Mass shooting in el paso

It wasnt me123

nc6000 wrote: »

Good point but not sure how much of an impact an amnesty will have. At this stage it's gone too far when American civilians already own an estimated 393 million guns. I'm assuming that the amount of ammunition already sold to go with these guns is many many multiples of this.

Even if all sales were banned tomorrow how can they even start to get that quantity of weapons back?

You have to start somewhere -
plan to close the gun shops - but in the meantime, increase the difficulty in buying them nationwide - so not walmart or lidl or any other supermarket, proper ID etc
12 months later start an amnesty - get in the AK47 types first and work your way down.

The cost of the guns would be offset by the cost of mass shootings on tourism, commercial sales, hospital admittances etc

IMO saying its too hard and where do we start is not a good enough reason not to do it.

YFlyer

Brian? wrote: »

No chance of that. But it’s illegal to concealed carry on any premises that puts up the “no concealed carry” sign and all bars.

I wonder if somebody with a concealed weapons fired back would they be charged?

RandomName2

There's been another mass shooting in Dayton Ohio. At least 9 people dead.

steddyeddy

YFlyer wrote: »

I wonder if somebody with a concealed weapons fired back would they be charged?

Well if they're participating in conceal and carry themselves they're likely making the problem worse anyway. Another study from the same journal that determined that ice is cold

Scientists Showed How More Guns Led To More Violent Crime
A Supreme Court case may soon create a constitutional right to freely carry a gun everywhere, but that would be a dangerous mistake to make, suggests a new study of violent crimes.

Right-to-carry handgun laws trigger a 13% to 15% increase in violent crime a decade after the typical state adopts them, suggests a new statistical analysis of 33 US states.

The Journal of Empirical Legal Studies report released Monday is the latest in a thorny academic fight over how letting people more freely carry around guns affects those crimes.

El_Duderino 09

Fox news not suggesting the Ohio one is a terrorist incident. So it's probably a white right wing terrorist.

I wonder how Trump will deal with this since it's right wing terrorism. He'll have to say it was bad but without denying his base is justified in being angry. I wonder if the real blame lies with the left. Tends to be the way these things go.

Brian?

YFlyer wrote: »

I wonder if somebody with a concealed weapons fired back would they be charged?

I doubt it. They’d be shot by the first cops arriving on the scene.

briany

Of all the mass shootings I've heard about in America, I don't think I've ever heard of two in a single day.

alchemist33

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Fox news not suggesting the Ohio one is a terrorist incident. So it's probably a white right wing terrorist.

I wonder how Trump will deal with this since it's right wing terrorism. He'll have to say it was bad but without denying his base is justified in being angry. I wonder if the real blame lies with the left. Tends to be the way these things go.

We've already seen in the Trump thread that there's a focus on the Dems for winding up the killer.

Harika

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/americas/2019/08/04/the-el-paso-shooting-and-the-gamification-of-terror/

Bellingcat with some interesting info as the shooter went to the internet before

Harvey Weinstein

The two shooters look eerily similar

MrFresh

batgoat wrote: »

This shooter was another subscriber to the great replacement conspiracy, same as the Christchurch perpetrator. A conspiracy that's pushed by the far right on a constant basis, even on this site unfortunately.

And also pushed by Boards posters. The white genocide of Europe has been brought up frequent enough.

Kermit.de.frog

The idiot in chief sends his *shock horror* "thoughts and prayers".

The script writes itself.

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1157868519964499968

lainey_d_123

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Gotta laugh at the idea of a white nationalist expressing hate against Hispanics in a city called El Paso. Who is the invader?

It's insane how many white Americans see themselves as the 'default' American. They truly believe they are 'real' Americans and all the brown people are immigrants. They think English is the national language despite the US not having any official language and significant parts of the US having been taken fairly recently from Mexico. Doesn't seem to occur to them that places named Los Angeles and San Diego and El Paso weren't founded by Anglos. The ignorance and arrogance is really something to behold.

lainey_d_123

Harvey Weinstein wrote: »

The two shooters look eerily similar

Pathetic losers who fail at life and blame all their problems on brown people/women/liberals?

p1akuw47h5r3it

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

The idiot in chief sends his *shock horror* "thoughts and prayers".

The script rights itself.

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1157868519964499968

And what else is he going to do in the immediate aftermath? He's just done what any politician would do.

Igotadose

DanDan6592 wrote: »

And what else is he going to do in the immediate aftermath? He's just done what any politician would do.

15 minutes later he was promoting an MMA fighter, of course one that fawns on Trump. https://popculture.com/trending/2019/08/03/president-trump-blasted-tweet-promoting-mma-fighter-following-el-paso-shooting-walmart/

Other politicians adapt a somber attitude. Trump's too stupid for such.

