Should Israel really be condemned and boycotted?

Das Reich · 07-08-2019 3:52pm

My opinion is that Arab Christians are the real natives of those lands and Palestine is another place messed up after English colonization and English decolonization (the former is always worse than the first).

tayto lover · 07-08-2019 3:53pm

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Are you concerned for example with what happens in Lagos,Nigeria?

A mere 5271 kilometrs distant:

Here's 65 people killed in one day

Here's 30 more

After 2 seconds of googling./..all these innocent people..why arent you defending them and condemning Boko Haram?

Yes I’m concerned about any downtrodden peoples.
Start a thread on them and I’ll comment.

I also contributed to famine relief in many African countries.

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 3:54pm

The Enbalmer wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cD2FezhJgqA

"protestors" my arse..they're being trained for genocide..

I have no idea if those subtitles are correct.

Sephardim and mizrahim speak arabic usually as their first language. So whatever is out there on palestinian media they are seeing it too.

Which might explain why when it comes to palestine they generally so harsh.

end of the road · 07-08-2019 3:54pm

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Israel is 5700 kms from ireland,i really don't see why people over here regard it as any of their business.

lots of countries are thousands of miles away. that means nothing and does not prohibit discussion of them.
also, we have had israely agents using irish passports to do god knows what so certainly israel is our business. israel also claims to be a western style democracy and expects undying support no matter what.
a country will become one's business if they decide themselves that it should, in the name of discussion.

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Antisemitism is the only explanation.

israel's behaviour is the explanation.
aiming the old antisemitism allegation at people no longer works. it's bankrupt and nobody falls for it anymore.

The Enbalmer · 07-08-2019 3:55pm

tayto lover wrote: »

Yes I’m concerned about any downtrodden peoples.
Start a thread on them and I’ll comment.

I also contributed to famine relief in many African countries.

So downtrodden to you doesn't include being under siege by hostile neighbours,constant terrorist attacks and people on the other side of the world condemning them?

Do you support Hammas?

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 3:56pm

tayto lover wrote: »

Yes I’m concerned about any downtrodden peoples.
Start a thread on them and I’ll comment.

I also contributed to famine relief in many African countries.

Israel brought whole tribes to israel.

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 3:58pm

end of the road wrote: »

lots of countries are thousands of miles away. that means nothing and does not prohibit discussion of them.
also, the we have had israely agents using irish passports to do god knows what so certainly israel is our business. israel also claims to be a western style democracy and expects undying support no matter what.
a country will become one's business if they decide themselves that it should, in the name of discussion.

israel's behaviour is the explanation.
aiming the old antisemitism allegation at people no longer works. it's bankrupt and nobody falls for it anymore.

You realize like half of Israeli jews have arabic as their first language?

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 4:00pm

end of the road wrote: »

lots of countries are thousands of miles away. that means nothing and does not prohibit discussion of them.
also, the we have had israely agents using irish passports to do god knows what so certainly israel is our business. israel also claims to be a western style democracy and expects undying support no matter what.
a country will become one's business if they decide themselves that it should, in the name of discussion.

israel's behaviour is the explanation.
aiming the old antisemitism allegation at people no longer works. it's bankrupt and nobody falls for it anymore.

Ok why bring jews into it then? Why bring all israelis into then? Why not limit it to the israeli govt?

and i mean its been said half the jewish population of the world live in Israel.

The Enbalmer · 07-08-2019 4:01pm

end of the road wrote: »

lots of countries are thousands of miles away. that means nothing and does not prohibit discussion of them.
also, the we have had israely agents using irish passports to do god knows what so certainly israel is our business. israel also claims to be a western style democracy and expects undying support no matter what.
a country will become one's business if they decide themselves that it should, in the name of discussion.

Gibberish.

end of the road wrote: »

israel's behaviour is the explanation.
aiming the old antisemitism allegation at people no longer works. it's bankrupt and nobody falls for it anymore.

Who is this "£nobody" you speak of?

A load of leftist scumbags who support Hmmas and ISIS in the name of destroying western culture and civilisation?

Israel could glass it's "neighbours" back to the stone age if it so chooses but instead it opts for a progressive style of policing unlike it's arab enemies who have pledged the destruction not only of Israel but of ALL JEWS.

The arab cowards are too afraid to take Israel on in a military campaign so they brainwash children into committing terrorist outrages and Israel has no option sometimes to respond..and you support the HAMMAS-led insurgency?

Well then you also support ISIL and have no business in this country or in the West.

