Everything you always wanted to know about electric vehicle (but were afraid to ask)

Sabre Man

This is IEVOA chairperson Simon Acton's contribution to the panel discussion on empowering EV startups at the London EV Show 2021, where he talks about his own company, next eco car, which you can visit at nextecocar.ie.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dbfGazod_1E

shanec1928

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118604206#Comment_118604206

I might have missed it but do you have some affiliation to the above group posting all the videos from there channel.

Sabre Man

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118604281#Comment_118604281

Yes

Paul Kiernan

How do I look after the EV Battery?

For 10 or 11 months of the year I'll be doing only 100-200km a week in my new 58kw (say 300km) Ioniq 5. My granny charger on night rate can manage about 30% battery recharge per night.

So the question is should I charge in a certain way to help maintain the battery. Hyundai suggest letting drop to 20% then charge to 100% but some online advice suggests only charge to 80%. I have a multitude of options and no idea which one is best or if it even matters!

theinferior

How easy is it to steal an EV? Or to prevent its theft?

I park outside my house, but don't have a driveway...

verizon

Just to follow on to my previous query. I emailed the hotel I am going to be staying in about charging points, they don't currently have one (I knew this already) but they did offer to have a charging point installed in their carpark. I'm not sure if I'll have my EV by then but I said that would be great if they can :)

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118611938#Comment_118611938

Just charge as you need it. Don't worry about looking after the battery. It is unnecessary. The battery is already well protected by the BMS (battery management system). Whatever you do, it won't have any material impact on your range or the state of health of your battery. Just the one thing: don't leave your car fully charged for weeks or months on end. That's not great. Apart from that, don't worry about it, just enjoy your car.

markpb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118611938#Comment_118611938

It’s not good for some kinds of batteries to be left fully charged or nearly discharged for long. This is why the 20%-80% advice came into effect. Newer cars have a BMS feature which lies to it in order to protect the battery. If it says the battery is fully charged, it’s not. There’s a reserve left at the top so it won’t ever be fully charged. As unkel says, trust the BMS and it will look after the gory battery details for you.

Art2013

Hi I’m new to this site.. Just purchased an Ioniq 5 ..73kw premium .., a couple of questions.. how do I know this model has a heat pump and how do I know it’s working? I have Bluelink app .. by the way not user friendly.. but negotiating it better now…two weeks in and charging using Zappi at home.. not charging up to anything close to 481km at 100 % .. come out in morning it’s at 340km another morning 402km.. is this normal? Car is really nice to drive.. just these concerns.. also I read that a 77.4 km battery on the way in Feb/ March.. our 73.6 Kw has 2 of the 32 cells unused.. so only using 30 cells presently in the car.. can we get these working to increase our range? Will Hyundai do this for us? Why did they leave this early 2022 purchaser short?

MightyMunster

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118595718#Comment_118595718

It's based on your cars onboard charger.

11 is good, lots of cars are only single phase 7kw

KCross

not charging up to anything close to 481km at 100 % .. come out in morning it’s at 340km another morning 402km.. is this normal?

it’s normal that it changes a bit based on the outside temperature.

the type of driving done in the last few trips also affect it.

you are showing quite a large range though. Not sure about that. Maybe you are comparing a warm day with easy driving vs a frosty morning or something.

also I read that a 77.4 km battery on the way in Feb/ March.. our 73.6 Kw has 2 of the 32 cells unused.. so only using 30 cells presently in the car.. can we get these working to increase our range? Will Hyundai do this for us? Why did they leave this early 2022 purchaser short?

I think you might have misread that. There are rumours they plan to add 2 cells to new cars. You don’t have two unused cells in your car so what you got you got and that’s that.

cars get improved and specs change all the time.

crisco10

Been chatting to a few PHEV drivers and when I asked them how they maximise electricity use, the answer always seems to be drive it softly and gently. I.e. don't floor it. I noticed this myself on a couple of test drives as well.

