Should Israel really be condemned and boycotted?

ILoveYourVibes

TaurenDruid wrote: »

Yeah. There is.

Let's see how that provision of water works out in practice:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_supply_and_sanitation_in_the_State_of_Palestine#Water_use_of_Israelis_versus_Palestinians

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/10/palestinian-villages-hours-water-week-161023105150024.html

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2011/sep/14/west-bank-villagers-battle-water

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-why-doesn-t-israel-want-palestinians-to-have-running-water-1.6959524

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20190307-israel-cuts-water-supply-to-2600-palestinians-in-jordan-valley/

(Apologies. One of those sources is nearly 8 years old. But they are all in English, at least. If those ones aren't good enough for you, I have more. But yeah - Israel steals Palestine's water.)

Not they don't.

Israel is the only one providing Palestinians with water.

Don't you GET IT?

Their own govt isn't bother providing water for its people. They think Israel should.


Yes israel STOPS supplying water for its enemies when they start bombing its people.

Why doesn't Palestine get up of its arse and supply its own people with water?

ILoveYourVibes

TaurenDruid wrote: »

I wonder is three anyone on boards doing that? Badly? Repeatedly?

Maybe even on this thread...

Yeah totally.

I am a Russian Israeli bot.

Israel is deeply concerned with Ireland.

I mean the USA and most of Europe is banning BDS campaigns but Israel is totally going to waste time and resources on a tiny Island.

TaurenDruid

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Not they don't.

Israel is the only one providing Palestinians with water.

Don't you GET IT?

Their own govt isn't bother providing water for its people. They think Israel should.


Yes israel STOPS supplying water for its enemies when they start bombing its people.

Why doesn't Palestine get up of its arse and supply its own people with water?

Asserting something (repeatedly) does not make it true. I've provided multiple sources demonstrating that Israeli steals water from Palestinians. Others have too. You're... just shouting.

end of the road

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Not they don't.

Israel is the only one providing Palestinians with water.

Don't you GET IT?

Their own govt isn't bother providing water for its people. They think Israel should.


Yes israel STOPS supplying water for its enemies when they start bombing its people.

Why doesn't Palestine get up of its arse and supply its own people with water?

israel steals their water as shown by a number of posters.
if the gazan government were to implement water infrastructure israel would destroy it.

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Yeah totally.

I am a Russian Israeli bot.

Israel is deeply concerned with Ireland.

I mean the USA and most of Europe is banning BDS campaigns but Israel is totally going to waste time and resources on a tiny Island.

banning bds campaigns won't make a difference. there are plenty of ways to organise them under the noses of the authorities. the bds campaign will win.
israel is very concerned about everywhere as people are slowly but surely waking up to the actions of it's government and the anti semitism accusations to anyone who criticises the actions of said governments are no longer working in shutting down such criticism.

ILoveYourVibes

end of the road wrote: »

banning bds campaigns won't make a difference. there are plenty of ways to organise them under the noses of the authorities.

You mean illegally?

ILoveYourVibes

TaurenDruid wrote: »

Asserting something (repeatedly) does not make it true. I've provided multiple sources demonstrating that Israeli steals water from Palestinians. Others have too. You're... just shouting.

I can't understand how you don't see reality.

I am typing and a lot more politely than some others on here.

end of the road

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

You mean illegally?

if people are organising the campaigns illegally then i have no problem with that.
countries banning people from organising a campaign to boycott a country who is misbehaving have something to hide. such campaigns should be allowed to sink or swim on their own merrits.

ILoveYourVibes

end of the road wrote: »

if people are organising the campaigns illegally then i have no problem with that.
countries banning people from organising a campaign to boycott a country who is misbehaving have something to hide. such campaigns should be allowed to sink or swim on their own merrits.

You realize in some countries they found they were funding terrorism not only in Palestine.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/27/world/middleeast/bds-israel-boycott-antisemitic.html

Opponents have attacked B.D.S. not just for failing to condemn violence but for allowing terrorists and their supporters under its umbrella. The B.D.S. National Committee’s members, for example, include the Council of National and Islamic Forces in Palestine. The council includes several groups designated by the United States as terrorist organizations, including Hamas, Palestinian Islamic Jihad and the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine.

hamsin

TaurenDruid wrote: »

I've provided multiple sources demonstrating that Israeli steals water from Palestinians. Others have too.

