Mass shooting in el paso

Rjd2

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Well yes, he should. Thays what being in power givew you the , eh, power, to do.

He mocks all sort of nobodies on twitter to pass the time, even something as simple as taunting these white nationalists dip****s would be something.

ampleforth

El_Bee wrote: »

lets look at why these idiots want to keep their guns

1)to stop criminals
errr.... that's what the police are for??? and the stats overwhelmingly say that criminals will take the gun from the gun owner and shoot them

2)to resist the government in case they become "tyrannical"
yeah, a few fat beer swilling rednecks are going to take on the US military, jesus...

this should have been done after the first mass shooting in colombine, guns have no business being in civilians hands

All true, but since this is an emotional issue reason does not work; especially in this current presidential climate...

tuxy

Brian? wrote: »

How do you know?

From reports that show 35% of people in Texas who can legally own a gun do so.
Maybe that's still low as it's not even half the people but I'd still consider it high. Of the 35% only a very small percentage have a conceal carry permit so they would have to open carry. Loook at any videos from yesterday and tell me how many people you saw open carry near the Walmart.

Manic Moran

tuxy wrote: »

Gun ownership is high in Texas but most people leave them at home making the useless.

There is a bit of a misconception about Texas. In fact, the percentage of adults with a permit to carry is in the lower half of the US, at about 6%. Top of the list is Alabama, 22%.* We have a lot of firearms, but dont carry them around as much as you might think, for two reasons. Firstly, it's really damned hot here right now, and El Paso is basically desert. Concealing a weapon in 40 degrees is neither particularly simple nor comfortable. Secondly, as one of the earlier adopters of concealed carry, there are a surprising amount of places you can't carry, they put a fair few restrictions in. As a result, as you're going around your business, it's really easy to encounter either a prohibited area or a 30.06 sign, making carry rather troublesome.

*It is worth noting that with the recent increase in what is being termed "constitutional carry" (thirteen states do not require a permit to carry, and Texas is not one of them) that ranking is soon going to become obsolete.

MrFresh

sdanseo wrote: »

Constitutional amendments in the US are exceedingly difficult to get to the table, let alone pass.

66% of congress has to vote in favour. There is rarely that sort of majority in either house. The amendment then has to be ratified by the state legislatures of at least 38 states.

Any meaningful restriction, rewording or removal of the 2nd Amendment would have absolutely no hope whatsoever of passing without many years of bipartisan campaigning in its favour. Blue and Red would have to agree.

If you could get a majority of the Supreme court to back an interpretation of the amendment (e.g. the Assault Weapons Ban) then you could have meaningful, legal restrictions without touching the constitution. But given that Trump has backpedalled a decade or more of progress through his warmongering, dangerous and completely untrue rhetoric that seems nearly as unlikely at the moment.

With the current Supreme Court, a constitutional amendment is likely the only way things will change for decades.

Dog Man Star

Manic Moran wrote: »

There is a bit of a misconception about Texas. In fact, the percentage of adults with a permit to carry is in the lower half of the US, at about 6%. Top of the list is Alabama, 22%.* We have a lot of firearms, but dont carry them around as much as you might think, for two reasons. Firstly, it's really damned hot here right now, and El Paso is basically desert. Concealing a weapon in 40 degrees is neither particularly simple nor comfortable. Secondly, as one of the earlier adopters of concealed carry, there are a surprising amount of places you can't carry, they put a fair few restrictions in. As a result, as you're going around your business, it's really easy to encounter either a prohibited area or a 30.06 sign, making carry rather troublesome.

*It is worth noting that with the recent increase in what is being termed "constitutional carry" (thirteen states do not require a permit to carry, and Texas is not one of them) that ranking is soon going to become obsolete.

More nonsensical, irrelevant guff from Moran, the Irishman US Soldier (TM), our 'voice from the inside'. Always guaranteed to answer the question no one asked. A waste of text, always, and a diehard Trump supporter cloaked in Irish nostalgia.

He often uses quotations that quote no one, another tactic to commute sincerity. It's lies, always lies. His boring details are the giveaway of a man who knows nothing, some classics here : "30.06 sign", "40 degrees", all blathering ****e.

