Ireland agrees to plan on migrant resettlement

Help!!!!

Boggles wrote: »

You described your Syrian Neighbors, with their brand new house and 13k as an immigrant family.



Link?




Well no I think all people are inherently equal.

It's you who think migrants should not be favored ahead of Irish people.

I don't necessarily disagree with that, but then again I'm not living in a state sponsored house with a migrant pontificating about migrants.

As I have said before I have no problem with migrants coming legally & working here paying their taxes
The Syrians are 'refugees' who are pushed to the top of the housing list & you know that so stop playing games
There are plenty of Polish, Lithuanian, English, African on housing lists
Again no one should be pushed ahead in the Q

Calhoun

Help!!!! wrote: »

OK we can do our bit but shoving them into accommodation in areas without the infrastructure is wrong, not consulting with or letting the locals know about it is wrong, so is doing it during the night, theres something sinister about the whole thing
Dont worry once the UK leaves we will be bent over first before being thrown under the bus

Just because our own internal government has handled this in a piss poor manner does not mean we should not contribute.

I agree the current system is bad especially the decisions to use local hotels even though self purpose centers existed in towns because small hoteliers want to make bank.

Calhoun

eagle eye wrote: »

Time for an Irexit referendum if that is being forced upon us.
The EU are not helping us with Brexit, it's been made very clear that we are going to get screwed.

Until that happens which i don't think it will as we have seen signs of support from governments and if they screw over us it will be the signal to the right and left in europe that other countries could be screwed to save the core block.

Its not just us that have land disputes with the UK, Spain ect also does.

Odhinn

Stephen15 wrote: »

So why can't the shia in Pakistan seek asylum in Iran? That's a shia country and a lot nearer to Pakistan than Ireland anyway the majority of Pakistanis I've met here in Ireland are Sunni.

Anywhere but here, eh?

Odhinn

Gatling wrote: »

It's true and anyone can deny and lie by claiming it didn't happen , Well it did happen just because you or anyone else don't agree doesn't mean it didn't happen .

We've already agreed that some payments are accessible to the public. However nobody has produced any evidence for payments for cars, or large payments exclusive to asylum seekers.

Stephen15

Odhinn wrote: »

Anywhere but here, eh?

Yes in a way we should be looking out for own interests and no others. It's common sense surely to seek asylum in nearby countries with similar cultures. If a war was to break out in Ireland where would you be more likely to seek asylum England or Pakistan?

Of course I nearly forgot common sense is not something you people do.

Atoms for Peace

I know of nobody (who pays taxes) who wants this.

Help!!!!

Odhinn wrote: »

We've already agreed that some payments are accessible to the public. However nobody has produced any evidence for payments for cars, or large payments exclusive to asylum seekers.

You still havent explained how the asylum seekers end up getting cars within weeks of being housed
Maybe Leprechaun's are real;)

Help!!!!

Atoms for Peace wrote: »

I know of nobody (who pays taxes) who wants this.

Some will be round in a minute

Eric Cartman

Atoms for Peace wrote: »

I know of nobody (who pays taxes) who wants this.

ahh there are though. They mostly live in areas that migrants are completely priced out of, drink in pubs, eat in restaurants and shop in areas migrants are under represented at the moment anyway and live in a nice little bubble where the only 'brown' people they have ever met are the wealthy arab children their kids attend private school with.

Who would have an issue with islam if ahmed the son of a billionaire oil sheikh is your only experience of islam.

Odhinn

Help!!!! wrote: »

You still havent explained how the asylum seekers end up getting cars within weeks of being housed
Maybe Leprechaun's are real;)

That's because I've no evidence that they got the cars in the first place. If theres a specific grant, somebody could surely put a name to it. There is such a thing as an Exceptional needs payment, but thats available to everyone.

Help!!!!

Eric Cartman wrote: »

ahh there are though. They mostly live in areas that migrants are completely priced out of, drink in pubs, eat in restaurants and shop in areas migrants are under represented at the moment anyway and live in a nice little bubble where the only 'brown' people they have ever met are the wealthy arab children their kids attend private school with.

Who would have an issue with islam if ahmed the son of a billionaire oil sheikh is your only experience of islam.

