The Dominance of Dublin GAA *Mod warning post#1*

odyssey06

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

I've never made that accusation, but I would like to know what exactly someone like Diarmuid Connolly works at? It seems like the guy can p*ss off to America any time he wants for the big bucks playing over there.
So what is his full time job does anyone know? Is he unemployed?

Seriously is that what this thread has descended to?

If you'd like to explain your theory about Diarmuid Connolly's employment status and the money in GAA circles in the states, and how it relates to Dublin's dominance, we're all ears.

You wanna do a side by side occupation comparison for Dublin's squad versus Kerry or Mayo, and which of those jobs are actually real jobs, go ahead.

Otherwise this is assumed to be a scurrilous post.

BonnieSituation

odyssey06 wrote: »

Seriously is that what this thread has descended to?

If you'd like to explain your theory about Diarmuid Connolly's employment status and the money in GAA circles in the states, and how it relates to Dublin's dominance, we're all ears.

You wanna do a side by side occupation comparison for Dublin's squad versus Kerry or Mayo, and which of those jobs are actually real jobs, go ahead.

Otherwise this is assumed to be a scurrilous post.

I wonder how many handy local bank jobs those Kerry lads had back in the noughties.

gormdubhgorm

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Ah, you're awake.

Care to link me to the post where I said I put you on ignore.

He might be getting his Bonniesitution and his Bonniedog mixed up in fairness...?

Both posters of the upmost quality easy to confuse....

BonnieSituation

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

He might be getting his Bonniesitution and his Bonniedog mixed up in fairness...?

Both posters of the upmost quality easy to confuse....

I assumed he had. But that's not up to us. I mean when one posts here you assume they can back up their statements or retract them when proven wrong.

That's how I roll anyway. A few years posting over on Politics disciplines a fellow.

odyssey06

Augme wrote: »

For the people saying this simply down to a golden generation, at how many Dublin titles will Dublin fans start to wonder if it is something more? For example, if Dublin win the next 8 out of 10 championships? 13 out of 15? Or will winning it at that rate simply be down to another golden generation?
I'm curious to know what is the turning point, if there even is one.

That looks a lot like Kilkenny's hurling record from 2000 - 2015 doesn't it?
How is it tolerated in hurling and suspicious in football?

ToBeFrank123

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Ah, you're awake.

Care to link me to the post where I said I put you on ignore.

Also let's not forget:

How have Dublin been handed a free stadium?

Does the financial mismanagement in the likes of Galway and Cork not concern you as it impinges on the association as a whole and means such latent giants like Wicklow and Longford can't win All-Irelands?

I can do this all day.

I know you can. Do you work? Because I do. So I will reply when it fits my work schedule.

You're almost 24/7 posting and tracking other posters movements is a bit bizarre to be honest.

gormdubhgorm

BonnieSituation wrote: »

I wonder how many handy local bank jobs those Kerry lads had back in the noughties.

What was the one with Cork's Sean Og handing out the change...

Oh yeah they had to move him from the till because loads of girls were queuing up to get change (nice work if you can get it )

bruschi

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

You are speculating as much as I am assume these 2 or 3 players will improve or equate to the players that have left.
I am saying you ate not looking at the other variables.

Anyone who watched those Kerry minors in the flesh know that they were head and shoulders above the rest - incredible bunch.
They are already showing fruits of thier labour

League title - win 2017 (against the dubs) - runner up this year, and they are now in an AI final.
They must be doing something right?
Plus I was at the Donegal v Kerry game - there is some skill in that Kerry side - all they need are a few more 'dogs' and they are easier to find than the skillful lads.

Fellas following the Dubs know the crop coming up does not look like the same quality.
For example - back in 2017 it was obvious that Con was start in the making there was a buzz about him - wait till you see this fella etc.
I do not sense the same buzz from the current crop.
In fact there was deflation how the Dubs imploded despite a big lead against Cork.
It was described on here as unforgivable at any level.

Ciaran Archer certainly has that buzz about him. If not more to be honest. His scoring in Leinster this year was phenominal and completely unplayable. And dont forget, this was U20, not 21. Now this is from the outside in, maybe those in Dublin rate him less, but he looks as good as anything that has gone before. Luke Swan too, whether he is better at hurling or football I dont know, but there is a buzz about him,, maybe more to do with the dual aspect.

Yes Kerry are doing stuff right, in time they will more than likely be the ones to topple Dublin. But again, the point being, there is no real signs of Dublins dominance ending. They have won every game they played in championship this year with some ease. Kerry may put up more of a fight, Dublins closest games are often in the final itself.