"El Paso is basically desert", with maximum temperatures of mid-thirty degrees? Just utter lies. Block him please, the last thing we need is blowhards giving yet more false facts.

Manic Moran

Dog Man Star wrote: »

More nonsensical, irrelevant guff from Moran, the Irishman US Soldier (TM), our 'voice from the inside'. Always guaranteed to answer the question no one asked. A waste of text, always, and a diehard Trump supporter cloaked in Irish nostalgia.

He often uses quotations that quote no one, another tactic to commute sincerity. It's lies, always lies. His boring details are the giveaway of a man who knows nothing, some classics here : "30.06 sign", "40 degrees", all blathering ****e.

"El Paso is basically desert", with maximum temperatures of mid-thirty degrees? Just utter lies. Block him.

Out of mild curiousity, you've been hassling me over on the Politics subforum as well, until it got you banned.

What's your beef with myself that you feel incapable of discussing the actual topic?

Akrasia

igCorcaigh wrote: »

I haven't read the killer's manifesto, just an analysis of it, and it is very much in tune with the eco fascist ideology behind the NZ massacre.

This seems an emerging international terrorist threat. Very worrying.

Ah, so it’s all the green party’s fault.

Where exactly did you read this ‘analysis’ by the way? Care to link to it so everyone can see?

Dog Man Star

Manic Moran wrote: »

Out of mild curiousity, you've been hassling me over on the Politics subforum as well, until it got you banned.

What's your beef with myself that you feel incapable of discussing the actual topic?

My "beef" with you is that you are clearly a Trump supporter, yet refuse to admit it. You defend his abhorrent actions regularly, and you have been found out on a regular basis by numerous posters on this website. Your tangents are boring and are always designed to distract from the issue at hand.

The topic here is an act of domestic terrorism and you are blathering on about "concealed carry" as a man walks into a shopping centre with an automatic rifle, full of parents buying school stuff for their kids.

Get your head out of your army ****e and get a grip on the real world.

I wasn't the only one banned for not taking your crap, your Boards joined date is significant to who gets banned.

And, as I said before, when Trump is flooding the likes of you with funding, why would you complain? He is your boss, another fact you denied.

chicorytip

Sonics2k wrote:

Hol' up.

Sonics2k wrote:

Three white people go on a shooting spree, clearly under the influence of right wing rhetoric, and murder indiscriminately (including children) and your answer is to build a wall to keep migrants out?

Guy:Incognito wrote:

Maybe everyone should go back where they came from and leave the country to the actual natives?

batgoat wrote:

But conveniently ignore all the other stuff he says.......

steddyeddy wrote:

I think I'll focus on far more serious problems like the fact we have some people so radicalised by your fear of Hispanics that they actually murder innocent people.

The "wall comment" was facetious. The physical border with Mexico is large and the terrain difficult making it impossible to police effectively. I think this guy fits the exact profile of a patsy controlled by some white supremacist organisation. America has a benign and tolerant attitude to immigrants who enter the country legally, who intend working and contributing to society. The population of El Paso itself is now over eighty per cent hispanic as a result, obviously, of decades of integration. Trump, correctly, sees the need for controlled levels of immigration which his opponents use as an excuse to brand him a racist. Controlling levels of immigration is now commonplace in countries throughout the civilised western world, including Ireland.

pjohnson

Tbf MM's excuses are amusing otherwise the threads would be quite short due to common sense. There needs to be gun lovers to try and excuse each disaster.


I'm just suprised they still make news around the world given how routine they are in America now. America and the likes of MM and the NRA see guns more important than lives. Thats how it will always be.

lawlolawl

chicorytip wrote: »

The "wall comment" was facetious. The physical border with Mexico is large and the terrain difficult making it impossible to police effectively. I think this guy fits the exact profile of a patsy controlled by some white supremacist organisation. America has a benign and tolerant attitude to immigrants who enter the country legally, who intend working and contributing to society. The population of El Paso itself is now over eighty per cent hispanic as a result, obviously, of decades of integration. Trump, correctly, sees the need for controlled levels of immigration which his opponents use as an excuse to brand him a racist. Controlling levels of immigration is now commonplace in countries throughout the civilised western world, including Ireland.

