Is transportation in the Dublin the worst in any European capital?

fritzelly

Dublin bus should have long ago changed to central buses out to SCR/canal for example and buses going from that point to the destination and back again and the single journey ticket.
No need for every bus to chug along thru the city to head off to another destination 10+ miles further out then repeat it on the return route.
Stupid the amount of buses trying to get thru the city in the mornings and evenings.
Most European cities I've been to operate along the lines of it could take 2 or 3 journeys to get where you want to go but it's quick

cdeb

strandroad wrote: »

The Luas is not an underground network though, it's a bog standard tram with a fancy name.

Doesn't matter. It was said that the Luas doesn't link up. It does.

I completely agree that the tram network is ridiculously small; destroying it was one of the more short-sighted decisions the Government has taken. But it's not the point that I was debating.

disposableFish wrote: »

It's terrible though.

Wait an hour in the freezing cold at 2am and then hope you actually get on because there's 80 people that want to get on one coach.

Why would you wait an hour? Do you not have access to the timetable?

I don't think I've ever known the Aircoach to be even half-full to be honest. Certainly not at 2am. I think this is another one of those ill-thought out ranty posts that have little enough basis in reality, and which are really unhelpful as a result.

strandroad

killbillvol2 wrote: »

50 years of communism should sort us out then.

Cities like Budapest or Prague had very advanced rail transport well before communism even existed. Read up on the Budapest metro... I was quite impressed.

cdeb

Second oldest in the world, isn't it?

strandroad

cdeb wrote: »

Second oldest in the world, isn't it?

It is. These old stations are absolutely beautiful with their original tiles and masonry.

Public transport is not a communist thing, it's a continental thing. And Dublin wasn't that far behind, until its tram network was razed when it should have been upgraded.

disposableFish

cdeb wrote: »

I don't think I've ever known the Aircoach to be even half-full to be honest. Certainly not at 2am. I think this is another one of those ill-thought out ranty posts that have little enough basis in reality, and which are really unhelpful as a result.

Based purely on personal experience, so no I'm not pulling it out of nowhere as you seem to be implying in your rush to be dismissive.

The (reduced frequency) Aircoach is the only thing going from the airport that late other than taxis. So, while there might not be a lot of people around that late, a high percentage of them want to take the aircoach.
What do schedules have to do with it? You have to just go there and wait out in the cold, if you don't then you risk not getting on.

Have I just been unlucky? Maybe so.

Either way, it's a poor kind of service and not up to scratch.

Strumms

They can prattle on about bus corridors and nicking peoples gardens to achieve it but realistically until the Metro gets up and running and the city is provided with a joined up, fit for purpose and efficient Transport system...Metro, Luas and bus...all planned, integrated and operational it’s going to be pîss awkward still to navigate this city unless a bus or luas is outside your door to convey you to your destination that happens to be on the line or route of your chosen method of transport...

Spanish Eyes

If bus lanes and Bus Gate were really Bus Only there might be a chance, but the amount of taxis (especially on College Green) is unreal now.

fritzelly

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

If bus lanes and Bus Gate were really Bus Only there might be a chance, but the amount of taxis (especially on College Green) is unreal now.

LOL
Bus lanes should be made no stopping lanes except for buses (are taxis not only allowed to use them when they have a fare?) - so all these delivery vans, cars picking up people and so on get an instant fine. Georges St may as well not have a bus lane

cdeb

disposableFish wrote: »

What do schedules have to do with it?

Schedules tell you when the bus is going to come. They won't be exact to the minute, granted, but there's still no need to be waiting an hour if you read the schedule first.

And given that the Aircoach runs at worst once an hour, I doubt you've ever waited an hour for one. If you did, that's not unlucky. That's bad planning on your part

I'd be interested to hear if anyone else has come close to not getting on a 2am Aircoach. Tbh, I've often wondered why they operate at that time as they're usually empty.

Either way, it's a poor kind of service and not up to scratch.