ToBeFrank123

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

He might be getting his Bonniesitution and his Bonniedog mixed up in fairness...?

Both posters of the upmost quality easy to confuse....

Maybe I did. You have to admit having two Dublin posters starting with Bonnie is confusing to say the least.

As I'm catching up on work after holidays, my time is limited. I just had a look and Bonniesituation has posted over 3000 times alone on GAA. That's going to take some getting through.

I know one of the Bonnies said they had me on ignore, didn't reply to my posts for a week and then went all in! I'm sure whoever it was is busy cleaning up their posting history as we speak!

Dr. Bre

Allegedly Aslan gets played at half time of All Ireland finals ! Disgusting advantage lol

gormdubhgorm

Augme wrote: »

For the people saying this simply down to a golden generation, at how many Dublin titles will Dublin fans start to wonder if it is something more? For example, if Dublin win the next 8 out of 10 championships? 13 out of 15? Or will winning it at that rate simply be down to another golden generation?

I'm curious to know what is the turning point, if there even is one.

Well you are right there are other varbilbes added in Dublin cannot control -

Will other counties continue with thier own mismanagement?
Will former/current great managers stay with thier current teams - Mickey Harte/Jim Gavin
Will Cork continue thier upward rise?

A few years ago Tipp had a great group of players but failed to capilaise on it.
A little bit but then the pull of hurling proved too strong.

If there is a county with a good manager and a good crop of young lads kept together a lot can be achieved.

Dyr

blanch152 wrote: »

Let me Cluxton is a teacher, as is Cillian O'Connor, and Paul Galvin was one too.

Now Jack McCaffrey is a doctor, is that a real job, Cian O'Sullivan is a tax partner, wonder if that is a real job too.

More uninformed drivel.

Lest we forget, first 30 seconds of this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fT5rMsUdyY

"Would you be professional?"

"with Kerry we would"

Amazingly, no-one feinted or tried to pass a motion at congress

gormdubhgorm

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

Maybe I did. You have to admit having two Dublin posters starting with Bonnie is confusing to say the least.

As I'm catching up on work after holidays, my time is limited. I just had a look and Bonniesituation has posted over 3000 times alone on GAA. That's going to take some getting through.

I know one of the Bonnies said they had me on ignore, didn't reply to my posts for a week and then went all in! I'm sure whoever it was is busy cleaning up their posting history as we speak!

Ah sure it's all part of the fun of it.
If people were not talking about the GAA that is when it would be worrying.
You would have a league of Ireland situtaion where the majoirty are just not tuned in.
As long as people are interested (even watching on telly) if not going to games it will be grand.

A real rivalry needs to start though - Kerry really need to push Dublin - or even win.
Then it can take off again - like the 70's all over again - Kerry the pups and Dublin the old aging side.

Tyrone only know the one way to play - need a more flexible manager (can count them out)

There is hope for Donegal and Cork though - both great sides to watch too
I expect the later two to be in the mix in the next few years.

ClanofLams

STB. wrote: »

I have never said it is entirely irrelevant. I have said that it is condescending to the current lads that devote their time outside work to it and get the results. There are contributing factors that has us here discussing the state of the game, rather than revelling in a brilliant period in the sport where the quality of football in one county is at an all time high.

The simple fact is that after the recession the GAA decided to get organised. The tried to professionalise elements of the sport whilst continuing to not pay them. This has coincided with the emergence of a very skillfull and devoted team of players that are playing at a higher level.

The GAA realised attendance figures were dropping after 2008.

In a previous thread ClamofLams quoted the years (2005-2008) and the record attendances which were post recession. The GAA as an organisation simply never recovered to get attendences to rise outside finals. They'd like to but they went about it completely the wrong way.

Long before the Dubs went on a run, the figures were going one way. Down.

So what did the GAA do ?

• They sold some of the game to a paywall company in Sky, ensuring a fragmented championship with viewing figures that matched the smallest ground attendance figures in Ireland.
• They raised the price of tickets.
• They introduced the Super 8's, the thinking being more games = more bums on seats.

Dominance is not a key factor, but it is a factor (and it was in the past when Kerry where dominant in the 80s). The period of dominance in the past were celebrated rather than honed in on as look what they have, rather than how can we fix our own. If you don't think Kerry were well organised as well as having good fit players, back in their period of dominance, you are only codding yourself.

To get to that level, you need to match it.

The quality of fare on display is an influencing factor in whether fans attend. Only the "fans" from those counties can answer the question why they didn't turn up to support their county at a semi final last weekend (a day on which they were also represented in the minor game).