How much water has Israel "stolen" in the last year? Last 2 years? Any period of time?

bunderoon

hamsin wrote: »

TaurenDruid wrote: »

I've provided multiple sources demonstrating that Israeli steals water from Palestinians. Others have too.

How much water has Israel "stolen" in the last year? Last 2 years? Any period of time?

Are you inferring that it's Israel's water to begin with? Why the 'stolen' in quotes?

ILoveYourVibes

bunderoon wrote: »

Are you inferring that it's Israel's water to begin with? Why the 'stolen' in quotes?

Because as has been stated Israel is legally obliged to provide Palestine with all of its water. Palestine has no independent water system.

Its part of the Oslo agreement.

Palestinians don't collect or treat water. Except maybe on a tiny personal scale for some people.

Where would you steal it from?

Israel have 'CUT OFF' water at times but more so in Jordan.

Israel is also supposed to supply Jordan with water.

You guys probably don't know. But water is something israel is good at.

They are very efficient at recycling water treating it so that is why they are in this position in the region or part of why.

I mean in order to provide palestine with water and jordan with water as its legally obliged to Israel needs to collect water for them.

So how could they steal it? They HAVE to collect it. Otherwise they can't provide what they are obligated to provide both countries with.

You seem to be saying they are stealing water from palestinians ....but they have to collect water for palestinians ..

What you are saying makes no sense.

If you were saying they cut off water sometimes or let it run on low pressure only that is true at times when Hamas is attacking Israel.

But in Israel's defense ..they say the system is leaky on the palestinian side. Which even hamas admits.

It needs replacing to be more efficient.

bunderoon

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

bunderoon wrote: »

Are you inferring that it's Israel's water to begin with? Why the 'stolen' in quotes?

Because as has been stated Israel is legally obliged to provide Palestine with all of its water. Palestine has no independent water system.

Its part of the Oslo agreement.

Palestinians don't collect or treat water. Except maybe on a tiny personal scale for some people.

Where would you steal it from?

Israel have 'CUT OFF' water at times but more so in Jordan.

Israel is also supposed to supply Jordan with water.

You guys probably don't know. But water is something israel is good at.

They are very efficient at recycling water treating it so that is why they are in this position in the region or part of why.

I mean in order to provide palestine with water and jordan with water as its legally obliged to Israel needs to collect water for them.

So how could they steal it? They HAVE to collect it. Otherwise they can't provide what they are obligated to provide both countries with.

You seem to be saying they are stealing water from palestinians ....but they have to collect water for palestinians ..

What you are saying makes no sense.

If you were saying they cut off water sometimes or let it run on low pressure only that is true at times when Hamas is attacking Israel.

But in Israel's defense ..they say the system is leaky on the palestinian side. Which even hamas admits.

It needs replacing to be more efficient.

Who did own the west bank water supply and who owns it now? Who owns/controls it now?

Give this a read. Curious to why you omitted the vast majority of it....
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_supply_and_sanitation_in_the_State_of_Palestine

ILoveYourVibes

bunderoon wrote: »

Who did own the west bank water supply and who owns it now? Who owns/controls it now?

Give this a read. Curious to why you omitted the vast majority of it....
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_supply_and_sanitation_in_the_State_of_Palestine

Of course Israel controls it now. That was part of the Oslo agreement.

You don't get it do you. After Egypt and Jordan left in 67 did you see the state of sanitation in Palestine?

If Israel hadn't stepped in they would dead.

Its a desert. Its not about natural resources there aren't enough. It doesn't work that way.

Its about TECHNOLOGY.

It it were up to nature it would be one of the most water stressed regions in the world.

As for stealing water.

The Palestinian-Arabs steal Israel’s water by drilling illegal holes into Israel’s water lines. Israel has to repair around 600 of these illegal taps each year. When Israel asks to work with the PA to prevent theft through joint water patrols, the PA refuses every time.


