Irishman extradited to US sent to prison! Team America: World Police.

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

I find it wrong that an Irish person can be extradited to the US and given a prison sentence over there when all of his alleged crimes happened while he was in Ireland.

Sending an Irish person off to an American prison seems like a very cruel punishment for anyone. The Silk Road servers were located in Iceland as far as I know.

Should we send all Irish distillers off to face the Saudi Arabian criminal justice system for making alcohol?
Or all Irish people who are gay married off to Pakistan to face their criminal justice system?
Or every Irish person on the island off to a North Korean gulag as we don't sing to their glorious leader every morning?

Since when did it become okay to extradite Irish citizens to face criminal punishment in a country that they have never even stepped foot in?

This has set a really bad precedent. :mad:


An Irish man who was extradited to the US has been sentenced to more than six years in prison for his role in helping operate the Silk Road website.

Eric Cartman

for a non violent offence of being a sysadmin for an 'illegal' business there is no way in hell he should have been extradited, shouldnt have even faced prison time really, its not like he owned the thing or actually shipped drugs.
Utter disgrace.

notobtuse

He pleaded guilty to narcotics conspiracy? Something tells me there is more to the story than the article presented.

BaronVon

Crime has no borders, so why so law enforcement? Although it could be argued that the offences he committed were also offences here, then I would prefer for him to be prosecuted here.

Shefwedfan

Let the US pay for him while he is in prison, why should we?

We should ship them all over their, save us a fortune

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Let the US pay for him while he is in prison, why should we?

We should ship them all over their, save us a fortune

Who is 'them' that should be shipped over there?

Irish citizens?

Donald Trump

I'm sure that if the boot was on the other foot and someone in the US was facilitating the importation of dangerous illegal drugs to Ireland, and the Irish authorities could prove it, they'd try to have him extradited.


Else I will set up a Silk Road 3.0 and just have admins in US looking after Irish "clients" and admins in Ireland looking after US clients

Shefwedfan

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo wrote: »

Who is 'them' that should be shipped over there?

Irish citizens?

Them is people in jail....

Ship them all over....save us a fortune in tax feeding and watering them

biko

This is scary indeed.
US can order the Irish government to give up an Irish citizen?
I doubt US would hand over a US citizen to us for something bad he did on the internet.

Shefwedfan

biko wrote: »

This is scary indeed.
US can order the Irish government to give up an Irish citizen?
I doubt US would hand over a US citizen to us for something bad he did on the internet.

He was part of a multi million drug business

Irishphotodesk

He isn't the first to have been extradited ... Eric Eoin Marquez was sent before him - he was accused of being the largest child porn facilitator on the planet according to an FBI agent.

I'm sure the CEOs of Google, Facebook etc are thinking they could be next but they have money/information pouring into the US government so maybe a blind eye is turned.

The dark web exists because criminality exists and anyone who didn't think criminals would use the technologies available to them to circumvent the law is an idiot, the laws are not written to properly police the online world and as such the various law enforcements seek innovative ways to cut off some of the elements involved.

I have been in court for both Marques and Davis cases over the past 6yrs and believe they should both be back in Ireland but also believe the Irish system couldn't punish them if they were guilty of anything, our law makers can't/won't make laws clear enough or fast enough unless it directly impacts the right people.

If you look at how quickly "legal highs" were outlawed because head shops were operating and the government didn't know how to tackle them, legalise the products and you have a fresh income stream, however if they remained open you potentially faced legal actions for injuries/addictions or crimes committed while under the influence of "legal highs".... It shows that the government can make changes quickly when they want to.... Has there been any substantial movement to regulate the insurance industry or the banking industry or even the political arena properly .... And appropriately bring accountability to those who created the economic crash and those who profited from it !

Sorry if it feels like my rant is veering off topic, I have issues with the glaring inefficiency within multiple facets of the Irish systems.

biko

Shefwedfan wrote: »

He was part of a multi million drug business

Then he should have been tried and sentenced here.
What kind of country gives up its citizens?

Timberrrrrrrr

biko wrote: »

Then he should have been tried and sentenced here.
What kind of country gives up its citizens?

If you commit a crime in another country then you csn be extradited and tried in that country. He broke the law, pretty simple imo.