Don't worry, we'll get our turn at being "racist" eventually.

The Twitter concern trolls are too fixated on Trump at the moment but they will get to us.

Dog Man Star

pjohnson wrote: »

Tbf MM's excuses are amusing otherwise the threads would be quite short due to common sense. There needs to be gun lovers to try and excuse each disaster.


I'm just suprised they still make news around the world given how routine they are in America now. America and the likes of MM and the NRA see guns more important than lives. Thats how it will always be.

Exactly right. Excusable maybe for a US nut, but an Irishman disgracing himself over there, with our history of immigration, it's beyond pathetic.

He can't hack it here and is now our Boards US ambassador? Give me a break.

Plumbthedepths

These events are so common now, very few people care. I told my son about the shooting yesterday it was sad to see his level of disinterest when I told him where it happened.
I suppose since Americans don't care why should anyone else.

eagle eye

You'll never get rid of guns in the US, best you can hope for is gun control.
I think every person that wants to own a gun should have to take classes and pass them and there should be a psychiatric test also. If somebody goes crazy you can sue the psychiatrist and I'd be pretty sure that when one of them loses their life's savings that it'll be much harder to get a gun.

BattleCorp

Dog Man Star wrote: »

My "beef" with you is that you are clearly a Trump supporter, yet refuse to admit it. .

It's not a crime to support Trump.

As far as I can recall, about 50% or close enough to that number voted for him.

Dog Man Star

BattleCorp wrote: »

It's not a crime to support Trump.

As far as I can recall, about 50% or close enough to that number voted for him.

"As far as I can recall" = I am making this crap up. Deserves a ban mods? Definitely against the charter: "Do not post any material that you know or should know is...inaccurate"

25.7% of eligible voters, voted for Trump.

(27.8% voted for Clinton)

Total lies. Where's the ban?

tuxy

eagle eye wrote: »

You'll never get rid of guns in the US, best you can hope for is gun control.
I think every person that wants to own a gun should have to take classes and pass them and there should be a psychiatric test also. If somebody goes crazy you can sue the psychiatrist and I'd be pretty sure that when one of them loses their life's savings that it'll be much harder to get a gun.

Manic Moran wrote: »

Not legal, for the same reason that they can't really put much of a tax on media, etc beyond 'standard' such as sales tax.

If you have a Constitutional right to something, you can't restrict it by back-door regulation or excessive taxation.

I'm going to agree with eagle eye on this, I'm sure you can restrict it by back-door regulation. No psychiatrist would approve of anyone getting a gun under those circumstances. It would be impossible to get the senate to move on this so back door regulation it is!

osarusan

I never understand the 'it's a mental health issue' angle.

I mean, if there is some kind of predisposition among US people towards a mental health issue which manifests itself as mass shootings (on a scale which dwarfs everywhere else), surely that's an argument in favour of much tighter gun control?

I remember Charlton Heston saying much the same thing in Bowling for Columbine, that it wasn't an issue of access to guns, it was just something in the American psyche, something inherent in their society. And I was thinking...doesn't that make Americans just the kind of people that need access to guns to be as limited as possible.

BattleCorp

Dog Man Star wrote: »

Total lies.

25.7% of eligible voters, voted for Trump.

(27.8% voted for Clinton)

I was out by 4%. Trump got 45.9% of the Electoral College votes. https://www.nytimes.com/elections/2016/results/president

Dog Man Star

BattleCorp wrote: »

I was out by 4%. Trump got 45.9% of the Electoral College votes. https://www.nytimes.com/elections/2016/results/president

And again, against the charter: "Do not post any material that you know or should know is...inaccurate"

When will this poster be banned? Can we ban him now please?

BattleCorp

eagle eye wrote: »

You'll never get rid of guns in the US, best you can hope for is gun control.
I think every person that wants to own a gun should have to take classes and pass them and there should be a psychiatric test also. If somebody goes crazy you can sue the psychiatrist and I'd be pretty sure that when one of them loses their life's savings that it'll be much harder to get a gun.