Well, not "either way". If you can't read a timetable, that's hardly their fault. I've always found the Aircoach to be excellent, if pricey. Yes, it's slow, but that's the nature of public transport making lots of stops. Happens everywhere.

disposableFish

cdeb wrote: »

Schedules tell you when the bus is going to come. It won't be exact to the minute, granted, but there's still no need to be waiting an hour if you read the schedule first.

Thanks for the explanation...
Point is that a schedule is irrelevant - you arrive in at whatever time you arrive and wait for the next bus.

cdeb wrote: »

I'd be interested to hear if anyone else has come close to not getting on a 2am Aircoach. Tbh, I've often wondered why they operate at that time as they're usually empty.

Hi! *waves hand*

cdeb wrote: »

Well, not "either way". If you can't read a timetable, that's hardly their fault. I've always found the Aircoach to be excellent, if pricey. Yes, it's slow, but that's the nature of public transport making lots of stops. Happens everywhere.

Why are we back on the schedule and my supposed learning difficulty?
The aircoach itself is fine in the sense that they're comfy busses, a nice idea for longer services but not really the right typeof service as the only available PT option from an airport (ie. the situation is poor in terms of available public transport and addressing need).

Franz Von Peppercorn II

cdeb wrote: »

There's plenty of European capitals without rail links to the airport. Cardiff, Prague, Bratislava, Luxembourg, Tirane, Podgorica, Zagreb, Belgrade, Budapest, Ljubljana, Nicosia, Tallinn...

This was always the stupid part of the op’s argument. Screw tourists - a taxi shared amongst adults to the centre isnt that expensive.

Let’s fix the system for those of us who live in Dublin (and Ireland)

Strumms

I presume the 2am air coach is really only for airport workers I’d imagine. The first departure from the airport is 5.30 am so that’s going to be a shít load of sitting around up there with not much open in the way of bars, eateries or even shops. Not sure what time security and check in might open at..

Franz Von Peppercorn II

Strumms wrote: »

I presume the 2am air coach is really only for airport workers I’d imagine. The first departure from the airport is 5.30 am so that’s going to be a shít load of sitting around up there with not much open in the way of bars, eateries or even shops. Not sure what time security and check in might open at..

Plenty of people will get there or stay there over night for an early flight. And many places are open all night or early morning - or 2am.

Peregrine

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

This was always the stupid part of the op’s argument. Screw tourists - a taxi shared amongst adults to the centre isnt that expensive.

Let’s fix the system for those of us who live in Dublin (and Ireland)

People who live in Ireland use the airport in larger numbers than tourists. Not to mention the thousands that work there. Screw them too?

Or we could just find solutions that work for more than one group. We already have one, actually. It's just a case of building it.

Franz Von Peppercorn II

Peregrine wrote: »

People who live in Ireland use the airport in larger numbers than tourists. Not to mention the thousands that work there. Screw them too?

The majority who work there live around there. A rail to the city centre isn’t that important for them, if at all.

until the rest of the situation is fixed the airport situation is the least of our problems.

Peregrine

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

The majority who work there live around there. A rail to the city centre isn’t that important for them, if at all.

until the rest of the situation is fixed the airport situation is the least of our problems.

That's not even remotely true. People who work at the airport travel from all around Dublin and surrounding counties. Swords might be the most popular area but it's far from the majority.

It's a pretty big problem. It actually costs more to ignore it now and fix it later after we fix the rest of the situation. Whereas it's easily incorporated into a metro line serving vast swathes of the city and Swords.

I've always stressed that the proposed metro plans are more than just about the airport and that the airport is only one of the areas it serves but 'Let's purposely go out of our way to ignore the airport for now even if it costs more' is such a strange hill to die on.

wakka12

Strumms wrote: »

I presume the 2am air coach is really only for airport workers I’d imagine. The first departure from the airport is 5.30 am so that’s going to be a shít load of sitting around up there with not much open in the way of bars, eateries or even shops. Not sure what time security and check in might open at..

flight may be at 5.30 but youll want to be on a bus heading to the airport two hours before that, depending on where you live

Franz Von Peppercorn II

Peregrine wrote: »

That's not even remotely true. People who work at the airport travel from all around Dublin and surrounding counties. Swords might be the most popular area but it's far from the majority.

