window was still open. This is such a surprise and a shock how our season is going so far.

Who knew? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

It had a supposed goalscorer last season and the one before and there were plenty of days like today. It's endemic in the squad. There's a lack of effort and pride in playing for the team and tbh, why would you? United is now a soulless entity motivated entirely by money. Everyone connected with them, is purely out for the payday and sporting achievement is low on the list. I thought Ole would change that at least but it's too deeply rooted at this stage.

StringerBell

Em, United has been a soulless entity motivated by money for quite some time.

The point is not that Lukaku on his own wasn't enough last season or the season before, was probably that considering he is a far superior striker to anything we currently have weakening an already **** team further wasn't the brightest decision.

Mokuba

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

How bad is it that Fred came on and created most chances or Mata who was sh1te had most shots.
Even the general thread is full of concern about us. Are we now more to be pitied than laughed at?

Fred is actually decent but Ole won't use him. I'd go as far as to say with a run of games he is the best midfielder we have other than Pogba.

Cantona's Collars

Mokuba wrote: »

Fred is actually decent but Ole won't use him. I'd go as far as to say with a run of games he is the best midfielder we have other than Pogba.

My post wasn't a slight on Fred,he came on and was more creative than anyone else was previously.
As derided as Pogba is,we are seriously lacking creative play without him. Fred is meant to be a more destructive player but it shows how poor our midfield is if he's the creative outlet.
Pereira is just Cleverly MK2 with a Brazilian name. What he does to link with the attack is a mystery.

jharr100

Robson99 wrote: »

What do we expect with a middle 3 of Matic, McTominay and Mata....absolute rubbish middle of the park

Exactly.
Rashford is no Harry Kane or Aguero , but he or Martial when playing up front are getting terrible service, living off scraps and relying on counter attacks and half chances . No striker in this team and set up could get anywhere near the magical 30 goals a season or even 20. But if you put Rashford and Martial in a functioning team it might be an altogether different prospect . Just shows how much we miss Pogba when he doesn't play, even though half this forum wanted him out. He probably wouldn't be replaced either if he was sold , shur the kids will step up.

Ordinary man

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

https://twitter.com/SkySportsStatto/status/1175431183666176006

This can't be right cos lukaku was there for 2 of those seasons and apparently he's world class

Trigger

Ordinary man wrote: »

This can't be right cos lukaku was there for 2 of those seasons and apparently he's world class

Citation?

Jurgen The German

Ordinary man wrote: »

This can't be right cos lukaku was there for 2 of those seasons and apparently he's world class

More straw manning, nobody has said Rom is world class. This thread is hilarious by times, the amount of times peoples position has been spelled out clearly only to have a handful of posters literally make things up to try and back up their point.

Ole clearly didnt rate Rom, that's grand. Personally I dont believe he gave him a chance but thats my own opinion. Someone posted earlier about how well Rashford or Martial would do in a properly functioning team. Rom was our top scorer for the last two year in the same turgid, languid set up. What could he do in a properly functioning team?

None of that matters as he is gone and it's all ifs and buts. The biggest problem I and many others have is that our top scorer for the last two seasons was sold and not replaced, that's where the bulk of my annoyance surrounding his transfer comes from.

Not that I think he is world class.

Not that I have a horn for him.

Not that I dislike Ole.

He was sold and not replaced, absolute madness and it is a situation of Oles making. To leave us in that position is unforgivable.

micks_address

Was just about to compare him to wellbeck.. they in similar class if you ask me. Generally great players burst on the scene then constantly get better.. he hasn't improved in last two seasons.. he was making pointless runs yesterday after lost causes which make it look like he really cared, which obviously he does but then of course he gets injured..

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

micks_address wrote: »

Jose was right when he said lukaku was better than rashford as a number 9. Still don't think lukaku or rashford are good enough to get the job done..martial isn't the answer either.. we have a great keeper, good back four, pogba and James..everyone else just isn't good enough..Mata, matic, lingard, mctominnay, Fred, Pereira.. rashford..
Greenwood it's to early to judge him..

It was interesting seeing garragher almost defend the team today saying he felt Liverpool were similar till suaraz came in..

Rashford has had five seasons now...he's not going to get any better..

We need at least three quality players to get us more goals ASAP...which is probably next summer...don't think ole will be there till end of the season... putting someone else in now would make no difference..we need a creative midfielder and a 30 goal a season man up front..

I don't think anything is overreacting or new... It was a bad risk to sell lukaka without a replacement.. evn though I hated him he'd score enough goals to keep us scratching about the top four... If we can't breakdown the likes of Astana then it's going to be a long season

He's had 3 full seasons.

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Strumms wrote: »

He’s not going to get any better either way.

I’m not going to write off a 21 year old.