But now I'm driving my BEV, and realising (what others said) is that the acceleration from the BEV is lightning and really torquey. So my question is, if Electric is so good at accelerating hard, why does that cause the ICE to kick in on a PHEV? "Fuel" conservation?

ted1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619467#Comment_118619467

Completely different gearing ratios and the motor is rated different, the electric motors on hybrids isn’t as powerful.

e.g the Tucson phev has a 69kW motor , the ID range as a 109-225 kw motor

Grumpypants

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619467#Comment_118619467

Smaller battery and smaller motor. Going faster uses more power so the Phev doesn't want to waste the electricity on acceleration over a short distance when it could be better used over a longer distance.

unkel

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118619467#Comment_118619467

Soft and gently is right. If even a Nissan Leaf is too fast for you, you might consider buying a PHEV 😁

But seriously I have heard from many disappointed PHEV owners. Thought they did the right thing going greener. Were a bit afraid of full electric, knew they would eventually go fully electric but decided to go half way this time and get "the best of both worlds". Of course they ended up with the worst of both worlds. You get the same performance as a slow boat petrol or diesel, nowhere near what an electric car can do. Any acceleration at all and the internal combustion engine kicks in. Range on electric far less than promised (which doesn't matter much in a BEV but you feel it directly in your wallet in a PHEV), general disappointment.

Sabre Man

You may presume that all the connectors of a charge point can be used at the same time, but that's not always the case, so in this video Inge will tell you which charge points allow for several connectors to be used at the same time, and which connectors they are.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANoufDUkMYs

PaulJoseph22

I have a PHEV, my brother an EV. He’s the one disappointed that he didn’t follow my path. PHEV is great for me, I’ll go full EV in a few years when we have a better charging network.

Paul Kiernan

PHEV v. BEV Efficiency

I just changed my BMW 530e for an Ioniq 5.

The 530 on a full charge (about 8kwh usable I think) only did about 20km of my typical city driving at this time of year so about 2.5km/kwh or 40kwh/100km.

The Ioniq, on the other hand, appears to be more than twice as good at over 5km/kwh or under 20kwh/100km!

Why such a big difference? One thing I have noticed is that the Ioniq 5 (if the figures can be trusted!) seems to get very good regen rates. About 6kwh for every 10kwh used.

PaulJoseph22

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118624357#Comment_118624357

It may depend on the year of BMW you have, I know that the new BME 330e have doubled the distance on the previous ones.

I can get 45km on electric in the Winter and it’s great when you’re driving around all day in a wide area that has no access to chargers you can click over to petrol.

Everyones experience and circumstances are different plus the way you drive the car is a big factor as well.

verizon

Just to follow on to my previous query. I emailed the hotel I am going to be staying in about charging points, they don't currently have one (I knew this already) but they did offer to have a charging point installed in their carpark. I'm not sure if I'll have my EV by then but I said that would be great if they can :)

unkel

It makes perfect business sense. They can write off the entire cost of the install against tax in the first year and electricity doesn't cost much to fill up a customer's car. When I now book a hotel I always ask up front if they have car charging and if they don't, they won't get my business. Simple.

innrain

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118624357#Comment_118624357

There are 2 limits on the energy recuperation.

First is the size of the motor. Bigger is better. In hybrids they are quite small in PHEVs they usually get bigger but much smaller than in EVs. Imagine that if you produce less mechanical energy in a given time with a smaller rated motor, the reverse is also true.

The second limiting factor is the battery size. Again bigger is better. In a small battery you can't add much energy in a short time even if the motor is able to produce it. Again hybrids have the smallest batteries ~<10kWh, PHEVs ~<15kWh while EVs roam around >50kWh.

I can workout numbers for each case but as a hand waving argument these 2 limitations put hybrids recuperation energy on a much lower scale compared to EVs.

Say you have to leave the motorway and slow down a 2t car from 120km/h to 60km/h that is around 200Wh energy difference or as charging goes 6 minutes on a 3 pin plug. The question is are you able to harvest it?

unkel

@innrain - have you a formula to calculate the energy based on mass, speed and or acceleration (deceleration)?

Bandana boy

I see a few lads on here have fitted their own Dash Cam , I previously have always had mine fitted professionally by Halfords.

I see as I plan too pick up my new EV this week when I tried to book a fitting with Halfords and they are refusing to fit Dash cams on EV or PHEV

Anybody know what this is about ? Does anybody know a retailer who installs on EV vehicles at the same price point (~40 euro)

Paul Kiernan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118628618#Comment_118628618

E = 1/2 x m x v(squared) but not sure what the units are! So a reduction in speed from 120 to 60 means you have to do something with three/quarters of the energy. Traditionally you heated up your discs!

Paul Kiernan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118629010#Comment_118629010

On further research I believe the units are Joules, kg and meters per second. 1 Joule = ! watt second so 3,600,000J = 1kwh so for a 2000kg car decelerating from 120km/h (33.3m/s) to 60km/h -

Energy = 3/4 x 1/2 x 2,000 x 33.3 x 33.3 = 831,000J = 0.23kwh

Grumpypants

Weird they don't install on EVs. Maybe more chance if something going wrong.