That’s their decision. There are people who live anywhere in Dublin or outside it who also work anywhere in the city and have 1-1/2 hour commutes. Airport workers can work in the north city or county.

It's a pretty big problem. It actually costs more to ignore it now and fix it later after we fix the rest of the situation. Whereas it's easily incorporated into a metro line serving vast swathes of the city and Swords.

I’ve no problem with the airport being given a rail line as part of a full solution. However one line to the airport is only going to benefit people on that line and who knows if the system will even be an all night service. If not it’s no good to the people getting a 5:30 flight.

I've always stressed that the proposed metro plans are more than just about the airport and that the airport is only one of the areas it serves but 'Let's purposely go out of our way to ignore the airport for now even if it costs more' is such a strange hill to die on.

This seems to be a hobby horse of yours. It it works as part of an integrated solution then fine. It if costs more merely to facilitate tourists the its a nice to have after we fix other stuff.

Calina

mikemac2 wrote: »

Luxembourg making the system free will not achieve anything. It is already dirt cheap with 360 euro or less if you are in a company group scheme getting you an annual ticket.

Nobody pays on Saturday as it is free to encourage shopping. Under 25´s or full time students do not pay. The frontaliers/ border workers do not pay as they drive across the border. And the biggest culprits for congestion are the banking managers in company cars or public servants who will not change their ways

Some of the Luxembourg trains are out of a film set in the 1950´s, ancient. It would have been better to keep the fares and invest in the rolling stock.

They make valiant efforts against congestion with multiple massive park & rides, dirt cheap fares and more. However they failed to tackle the people who drive in Luxembourg and this headline grabbing free transport will change little or nothing.

It was a sound byte friendly election promise and they won so they must do it

You missed my point. The issue is Dublin is not moving in the direction of making public transport attractive from a price point of view.

LeBash

LirW wrote: »

It's okay but it's crazy expensive.
The need to go via the city centre makes it heavy on the wallet. The fact that there are no dedicated tourist passes with a flat rate. And for many people travelling the reduced rates for just a few stops are super confusing.

My folks were staying somewhere on Clontarf when we lived in Glasnevin and if they wanted to take the bus to come over they'd have to go through town paying for two journeys each.

I also know two people staying on Dublin for Erasmus and the cost of public transport was a big annoyance.

There are flat rate tickets but only available in the airport. Or at least there was 2 or 3 years ago. Haven't had to go to get one for someone in the last while.

AndrewJRenko

fritzelly wrote: »

LOL
Bus lanes should be made no stopping lanes except for buses (are taxis not only allowed to use them when they have a fare?) - so all these delivery vans, cars picking up people and so on get an instant fine. Georges St may as well not have a bus lane

This is huge issue. Between beer deliveries to the pubs and all kinds of deliveries to Five Guys, that bus lane is not fit for purpose.

This should be part of planning permission - ensuring that they can take deliveries without blocking up the city.

dubrov

Why the obsession with a rail connection to the airport?

It is much easier to get from Dublin airport to the city centre than loads of cities in Europe.

Taxi is less than 20 minutes and for the cheap option, there is Dublin bus which is about 35 minutes.

Better to spend the money on transport links for commuters than a show off connection to the airport

cdeb

disposableFish wrote: »

Thanks for the explanation...
Point is that a schedule is irrelevant - you arrive in at whatever time you arrive and wait for the next bus.

Hold on - you said you've an issue with waiting for an hour in the freezing cold at 2am.

Why would you be going home from Dublin Airport at 2am? There's no flights coming in at that time. If you're working there on those shifts, it'd be far easier to drive.

And if you are at the airport - why would you be waiting outside in the freezing cold instead of sitting down inside?

Sorry - you're still not making much sense here.

disposableFish wrote: »

Why are we back on the schedule and my supposed learning difficulty?

Because literally the only argument you put out against the Aircoach was "It's terrible though. Wait an hour in the freezing cold at 2am and then hope you actually get on because there's 80 people that want to get on one coach."