I was posting in response to ridiculous assertions that Dublin were somehow immune to falling attendances. Seventy thousand attended the Leinster final in ‘12. A decade ago Dublin would have filled Croker on their own for an All Ireland semi final whereas notwithstanding Galway’s poor following last year.

The same poster who was arguing Dublin had not been affected by falling crowds at all also implied Dublin games on tv were maintaining their interest levels, then completely ignored my response where I proved that to be untrue.

I did not say Dublin were unique in suffering from declining interest, in fact I repeatedly noted it was an issue for all counties, the argument that Dublin are somehow immune from it is clearly nonsense however.

ToBeFrank123

Right, I checked back and it was Bonniedog who put me on ignore.

So fair enough Bonniesituation, I withdraw the accusation.

But as someone else said, two Bonnies on the one forum is confusing. You're like the Bonnie and well Bonnie of the GAA forum.

Dr. Bre

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Ah sure it's all part of the fun of it.
If people were not talking about the GAA that is when it would be worrying.
You would have a league of Ireland situtaion where the majoirty are just not tuned in.
As long as people are interested (even watching on telly) if not going to games it will be grand.

A real rivalry needs to start though - Kerry really need to push Dublin - or even win.
Then it can take off again - like the 70's all over again - Kerry the pups and Dublin the old aging side.

Tyrone only know the one way to play - need a more flexible manager (can count them out)

There is hope for Donegal and Cork though - both great sides to watch too
I expect the later two to be in the mix in the next few years.

If Meath came back that would be great. A fierce rivalry.

gormdubhgorm

Bambi wrote: »

Lest we forget, first 30 seconds of this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fT5rMsUdyY

"Would you be professional?"

"with Kerry we would"

Amazingly, no-one feinted or tried to pass a motion at congress

It was funny though the most 'un-superstar-ish' superstar you could get.

kilns

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

Right, I checked back and it was Bonniedog who put me on ignore.

So fair enough Bonniesituation, I withdraw the accusation.

But as someone else said, two Bonnies on the one forum is confusing. You're like the Bonnie and well Bonnie of the GAA forum.

to be fair everyone should have ToBeFrank123 on ignore

Augme

odyssey06 wrote: »

Augme wrote: »

For the people saying this simply down to a golden generation, at how many Dublin titles will Dublin fans start to wonder if it is something more? For example, if Dublin win the next 8 out of 10 championships? 13 out of 15? Or will winning it at that rate simply be down to another golden generation?
I'm curious to know what is the turning point, if there even is one.

That looks a lot like Kilkenny's hurling record from 2000 - 2015 doesn't it?
How is it tolerated in hurling and suspicious in football?

If kilkenny did played all their matches at home and week given €17m extra compared to the other counties during that time then I think you would hear a lot more about it. You don't?

Dyr

Dr. Bre wrote: »

Allegedly Aslan gets played at half time of All Ireland finals ! Disgusting advantage lol

Also, Dustin The Turkey is allowed give a talk in the Dublin dressing room before the game

BonnieSituation

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

I know you can. Do you work? Because I do. So I will reply when it fits my work schedule.

You're almost 24/7 posting and tracking other posters movements is a bit bizarre to be honest.

Is that you moving the goalposts again?

Honestly, I don't care about the "ignore post". I know it was Bonniedog that said it.

I just like to make sure that posters are kept honest when throwing around reports and accusations. So I'll be constantly asking you the same questions in this thread regarding your assertions until you actually answer and back up your bullcrap.

As an aside, if this was the Politics forum you would long have been banned. So be grateful for the patience of rebelgirl and selghegit.

---

But I'm sure it's not that hard for you to answer the following questions, given the time pressures you're under:

How did Dublin get a "free stadium handed to them"?

Does the financial mismanagement of counties like Cork and Galway not give you pause to think that it's a scandal and incumbent on all in the GAA to criticise that, as it is imoinging on possoble success and boosts to finances for weaker counties?

ToBeFrank123

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Ah sure it's all part of the fun of it.
If people were not talking about the GAA that is when it would be worrying.
You would have a league of Ireland situtaion where the majoirty are just not tuned in.
As long as people are interested (even watching on telly) if not going to games it will be grand.

A real rivalry needs to start though - Kerry really need to push Dublin - or even win.
Then it can take off again - like the 70's all over again - Kerry the pups and Dublin the old aging side.

Tyrone only know the one way to play - need a more flexible manager (can count them out)

There is hope for Donegal and Cork though - both great sides to watch too
I expect the later two to be in the mix in the next few years.

I wrote a long post in response about how important rivalries are and my browser crashed and I lost it. In summary, you are right, rivalries are critical to the future of the GAA, because without them the sport is effectively dead.