MG were smart enough to put a usb in the reader view mirror console so you just plug it in.

innrain

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118629094#Comment_118629094

That is absolutely brilliant Paul. Joule is the unit for energy in SI. Now before @unkel comes and disagree we must mention the above model works in the assumption of a flat surface and of course we discount drag variation with speed, losses due to heat, etc.

Usually the motorway slips are slopped but that is very easy to account for using potential energy E_p=mgh. assume g=10m/s2 h =10 m (not sure how high a motorway bridge is but safe enough) delta E_p= 200 000 J (Ws) or about a quarter of the gain from the kinetic energy. The reverse is also true. If you go down 10m in altitude you gain 56 Wh

Lets stay with 200 Wh figure for the moment (we assume we slowdown to 50km/h to compensate for the difference). What would be a comfortable time to perform the deceleration? I googled and found something like 3.4 m/s2 which yields the time required to reduce speed of 4.7 ~5s. We can calculate the theoretical power we can recuperate as Power = Energy / time => 144kW lets call it 100 kW. You need a motor capable of generating such power (which a HEV will never have, a PHEV will barely but a BEV mostly) and also a battery capable of accepting this power and we can repeat: HEV never, PHEV unlikely BEV mostly. So here is why BEVs will always have better recuperation and of course better overall efficiency. Sorry for such long posts

Paul Kiernan

Using your EV as a 220v power supply ....

With power outages around the country it seems a good time to ask this!

Excluding dedicated 220v units as in the new EV6/Ioniq5 V2L how realistic is it to get 220v power from an EV? I'm talking about the standard power inverters that come from 100w to 2000w or so and clip directly onto the 12v battery in most cases.

kanuseeme

Make sure its a pure sine wave inverter, the big question is, how much can you draw from the 12 v battery versus what rate it is being charged at from the traction battery.

Draw more than the charging rate and your 12 v is going to go flat after prolong heavy use.

I have a 1000 watt inverter, I would not use all of that 1000 watts for long periods only maybe half, I have used it on the well pump, but on and off as needed. I would believe that would be near its max capacity.

Modified sine wave inverter is the other type but it can damage some electronics, cannot say what .

unkel

You need to know what you are doing. Connect to the 12V lead acid and if the car isn't on / aware, it will drain very quickly and it is easy to drain the lead acid that way. The inverter would cut off and your car would not longer start, until you manage to jump start it or charge the battery from an external source first.

I have an inverter permanently connected on my Tesla, but these cars are "always on", so you don't run that risk. Obviously you could force your EV to be on while using the inverter

I would also recommend to only use a good quality pure sine wave inverter. And use a fused circuit to protect your battery from over current.

You could of course connect directly to your DC-DC converter (the bit of equipment that charges your 12V lead acid battery from your main high voltage traction battery), but you need to know even better what you are doing there 😂

After all these caveats, a 220V system is super handy to have, not just when you are out and about (e.g. camping) but also when you have a power cut at home. I powered my office (router / PC / monitor / phone charger) with it for several hours when we had a prolonged power cut last year. There is also so much energy in your car's high voltage battery that you could power your whole house for a week from an EV (if you had the appropriate systems in place)

Paul Kiernan

Thanks guys. The Ioniq5 has a "UTIL" mode which keeps power on the battery though I haven't checked that it works yet! I presume reading the voltage on the 12v would verify it?

In the simplest case scenario it'd be grand just to cover power cuts so 700w travel kettle, maybe microwave, TV, lamps, gas boiler, wifi modem but obviously not all at the same time!

In a more advanced scenario it'd be nice if your home charger could draw back power from the car and feed it back into your mains system if you needed it or even if it made sense pricewise with stored night rate electricity. Does anything like that exist?

unkel

Yes, that's the holy grail. It's called V2H (vehicle to home) or V2G (vehicle to grid)

In future all EVs will have this capability and they can be used as an enormous buffer for when excess renewable is generated (from solar and wind). This buffer can then be used when demand is high and / or when there is a shortage of renewables

You can emulate this already a little bit by charging up your EV at night and by using an inverter on your car to (partially) power your house

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118629267#Comment_118629267

Didn’t Skoda start doing this a few years back too.

all cars should have it as standard.

give it a dedicated fuse in the fuse box and only power on when the systems power up.

Soarer

Figured I'd ask this in here so as not to clog up anyone else's thread. Haven't been on here for a while, so out of the loop regarding EVs/PHEVs.

