Probation period of up to 18 months

horacemckenzie

Hello Boards,

I'm a long time lurker here, but seems to be some sound advice for folks so thought some of yee wise heads may know a thing or two about employment matters. I am with my current employer since mid February. I was initially on a temporary contract (via a recruitment agency, so I was officially on their books) for maternity cover. However, the maternity leave person decided not to return and so I am now a full time employee of the company I have been working for, as of the start of July.

I got the contract last week after a delay and it's fine. However, there is a stipulation of 12 months of probation with the right to extend it by a further 6 months. I did mention that I would be happy with it being 6 months as this is standard. I know it can be extended further at a company's discretion. However, I did say I wasn't comfortable with 12 months and the possibility of extending it a further 6 months thereafter. I am sure more than 12 months may well be illegal.

I have asked for it be to changed to '6 months probation' as I feel 12 months is excessive, and the lack of stability it would give. Does anyone have any advice on how to handle this, if the employer comes back and says no, they will not change the terms as it stands? I like the company overall and had not planned on moving on this quickly. I'm jut unhappy with those terms as they don't seem fair or reasonable. It is also a small company of less than 10 employees.

Any advice appreciated. Thanks!

antix80

Within 2 years you have few employment rights anyway.
If you want to get a mortgage, it's understandable that you'd want to have a shorter period. Otherwise don't worry about it.

I worked 4 months in a company as agency staff and then moved on to a permanent contract. I received it from HR and noticed a 6 month probation period. I brought it up with them and they said it was the standard contract, but as I was already with them so long they removed that clause but they had no obligation to do so.

whampiri

horacemckenzie wrote: »

Hello Boards,

I'm a long time lurker here, but seems to be some sound advice for folks so thought some of yee wise heads may know a thing or two about employment matters. I am with my current employer since mid February. I was initially on a temporary contract (via a recruitment agency, so I was officially on their books) for maternity cover. However, the maternity leave person decided not to return and so I am now a full time employee of the company I have been working for, as of the start of July.

I got the contract last week after a delay and it's fine. However, there is a stipulation of 12 months of probation with the right to extend it by a further 6 months. I did mention that I would be happy with it being 6 months as this is standard. I know it can be extended further at a company's discretion. However, I did say I wasn't comfortable with 12 months and the possibility of extending it a further 6 months thereafter. I am sure more than 12 months may well be illegal.

I have asked for it be to changed to '6 months probation' as I feel 12 months is excessive, and the lack of stability it would give. Does anyone have any advice on how to handle this, if the employer comes back and says no, they will not change the terms as it stands? I like the company overall and had not planned on moving on this quickly. I'm jut unhappy with those terms as they don't seem fair or reasonable. It is also a small company of less than 10 employees.

Any advice appreciated. Thanks!

12 months is standard for most probation periods but they can be any length. The contract being issued is probably standard and tbh if I was the employer and someone was kicking up over a 12 month probation period, I'd be asking myself if I'd made a big mistake.
There is no legal limit to a probation period (that I'm aware of) and the reason they generally don't go over the year is because of employment legislation protections.
Think, what difference does it make if I'm on probation? The only real difference is the ease with which a company can dismiss you for screwing up.

horacemckenzie

Hi Whampri,

The big difference is, as far as I know, you won't be granted a mortgage, or any form of credit from a Financial Institution while on probaation, or it is much less likely due to lack of job security. I thought someone here may have worked in HR or similar. I don't think 12 months is standard here tbh, certainly not up to 18 months. It's the first time I've came across it. It was six months in previous places of employment. I'm not making a fuss but it seems everything is in favour of the employer and I have reasons for wanting it to be shorter.

I have't screwed up but bearing in mind, I have already worked here for almost 6 months so I'm not a stranger and the employer can see how my performance has been.

heroics

whampiri wrote: »

12 months is standard for most probation periods but they can be any length. The contract being issued is probably standard and tbh if I was the employer and someone was kicking up over a 12 month probation period, I'd be asking myself if I'd made a big mistake.
There is no legal limit to a probation period (that I'm aware of) and the reason they generally don't go over the year is because of employment legislation protections.
Think, what difference does it make if I'm on probation? The only real difference is the ease with which a company can dismiss you for screwing up.