I never said anything about a learning difficulty btw?

disposableFish wrote: »

The aircoach itself is fine in the sense that they're comfy busses, a nice idea for longer services but not really the right typeof service as the only available PT option from an airport (ie. the situation is poor in terms of available public transport and addressing need).

Well that's a completely different a completely different argument you're making now. And I still don't agree. The Aircoach is better than a Dublin Bus in that there's much more space for baggage - and before the Aircoach, the 747 bus was the main public transport option. Also, taxis are public transport too. And the 747 still runs anyway. In fact, wikipedia says 700 buses a day run to the airport. So it's nonsense to say the Aircoach is the only type of public transport at the airport.

The_Brood

cdeb wrote: »

Hold on - you said you've an issue with waiting for an hour in the freezing cold at 2am.

Why would you be going home from Dublin Airport at 2am? There's no flights coming in at that time. If you're working there on those shifts, it'd be far easier to drive.

And if you are at the airport - why would you be waiting outside in the freezing cold instead of sitting down inside?

Sorry - you're still not making much sense here.


Because literally the only argument you put out against the Aircoach was "It's terrible though. Wait an hour in the freezing cold at 2am and then hope you actually get on because there's 80 people that want to get on one coach."

I never said anything about a learning difficulty btw?


Well that's a completely different a completely different argument you're making now. And I still don't agree. The Aircoach is better than a Dublin Bus in that there's much more space for baggage - and before the Aircoach, the 747 bus was the main public transport option. Also, taxis are public transport too. And the 747 still runs anyway. In fact, wikipedia says 700 buses a day run to the airport. So it's nonsense to say the Aircoach is the only type of public transport at the airport.

Have you ever travelled at night? You are aware that flight delays exist? On top of it all if your coming back with Ryan Air you face 30 min walk from the gate back to the exit of the terminal and buses.

A Shropshire Lad

Maybe we should use the Apple 13 Billion we are owed and invest it in a world class transport system. For that money we could have the Luas running to Listowel and Letterkenny !

cdeb

The_Brood wrote: »

Have you ever travelled at night? You are aware that flight delays exist? On top of it all if your coming back with Ryan Air you face 30 min walk from the gate back to the exit of the terminal and buses.

If you're coming in at 2am and you've literally just missed an Aircoach (which is the only way you can be waiting an hour - and even then some routes are every 30 minutes at night), then get a taxi. Any airport is going to have reduced transport links at that time of night.

If you absolutely have to get the bus, then at least get in out of the cold. Not rocket science. (It isn't always "freezing cold" at 2am either. It can be quite balmy in the summer in fact)

If there's 80 people getting on the bus at 2am, then wake up from whatever dream you're having.

In an area where there are genuine issues to discuss, none of the above have any merit tbh

Chinasea

First DART on a Sunday morning to Dublin city centre from Blackrock is 09.24. What kind of a lazy, expensive "service" is that.

The DART stations are grimey too. All need proper regular cleaning. I raised this directly with Iarnroid Eireann. After several fob off back and forward emails I gave up...

Elemonator

cdeb wrote: »

Aircoach is a 24 hour service

True, I'll refine my statement. There should be a public link. The ones I have observed in other European cities included rail and bus services. The Berlin buses are operated by BVG. Tegel Airport doesn't have a direct rail link but there are multiple bus lines with frequent buses. Schonefeld has rail and bus connections. The new Brandenburg airport will have both also.

Aircoach on the other hand is a private entity I believe. Aircoach is also frequently at capacity. Not overly frequent either. I do think the airport could do with a metro or DART Underground connection.

L1011

mulbot wrote: »

Tallinn does have such a transport system from the airport.

It is very recent so easily missed if looking at lists. Was taxis all the way when I was there in 2016 even

The airport is VERY close to the city though. Comparable city distance wise in Lisbon hosted a World's Fair (Expo) and Euro 2008 without it's airport Metro built at the time

Dublin Airport is close by international standards but not that close