You forget the 'brown' people down the local curry house who cook their tikka masala when they feel a bit naughty & want a bit of cultural diversity

Eric Cartman

Help!!!! wrote: »

You forget the 'brown' people down the local curry house who cook their tikka masala when they feel a bit naughty & want a bit of cultural diversity

takeaway and the au pair opens the door to collect it, as far as theyre concerned, nevin maguire invented popadoms.

Calhoun

Eric Cartman wrote: »

ahh there are though. They mostly live in areas that migrants are completely priced out of, drink in pubs, eat in restaurants and shop in areas migrants are under represented at the moment anyway and live in a nice little bubble where the only 'brown' people they have ever met are the wealthy arab children their kids attend private school with.

Who would have an issue with islam if ahmed the son of a billionaire oil sheikh is your only experience of islam.

I pay taxes, allot actually for very little return. There are two direct provision centers within 20 minutes of where i live. Its in the midlands which is much cheaper than Dublin and there are allot of people around.

I am not for this measure as it stands because of how our government currently handles it but even i understand we have to do something.

handlemaster

Could we ship out a few thousand locals while were at it. Like a swapping system our low lifes for people.who.would appreciate the country its people and it's laws better !

Damien360

Help!!!! wrote: »

You still havent explained how the asylum seekers end up getting cars within weeks of being housed
Maybe Leprechaun's are real;)

You can get a car for a few hundred. I would question how car insurance is paid for. No history of driving, old banger (old Renault for mammy or X trail for daddy) raises red flags for insurance.

enricoh

Stephen15 wrote: »

Yes in a way we should be looking out for own interests and no others. It's common sense surely to seek asylum in nearby countries with similar cultures. If a war was to break out in Ireland where would you be more likely to seek asylum England or Pakistan?

Of course I nearly forgot common sense is not something you people do.

Whats the scratcher like in Pakistan? It'd wanna be top notch for me to consider it!

Stephen15

enricoh wrote: »

Whats the scratcher like in Pakistan? It'd wanna be top notch for me to consider it!

I hear the DP centres out there are supposed to be class would be a tough call between them and Nigeria

Boggles

Help!!!! wrote: »

As I have said before I have no problem with migrants coming legally & working here paying their taxes

Asylum seekers were precluded from working up until quite recently.

So does that mean you have no problem with them now?

All though the barriers for employment would be quite high living remotely in a DP, I imagine.

The fictional car grant may not be a bad idea.

Help!!!! wrote: »

The Syrians are 'refugees' who are pushed to the top of the housing list & you know that so stop playing games

Well no, your Syrian neighbors were asylum seekers who have been given permission to stay.

As for the pushed to the top of the housing list we are still awaiting your proof of that claim, something tangible, surely it has be buried in some published policy document or media report?

jmayo

Boggles wrote: »

They don't recognize Refugees plus they are complete bastards.

The Donald is a big fan.

But, To say Syrians neighbors don't take in refugees is complete and utter nonsense.

Yes fair dues Turkey, Lebanon, Jordan and indeed Iraq with it's own huge problems have taken Syrians in because they are right next door.
But look at a slightly bigger picture and you find some of the richest states in the world like Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Oman, Kuwait, UAE haven't exactly thrown the welcome matt out and countries the far side of Europe are meant to.

Also once again stop trying to conflate migrants, asylum seekers with Syrian refugees

I know it is a stock approach from some as it tugs at the heart strings, but it is highly disingenous.

Eric Cartman wrote: »

ahh there are though. They mostly live in areas that migrants are completely priced out of, drink in pubs, eat in restaurants and shop in areas migrants are under represented at the moment anyway and live in a nice little bubble where the only 'brown' people they have ever met are the wealthy arab children their kids attend private school with.

Who would have an issue with islam if ahmed the son of a billionaire oil sheikh is your only experience of islam.

IMHO there are lot of younger Irish people that have grown up in an environment and probably more importantly studied and worked in environments where there are lots of foreigners and lots of non Irish.
Fair enough we were due some much needed new blood in Ireland.

If you work in the likes of Facebook, HP, Microsoft then yes you might have a rosey view of the world and all it's inhabitants.