I've never heard of 12 Months probation unless it had been extended. All the companies I worked for were 3-6 months.

And I'm with the OP if I'd been a contractor for 6 months already and was made permanent 12 months would be completely over the top.

heroics

From this link

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/employment_rights_and_conditions/contracts_of_employment/contract_of_employment.html

"Probationary period

The contract can include a probationary period and can allow for this period to be extended. The Unfair Dismissals Acts 1997–2015 will not apply if you are dismissed at an early stage in your employment while you are on probation or undergoing training, provided that:

The contract of employment is in writing
The probation or training lasts for one year or less and is specified in the contract"

whampiri

horacemckenzie wrote: »

Hi Whampri,

The big difference is, as far as I know, you won't be granted a mortgage, or any form of credit from a Financial Institution while on probaation, or it is much less likely due to lack of job security. I thought someone here may have worked in HR or similar. I don't think 12 months is standard here tbh, certainly not up to 18 months. It's the first time I've came across it. It was six months in previous places of employment. I'm not making a fuss but it seems everything is in favour of the employer and I have reasons for wanting it to be shorter.

I have't screwed up but bearing in mind, I have already worked here for almost 6 months so I'm not a stranger and the employer can see how my performance has been.

I work in HR. I understand that you may need permanency for the purposes of mortgage applications but if this is their standard contract, dont be surprised if they say no.

If you had worked there for a full year, would you have expected them to disregard probation altogether? I wouldn't and a company would be silly to do so.

My experience is that people on contracts tend to work hard to be kept on while those who gain permanency may take their foot off the gas slightly.

antix80

whampiri wrote: »

My experience is that people on contracts tend to work hard to be kept on while those who gain permanency may take their foot off the gas slightly.

I found the same of employers. When a contract is coming to an end the employer will be on a charm offensive to keep the employee. Once you're permanent the employer takes you for granted.

charlietheminxx

I think a really simple and non-confrontational way to handle this, is to ask that the probation period be revised to reflect the time you have already spent there (i.e. that the 6 months you have worked there already counts as the first 6 months of your probation, so you only have another 6 months from now).

Berserker

whampiri wrote: »

12 months is standard for most probation periods but they can be any length. The contract being issued is probably standard and tbh if I was the employer and someone was kicking up over a 12 month probation period, I'd be asking myself if I'd made a big mistake.

Twelve months is not standard. Six months, with the option to extend it for another three months is the norm in most industries. I find it odd that you'd take issue with a potential employee requesting clarification on the terms and conditions of their employment.

OP, what is the notice period for the employer and the employee during probation? Also, how long was the lady who is on maternity leave a member of staff? Have you spoken to your manager about this issue? You've been working in the organisation for some time now, so I fail to see the value in a probation period.

rock22

Berserker wrote: »

Twelve months is not standard...

Over a lifetime(40 years0 working, every employer I worked for had 12 months probationary period.

Berserker

rock22 wrote: »

Over a lifetime(40 years0 working, every employer I worked for had 12 months probationary period.

What sector/s, if you don't mind me asking?

runawaybishop

Berserker wrote: »

Twelve months is not standard.

12 months is standard in all public and civil jobs.

rock22

Berserker wrote: »

What sector/s, if you don't mind me asking?

education and health care

skallywag

I would also find twelve months very unusual, and have nearly always seen a three to six month probation period, this is coming from an R&D / Engineering background.

As soon as it becomes apparent that an employee is a good fit, then it is usually beneficial to move to a permanent footing ASAP, with one reason being that the notice period will then kick in which offers employers protection to a degree.

kennethsmyth

We do 9 months with option to extend to 12, but cannot be longer than that. It’s to help both employer and employ recover if the employment is not going quite to plan as recruiting is an expensive task.