Can someone explain the dos/don'ts/can/can'ts regarding importing cars now?

Last time I was around, the talk pre-Brexit was you'd not have to pay VAT on cars from the UK as long as they were first registered in Northern Ireland. Is this actually the case?

And when it comes to EV/PHEV VRT rebates, are they still available, again as long as the car was originally purchased in Northern Ireland?

Thanks folks.

AFOL

I am sure this has been asked before but...

Do I need to have an EV car already to apply for the charger grant? I would like to have a charger installed before my car is delivered. You need to first get grant approval before having the charger installed?

the 12 th man

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118669035#Comment_118669035

No you don't but you will need to send them a photo of your taxi plugged into your charger in your driveway to be reimbursed,you can fill in the application to get the ball rolling in the meantime.

cannco253

https://www.irishevowners.ie/save-the-date-agm-on-april-9th/

I don't think this has been mentioned yet, but it's up on the IEVOA website

Paul Kiernan

I suspect this is a particularly stupid question so I am afraid to ask ...

Can I use a Tesla Supercharger to charge my Ioniq 5? I'm going to West Kerry next month and the one in Tralee is ideally located for a quick charge!

ted1

No. Currently they are available to Tesla cars only.

Paul Kiernan

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118678429#Comment_118678429

So why have they two different connectors on them? Which one does the Tesla use?

AndyBoBandy

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118678521#Comment_118678521

Tesla Model S & X use the Type 2 looking plug, and Model 3/Y will use the CCS plug. The newer V3 sites are CCS only so Model S & X will need to use a CCS adaptor with V3 SuperChargers.

Currently Superchargers in Ireland are not part of the opening up trial thats taking place in Germany, Holland, France & Norway

Model S;

Model 3;

Sabre Man

In this video Inge talks to Paul Kelly, IT/webmaster at the Irish EV Owners Association, about best practices for taking care of EV batteries. Paul answers the following questions:

What is the ideal level of charge, also known as the state of charge?

Should I let the state of charge drop to a certain level before charging?

Is frequent charging to 100% bad for the battery? Is it bad for the battery if I charge to 100% at home if I'm not going anywhere immediately?

Is fast charging bad for your battery? Should we avoid fast charging if possible?

Is it bad for the battery if it's completely empty?

Should you be driving more often?

Is it OK to charge your EV every day?

What should you do if you won't be driving for a few weeks, for example if you're going on a holiday and are leaving your car at the airport?

Are all batteries and battery management systems created equal, or are some better or worse than others?

What are the main factors causing battery degradation? Is it time, mileage, or charging habits?

How long does the battery in an electric car last?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0DZWHqswRVI

breeno

Is there a thread around recommended electricity tariffs? We've just had a smart meter fitted at home and the fitter recommended I look at a smart tariff that gives you a free days electricity per week on Saturday or Sunday and I figured charging an electric car once a week would be an ideal scenario for my use case.

Hoping to make the EV jump next year so would be interested to hear if anyone has has taken the above tariff or if there's another out there recommended?

Fingleberries

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118726469#Comment_118726469

Here you go -- https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058226818/2022-best-electricity-plan-for-new-ev-owners

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118668770#Comment_118668770

UK - VRT depending on value. VAT on the total price including delivery. May also need an import agent.

NI - if registered on or before 31st Dec 2020 then it can be imported VAT free but usual VRT applies.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118669035#Comment_118669035

You don’t need to have the car.

You do need to state which car your buying and battery size.

Once the car arrives you’ve to send in a series of photos of the car plugged into the charger.

Money arrives about 8 weeks after that.

Atlantic Dawn

Can a manufacturer remotely disable all their electric cars in a single country if they wanted to, if so can all do this? I recall Tesla had some update to security a few months back and owners had problems getting in to their cars.

markpb

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/118749112#Comment_118749112

They had a server outage which stopped people from using the app (via the internet) from unlocking their phone. It didn’t affect anyone using their key, key card or app via Bluetooth.

Hypothetically it should be possible to do what you’re suggesting as long as the car has an internet connection and there’s a link from there to the motive side of the CANbus. I doubt the functionality is supported by any cars firmware and there would be a lot of deep, meaningful decision making before they did include it. It sets an extremely bad precedent.

AndyBoBandy

In a Tesla all you have to do is remove the SIM card and omit cuts all communication with home base.

tehn just avoid Wi-Fi hotspots in case the car tries to connect that way..