Boggles

Nothing complex about him.

Racist saddo who spent his pathetic life online ranting and raving about foreign people, blaming his inadequacies on others.

Sounds all too familiar.

p1akuw47h5r3it

Igotadose wrote: »

15 minutes later he was promoting an MMA fighter, of course one that fawns on Trump. https://popculture.com/trending/2019/08/03/president-trump-blasted-tweet-promoting-mma-fighter-following-el-paso-shooting-walmart/

Other politicians adapt a somber attitude. Trump's too stupid for such.

But the poster referenced his tweet in isolation offering condolences as if there was something inadequate about it. Never mentioned his tweets after.

I'm no Trump fan but the whole of American politics is poisonous and such senseless sniping is oh so prevalent over there and here when American politics is being discussed. It's very unhelpful. The (more mainstream) left and the right are as bad as eachother over there.

These tragedys will be used by the left to paint a certain demographic a certain way, the same as when an immigrant or Muslim does something terrible the right does likewise. Both "sides" ultimately use these things for the own ends, and whilst talking about bringing America engage in activities that does the opposite.

8-10

YFlyer wrote: »

Do they check for weapons at the entrance?

They display penal code 30.06 (concealed) and/or 30.07 (open) carry signs at the entrance and defying these is the same as a trespassing felony.

steddyeddy

Governor of Texas vows to prosecute this as a hate crime.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/us/texas-governor-vows-to-aggressively-prosecute-mass-shooting-as-a-hate-crime-1.3976799?fbclid=IwAR0Xrh_QvR3Ws1qLfkDlnOaCrtxVlEhGhizeqVPrY2OVT1k05w02KgCiH-4

steddyeddy

DanDan6592 wrote: »

But the poster referenced his tweet in isolation offering condolences as if there was something inadequate about it. Never mentioned his tweets after.

I'm no Trump fan but the whole of American politics is poisonous and such senseless sniping is oh so prevalent over there and here when American politics is being discussed. It's very unhelpful. The (more mainstream) left and the right are as bad as eachother over there.

These tragedys will be used by the left to paint a certain demographic a certain way, the same as when an immigrant or Muslim does something terrible the right does likewise. Both "sides" ultimately use these things for the own ends, and whilst talking about bringing America engage in activities that does the opposite.

The Tweet in isolation was OK but his supporters are the ones who're pushing this white man victim complex that's resulting in so many of these attacks.

steddyeddy

Just an indication of the scale of the problem.

Germany: 0
Italy: 0
UK: 0
Australia: 0
Spain: 0
Saudi: 0
France: 0
Canada: 1
Brazil: 1
Netherlands: 1
Mexico: 3
US: 249

8-10

steddyeddy wrote: »

Just an indication of the scale of the problem.

Germany: 0
Italy: 0
UK: 0
Australia: 0
Spain: 0
Saudi: 0
France: 0
Canada: 1
Brazil: 1
Netherlands: 1
Mexico: 3
US: 249

That's 2019 as a whole I presume?

Igotadose

steddyeddy wrote: »

Just an indication of the scale of the problem.

Germany: 0
Italy: 0
UK: 0
Australia: 0
Spain: 0
Saudi: 0
France: 0
Canada: 1
Brazil: 1
Netherlands: 1
Mexico: 3
US: 249

Over 1100 people wounded (not killed) in the US in mass shootings (4 or more) this year. Contemplate that number. Wounded can mean, disabled for life.

And, heck, it's only August. 4 more months to go. A hot summer (like every summer) and the violence goes up.

Itssoeasy

Just seeing on CNN a press conference about the Ohio shooting that in a minute before the police arrived the shooter killed 9 people and injured 26 people. That's insane stuff.

JP Liz V1

Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »

Police held a conference and have now released the numbers of dead and injured.

20 people died and 26 injured. Sad day for the families in this area today.

RIP so common now to hear of shootings in America

Itssoeasy

And I know people say that America needs to change their gun laws, but honestly if sandy hook didn't change a thing and you had that cretin Alex jones spread his lies about it why would anything change about 20 people in El Paso Texas ?

weisses

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

RIP so common now to hear of shootings in America

And yet Americans seem not to care to address the gun issue ... They only have themselves to blame ... I stopped feeling sorry for their dysfunctional society a long time ago

Rhys Essien

steddyeddy wrote: »

Just an indication of the scale of the problem.

Germany: 0
Italy: 0
UK: 0
Australia: 0
Spain: 0
Saudi: 0
France: 0
Canada: 1
Brazil: 1
Netherlands: 1
Mexico: 3
US: 249

That information is out of date. Dayton made it 250. The sad reality is that around 90% of Americans are happy with the current gun laws and the vast majority of people killed are killed by hand guns so things will probably continue as they are.

briany

weisses wrote: »

And yet Americans seem not to care to address the gun issue ... They only have themselves to blame ... I stopped feeling sorry for their dysfunctional society a long time ago

America should just be honest about the issue, because they imply it anyway - they've decided, as a general society, that having these random gun attacks and deaths is a heavy yet worthy price to pay for the 2nd Amendment. Admit that and go from there.