Dyr

Augme wrote: »

If kilkenny did played all their matches at home and week given €17m extra compared to the other counties during that time then I think you would hear a lot more about it. You don't?

If Kilkenny were allowed by the GAA to completely ignore football in their county I'd say we'd hear about it from the other counties. :rolleyes:

BonnieSituation

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

Jesus Christ. Do you ever get tired of posting clueless stuff like this?

How many people attended Mayo games this year? And how many attended Dublin games? I reckon the totals wouldn't be too far off similar numbers.

We can't really compare the TV audience because of the GAA deal with SKY meant most Mayo games were behind a paywall, not that Mayo GAA see a red cent from that deal. Its used to pay the salaries of the GAA and also help out the Dublin Games Development Fund, as will no doubt the gate receipts at the Dublin v Mayo semi final.

You tell us.

How many people attended Mayo games v Dublin games this year?

gormdubhgorm

Dr. Bre wrote: »

If Meath came back that would be great. A fierce rivalry.

They are improving need to find a few forwards.
What did cross my mind was if a few Dublin forwards moved to a Meath club....
And actually played for Meath...
Instead of just Stuart Lowndes
Didn't a dublin forward play u21 for Dublin while with Donaghmore/Ashbourne?

ToBeFrank123

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Is that you moving the goalposts again?

Honestly, I don't care about the "ignore post". I know it was Bonnidog that said it. Just like to make sure that posters are kept honest when throwing around reports and accusations.

---

But I'm sure it's not that hard for you to answer the following questions, given the time pressures you're under:

How did Dublin get a "free stadium handed to them"?

Does the financial mismanagement of counties like Cork and Galway not give you pause to think that it's a scandal and incumbent on all in the GAA to criticise that, as it is imoinging on possoble success and boosts to finances for weaker counties?

1. How much did Dublin GAA invest in the building of Croke Park? And it doesn't matter if its rented - the stadium is in Dublin in their own backyward. Its their home stadium. Not Parnell Park, or anywhere else, its Croke Park. So yes how much did Dublin invest and how much do they currently owe?

2. Financial mismanagement? Large Capital projects always lead to cost over-runs - you only have to look at the farce of the national childrens hospital. But Pairc Ui Chaoimh was crumbling and was a historic stadium, which the GAA agreed to help out with, although Cork have to also pay millions.

3. Galway mismanagement - again related to stadium development as I understand it. Always risks involved.

4. I'm sure if you examined Dublin in detail you'd see similar questionable practises around pitch and clubhouse developments, conflicts of interests, etc

But these are more capital projects. Its the games development funding imbalances where the real scandal is. As others have said, Dublin are at least 10 years ahead of the rest of the country in the level they received.

There's one other thing you conveniently ignore - counties like Mayo, especially this year have massive expenses around travel, mileage and hotel stays. It eats massively into their 1.5 million a year spend, whereas it doesn't with Dublin who mostly only have to roll down the road to Croke PArk. This is another advantage enjoyed by Dublin over the rest.

gormdubhgorm

Augme wrote: »

If kilkenny did played all their matches at home and week given €17m extra compared to the other counties during that time then I think you would hear a lot more about it. You don't?

They stopped playing football at senior level bar a few flurries at Tommy Murphy then killed that. DJ trying to lead a revival at underage.
Pumped all the money into hurling - plus hurling and football are not like and like only really 6 teams in hurling, maybe 8 at a push.
Less competition - less money needed to be a success at the depth in the game in hurling is not there.

Kilkenny also made thier money by winning league titles consistently - pumped into thier sole sport - which is forgotten about.

Maybe Dublin should focus on football and forget the hurling?
It might improve them is what you are implying?

ToBeFrank123

BonnieSituation wrote: »

You tell us.

How many people attended Mayo games v Dublin games this year?

Maybe later - too busy with work. Unless someone else wants to do the research?

flasher0030

blanch152 wrote: »

Let me Cluxton is a teacher, as is Cillian O'Connor, and Paul Galvin was one too.

Now Jack McCaffrey is a doctor, is that a real job, Cian O'Sullivan is a tax partner, wonder if that is a real job too.

More uninformed drivel.

Lets not get ahead of ourselves. I know these guys are your idols and can do no wrong. He is tax director.

piplip87

The dominance of Dublin GAA is all down to the work of the clubs youth structure in Dublin for the last 10-20 years. They are seeing the results now.

Now money has made that happen. Yes Dublin do get far much more money than anywhere else, but it was spent right. Getting kids into GAA at young age, off the streets and they just have had an exceptional bunch of athletes come through for the last decade or so. They have also had a fantastic couple of managers.