The PA is not developing new sewage or desalinization plants – a violation of the Oslo Accords it signed with Israel in 1993. The PA has only built one sewage plant in the past 15 years. A horrifying 95 percent of its sewage goes untreated, contaminating the same water sources that lead into Israel.

ILoveYourVibes

bunderoon wrote: »

Who did own the west bank water supply and who owns it now? Who owns/controls it now?

Give this a read. Curious to why you omitted the vast majority of it....
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_supply_and_sanitation_in_the_State_of_Palestine

And for the last time JORDAN owned and controlled the west bank water supply.

Israel controls it now because Palestine signed it over and its obligated to supply both Jordan and Palestine with water.

There is no way Palestine could have supplied itself with water in 67 or now.

And prior to 67 Jordan owned water in the west bank and Egypt owned it in Gaza.


If you are talking in between 67 and 93 when Palestine signed over the rights to Israel. I don't think you understand what Palestine was like then. Only 10% of Palestinians were connected to a water supply in 67. THat is 95 % now. So you really think Israelis have been stealing water??

When jordan left only 10% of Palestinians had a water supply in the west bank ..israel took over the water supply now 95% of Palestinians have a water supply.


I think that mutes your argument.

Israel only uses their own allocation and helps get the Palestinian allocation into Palestinian homes.

end of the road

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

You realize in some countries they found they were funding terrorism not only in Palestine.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/27/world/middleeast/bds-israel-boycott-antisemitic.html

of course those who oppose bds will accuse the movement of all sorts. i amsurprised they haven't accused the movement and it's members of being anti semetic.

hamsin

bunderoon wrote: »

Why the 'stolen' in quotes?

Because I don't use idiotic anti-Israel rhetoric.

Atoms for Peace

end of the road wrote: »

of course those who oppose bds will accuse the movement of all sorts. i amsurprised they haven't accused the movement and it's members of being anti semetic.

You should always go for the head of the snake. The leadership of the BDS movement doesn't recognise the right for the state of Israel to exist.

TaurenDruid

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

And for the last time JORDAN owned and controlled the west bank water supply.


When jordan left only 10% of Palestinians had a water supply in the west bank ..israel took over the water supply now 95% of Palestinians have a water supply.


I think that mutes your argument.

Israel only uses their own allocation and helps get the Palestinian allocation into Palestinian homes.

It won't be the last time, though - you keep repeating yourself. And shouting.

That doesn't help you win an argument. It just makes others realise you have no argument.

Yes, we know Israel supplies water to Palestine. They also steal it, divert it, re-route it. Illegal Israeli settlements have swimming pools, and the downstream villages no longer have a stream...

And once again you've ignored the links I posted, showing this theft of water from Palestinians. You are in no way helping your cause, you're just demonstrating that you're a Zionist who can only see one side of an argument.

TheRepentent

I think the first 2 replies sum up the question asked in the OP.

Apartheid state with no regard for the human rights of the Palestinians. Murderous regime that has been allowed break UN sanctions unopposed.

Peace through ethnic cleansing is not to be commended

Bit cringeworthy that the zionist state is only being defended by an obvious hasbara shill and a re-reg troll.

end of the road

Atoms for Peace wrote: »

You should always go for the head of the snake. The leadership of the BDS movement doesn't recognise the right for the state of Israel to exist.

well that's ultimately their problem.
i don't agree with them (israel has a right to exist within the borders as set out for it in 1948) but the heads apparently believing it has no right to exist at all would not turn me against the movement.

Subcomandante Marcos

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

That was egypt.

And anyway ...why doesn't hamas re-open it?

Afraid of Egypt?

No. Israel controls the air and sea space around the Gaza strip and West Bank and enforces, viciously, a maximum three mile distance from the shore in which gazans can operate their fishing operations.

TaurenDruid

Subcomandante Marcos wrote: »

No. Israel controls the air and sea space around the Gaza strip and West Bank and enforces, viciously, a maximum three mile distance from the shore in which gazans can operate their fishing operations.