The fact is his performance level right now is worth around half what we’re paying him and that probably isn’t going to change in the next couple of years. He is midtable standard.

If he does improve it’ll more than likely be in 3-5 years time and even then how good he gets is anyone’s guess, it could be Rooney or it could be Welbeck.

I’d love to know who was involved in giving him such a silly contract and putting so much expectation on him, and the thought process behind it.

Backstreet Moyes

Robson99 wrote: »

What do we expect with a middle 3 of Matic, McTominay and Mata....absolute rubbish middle of the park

Probably what you expected when you were throwing abuse at Jose for the same performances the last few years at every chance you could

Cantona's Collars

Rashford just lacks the natural instinct a top striker has. There was a situation yesterday where a great ball was crossed in and he seemed half asleep. Neville was losing it and rightly so. This isn't the first time Rashford has done this, stopped when he should be moving or running into an area where he'd never get a ball.
Compare him with Aguero who just knows where to be stood,where to run into or even just walk into.
It's a bit odd that a great natural finisher like Ole hasn't so far been able to mould Rashford into a half decent striker. Maybe the kid just doesn't have it.
A winger who chips in with 10 goals a season might be his role,cos he's definitely not a 25-30 goal a season striker.

Backstreet Moyes

I think it was Wan Bissaka who put in a great ball between the keeper and defender and Rashford just stood static and didn't even attack it - Neville mentioned it in passing

bucketybuck

Say it again, the issue isn't the 21 year old who isn't good enough yet, it is the club and manager who decided to put all the responsibility on his shoulders, even to the exclusion of other options.

Compare and contrast. Rashford had a very productive period in the team when Jose was alternating him and Martial game by game, no pressure on either of them and they both responded with goals and good contributions.

Since Ole came in Rashford has been kept right in the spotlight up front despite being utterly horrible for going on 8 months now. He has a shocking goal return, has been getting worse not better and now the criticism and pressure is reaching a point that is clearly affecting him.

Now you tell me which was the better way of handling a young player?

Cantona's Collars

No coincidence that he looks a better player with England, strangely enough there's less pressure on him there. I suppose it's to do with the fact that Kane is the main man there.

Lord TSC

bucketybuck wrote: »

Say it again, the issue isn't the 21 year old who isn't good enough yet, it is the club and manager who decided to put all the responsibility on his shoulders, even to the exclusion of other options.

And yet, there's been a nearly cult-like group of fans demanding a "focus on youth" policy since LVG too.

This is the end result of that. We're slipping further and further back, because a lot of fans thought if we played nothing but kids, put all that responsibility on 21 year olds and younger, suddenly we'd recapture lightning in a bottle.

Ole is to blame. Woodward is to blame. But there's a sizable portion of the fanbase who not just wanted but demanded this philosophy too.

Your Airbag

StringerBell wrote: »

Em, United has been a soulless entity motivated by money for quite some time.

The point is not that Lukaku on his own wasn't enough last season or the season before, was probably that considering he is a far superior striker to anything we currently have weakening an already **** team further wasn't the brightest decision.

Jurgen The German wrote: »

More straw manning, nobody has said Rom is world class. This thread is hilarious by times, the amount of times peoples position has been spelled out clearly only to have a handful of posters literally make things up to try and back up their point.

Ole clearly didnt rate Rom, that's grand. Personally I dont believe he gave him a chance but thats my own opinion. Someone posted earlier about how well Rashford or Martial would do in a properly functioning team. Rom was our top scorer for the last two year in the same turgid, languid set up. What could he do in a properly functioning team?

None of that matters as he is gone and it's all ifs and buts. The biggest problem I and many others have is that our top scorer for the last two seasons was sold and not replaced, that's where the bulk of my annoyance surrounding his transfer comes from.

Not that I think he is world class.

Not that I have a horn for him.

Not that I dislike Ole.

He was sold and not replaced, absolute madness and it is a situation of Oles making. To leave us in that position is unforgivable.

The point some are making that is continuously ignored is that Lukaku forced his way out, he left the club with no option.

Ole was then willing to promote Greenwood and give him more responsibilities and use Martial there when needed both of whom were injured yesterday, something out of Ole's control.

Ole did not willingly put us in the unforgivable position of having no other striking options. Greenwood would have clearly come on yesterday instead of Lingard if available.

Whatever you think of Oles summer clear out or tactics is one thing, but posters are rightfully pointing out the disingenuous argument that its "unforgivable" and "on Ole" to leave us in this position. Its bullcrap, there is no postion, we had two other options who were injured, its that simple and some have the nerve to be talking about "posters literally make things up to try and back up their point".