There's also economic reasons for this success, how many counties have lost serious footballers to emigration in the last decade ? How many lads have to travel to Dublin for work and collage and as a result cannot commit to county ?

The Dublin lads can work, live and study in Dublin while the same cannot be said for many other counties, that is another part of it.

It has to be said I enjoy watching Dublin and fair play to them but the playing field regarding funding needs to be leveled.

jmayo

Blueshoe wrote: »

Why don't they dominate in hurling too or at least reach semi final stage

I really love how this old chestnut is floated as if it means there have been no sizable gains in performance and results.

Even your fellow dubs will admit how far back they are starting from in comparison to the footballers.

Even then the amount of club and inter-county titles have grown exponentially since the early 2000s.
But sure according to some because they haven't won Liam or been in final it doesn't count. :rolleyes:

Trampas wrote: »

Why doesn’t barret get a job that’s involves working from home or get a job nearer to Mayo.
...

The fact you uttered such shyte shows how little you know of the wider country and it also says a lot about the other dubs that actually agreed (thanked) with your lack of knowledge.

blanch152 wrote: »

I have already posted the facts in another thread, but here they are again for ease of reference.

From the 21 players that played in the 2015 final, there has only been Bastick, Alan Brogan and Paul Flynn who have left the panel. Two of the unused subs are gone - Brady and Savage - but the other three unused subs are still on the panel, meaning that 21 of the 26 named for the 2015 All-Ireland final are still involved with Dublin.

How many of the Kerry team that played that day will play on the 1st of September? Well, I don’t think we will see Aidan O’Mahony, Brendan Kealy, Fionan Fitzgerald, Jonathon Lyne, Peter Crowley, Anthony Maher, Johnny Buckley, Donncha Walsh, Colm Cooper, James O’Donoghue, Brian Kelly, Kieran Donaghy, Bryan Sheehan, Barry John Keane, Darren O’Sullivan or Paul Galvin, will we? That is 16 of the Kerry 26 in 2015 who I don’t expect to see anywhere near the Kerry 26 on the 1st September (I am happy to be corrected if I have got one wrong).

You keep making this point ad nauseam and it is rather disingenuous.

What age were those Kerry players at the time in 2015 ?
How long had they been around because I can remember a fair few of them playing Mayo in 2006 which would have been 9 years before.
Galvin, O'Sullivan, Sheehan, Donaghy, Cooper had all been involved in 2006 and some of them were well enough established at the time.

Oh and Peter Crowley is sidelined with injury this season, James O’Donoghue has had huge amount of injuries over last number of years.
Jonathan Lyne and Killian Young start mainly on the bench.

So your grand statement doesn't quite stand up to closer scrutiny.

blanch152 wrote: »

The bare facts of the issue are this:

10 of the Kerry 26 in 2015 made the squad last Sunday.
18 of the Dublin 26 in 2015 made the squad last Saturday.
...

And yet again pedaling the same line for affect. :rolleyes:

LeinsterDub wrote: »

The gaa is a democracy. This funding was democratically allocated. That's the justification

What about bertie's pet project that was specifically targeted at Dublin ?

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Plus why are the different columns in Mayo colours?

Also increase in funding does not equate to increase in success that is fallacy.

If that was the case China would dominate snooker - they do not (still have not won a world title despite the hype)
China would dominate soccer - they do not (What have they done in any World Cup?)
The Dublin hurlers were beaten by Laois this year!

Ah yes lets drag the hurlers into it as the now scared cow of how Dublin funding has no effect.

BTW what about the financial investment China made in other sports ?
What about their medal haul in Olympics, has that not drastically increased over the years ?
China went from winning about 30 odd medals in 1984 to a 100 at Bejing Olympics in 2008 and are now around 90 odd.

Take Russia for another example, Yeltsin was big Tennis fan and put money into it and hey presto you have Russians winning major tournaments.

Look at huge British investment in cycling and how that won them Olympic medals and led to tour successes.

Yes you are right that Dublin have been wise and professional in putting structures and the management in place, but totally discounting the actual funding being made available is frankly baffling and insulting to the rest of us.

gormdubhgorm

BonnieSituation wrote: »

You tell us.

How many people attended Mayo games v Dublin games this year?

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

Maybe later - too busy with work. Unless someone else wants to do the research?

Working backwards AI semi-final full house - 82,300 Dublin v Mayo

Would guess that the league was about 40k-50k

odyssey06

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

There's one other thing you conveniently ignore - counties like Mayo, especially this year have massive expenses around travel, mileage and hotel stays. It eats massively into their 1.5 million a year spend, whereas it doesn't with Dublin who mostly only have to roll down the road to Croke PArk. This is another advantage enjoyed by Dublin over the rest.