KevRossi

Rhys Essien wrote: »

The sad reality is that around 90% of Americans are happy with the current gun laws and the vast majority of people killed are killed by hand guns so things will probably continue as they are.

Post #247 above has the totally opposite info. 67% are unhappy with them and want rules tightened.

https://www.apnews.com/99e6a9b480a947eab6da194697b8a303

lawlolawl

The US opened Pandora's Box with "the right to bear arms". I don't ever see private gun ownership going away.

The US intelligence agencies took their collective eye off the ball in regards to keeping track of domestic/white supremacist terrorism whilst they'll were obsessed with Islamic extremists for the past decade plus. These groups are out in the wild now and the internet makes it very easy to organise, even through "harmless" sites like 4Chan and Reddit.

Another thing is the media handling these guys like they are scary comicbook villians and publishing their silly little manifestos. Treat them like the sad, broken losers they are. Maybe it'll make no difference but it takes some of their power away.

p1akuw47h5r3it

steddyeddy wrote: »

The Tweet in isolation was OK but his supporters are the ones who're pushing this white man victim complex that's resulting in so many of these attacks.

But the poster suggested it wasn't, hence why I responded.

There are "attacks" against white males in the American media, and less so amongst it's politicians. Or at least a way of talking about white males with a constantly negative undertone. Anymore than any other group? Probably not. The right are always bemoaning illegal immigrants as if they're the cause of all America's woes, Trumps go home and comeback comments. Now does this somehow excuse these mass shootings? Obviously not. However, if the right-wing media are to be held accountable for the words they use and the negative "tropes" they constantly apply, then the left should be held accountable like-wise.

The picture of the garlic shooter and the shooter last night; they look like you're sterotypical the-internets-my-only-friend loser. The kind of people that need to be told to log of reddit and the internet as a whole. Pathetic.

Rhys Essien

They show the house in this tweet of the El Paso maniac. Looks like it’s worth a fair few bob. Obviously a pampered kid who now messed up the rest of his family’s lives.

https://twitter.com/reuters/status/1157979493861974017?s=21

Harry Palmr

If Americans were that unhappy they'd be marching in every city and on Washington and organising an ongoing programme of disruption against the gun industry. Maybe at some point someone will be able to mobilise a silent majority (or even a big minority) but right now it's just thoughts and prayers.

Faugheen

I actually have no issue with the second amendment.

However, there is no reason for any ordinary citizen to own a semi-automatic weapon. It's absolutely ridiculous.

KevRossi

I think the problem in the US is beyond repair for the forseeable future. Much like Northern Ireland it will take a couple of generations to sort out.

An amnesty will work to a point: the really paranoid/gung-ho ones will not hand their weapons in. And what then? Do you get them off them by force? There are literally tens of thousands of people in the States, many of them in hard to reach areas who will not give guns up without a fight.

So what's the solution? An amnesty for all auto and semi auto guns for sure, as well as any pump actions and any mods that can make a gun auto or semi auto. Then do you just ban them? Or ban the manufacture and sale of ammunition. Do this and you'll have a black market for it, and this is discounting the fact that tens of billions of rounds of ammunition are in private hands.

Legislation would be the first step, but I doubt it will happen. Sandy Hook happened 5 weeks after Obama won his 2nd term of office and not a lot was done after that.

p1akuw47h5r3it

KevRossi wrote: »

I think the problem in the US is beyond repair for the forseeable future. Much like Northern Ireland it will take a couple of generations to sort out.

An amnesty will work to a point: the really paranoid/gung-ho ones will not hand their weapons in. And what then? Do you get them off them by force? There are literally tens of thousands of people in the States, many of them in hard to reach areas who will not give guns up without a fight.

So what's the solution? An amnesty for all auto and semi auto guns for sure, as well as any pump actions and any mods that can make a gun auto or semi auto. Then do you just ban them? Or ban the manufacture and sale of ammunition. Do this and you'll have a black market for it, and this is discounting the fact that tens of billions of rounds of ammunition are in private hands.

Legislation would be the first step, but I doubt it will happen. Sandy Hook happened 5 weeks after Obama won his 2nd term of office and not a lot was done after that.

Could they not just hugely increase taxes on fire-arms and ammunition? I presume more to it like.

steddyeddy

It looks like the shooter was another "Mexicans, blacks natives and liberals are all out to get me sort of guy". Police are investigating a blog post attributed to him where he talks about a "Hispanic invasion".