James Brown · 07-08-2019 4:02pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Lots of things are happening in the world. Much worse Syria Yemen. China. Myanamar. Burma.

Its like they have been inducted into a debate.

I am not saying you can't or should not support palestine. But I don't get the visceral hate expressed to jews and israelis.

I mean you had the lord mayor of dublin turn up to an event to celebrate the grand mufti then he says he didn't know the mufti helped hitler when photos surface online of the two men meeting.

Its mad if you didn't know who he was why did you go?

Israel and palestine are equally bad or equally good whatever way you look at it. Like unionists and nationalists the only way forward is reconciliation.

You should report such comments.
Victims of oppression aren't guilty of anything IMO.

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 4:18pm

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Victims of oppression aren't guilty of anything IMO.

Right. Well its nothing to do with me from here on in.

end of the road · 07-08-2019 4:19pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Their rockets are pretty effective. Guided too.

Israelis build bomb shelters though.

Palestine does not.

the vast majority of them land in uninhabited areas. they are really ineffective.

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Are you concerned for example with what happens in Lagos,Nigeria?

A mere 5271 kilometrs distant:

Here's 65 people killed in one day

Here's 30 more

After 2 seconds of googling./..all these innocent people..why arent you defending them and condemning Boko Haram?

because the thread is discussing israel. if you want to discuss Boko Haram perhapse start a thread on it yourself instead of expecting everyone else to do all of the work for you.

Strumms · 07-08-2019 4:21pm

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Israel is 5700 kms from ireland,i really don't see why people over here regard it as any of their business.

Antisemitism is the only explanation.

It’s not. People here can relate to the conflicts and difficulty involved where one nation wrongly claims sovereignty over another states land. They can relate and be sympathetic to the difficulty and the bullying that Palestine have had to endure for decades.

If you have any involvement whatsoever yourself with the ‘state’ of Israel through whatever medium you will appreciate the mindset that has proliferated bullying and skulduggery throughout the world but the Middle East in particular ...it often goes under the radar so as not to offend certain individuals and certain mindsets.

The Israel vs Palestine issue to me was always something on the news, just ‘another conflict’...then I ended up working for a company that had a contract with the Israeli embassy here and let’s say my eyes were opened, that’s all I’ll say. Boy my sympathies with Palestine rose 9000000000 fold.

end of the road · 07-08-2019 4:25pm

The Enbalmer wrote: »

So downtrodden to you doesn't include being under siege by hostile neighbours,constant terrorist attacks and people on the other side of the world condemning them?

oh it absolutely is, hence my support for the rights of the palestinians to have their own state and my condemnation of israel's aggression, colonisation and land theft.
israel certainly isn't under siege.

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Do you support Hammas?

no, but i completely understand why they exist and defend their territory.

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 4:25pm

Strumms wrote: »

It’s not. People here can relate to the conflicts and difficulty involved where one nation wrongly claims sovereignty over another states land. They can relate and be sympathetic to the difficulty and the bullying that Palestine have had to endure for decades.

If you have any involvement whatsoever yourself with the ‘state’ of Israel through whatever medium you will appreciate the mindset that has proliferated bullying and skulduggery throughout the world but the Middle East in particular ...it often goes under the radar so as not to offend certain individuals and certain mindsets.

The Israel vs Palestine issue to me was always something on the news, just ‘another conflict’...then I ended up working for a company that had a contract with the Israeli embassy here and let’s say my eyes were opened, that’s all I’ll say. Boy my sympathies with Palestine rose 9000000000 fold.

Why do they always drag jews not from israel into it?

The Enbalmer · 07-08-2019 4:25pm

Strumms wrote: »

It’s not. People here can relate to the conflicts and difficulty involved where one nation wrongly claims sovereignty over another states land.

Well then you should have no problem with Israel whatsoever. The Holy Land being the home of the tribes of Israel for 1000 years before Mohammed and his Islamic hordes killed and expelled the jews around the year AD 500.

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 4:27pm

I remember an interview with the chief rabbi of Ireland. He is from the uk ...all of a sudden out of nowhere the interviewer asks him about israel.

tayto lover · 07-08-2019 4:27pm

The Enbalmer wrote: »

So downtrodden to you doesn't include being under siege by hostile neighbours,constant terrorist attacks and people on the other side of the world condemning them?

Do you support Hammas?

You’re not downtrodden if you have the might of the IDF behind you.
You are if you only have a poorly armed (in comparison) Hamas behind you.