But just because you know loads of guys from say India, Pakistan or Jordan that are cool, well educated and culturally fairly open doesn't mean the next batch of migrants you receive from that neck of the woods will be the same.
Hell I have even known very educated Pakistanis that would make the most backward mysognistic Irish guy look like an enlightened progressive.

And the ones that are making their way into Europe illegally from Asia, Middle East, Africa are usually the uneducated, unskilled and definitely not very culturally open minded and most definitely often criminals.

We are sowing the seeds for more of what has been experienced in certain European countries over the last two decades or so, not to mention the serious strain being put on state resources by a huge chunk of people not adding anything but only taking.

I think we are already seeing a backlash with the rise of right wing politicians in certain states and it is probably going to get worse with increasing unemployment for lower skilled people due to rise in globalisation and automation.

The way to help the people in these countries is not to import them into a Western European country, but to finally drag their home countries into the 20th century.
Turning everywhere into a shytehole doesn't help the actual shyteholes there already.

But that doesn't often suit the real powers, the industrialists, the corporate shareholders, the political and military classes harping back to the days of empires and flexing ones might by domination of poorer asset rich states, nor the NGOs who need to feel superior.

Boggles

jmayo wrote: »

Yes fair dues Turkey, Lebanon, Jordan and indeed Iraq with it's own huge problems have taken Syrians in because they are right next door.
But look at a slightly bigger picture and you find some of the richest states in the world like Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Oman, Kuwait, UAE haven't exactly thrown the welcome matt out and countries the far side of Europe are meant to.

Yeah, I addressed it in the post you replied to. They do not recognize Refugees and are bastards.

The likes of Qatar hardly a next door neighbor of Syria are giving quite a bit of funding to camps in the neighboring countries.

That said they changed their laws quite recently and have pledged to take 25,000 from Yemen, will be interesting to see if they do, especially considering the country is only about 40% bigger than Cork.

jmayo wrote: »

Also once again stop trying to conflate migrants, asylum seekers with Syrian refugees

I know it is a stock approach from some as it tugs at the heart strings, but it is highly disingenous.

I was talking exclusively about Syrians.

Galwayguy35

Our Politicans should lead by example and house a few of them in their posh neighbourhoods.

I'd say the people living in places like Dalkey wouldn't mind at all.

Help!!!!

Boggles wrote: »

Asylum seekers were precluded from working up until quite recently.

So does that mean you have no problem with them now?

All though the barriers for employment would be quite high living remotely in a DP, I imagine.

The fictional car grant may not be a bad idea.



Well no, your Syrian neighbors were asylum seekers who have been given permission to stay.

As for the pushed to the top of the housing list we are still awaiting your proof of that claim, something tangible, surely it has be buried in some published policy document or media report?

People in DP are not residents of the country
How does someone come into the country & get a council house when some have been on the waiting list for years living in hotels or b&bs?
Come on its not that hard

Help!!!!

There was a guy from the DR of the Congo who had a council flat he said that he was going to move to Galway & rent out the flat he had, when we asked him where he was going to live in Galway he said he would get a council flat. Amazing the sense of entitlement

Eric Cartman

Help!!!! wrote: »

There was a guy from the DR of the Congo who had a council flat he said that he was going to move to Galway & rent out the flat he had, when we asked him where he was going to live in Galway he said he would get a council flat. Amazing the sense of entitlement

This strikes me as like that old taxi driver fable of "the nigerian woman left the buggy by the road and said the state would just give her another one" parable. There has never been a roadside buggy dumping problem.

Unless the guy was into identity fraud , the systems are joined up enough to only give him one property.

weldoninhio

Boggles wrote: »

Where did I say we didn't?

“We are part of the EU, we have no choice“

Boggles

Help!!!! wrote: »

People in DP are not residents of the country

I never claimed they were.

Help!!!! wrote: »

How does someone come into the country & get a council house when some have been on the waiting list for years living in hotels or b&bs?

I have no idea, I haven't heard of any asylum seekers waiting for their case to be ruled upon given tenancy on social housing.

This is your unverified claim.

Nor have I ever heard of people waiting on asylum hearings being given brand new houses and €13,000.

