Sexual assaults in Courtown - see OP for mod warning - updated 01/08/19

Beasty

In the same way there is to be no speculation over the perpetrators, please do not speculate over the victims. They are entitled to complete anonymity

Any questions, please PM me. Do not respond to this warning in-thread

MrFresh

biko wrote: »

The Gardai should conceal info only when it is required for the investigation, and then release it after.

To keep information from the public because some politician thinks it may be "sensitive" means giving in to the snowflakes.

I don't agree. And it makes me suspicious when someone wants to restrict information.
Not you but when police say they are withholding the profile of the perp and then you find it was only because it was "sensitive" (aka non-national).

It's very rare that Gardaí release any details of sexual assaults, no matter the circumstances or sensitivities.

matsy1

In fairness if it was a refugees from the direct provisions, there would be uproar and the government would be under pressure! So the guards have to keep it quite. As regards to juveniles, does anyone remember if Jamie Bolger's killers were named at the time? It is a sensitive issue that will always cause a debate. I think calling racism is often the easy way to feel morally right. I was literally called racist on a resident WhatsApp group asking what was the description of a young guy who was attacking kids in my estate!! The world is gone mad.

tuxy

matsy1 wrote: »

As regards to juveniles, does anyone remember if Jamie Bolger's killers were named at the time?

No one has to recall from memory the trial details are readily available online. That trial was held under UK law. Ireland has not been under UK law for a very long time now.

Beasty

matsy1 wrote: »

In fairness if it was a refugees from the direct provisions, there would be uproar and the government would be under pressure! So the guards have to keep it quite.

There is no such suggestion. If juveniles are involved then that is certainly very relevant though. If the guards already know their identity there is absolutely no reason to issue any descriptions (and indeed even if there was they could probably be publicising photos rather than photofits or narrative descriptions!)

matsy1 wrote: »

As regards to juveniles, does anyone remember if Jamie Bolger's killers were named at the time? It is a sensitive issue that will always cause a debate.

As already pointed out it's technically not relevant here. However there has been a recent very high profile Irish case where the likes of Twitter and Facebook had to answer serious questions over their handling of the naming/speculation over identities of the convicted juveniles.

Kermit.de.frog

If they are asylum seekers or asylum seeker children who have arrived here it should be straight to Dublin Airport, no questions asked.

But then we don't know the story here. It might not be refugees or new comers at all. I see there is speculation it could be Travellers for example.



What we do know is that France and Germany have been dealing with incidents like this for decades and it can make people very angry (rightfully so) as we have seen in the recent past. For that reasoning the gardai will be very reluctant to devulge anything on ethnicity or residence status.

TheValeyard

I think the lack of information is having an adverse reaction in that's it's stoking anger towards ethnic groups rather than quelling it.

MrFresh

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

If they are asylum seekers or asylum seeker children who have arrived here it should be straight to Dublin Airport, no questions asked.

But then we don't know the story here. It might not be refugees or new comers at all. I see there is speculation it could be Travellers for example.



What we do know is that France and Germany have been dealing with incidents like this for decades and it can make people very angry (rightfully so) as we have seen in the recent past. For that reasoning the gardai will be very reluctant to devulge anything on ethnicity or residence status.

Sure keep your fingers crossed. You might be able to get a political win out of this tragedy.



As has been mentioned quite a few times, it is very rare for Gardaí to release any of the details people are talking about unless they need to. It's very rare for Gardaí to offer knowledge of a crime occurring at all unless the press get onto them first about it.

Kermit.de.frog

MrFresh wrote: »

You might be able to get a political win out of this tragedy.

Political win?

Are you on glue?

3 children were sexually assaulted. I don't care about your politics but I can tell you right now and without fear of contradiction that if the perpetrators are asylum seekers then they should be hauled out of this country and the vast majority will agree with me.

Franz Von Peppercorn II

TheValeyard wrote: »

I think the lack of information is having an adverse reaction in that's it's stoking anger towards ethnic groups rather than quelling it.

Yeh. I’m pretty certain at this stage it isn’t anybody from the refugee centre but the speculation continues.

MrFresh

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

Political win?

Are you on glue?

3 children were sexually assaulted. I don't care about your politics but I can tell you right now and without fear of contradiction that if the perpetrators are asylum seekers then they should be hauled out of this country and the vast majority will agree with me.

Yeah, 3 children were sexually assaulted and you are going on about asylum seekers with no indication the perpetrators were asylum seekers. So desperate are you to shoehorn in your agenda wherever you can you have chosen this thread to do so. Don't try and act like you have some high ground here.