Match expenses are covered from GAA central funds:
"Travel and hotel expenses and grants, which shall be reviewed annually, shall be paid to teams competing in All-Ireland Quarter-finals, Semi-finals and Finals."

ToBeFrank123

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Working backwards AI semi-final full house - 82,300 Dublin v Mayo

Would guess that the league was about 40k-50k

These are rough estimates based on memory, but will look for exact stats later.

Donegal v Mayo 25k
Kerry v Mayo 30k
Meath v Mayo double header but probably 15k Mayo and 10k Meath fans. Hard to know with double headers. So guessing 25k
Galway v Mayo 20k
Armagh v Mayo 10k
Down v Mayo 8k
Dublin v Mayo 82k
Roscommon v Mayo 20k
Mayo v NY 10k

Rough total = 230,000 attended Mayo games during the championship. So anyone who says Mayo are being subsidised etc are talking nonsense.

In 2017 with the replay with Kerry, it was probably as high. Also 2016 and 2015 with the Dublin replays.

Dyr

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Maybe Dublin should focus on football and forget the hurling?

Sure that's what most of our hurlers did

odyssey06

jmayo wrote: »

Look at huge British investment in cycling and how that won them Olympic medals and led to tour successes.

Cycling and GAA are not remotely comparable given the importance of equipment and wind tunnels in cycling we would expect funding to have a major impact.
It was one of the main reasons why the British selected it as a sport to pump with funding.

Dots1982

Can’t wait for the “Dublin only win because of theyr unfair advantages” cabal to finally convince the dubs here with their arguments.

Bound to happen any day now.

gormdubhgorm

jmayo wrote: »

Ah yes lets drag the hurlers into it as the now scared cow of how Dublin funding has no effect.

BTW what about the financial investment China made in other sports ?
What about their medal haul in Olympics, has that not drastically increased over the years ?
China went from winning about 30 odd medals in 1984 to a 100 at Bejing Olympics in 2008 and are now around 90 odd.

Your problem is that you are assuming funding is the MAIN reason for Dublin's success.
it is not proper management is.
You yourself bring up China - if the funding was the sole reason for success in sports - China would be doing much better in Soccer and win the majority of World titles in snooker (they have yet to win a world snooker title)

That is the bit that grates upon Dublin fans - yes Dublin fans know they have advantages - are the DCB willing to change them if Congress want to? Yes
But Congress do not.....
There are also plans afoot to begin 'equalisation' in Leinster football that is the term they use.

See the leinster council annual report 2017 -

http://leinster.clubandcounty.com/wp-content/uploads/sites/33/2018/01/LConv_17_WEB-2.pdf


From the report -

Equalisation

There has been a large amount of comment in relation to the different standards in Counties. I alluded last year to the need for equalisationof funding to be given to those counties who find it hard to raise capital. I feel this matter needs addressing as a lot of energy is expendedin these counties struggling to manage their finances and distracting away from the main purpose of this organisation promoting games.
Taking monies away from counties will be divisive - but allocating funds from new revenue streams to the weaker would be a great help.
However, if this is to happen it must be subject to an acceptance of a greater governance. Sponsorship is also difficult for some counties in
terms of the sums they receive. A common sponsor negotiated at national level might improve the situation with a number of counties being signed up to the same sponsor.

- - - - -

What posters such as yourself fail to acknowledge is the superb management of the team, the superb caliber of players, and the superb management of funds.
To imply that funding is the sole/main reason for Dublin's success is insulting in the extreme.
But then again it takes the focus away from examination of what other counties did from a position of strength and faded - Kildare - Galway - Meath.

Let us not forget Galway have one of the strongest football clubs in the history of the game

Kildare had great underage success - but blew it with a poor manager at senior level who did not bring them on

Meath had a great foundation left at senior level after Boylan - but they let underage wither - too complacent

bruschi

Dots1982 wrote: »

Can’t wait for the “Dublin only win because of theyr unfair advantages” cabal to finally convince the dubs here with their arguments.

Bound to happen any day now.

I'm not so sure it will. I reckon the "Dublin are the best because of a once in a generation team and better club volunteers" argument will get there first!

Dots1982

bruschi wrote: »

I'm not so sure it will. I reckon the "Dublin are the best because of a once in a generation team and better club volunteers" argument will get there first!

Maybe, the stalemate is going to break though. I can feel it

blanch152

jmayo wrote: »

You keep making this point ad nauseam and it is rather disingenuous.