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

Prison is a very substantial punishment. Serving that sentence thousands of miles away in a foreign land, where you don't know anyone, no family or friends to visit, then the punishment becomes multiple times more harsh on anyone convicted.

The difference I saw with that other case involving porn was that the person extradited was Dutch.

This was an Irish citizen, extradited to a different continent to face charges and prison, for alleged crimes he committed while in Ireland.

The case really is unprecedented. And I think it is wrong that the Gardai, courts and justice system didn't protect the rights of an Irish citizen.

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

If you commit a crime in another country then you csn be extradited and tried in that country. He broke the law, pretty simple imo.

He didn't commit any crime while in the United States. He committed these crimes in Irish jurisdiction, and as an Irish citizen should only have ever been prosecuted in Irish courts.

Timberrrrrrrr

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo wrote: »

He didn't commit any crime while in the United States. He committed these crimes in Irish jurisdiction, and as an Irish citizen should only have ever been prosecuted in Irish courts.

I agree with you, i don't think he should have been extradited, shìt i don't think the courts should have even entertained the extradition request. But unfortunately (for him) the yanks have pull and some sort of "international law" seems to have been invoked.

Dangerous precedent has been set imo, what next? Extradition for calling Trump a cvnt?

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

I agree with you, i don't think he should have been extradited, shìt i don't think the courts should have even entertained the extradition request. But unfortunately (for him) the yanks have pull and some sort of "international law" seems to have been invoked.

Dangerous precedent has been set imo, what next? Extradition for calling Trump a cvnt?

I wonder have I 'technically' committed felonies for streaming US sports from time to time.

Yeah I'm obviously not worried about being extradited because of it. But the fact that this can be done now concerns me to a fair degree.

It opens up a whole can of worms. As an Irish person living in Ireland I must obey Irish law, European law is in place for a number of things as well (although it's not in the business of jailing people).
It seems like now we are also living under American law.

I feel like 'official Ireland' did this Irish citizen a grave disservice.

He is also on the autism spectrum and has social issues. Sending him to serve prison time in the US is as extreme a punishment as anyone living in the state could face.

Even when he gets out he has 3/4 years of probation to serve. Which could well have to happen in America as well. What's he meant to do then?

He's really been fed to the wolves here.

Shefwedfan

biko wrote: »

Then he should have been tried and sentenced here.
What kind of country gives up its citizens?

Get rid of the sc*m....every country would do the same if they could.....


He was the mod, was fully aware of what was going on....he settled arguements between buyer/seller in the US..... the transactions happened in the US.....


Why exactly would he be sentenced in Ireland?

Ship him off, I would have filled the plane with a few of his mates in prison and keep their passports so they can't come back

Franz Von Peppercorn II

The US is effectively a world empire.

Mean Laqueefa

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Get rid of the sc*m....every country would do the same if they could.....


He was the mod, was fully aware of what was going on....he settled arguements between buyer/seller in the US..... the transactions happened in the US.....


Why exactly would he be sentenced in Ireland?

Ship him off, I would have filled the plane with a few of his mates in prison and keep their passports so they can't come back

Because you dont disown one of your own and send them you a foreign country to face harsher sentences for running a website no matter shady practices were ongoing. It sets a very bad president for future events and shows no backbone.

Not having the laws and facility's and infrastructure to do it on our own is another matter and is what people should be be concerned about.

Transactions were carried about by a buyer and selling no ?
Both agreed said terms ?
If problems said ''Mod'' did his best to resolve ?

Seems like people buying drugs and good chance stopping that in any way or form, it makes people happy regardless if some dont like it.

From ''Gary's'' pov this happened in Wicklow, he should be investigated, tried, etc here and punished under our system, does his ISP have insurances measure go they cant be found somewhat at fault for allowing of service ?

biko

So if a moderator on boards is an American that never left the USA, and commits a crime on the site, let's say a death threat - she or he should then be extradited to Ireland to be judged and sentenced here?
Because he threatened an Irish citizen on an dot ie board?
What if the servers are in France? Did the crime happen in France?
What if the person the American moderator threatened was English, posting from UK?

I am not trying to diffuse matters but online stuff is tricky.