I do not support Hamas in any way but I can see why they exist.
With people being chased from their homes which are then bulldozed groups of fighters will always come to the fore.

Strumms · 07-08-2019 4:32pm

I have zero problem with the place, the people in the majority but yes to their actions in the political spheres.... but they get highlighted it’s countered with...’but ohhh but Palestine’ but ‘ohhhh poor us’... I’ve worked with Israeli people as have my family and hand on heart they were sound... one being a fantastic employer in law... but the state.... hmmmm

The Enbalmer · 07-08-2019 4:33pm

tayto lover wrote: »

You’re not downtrodden if you have the might of the IDF behind you.
You are if you only have a poorly armed (in comparison) Hamas behind you.

I do not support Hamas in any way but I can see why they exist.
With people being chased from their homes which are then bulldozed groups of fighters will always come to the fore.

You don't know what you're talking about:Hammas are dedicated to destroying israel AND THE JEWS in their entirety.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas_Covenant

he original Charter identified Hamas as the Muslim Brotherhood in Palestine and declares its members to be Muslims who "fear God and raise the banner of Jihad in the face of the oppressors." The charter states that "our struggle against the Jews is very great and very serious" and calls for the eventual creation of an Islamic state in Palestine, in place of Israel and the Palestinian Territories,[3] and the obliteration or dissolution of Israel.[4][5] It emphasizes the importance of jihad, stating in article 13, "There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors."[6] The charter also states that Hamas is humanistic, and tolerant of other religions as long as they "stop disputing the sovereignty of Islam in this region".[7] The Charter adds that "renouncing any part of Palestine means renouncing part of the religion" of Islam.[1]

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/kill-all-the-jews-says-senior-hamas-figure-zvx9jshbb

Ramallah A senior member of Hamas, the Islamist rulers of Gaza, has told Palestinians across the globe to kill Jews. In a video of a speech on Friday, Fathi Hamad said: “Seven million Palestinians outside, enough warming up, you have Jews with you in every place. You should attack every Jew possible in all the world and kill them.”

Odhinn · 07-08-2019 4:33pm

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Gibberish.

Who is this "£nobody" you speak of?

A load of leftist scumbags who support Hmmas and ISIS in the name of destroying western culture and civilisation?

Israel could glass it's "neighbours" back to the stone age if it so chooses but instead it opts for a progressive style of policing unlike it's arab enemies who have pledged the destruction not only of Israel but of ALL JEWS.

The arab cowards are too afraid to take Israel on in a military campaign so they brainwash children into committing terrorist outrages and Israel has no option sometimes to respond..and you support the HAMMAS-led insurgency?

Well then you also support ISIL and have no business in this country or in the West.

One of the most fact free, ranting and rabid posts I've seen in quite some time. Well done, as you've a high bar to reach.

progressive style of policing

This, however, makes me wonder if you're a bit of a WUM. Palestinians in the OT are subject to Israeli military law, sans the protection of the Geneva convention. Not so for Israeli colonists

https://www.yesh-din.org/en/category/accountability/

https://www.yesh-din.org/en/category/settler-violence/

tayto lover · 07-08-2019 4:40pm

Odhinn wrote: »

One of the most fact free, ranting and rabid posts I've seen in quite some time. Well done, as you've a high bar to reach.

This, however, makes me wonder if you're a bit of a WUM. Palestinians in the OT are subject to Israeli military law, sans the protection of the Geneva convention. Not so for Israeli colonists

https://www.yesh-din.org/en/category/accountability/

https://www.yesh-din.org/en/category/settler-violence/

He followed it up with another one above.

The Enbalmer · 07-08-2019 4:42pm

Odhinn wrote: »

One of the most fact free, ranting and rabid posts I've seen in quite some time. Well done, as you've a high bar to reach.

Would you care to refute it then or are you relying on your usual trick of sniping from the sidelines..ever watchful for a sematic way of crying "wacist" at every post?

Are you a supporter of Hammas and ISIL?

The Enbalmer · 07-08-2019 4:45pm

tayto lover wrote: »

He followed it up with another one above.

Looking for help are you?

Try your buddies in ISIL they're always looking for disenfranchised westerners to convert.

end of the road · 07-08-2019 4:49pm

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Gibberish.

except it's not. it's reality.

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Who is this "£nobody" you speak of?

nobody as in most sensible people who see it for what it is

The Enbalmer wrote: »

A load of leftist scumbags who support Hmmas and ISIS in the name of destroying western culture and civilisation?

if i remember rightly it was mostly the right who called for the support, training, and arming of isis. before isis showed their true colors we were being told how they were the greatist thing ever.