What age were those Kerry players at the time in 2015 ?
How long had they been around because I can remember a fair few of them playing Mayo in 2006 which would have been 9 years before.
Galvin, O'Sullivan, Sheehan, Donaghy, Cooper had all been involved in 2006 and some of them were well enough established at the time.

Oh and Peter Crowley is sidelined with injury this season, James O’Donoghue has had huge amount of injuries over last number of years.
Jonathan Lyne and Killian Young start mainly on the bench.

So your grand statement doesn't quite stand up to closer scrutiny.

This is laughable. Kerry players can be replaced when they get old, but Dublin must keep on a 40-year old Brogan.

The comparison I made between Kerry 1975-1978 and Dublin 2011-2015 remains valid, with the tweaks and changes needed to turn a good team (1975, 2011) into a great team (1978, 2015) being repeated with the same consistency of squad thereafter.

This consistency since 2015 is not replicated elsewhere, as Dublin have hung on to those players by and large.

gormdubhgorm

Put McGeeney in charge of this Dublin team - watch him make a sh*te of it
No amount of 'funding' would make a difference if that man was in charge - does he improve players?

Put Jim Gavin in charge of Mayo it would not be a famine it would be a feast.

blanch152

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

I wrote a long post in response about how important rivalries are and my browser crashed and I lost it.

40 years ago I used to say that the dog ate my homework. Is that this year's excuse?

BonnieSituation

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

1. How much did Dublin GAA invest in the building of Croke Park? And it doesn't matter if its rented - the stadium is in Dublin in their own backyward. Its their home stadium. Not Parnell Park, or anywhere else, its Croke Park. So yes how much did Dublin invest and how much do they currently owe?

Expalian to me why "renting" the stadium doesn't count? Is it because it doesn't suit your narrative of a "free" stadium being handed to Dubin?

Dublin can't help if the stadium is in Dublin. I mean the GAA have owned the site for over 100 years. No one complained that the capital had the national stadium in it before.

In fact it would seem like the best place to have a stadium of such a size would be in the largest city in the country. It means the GAA can sweat the asset and make more money for the assciation that can then funnel down to the grassroots and places that require it.

Do you have another suggestion to the contrary of this that would be a better idea?


I can't exactly answer how much Dublin GAA "directly invested" in the bulding of Croke Park, because

a) I can't find the figures, but assume it would never be accounted for in such a way if they did exist,

and

b) the building programmes which cost €285m (only €177m of which the GAA had to fund) started way back in 1993 so it's a tough one. I woudl guess though that Dublin GAA "directly" contributed the same as Galway and Cork and Kerry etc. I fail to see what that matters anyway as a contribution.

I wonder how much of the €109m of government funding was raised in Dublin through taxation though? I'd say a fair whack of it. Wouldn't you?

Parnell Park is our home stadium and unfortunately isn't able to be redeveloped to a level required. It would make no sense to anyway given there is already a stadium that exists in the general area that could accommodate Dublin.

Any thoughts on the stallled Spawell project that was scuppered by govt policy which could have taken us out of the precious Croke Park?

2. Financial mismanagement? Large Capital projects always lead to cost over-runs - you only have to look at the farce of the national childrens hospital. But Pairc Ui Chaoimh was crumbling and was a historic stadium, which the GAA agreed to help out with, although Cork have to also pay millions.

Large capital projects can lead to over-runs that is correct.

Does it make it right though that Cork's financial mismanagement led to an unbelievably naive budget plan for the stadium that any clown could have foretold them was nonsense.

The GAA bailed Cork CB out though. They paid off the loan and now Cork CB are paying it back to HQ at I would say a rather favourable rate.

The money that the GAA gave to Cork is now not available for other weaker counties. That seems unfair to me just because Cork fupped up.

3. Galway mismanagement - again related to stadium development as I understand it. Always risks involved.

Risks?

Any well run organisation always tries to mitigate risks though. In the case of Galway they failed to do so.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/gaelic-games/galway-abandon-plan-for-training-centre-near-athenry-1.3331573

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/sport/gaa/galway-clubs-want-answers-after-damning-audit-892456.html

Have a read of that; can you honestly tell me with such money flting about the place that nn one had the wit to think that this was a risky venture? No one?

The risk excuse is rather disgraceful and implies that there was "nothing that could be done".

4. I'm sure if you examined Dublin in detail you'd see similar questionable practises around pitch and clubhouse developments, conflicts of interests, etc

Abniltely, I'm sure there might be some things around the county which may make you go "Hmmmmmmmm", funny how it never sadls the DCB with in sane debt though? Woud it be because the DCB is well run and unbelievably professional in its work?

