What does it mean if landdirect.ie shows both freehold and leasehold folio?

irsy

I'm looking to buy a house and it seems I have newbie questions.

1) What does it mean if landdirect.ie shows both freehold and leasehold folio associated with the plot of land? (folio.jpg)

2) Additionally, I found this house has been purchased in 2016 and propertypriceregister.ie shows the price with ** which denotes not full market price. (sale_price.jpg)

Can you advise me what all of this could mean? Is there anything I should concern about?

drunkmonkey

It means you own the land the house is built on in relation to that particular property, the leasehold is the building and the freehold is the land.

looksee

This is the kind of thing that your solicitor will sort out, but fair play to you checking out on it before you go any further, it saves a lot of pointless viewings and messing about. Not such a newbie!

Its also worth checking on planning permissions.

irsy

Got it. Thank you, guys!

I might assume this house has been bought out from the local authority. As ** near the price on propertypriceregister.ie is very likely denotes that. Right?

What does it mean for me in terms of buying such a house, theoretically? Will I be a freehold owner of both land and building at the end?

drunkmonkey

Nothing it's just a house, I've one with both like that, ones bits got a folio and the other a big buch of old deeds and documents going back years. There kinda cool, a bit of history in them.

Dolbhad

irsy wrote: »

Got it. Thank you, guys!

I might assume this house has been bought out from the local authority. As ** near the price on propertypriceregister.ie is very likely denotes that. Right?

What does it mean for me in terms of buying such a house, theoretically? Will I be a freehold owner of both land and building at the end?

With every leasehold property, there is always a freehold element. So sometimes on landirect.ie you’ll see the green hatching which highlights leasehold but underneath the red spots (I think it’s spots) shows the freehold. But usually the owner of the leasehold and freehold is different. If the owner was the same person, they would usually merge the freehold and leasehold to that have freehold title. As long as you have a long leasehold there is no issue at all with the legal title. And you always have the option of buying out the freehold interest from the owner. So if it’s a long lease, it won’t prevent you owning the property.

More than likely the property was sold for less than market value. That can mean it’s been sold to a family member.

irsy

Dolbhad wrote: »

With every leasehold property, there is always a freehold element. So sometimes on landirect.ie you’ll see the green hatching which highlights leasehold but underneath the red spots (I think it’s spots) shows the freehold. But usually the owner of the leasehold and freehold is different. If the owner was the same person, they would usually merge the freehold and leasehold to that have freehold title. As long as you have a long leasehold there is no issue at all with the legal title. And you always have the option of buying out the freehold interest from the owner. So if it’s a long lease, it won’t prevent you owning the property.

More than likely the property was sold for less than market value. That can mean it’s been sold to a family member.

Thank you for the clear explanation! I understand that if a lease is long enough there is almost no difference, but if it's not...

I might be asking a stupid question, but what potentially might be the cost of buying out of the freehold interest from the owner? This particular house is in Co. Dublin where the cost of the land is quite significant. Does it mean the buyer has to pay the market price of the land to the owner?

L1011

Less than 70 years remaining and you probably won't get a mortgage.

Its not based on market value - nowhere near even if the lease is nearly expired or actually out. It also somewhat depends who the freeholder is and if they agree a price. This is something we have a very good system for that is vastly more equitable than the UK one - avoid reading UK info, its useless here.

Dublin City Council is a common freeholder for more modern (taking the basis that leasehold properties of the old type stopped in the 70s, the 70s is "modern" here!) properties in Dublin and they have a worked out price to buy:

http://www.dublincity.ie/housing-and-community-i-own-my-home-section/buying-domestic-ground-rent-freehold

If its a private holder, you can either agree a price or go to arbitration. If the owner can't be contacted I believe it goes to arbitration automatically - in my own estate the registered freeholder is liquidated and I believe notionally the Department of Finance holds the lands now as the residue; bit of a mess but mines already freehold so I've not had to figure out what's done here.

Arbitration decisions I've heard of were often 10x the annual ground rent.

https://www.prai.ie/guidelines-for-ground-rents-purchase-scheme/

Some new builds are leasehold with management companies; this is a different concept. You can't buy these out, but the leases are usually 999 years.

Dolbhad

L1011 wrote: »

Less than 70 years remaining and you probably won't get a mortgage.

Its not based on market value - nowhere near even if the lease is nearly expired or actually out. It also somewhat depends who the freeholder is and if they agree a price. This is something we have a very good system for that is vastly more equitable than the UK one - avoid reading UK info, its useless here.

Dublin City Council is a common freeholder for more modern (taking the basis that leasehold properties of the old type stopped in the 70s, the 70s is "modern" here!) properties in Dublin and they have a worked out price to buy:

http://www.dublincity.ie/housing-and-community-i-own-my-home-section/buying-domestic-ground-rent-freehold

If its a private holder, you can either agree a price or go to arbitration. If the owner can't be contacted I believe it goes to arbitration automatically - in my own estate the registered freeholder is liquidated and I believe notionally the Department of Finance holds the lands now as the residue; bit of a mess but mines already freehold so I've not had to figure out what's done here.

Arbitration decisions I've heard of were often 10x the annual ground rent.

https://www.prai.ie/guidelines-for-ground-rents-purchase-scheme/

Some new builds are leasehold with management companies; this is a different concept. You can't buy these out, but the leases are usually 999 years.

Pretty much as above. 70 years or less is not good marketable title. Bank won’t lend on it. Also closer to the expiration of the lease, the more expensive it can get to buy the freehold if it’s owned privately. The value of the leasehold can be cheap. The lease will set out the “rent” and based on that. It’s the legal fees and registration that’s more expensive. As long as you have an entitlement to buy our freehold, you can. If owner doesn’t want to sell, you can go to arbitration. Also if you can’t find the owner of freehold title, it goes to arbitration.

Apartments are by their nature always leasehold and you’ll never get the freehold but the fact that everyone shares the roof etc. But generally leasehold was given instead of freehold on land so covenants could be put in the lease to bind the new owners.

The PRAI website as a lot of information on grounds rents which is basically buying out the freehold.