Let's sum up the incredibly fragile, historically illiterate failure like him by repeating the fact that he talked about an "Hispanic invasion" in a place called El Paso.......

And yes Trump's Mexican immigrant rhetoric plays a part here too.

Greg Allen, El Paso police chief, said authorities were now working to confirm whether a racist, anti-immigrant manifesto posted online shortly beforehand was written by the suspect, who is said to have driven more than 1,000km from his home in Dallas to commit the atrocity.

Trump tells Congress a wall in El Paso made it safer. He was wrong
The four-page document includes passages decrying the “Hispanic invasion” of the US, while the author also makes clear he intends to kill during an upcoming attack.

The first sentence expresses support for Christchurch mosque shooter who killed 51 people in New Zealand in March.

“Right now we have a manifesto from this individual that indicates to some degree, it has a nexus to potential hate crime,” Chief Allen said.

Outlaw Pete

Oh for heaven sake. Nobody that is in favour of a wall (or "barrier" in the case of Obama and Hillary) ever suggested it would protect Americans from a shooter. What a bizarre thing for someone to suggest.

B0jangles

According to the stats around 30% of americans own a gun(1), and about half of the guns in private ownership are owned by just 3% of the population(2)

1https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/12/27/facts-about-guns-in-united-states/
2https://www.thetrace.org/2016/09/gun-super-owners-harvard-survey/

Think about that - 3% of the population, so around eleven million people, own a total of 130,000,000 guns.

BorneTobyWilde

The likes of CNN does an amazing job of brainwashing these wackos into thinking Trump is one of them, and then they go out and kill in his name.

pjohnson

steddyeddy wrote: »

It looks like the shooter was another "Mexicans, blacks natives and liberals are all out to get me sort of guy". Police are investigating a blog post attributed to him where he talks about a "Hispanic invasion".

Let's sum up the incredibly fragile, historically illiterate failure like him by repeating the fact that he talked about an "Hispanic invasion" in a place called El Paso.......

And yes Trump's Mexican immigrant rhetoric plays a part here too.

He probably thinks they should all "go home" despite at least a few of them likely being American born.

Stupidity and automatic guns is a recipe for disaster. Yet it will never be changed.

Rhys Essien

Not being pedantic but the media are reporting that it’s the 250th mass shooting but it’s actually the 251st.

Here is the list.

https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/reports/mass-shooting

MrFresh

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

The likes of CNN does an amazing job of brainwashing these wackos into thinking Trump is one of them, and then they go out and kill in his name.

So now we have had posters accusing the Sheriff of being a racist and CNN of indoctrinating the shooter with Trump's views. Amazing stuff.

pjohnson

MrFresh wrote: »

So now we have had posters accusing the Sheriff of being a racist and CNN of indoctrinating the shooter with Trump's views. Amazing stuff.

They are so used to making excuses and whatabouttery it just comes naturally.

thecretinhop

hmm 3 attacks all white males wow what a coincidence. its not like they are planned or anything

chicorytip

He (the shooter) is right in one respect. An "invasion" of Hispanics, illegal and undocumented, is an accurate term to describe the huge numbers now coming across the border. Shooting them dead is not the solution however!! Let Trump build his wall.

BorneTobyWilde

MrFresh wrote: »

So now we have had posters accusing the Sheriff of being a racist and CNN of indoctrinating the shooter with Trump's views. Amazing stuff.

CNN push the '' Trump hates black people'' '' Trump hates women'' ''Trump hates Immigrants'' '' Trump hates Mulsims''
They spend their whole day, year in year out pushing this crap on people, and all they are doing is causing all these groups to vote for Trump, because there are millions of Americans who hate black people, hate women, hate immigrants, hate Muslins, and they all come out and vote for Trump, because according to CNN, Trump is one of them.


Trump though has done so much for black communities in American, and for Women, and has visited Muslim countries and has wined and dined with them, and has encouraged legal immigration. He wants the brightest and smartest people across the world to come to American.

Midlife

B0jangles wrote: »

According to the stats around 30% of americans own a gun(1), and about half of the guns in private ownership are owned by just 3% of the population(2)

1https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/12/27/facts-about-guns-in-united-states/
2https://www.thetrace.org/2016/09/gun-super-owners-harvard-survey/

Think about that - 3% of the population, so around eleven million people, own a total of 130,000,000 guns.

And most of them are fine.

What astounds me is in cases like the 19 year old killing 3 people in California, including a 6 year old kid, the person in this case is young, impressionable and male, and has no problem buying assault weapons.

One thing to consider is that in the 80's MADD (Mothers against drink driving) led a campaign to nationally increase the drinking age from 18 to 21. It went through and sales of alcohol are restricted to under 21's now.

Kid can't be trusted to buy a six pack.