Again this is your unverified claim.

If they are granted permission to stay, then they can apply for social housing and HAP.

Damien360

Eric Cartman wrote: »

This strikes me as like that old taxi driver fable of "the nigerian woman left the buggy by the road and said the state would just give her another one" parable. There has never been a roadside buggy dumping problem.

Unless the guy was into identity fraud , the systems are joined up enough to only give him one property.

On the buggy one. Newbridge train station at the top of the boom had loads left on the platform every day. We were in mothercare buying our own one and the person serving us said it happens every week. They used to come in with a cheque from social to get a new one.

Eric Cartman

Help!!!! wrote: »

How does someone come into the country & get a council house when some have been on the waiting list for years living in hotels or b&bs?
Come on its not that hard

so youre granted right to remain or asylum or whatever , its you, your missus and one child, but while in DP you met some other families from your part of the world, wouldnt it be mad if you borrowed their 3 children and used them to facilitate a dire need of housing for you, your wife and your 4 kids, in return the other family borrows your kid when the time comes. You used to have some kids that would have 4-5 pps numbers behind them for all that sweet child benefit cash, but improved fraud detection has killed most of that craic. Housing department still havent copped it though.

JohnMc1

eagle eye wrote: »

Time for an Irexit referendum if that is being forced upon us.
The EU are not helping us with Brexit, it's been made very clear that we are going to get screwed.

Force the Traitors in the Dail out first. An Irexit would be worthless if Varadkar and the other Traitors currently sitting in Leinster House are still in.

Stephen15

JohnMc1 wrote: »

Force the Traitors in the Dail out first. An Irexit would be worthless if Varadkar and the other Traitors currently sitting in Leinster House are still in.

We should just do what Hungary and Poland are doing and disobeying the EU. Can't see the EU lasting too much longer anyway unles they change their act and stop bullying countries.

JohnMc1

Stephen15 wrote: »

We should just do what Hungary and Poland are doing and disobeying the EU. Can't see the EU lasting too much longer anyway unles they change their act and stop bullying countries.

That's why they spent the last few years trying to derail Brexit. If Britain ends up doing well it will only encourage more Countries to want to leave.

Boggles

Stephen15 wrote: »

We should just do what Hungary and Poland are doing and disobeying the EU

Sure let them hand back the 12 billion they get annually and trigger Article 50.

JohnMc1

Boggles wrote: »

Sure let them hand back the 12 billion they get annually and trigger Article 50.

While Ireland has benefited in the past that doesn't mean we're obligated to go along with every ruinous decision they make. If Germany, Sweden, France and Britain want to commit cultural suicide then let them. **** them if they're that stupid.

4068ac1elhodqr

In 2016, Ireland became a net contributor to the EU Budget.

After the UK leaves, someones gotta chip in even more for the next 6 countries to join (all with group average GDP-PP at half that of Germany).

_Kaiser_

Odhinn wrote: »

Anywhere but here, eh?

Yea yea, we're all racists :rolleyes: Feel better?

We have no obligation to resettle thousands of low skill economic migrants at massive cost for very little return or benefit (and potentially a lot of issues) just for social media kudos and self-congratulatory back slapping among the Liberal types who won't have to deal with these people anyway.

I couldn't care less about the domestic and social problems of countries in Africa. We can't even effectively deal with the domestic and social problems we have here.

Charity begins at home and that's where our efforts - and taxes - should be focused.

Ulysses Gaze

JohnMc1 wrote: »

That's why they spent the last few years trying to derail Brexit. If Britain ends up doing well it will only encourage more Countries to want to leave.

Sure can't the EU replace the Brits with those economic titans Serbia, Bosnia and Montenegro....

Odhinn

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Yea yea, we're all racists :rolleyes: Feel better?

We have no obligation to resettle thousands of low skill economic migrants at massive cost for very little return or benefit (and potentially a lot of issues) just for social media kudos and self-congratulatory back slapping among the Liberal types who won't have to deal with these people anyway.

I couldn't care less about the domestic and social problems of countries in Africa. We can't even effectively deal with the domestic and social problems we have here.

Charity begins at home and that's where our efforts - and taxes - should be focused.