Kermit.de.frog

MrFresh wrote: »

Yeah, 3 children were sexually assaulted and you are going on about asylum seekers with no indication the perpetrators were asylum seekers. So desperate are you to shoehorn in your agenda wherever you can you have chosen this thread to do so. Don't try and act like you have some high ground here.

I don't have an agenda.

I have common sense.

Jebus crisps
Do none of the posters on this thread actually read any posts? .

MrFresh

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I don't have an agenda.

I have common sense.

Common sense would dictate you not bring up the deportation of asylum seekers in a thread that has nothing to do with asylum seekers.

expectationlost

TheValeyard wrote: »

I think the lack of information is having an adverse reaction in that's it's stoking anger towards ethnic groups rather than quelling it.

that has probably more to do with the angry people

Kermit.de.frog

MrFresh wrote: »

Common sense would dictate you not bring up the deportation of asylum seekers in a thread that has nothing to do with asylum seekers.

How do you know?

Did I not say "if" or do you conveniently ignore the inconvenient?

MarquisDeSad

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

MrFresh wrote: »

You might be able to get a political win out of this tragedy.

Political win?

Are you on glue?

3 children were sexually assaulted. I don't care about your politics but I can tell you right now and without fear of contradiction that if the perpetrators are asylum seekers then they should be hauled out of this country and the vast majority will agree with me.

I agree with you. If asylum seekers commit crimes they should be deported.

Though you have no information on perpetrators to make an informed guess. Neither does anybody posting on the this thread, myself included.

It's a horrible event. I hope the girls get the support they will need going forward and can live as happy lives as they possibly can.

batgoat

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

How do you know?

Did I not say "if" or do you conveniently ignore the inconvenient?

And bringing asylum seekers into the thread when you have no basis to do so would indicate you have a pretty clear agenda.

martingriff

TheValeyard wrote: »

I think the lack of information is having an adverse reaction in that's it's stoking anger towards ethnic groups rather than quelling it.

That is down to the angry people. It is not the job of the garda to give you every little detail. Can you name me 1 time in Ireland where a case like this the info that people are looking for was given out

Seems like there is an element of people hoping that it's reveled that coloured immigrants are involved to satisfy a racist xenophobic agenda.

Imagine hoping that...

Deep_learning

A 'Confederacy of Dunces' is an appropriate description of this thread.

Kidchameleon

I dont blame anyone for assuming it was immigrants given that there is a direct corelation between increased immigration and increases in incedents of rape

martingriff

Kidchameleon wrote: »

People want to know who to look out for, to warn their children about etc.

Their descriptions should not have been witheld

How about tell them to be vigilant and look out for anything suspicious

martingriff

Kidchameleon wrote: »

I dont blame anyone for assuming it was immigrants given that there is a direct corelation between increased immigration and increases in incedents of rape

The problem with assumption is it gives you a very blinkered looked in what your looking for and not be ready to believe it can be something else and the real criminal goes away. So yes I do blame people to be so immovable in there belief either it has or does not be x or y. I say that of both left and right You know the old saying assumption make an a** of you and me and make a thread become quiet

Kidchameleon

martingriff wrote: »

How about tell them to be vigilant and look out for anything suspicious

That goes without saying but if a gang of travellers are responsible for a savage rape Id prefer to know so I can tell my child to watch out for them. Anything that narrows down who it was makes us all safer

John_Rambo

Deep_learning wrote: »

A 'Confederacy of Dunces' is an appropriate description of this thread.

Keyboard warriors obsessed with immigrants, race, skin colour and ethnicity.

Not a mention of the victims of course.

martingriff

Kidchameleon wrote: »

That goes without saying but if a gang of travellers are responsible for a savage rape Id prefer to know so I can tell my child to watch out for them. Anything that narrows down who it was makes us all safer

But if you narrow it down to say travellers then you are opening yourselves for not checking for signs from other people. Is it not safer to be vigilant off the whole

granturismo

Kidchameleon wrote: »

I dont blame anyone for assuming it was immigrants given that there is a direct corelation between increased immigration and increases in incedents of rape

Do you have any reference for this direct correlation?

Graham

Kidchameleon wrote: »

I dont blame anyone for assuming it was immigrants given that there is a direct corelation between increased immigration and increases in incedents of rape

There is a direct correlation between the increases in incidents of violent crime and the increasing number of odd socks in my sock drawer.

Following your logic, I should be assuming it is unsafe to approach my wardrobe.

Walter Bishop

granturismo wrote: »

Do you have any reference for this direct correlation?

Of course he doesn't and even if he did, more people in a country means more crimes committed overall, it doesn't matter what colour they are - if there was an extra 200,000 white people in the country, there'd be more crime, including more rapes.