That wouldn't work. How will you convince psychiatrists to come on board if such a system was in place.

I agree with you somewhat though. I think everone who wants to own a gun should take some sort of safety class. I think there should be background checks and if you are dodgy, then you shouldn't be allowed a gun.

But then again, there's the 2nd Ammendment which makes things awkward and I don't think there is the stomach in the States for getting rid of it. Mention banning guns in America and it's the best sales drive that gun sellers could hope for.

Boggles

BattleCorp wrote: »

I was out by 4%. Trump got 45.9% of the Electoral College votes. https://www.nytimes.com/elections/2016/results/president

Jesus, just underlines once more what an absolute disaster Clinton was.

At one stage I actually thought Trump was a Clinton plant.

tuxy

Boggles wrote: »

Jesus, just underlines once more what an absolute disaster Clinton was.

At one stage I actually thought Trump was a Clinton plant.

If only 6 states are swing states and so the vote of people from 44 states is worthless, wouldn't that lead to some kind of civil unrest in the long run?

Dog Man Star

Boggles wrote: »

Jesus, just underlines once more what an absolute disaster Clinton was.

At one stage I actually thought Trump was a Clinton plant.

?? She won over 3,000,000 votes than Trump. The swing in the 2018 midterms was the greatest in US history.

You think Trump will win in 2020? Not a hope in hell.

Even with the Russians changing votes in hacking the e-voting machines, Trump will lose by a landslide. 15% or more. The Republican party is doomed for decades. By the time it rebrands, white americans will be in the minority. The democrats will govern the US for the next 50 years at least. Trump has destroyed the republican party for at least 40 years. He has done the US a huge favour by being so inept. When guns are eliminated and healthcare is for all, you think there will be an appetite for white supremacy? Not a chance. Trump was always the last belch of frustrated white unskilled men. That is over now. All over the world, populism and nationalism are dying, rioting in Hong Kong, Moscow and Rio, the people have had enough. The good will out, they always have. Trump's humiliation in November 2020 will be the end of populism, racism and fear and a new era will begin for the American people. Under President Warren, pensions will come back, universal healthcare and free 3rd level education for your children. A generation of educated Americans will change the world. Violence will end, threats and hatred will end. Americans can look forward to a secure future for their families.

The press will keep the President in check. Daily press conferences, daily updates.

BattleCorp

greencap

BattleCorp wrote: »

That wouldn't work. How will you convince psychiatrists to come on board if such a system was in place.

I agree with you somewhat though. I think everone who wants to own a gun should take some sort of safety class. I think there should be background checks and if you are dodgy, then you shouldn't be allowed a gun.

But then again, there's the 2nd Ammendment which makes things awkward and I don't think there is the stomach in the States for getting rid of it. Mention banning guns in America and it's the best sales drive that gun sellers could hope for.

If only all these mass shooters had just had a safety class.

Gbear

As much as the guns, if not more, I think a primary cause of this issue is that there's a much larger cohort of fundamentalist, christian theocratic, ethno-nationalist or freeman on the land lunatics in the US. There's also far more abject poverty than is found in continental Europe, far more crime, worse statistics for opiate use, more isolated communities, areas of the country that are so vast they're impossible to effectively police, and many other factors.

The volume of guns won't be able to be fixed for centuries even if they make a huge change to their policies.

We think the US is the same as us, and bits of it are, but it's a very weird place in many respects, and the kind of insanity that breeds this violence has more of a likeness to the theocratic regimes in the Middle East or the sectarianism in the Balkans than they do with Western Europe, IMO.

dudara

Dog Man Star wrote: »

And again, against the charter: "Do not post any material that you know or should know is...inaccurate"

When will this poster be banned? Can we ban him now please?

Cut it out.

dudara

BattleCorp

greencap wrote: »

If only all these mass shooters had just had a safety class.

It's a start. It might encourage people to lock up their firearms safely so that kids etc. like Adam Lanza can't access them.

You can't boil the ocean all at once. Small steps.