We've signed up to the Geneva conventions, so yes, we have an obligation.

4068ac1elhodqr

Ulysses Gaze wrote: »

Sure can't the EU replace the Brits with those economic titans Serbia, Bosnia and Montenegro....

And they're cheap ones, imagine the costs (fiscally and culturally) of Turkey (their neighbour) joining. Then perhaps even later the Ukraine.

JohnMc1

Odhinn wrote: »

We've signed up to the Geneva conventions, so yes, we have an obligation.

None of these Migrants are escaping war so the Geneva Convention doesn't apply. That's why the UN had those migration pacts last December.

enricoh

Yahir Stale Piranha wrote: »

In 2016, Ireland became a net contributor to the EU Budget.

After the UK leaves, someones gotta chip in even more for the next 6 countries to join (all with group average GDP-PP at half that of Germany).

Are the multinationals here for access to the eu? If we left, do a fair percentage of them go elsewhere? If not irexit all the way imo.
Or would our politicians not countenance the end of plum eu jobs?!

Odhinn

JohnMc1 wrote: »

None of these Migrants are escaping war so the Geneva Convention doesn't apply. That's why the UN had those migration pacts last December.

Syrians? Iraqis? Yemenites? Pakistanis? Afghans?

4068ac1elhodqr

enricoh wrote: »

Are the multinationals here for access to the eu? If we left, do a fair percentage of them go elsewhere? If not irexit all the way imo. Or would our politicians not countenance the end of plum eu jobs?!

Primary location choice would be the very low corp tax 12.5%, and some of the sweetheart deals (dutch sandwich etc) that exist/existed.

Educated english speaking workforce with close cultural ties to the US would perhaps be 2nd. EU market access also important, but this can be done from anywhere in the EU.

The (post-brexit) UK was talking about directly matching the 12.5%, guessing to attract MNCs also (for global markets).

Stephen15

Odhinn wrote: »

Syrians? Iraqis? Yemenites? Pakistanis? Afghans?

What about the Dublin convention which states they must seek asylum in the nearest safe country in the case of the countries you mentioned Ireland is not the nearest safe country. Why are you so anti Irish?

JohnMc1

Odhinn wrote: »

Syrians? Iraqis? Yemenites? Pakistanis? Afghans?

The Bulk we're getting is from Africa. And to be considered a refugee you have to arrive at your nearest safe Country. Passing through several safe Countries to sign up at the soft touch gravy trains in Western Europe doesn't make them refugees. Just Gimmegrants.

Odhinn

Stephen15 wrote: »

What about the Dublin convention which states they must seek asylum in the nearest safe country in the case of the countries you mentioned Ireland is not the nearest safe country. Why are you so anti Irish?

Nope.

Stephen15

Odhinn wrote: »

Nope.

I suggest you give The Camp of the Saints a read to most rational people it should act as a warning but to you it's probably a how to guide. Just admit you support mass immigration.

Kivaro

Odhinn wrote: »

Syrians? Iraqis? Yemenites? Pakistanis? Afghans?

And once again you skew the topic of the thread by using these countries as examples.
None of these countries citizens are included in this new migrant resettlement plan that Fine Gael has signed us up for. This plan involves thousands of economic migrants from Africa.

The Geneva Convention was not intended for economic migrants.
Just to make it clear for you:
"Economic migrants are not eligible for asylum under the 1951 Geneva Convention Relating to the Status of Refugees."

jmreire

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Nigeria: no war

Pakistan: no war

Bangladesh: no war


Syria: no war

Georgia: no war

Albania: no war

We're being hoodwinked..Ireland is viewed as an easy touch because of the gullibility of the populace.

The War in Syria is far from finished, will be several more years before that happens.

Ulysses Gaze

Stephen15 wrote: »

I suggest you give The Camp of the Saints a read to most rational people it should act as a warning but to you it's probably a how to guide. Just admit you support mass immigration.

The Camp of the Saints is racist bollocks and Raspail is a right wing nut-job.

It's an interesting premise for sure, but his descriptions of Indians in the novel would read like something the British would have written about Indians, and Irish, in the 1800's.

And this was written in the 1970's.