Even going to the beach can be fatal...

(But it's ok - the IDF exonerated themselves, so that's all right...)

ILoveYourVibes

end of the road wrote: »

of course those who oppose bds will accuse the movement of all sorts. i amsurprised they haven't accused the movement and it's members of being anti semetic.

People have been convicted in France and Germany

There is photographic evidence that some members of the council are members of hamas.

ILoveYourVibes

TaurenDruid wrote: »

Originally Posted by Subcomandante Marcos
No. Israel controls the air and sea space around the Gaza strip and West Bank and enforces, viciously, a maximum three mile distance from the shore in which gazans can operate their fishing operations.

Not for Gaza Egypt controls that area now.

ILoveYourVibes

TaurenDruid wrote: »

Yes, we know Israel supplies water to Palestine. They also steal it, divert it, re-route it. Illegal Israeli settlements have swimming pools, and the downstream villages no longer have a stream...

You really don't realize what the west bank is like do you.

Yes they do have swimming pools and hotels in the west bank.Nowadays, every city in the West Bank has a pool or a recreational complex.

YES EVERY CITY IN THE WEST BANK HAS A POOL. AND MANY MANY PEOPLE HAVE PRIVATE POOLS

You have just revealed you know nothing about the west bank.

There are more swimming pools in the west bank than there are in Dublin.

Israelis DO NOT use any more water than is allocated to them.

Anyone who says otherwise is lying.


There are in fact a few OLYMPIC sizes swimming pools in the west bank.

The murad tourist resort


..in Jericho (funded by the international Olympic committee) in Qalqiya



Hawara

ILoveYourVibes

Do you guys know how many luxury hotels there are in the west bank?? HUNDREDS!


There is luxury there.

https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-middle-east-20275448/palestinians-build-luxury-houses-in-the-miami-of-the-west-bank

Palestinians build luxury houses in the 'Miami of the West Bank'

Many expat Palestinians return to their hometown of Mazraa Sharqiya near Ramallah after seeking their fortunes abroad.

The luxury houses they build for their families have earned the village the nickname the 'Miami of the West Bank'.

Murad Shishani report

Nablus




Nablus



Hebron



The west bank is totally different to Gaza.

Even some parts of Gaza are nice.

ILoveYourVibes

Both of these pictures are from Gaza city.





Swimming pool in Gaza city.





Gaza city.

ILoveYourVibes

Most images people see of gaza are fafah or the strip. Not all parts of gaza are like that.

ILoveYourVibes

Also another thing that is destroying the Palestinian economy is the stand off between the Palestinian Authority Govt and the Hamas govt.

No one talks about how that is making Palestinians poorer.


All hamas does in response to the economy is go to war with Israel and wait for the international response of sympathy and rallying of nationalist support. Which they get which makes them do it more.

Unemployment in Gaza is at 52 %. Its NUTS!

And i mean i don't know about you but if i want a country to open up its borders to me i stop going to war with it.

TaurenDruid

So - another 7 posts (in a row!), more shouting down other people, and - of course - completely missing the point. Or deliberately diverting from it.

My extended family all have adequate housing - that doesn't mean that Ireland doesn't have a housing crisis or that I'm going to put up a homeless person in our spare room. Likewise, the water in a swimming pool in a city cannot supply the village or farmland that used to have a water supply - until an illegal settlement was built and diverted their water supply.

Here are the facts and examples you again ignored and failed to refute:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_supply_and_sanitation_in_the_State_of_Palestine#Water_use_of_Israelis_versus_Palestinians

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/10/palestinian-villages-hours-water-week-161023105150024.html

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2011/sep/14/west-bank-villagers-battle-water

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/.premium-why-doesn-t-israel-want-palestinians-to-have-running-water-1.6959524

https://www.middleeastmonitor.com/20190307-israel-cuts-water-supply-to-2600-palestinians-in-jordan-valley/

Here are a few new ones:

https://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2014/03/israel-water-miracle-palestine-20143247252981587.html

EU briefing: Water in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict

https://www.amnestyusa.org/pdf/mde150272009en.pdf

And there are dozens more...