Mainly I'm pissed the Irish authorities bent over so easily for the yanks.
I suppose I'm just one of those people that take citizenship seriously.

lordlame

There’s no reasoning with these simpletons ... he should of been tried in Ireland, end of.

Shefwedfan

The attitude on here is gas, as if this guy didn’t know what he was doing. He was critical to the website and was getting paid handsomely for it.

Trying to compare to a mod saying they would put a thread on board is incorrect. This guy was pushing million and million of euro of drugs and taking margin on it.

The website was for the US, he was aware of what he was doing and saying a server is here or there makes no difference

If this website was used in Ireland then yes he should be sentenced here but it wasn’t, the people of affected was in the US, the reason these guys done it from outside the US was because they thought it would give them some sort of protection

He is no better than the sc*m in Dublin shooting each other, send him off to the US, let him rot and hopefully never to come back

It less sc*m dealers Ireland needs, not more

Shefwedfan

Mean Laqueefa wrote: »

Because you dont disown one of your own and send them you a foreign country to face harsher sentences for running a website no matter shady practices were ongoing. It sets a very bad president for future events and shows no backbone.

Not having the laws and facility's and infrastructure to do it on our own is another matter and is what people should be be concerned about.

Transactions were carried about by a buyer and selling no ?
Both agreed said terms ?
If problems said ''Mod'' did his best to resolve ?

Seems like people buying drugs and good chance stopping that in any way or form, it makes people happy regardless if some dont like it.

From ''Gary's'' pov this happened in Wicklow, he should be investigated, tried, etc here and punished under our system, does his ISP have insurances measure go they cant be found somewhat at fault for allowing of service ?

No it didn’t happen in Wicklow

It happened in the US, he happened to reside in Wicklow. The crime and the transaction happened in the US....

No drugs got sold in Wicklow, he facilitated the selling of drugs in US so the crime was on US soil so he gets sent to the US

What are Ireland going to prosecute him for exactly? What crime did he commit here? On Irish soil?

Glass fused light

biko wrote: »

Then he should have been tried and sentenced here.
What kind of country gives up its citizens?

It's as difficult as can be to be extradited from this country. Most of the early cases were going to be charged in UK courts so the bar was set high.
The State can offer to accecpt a transfer from the country of conviction and house an Irish Citizen here while serving their sentence.
It's common pratice to consider doing this within the EU so if the US agreed he could be repatriated.

suicide_circus

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

The US is effectively a world empire.

better them than the other candidates

CIARAN_BOYLE

biko wrote: »

So if a moderator on boards is an American that never left the USA, and commits a crime on the site, let's say a death threat - she or he should then be extradited to Ireland to be judged and sentenced here?
Because he threatened an Irish citizen on an dot ie board?
What if the servers are in France? Did the crime happen in France?
What if the person the American moderator threatened was English, posting from UK?

I am not trying to diffuse matters but online stuff is tricky.

I suppose in this case you might see where the victims are located.

So an American boards.Ie moderator runs an invite only forum. Inside that forum is an market place to arrange the delivery and sale of drugs to dealers across Ireland. The delivery of enough Heroine to Irish shores to supply 1,000 addicts is arranged here.

The moderator is paid a cut from the deals arranged in this forum.

The victims are Irish and you can be sure as hell the Irish government will want the moderator when identified.

The child porn admin extradition that was in the papers recently is another case. It's less clearcut imo because its harder to identify the victims as being American. I'll be honest and admit that my first response was that at least he will get a prison sentence over there.

Glass fused light

CIARAN_BOYLE wrote: »

The child porn admin extradition that was in the papers recently is another case. It's less clearcut imo because its harder to identify the victims as being American. I'll be honest and admit that my first response was that at least he will get a prison sentence over there.

I think that the fact that the FBI had a viable case with both. Plus the full right of the suspect processed through the Irish courts before the State will transport a citizen out to the state has to be taken in context.

If we as a state decide that we won't extradite are we wiling to apply all Irish law to citizens on side of the state?
Or will we become a haven for citizens who commit crime abroad and the flee back here

Flibble

Don't forget that in the case of Eric Eoin Marques, he held dual citizenship. He was Irish/American, so it wasn't quite the same as just extraditing an Irish citizen to a country they've no ties to. The FBI had a much stronger claim to him than this guy (I assume, I'm not too versed on the details).