But these are more capital projects. Its the games development funding imbalances where the real scandal is. As others have said, Dublin are at least 10 years ahead of the rest of the country in the level they received.

No the scandal is always wasting money like Cork and Galway needlessly done. Why do they get a free pass?

The money they waste in the end reduces all sorts of funding. That should be self-evident!

There's one other thing you conveniently ignore - counties like Mayo, especially this year have massive expenses around travel, mileage and hotel stays. It eats massively into their 1.5 million a year spend, whereas it doesn't with Dublin who mostly only have to roll down the road to Croke PArk. This is another advantage enjoyed by Dublin over the rest.

What travel expenses?

They played 4 games at home in the League this year. Dublin played 4 games away.

In Connacht, Mayo played New York - which I mean, hardly impinges on their travel costs given the Connacht Council stump up for that afaik. They then got beaten by Roscommon in Castlebar, beat Down in Newry, Armagh in Castlebar, Galway in Limerick and then had Donegal in Castlebar in the Super 8s with the other two games in Killarney and Croke Park respectively.

Have you got a breakdown of the Mayo CBs accounts detailing what all that money was spent on?

Maybe if Mayo won Connacht for a change they woudln't be stumping up so much needless cash traipsing around the country.

BonnieSituation

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Working backwards AI semi-final full house - 82,300 Dublin v Mayo

Would guess that the league was about 40k-50k

Frank intimated that more people watched Mayo than Dublin this year.

So I wanted the figures.

blanch152

BonnieSituation wrote: »

What travel expenses?

They played 4 games at home in the League this year. Dublin played 4 games away.

In Connacht, Mayo played New York - which I mean, hardly impinges on their travel costs given the Connacht Council stump up for that afaik. They then got beaten by Roscommon in Castlebar, beat Down in Newry, Armagh in Castlebar, Galway in Limerick and then had Donegal in Castlebar in the Super 8s with the other two games in Killarney and Croke Park respectively.

Have you got a breakdown of the Mayo CBs accounts detailing what all that money was spent on?

Maybe if Mayo won Connacht for a change they woudln't be stumpoing up so much needless cash.

Mayo spend the most of all counties on their senior team. Any funding they get from Croke Park is concentrated into the senior team. It is a very short-sighted approach and will cost them in the next decade.

The best approach for senior success is the one taken by Kerry. Concentrate on training the best of the 14 and 15-year olds and develop them into real players, giving them a culture of winning at minor level, take the best into the senior squad, while at the same time ignoring mass participation.

odyssey06

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Frank intimated that more people watched Mayo than Dublin this year. So I wanted the figures.

Given that 1/3 of Mayo's total attendance for the championship came in one match v Dublin, there is an element of double counting.

It's not that easy to find a single source with attendances, or if there is google didn't find it for me...
Dublin had 47000 for the Leinster Final, and 35000 for a double header Leinster semi-final. 36,530 for Dublin-Roscommon, which was a double-header with Tyrone-Cork, and 30,214 for Dublin-Cork. 15000 for Tyrone in Omagh. I'm guessing 18,000 for the first Leinster game.

There's not that much difference in the figures, but Dublin's average per game is much higher.

BonnieSituation

odyssey06 wrote: »

Given that 1/3 of Mayo's total attendance for the championship came in one match v Dublin, there is an element of double counting.

It's not that easy to find a single source with attendances, or if there is google didn't find it for me...
Dublin had 47000 for the Leinster Final, and 35000 for a double header Leinster semi-final. 36,530 for Dublin-Roscommon, which was a double-header with Tyrone-Cork, and 30,214 for Dublin-Cork. 15000 for Tyrone in Omagh. I'm guessing 18,000 for the first Leinster game.

There's not that much difference in the figures, but Dublin's average per game is much higher.

I would have discounted the AISF as it would be part of both teams totals.

But again let Frank come up with the figures. He's making the assertions.

ToBeFrank123

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Frank intimated that more people watched Mayo than Dublin this year.

So I wanted the figures.

I gave you an estimate of the Mayo figures. Its easy to check the real figures if you have the time which you no doubt have.

Do you have the Dublin figures or do I have to do that too?

odyssey06

ToBeFrank123 wrote: »

I gave you an estimate of the Mayo figures. Its easy to check the real figures if you have the time which you no doubt have.
Do you have the Dublin figures or do I have to do that too?

I have provided an estimate for the Dublin games from mixed sources.

Please provide the real figures & source for same if they are so easy to find because my experience has been that it isn't, and such a source would be useful.