Jurgen The German

Jurgen The German wrote: »

More straw manning, nobody has said Rom is world class. This thread is hilarious by times, the amount of times peoples position has been spelled out clearly only to have a handful of posters literally make things up to try and back up their point.

Ole clearly didnt rate Rom, that's grand. Personally I dont believe he gave him a chance but thats my own opinion. Someone posted earlier about how well Rashford or Martial would do in a properly functioning team. Rom was our top scorer for the last two year in the same turgid, languid set up. What could he do in a properly functioning team?

None of that matters as he is gone and it's all ifs and buts. The biggest problem I and many others have is that our top scorer for the last two seasons was sold and not replaced, that's where the bulk of my annoyance surrounding his transfer comes from.

Not that I think he is world class.

Not that I have a horn for him.

Not that I dislike Ole.

He was sold and not replaced, absolute madness and it is a situation of Oles making. To leave us in that position is unforgivable.

Make this a sticky

Simply ask yourself the question why did he force his way out? And answer it.

bucketybuck

Your Airbag wrote: »

The point some are making that is continuously ignored is that Lukaku forced his way out, he left the club with no option.

I'd explain the cause and effect to you, but historically you have had trouble with that concept.

edgecutter

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

A bit early to say for a player who is still only 21.

I would agree except for that fact that rashford was better at 18 than what he is presently showing. I think it's safe to say he has regressed.

Your Airbag

bucketybuck wrote: »

I'd explain the cause and effect to you, but historically you have had trouble with that concept.

Good one, why dont you explain the effect of our two other striking option being injured yesterday? I won't hold my breath for a response because the whole argument falls apart when you acknowledge reality.

Cantona's Collars

United had a problem when trying to sign Dybala,not their fault. They had a chance to sign Mandzukic,not one for the future but the guy knows how to score goals. He won't run around like Rashford but give him a ball in the box and he'll get a shot or header away. Whatever happened there he didn't move to United.Now we have no strikers bar a 17 year old kid.
Ole wanted youth but now has sprinters masquerading as strikers,may as well have signed Usain Bolt.

bucketybuck

Your Airbag wrote: »

Good one, why dont you explain the effect of our two other striking option being injured yesterday? I won't hold my breath for a response because the whole argument falls apart when you acknowledge reality.

Just so I'm clear, I have been saying for 4 months that injuries were going to hurt us badly, and I have also been saying for months on end that relying on Rashford and Martial was a big mistake and that the likes of Greenwood and Chong were not suitable backups...

...and now you want me to explain the effect of some injured players, one of whom is a 17 year old with a handful of senior appearances?

I don't need to hold my breath, I'm already blue in the face pointing out certain realities to you.

Cantona's Collars

A sad statistic.

City scored the same amount of goals against Watford than we scored all season.

Cantona's Collars

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

A sad statistic.

City scored the same amount of goals against Watford than we scored all season.

Morning zerks :pac:

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=111309178&postcount=7969

The Nal

Cantona's Collars wrote: »

United had a problem when trying to sign Dybala,not their fault.

That he didn't want to come to a club in freefall with no Champions League?

Tough choice for him. Stay and play with Ronaldo, de Ligt, Chiellini, Buffon at a club whos ambition is to win the league and Champions League this season, or slum it with Lingard playing in Kazakhstan on Thursdays.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

I predict the players to completely down tools come late October September

Ole to be sacked near November / DecemberOctober time frame

Then the usual PR spin from the club

And the cycle repeats itself as we fall further into the abyss

fyp

Backstreet Moyes

Anyone think we might struggle for Europa league we have played one decent side in Leicester and that was at home and have 8 points

Strumms

What has Greenwood done to show us that he can be likely a 18-20 goal a season guy ?

To try and fix a forward line by relying almost entirely on an untried 17 year old kid is madness. For the team and the kid. What we need for him is a staggered transition from the u-21s to the first team, showing patience and good judgment as to when we play him. In and out of the spotlight. For his benefit and the team.

In the interim till the transfer window we are fairly fûcked either way but I’m not for pissing around with the career of a 17 year old because the board and management at an internationally renowned organization like Manchester United can’t get the most basic things right...recruitment!

Weepsie

Should've asked to take Icadri in return for Sanchez. There are massive issues with him and his agent/wife of course, it would've ended in tears, but it would have been entertaining at least, and he probably would score some goals.

They're going to chase someone with a bit of promise/potential but who is not in anyway established. An exciting name that they'll overpay for and they'll disappear into obscurity.

Remember the days when our third/4th strikers options were Hernandez, Solsjkaer, Saha, Sheringham, etc.


anyway, if reports are true that Lingaard is getting a new contract, then i think the apathy toward the club will spill over even more.

Jurgen The German

Your Airbag wrote: »

The point some are making that is continuously ignored is that Lukaku forced his way out, he left the club with no option.