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Israel could glass it's "neighbours" back to the stone age if it so chooses but instead it opts for a progressive style of policing unlike it's arab enemies who have pledged the destruction not only of Israel but of ALL JEWS.

israel could only do that because it has nukes. nukes it effectively got illegally. it does not opt for a progressive style of policing, but instead engages in a slow process to achieve it's aims to try and throw people off the cent. but we all know what they are actually up to.
also, the 2006 war they started wasn't actuallly a huge success for them.

The Enbalmer wrote: »

The arab cowards are too afraid to take Israel on in a military campaign so they brainwash children into committing terrorist outrages and Israel has no option sometimes to respond..and you support the HAMMAS-led insurgency?

israel has plenty of option to stop causing trouble and committing terrorism, colonisation, and land theft.
i support anybody defending themselves against an aggressive bully who thinks it has the right to do whatever it likes, and then tries to use it's religion, and horriffic actions carried out against people of that religion as justification for their acts, and who then throws accusations of being against that religion in an attempt to shut down criticism of their actions.

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Well then you also support ISIL and have no business in this country or in the West.

i don't support isis and have every business being in my home country.

The Enbalmer · 07-08-2019 4:54pm

end of the road wrote: »

except it's not. it's reality.

nobody as in most sensible people who see it for what it is

if i remember rightly it was mostly the right who called for the support, training, and arming of isis. before isis showed their true colors we were being told how they were the greatist thing ever.

israel could only do that because it has nukes. nukes it effectively got illegally. it does not opt for a progressive style of policing, but instead engages in a slow process to achieve it's aims to try and throw people off the cent. but we all know what they are actually up to.
also, the 2006 war they started wasn't actuallly a huge success for them.

israel has plenty of option to stop causing trouble and committing terrorism, colonisation, and land theft.
i support anybody defending themselves against an aggressive bully who thinks it has the right to do whatever it likes, and then tries to use it's religion, and horriffic actions carried out against people of that religion as justification for their acts, and who then throws accusations of being against that religion in an attempt to shut down criticism of their actions.

i don't support isis and have every business being in my home country.

You have no idea what you're talking about..you seem to glean your "facts" from handouts at student rallies...socialists/marxists/ISIL/MSA/Hammas supporters and traitors.

If you hate the western world and the concept of democracy so much you should leave and join ISIL..that is if you have the courage of your convictions.

You are unworthy of further engagement.

The Enbalmer · 07-08-2019 4:56pm

end of the road wrote: »

if i remember rightly it was mostly the right who called for the support, training, and arming of isis.

Sweet Jesus :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Idiocy..just idiocy.

end of the road · 07-08-2019 4:56pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Ok why bring jews into it then? Why bring all israelis into then? Why not limit it to the israeli govt?

and i mean its been said half the jewish population of the world live in Israel.

i haven't brought all jews or all of the israely people into it. i am very clear that israel does not represent all jews or even all of it's people.

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Well then you should have no problem with Israel whatsoever. The Holy Land being the home of the tribes of Israel for 1000 years before Mohammed and his Islamic hordes killed and expelled the jews around the year AD 500.

that's history, irrelevant to now.
many countries have been home to different people before foreign armies rocked up. it doesn't mean that those who can trace their herritage back further can force out people descended from those foreign armies and peoples today.

hamsin · 07-08-2019 4:58pm

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

How was your experience in the army?

What city are you from?

And erm why are you posting on an Irish forum are you living here?

Well, I prefer not to share my personal info details in internet.
I'm Jewish and live in the center of Israel.
I tried to find anything about the Irish Jewish community and found the thread "Ireland's Jewish community" on this forum. I didn't plan to post here and I'm not sure I will continue to post.

Odhinn · 07-08-2019 5:03pm

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Would you care to refute it then or are you relying on your usual trick of sniping from the sidelines..ever watchful for a sematic way of crying "wacist" at every post?

Are you a supporter of Hammas and ISIL?

Never heard of "hammas". There is a small grouping called "Hamas" that control Gaza, however. The main palestinian organisation is in the west bank, called Fatah/the PLO.

You realise that IS consider all palestinians as apostates? You might want to refresh your knowledge of the matter.

I don't support sectarian organisations generally, so no, I'm a fan of neither.

Should Israel really be condemned and boycotted?

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