Ole was then willing to promote Greenwood and give him more responsibilities and use Martial there when needed both of whom were injured yesterday, something out of Ole's control.

Ole did not willingly put us in the unforgivable position of having no other striking options. Greenwood would have clearly come on yesterday instead of Lingard if available.

Whatever you think of Oles summer clear out or tactics is one thing, but posters are rightfully pointing out the disingenuous argument that its "unforgivable" and "on Ole" to leave us in this position. Its bullcrap, there is no postion, we had two other options who were injured, its that simple and some have the nerve to be talking about "posters literally make things up to try and back up their point".

Riddle me this.

You are laying the blame at Roms feet for forcing his way out?

Why did he force his way out?

Could it be because he was dropped in favour of Rashford?

Could it be that he wasn't willing to be a bit part player in the team, lower in the pecking order than someone with a much worse goal scoring record?

Who made the decision to not play him?

The answer is obvious to everyone except you seemingly so you either simply dont get it or you do get it and are choosing to completely disregard it, in either case, there is little point in engaging with you on the subject.

Backstreet Moyes

Would hope we are keeping an eye on Poch it is gone stale and he looks like he has lost interest

Would love to make a move now get him in with the squad early and give him money in January

Nuts102

Nuts102 wrote: »

Would hope we are keeping an eye on Poch it is gone stale and he looks like he has lost interest

Would love to make a move now get him in with the squad early and give him money in January

Sadly yet again, it's about stabling ship and preventing absolute free-fall.
If we don't move for Potch soon he will be at Madrid I suspect.
Madrid will sack Zidane and it's going to be a straight battle between Jose and Potch for the Madrid job.
They have two choices, we only have one.

micks_address

I don't think we could have gotten bissaka, Maguire and James along with three attacking players in the same transfer window.. I'd rather have the solid defense and goalkeeper we have now than a good striker and terrible defense..it's not going to be a great season but if we sign three quality players next summer I'd be happy enough. In fairness the current approach makes sense longer term.. it's just going to be painful short term.. now if they don't buy quality further up the pitch then I'll be first one looking for a change. If you look at Liverpool even with the great attack things didn't start to work until they sorted out their goalkeeper and defense.. we have that end right just the attack is lacking

Your Airbag

Jurgen The German wrote: »

Riddle me this.

You are laying the blame at Roms feet for forcing his way out?

Why did he force his way out?

Could it be because he was dropped in favour of Rashford?

Could it be that he wasn't willing to be a bit part player in the team, lower in the pecking order than someone with a much worse goal scoring record?

Who made the decision to not play him?

The answer is obvious to everyone except you seemingly so you either simply dont get it or you do get it and are choosing to completely disregard it, in either case, there is little point in engaging with you on the subject.

I've mentioned it already twice now so here we go again in baby steps to see if you can get it.

Rom deciding he wanted out and the reasons he wanted out have nothing to do with the arguments getting thrown around of Ole having left us without a striker on the bench to replace Rashford. Its that simple a point really but you just don't want to listen.

I mean it couldn't be more recent that our other striking option scored the winner for us, it was in our last home game.

Greenwood and Martial would have come on yesterday if available, they weren't, its that basic a point that we have two other striking options in the squad and Ole didn't opt to hope Rashford doesn't get a injury all season and plays every game. Its simply nonesense, and you were banging on about points being misrepresented, laughable. Has that made it clearer for you or do you want to ignore the point again?

Jurgen The German

micks_address wrote: »

I don't think we could have gotten bissaka, Maguire and James along with three attacking players in the same transfer window.. I'd rather have the solid defense and goalkeeper we have now than a good striker and terrible defense..it's not going to be a great season but if we sign three quality players next summer I'd be happy enough. In fairness the current approach makes sense longer term.. it's just going to be painful short term.. now if they don't buy quality further up the pitch then I'll be first one looking for a change. If you look at Liverpool even with the great attack things didn't start to work until they sorted out their goalkeeper and defense.. we have that end right just the attack is lacking

Liverpool's turnaround has been down to the fact they employed a competent and experienced manager and the board fully support him and what he wants to achieve. There is a clear vision. The current vision we have is akin to looking into the toilet in the bookies office in Trainspotting.

Adamcp898

On Rom fellas; I was never a fan as some of you know but the longer it goes since he left us the better he becomes in some people's eyes.

He has 3 goals in 4 league games for Inter this season but by all reports he has been ****e in between.

Rashford has 3 goals in 6 league games and been poor in between also.

Let's stop talking as if we just sold Ronaldo all over again, we'd be in the exact same position if we had kept him.

And all this talk about why did he force his way out? Perhaps think back and answer the question why had Jose already dropped him before Ole even took over first?