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Brexit discussion thread X (Please read OP before posting)
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Forty Seven wrote: »I deny any of it met the definition of racist. What with us being of the same race and all.
As for Cromwell. Did he affect you in any way? Can I drag up the Germans shooting at my grandfathers for some outrage aimed at the eu? That was a bit more recent and a tad more deadly. How far down the annals of history do you want to go?
Deal with the current crisis and get off your pity pot. ancient history has no place here.
Well recent history has shown that since the formation of the EEC/EU, Europeans have stopped shooting at each other.
It has been the most murderous continent on the earth over the past few hundred years. Remember the age of imperialism and nationalism culminated in the industrial mass murder of human beings in purpose built facilities the likes of which this world has never seen before or since. And now we have politicians in the UK telling us that a return to nationalism is the way forward.
I too share concerns over the rise of nationalism. I made a post about it a few pages back.
Imperialism however is history. The empire is history.0 -
ThePanjandrum wrote: »England, Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales are each treated as what they are, constituent parts of the UK.
Yet... Scotland has Holyrood, NI has Stormont, Wales has The Senedd.
If they really were constituent parts of the UK, England would have its own govt and parliament, and the UK would have it's own separate council.
HOC will always put English interests ahead of the UK, Scotland, Wales or NI.0 -
Since "race" is a social construct and not a precise scientific term of the art, one can make whatever assertions one likes as to where a dividing between groups of humans exist.Forty Seven wrote: »I deny any of it met the definition of racist. What with us being of the same race and all.
As the British actors who committed the various atrocities and acts of oppression against Irish certainly did believe that the Irish were "other", I would suggest that their beliefs in the matter- not yours -are more relevant.
I would suggest anyone willing to stoop to 'race is a social construct' to attempt to win a losing battle has very little to add to any debate. A good day to you sir. I hope you get over your hatred of my ancestors one day. Hating the long dead is unhealthy.0 -
Hypothetically but facts point to the opposite.Forty Seven wrote: »ElectronVolt wrote: »So was the Soviet Union, so was Rome, so was Turkey not that long ago too. Circumstances can change enormously when idiots get into power.
At present it's a minor world power, comparable to France in reach and scale and that's all it is. It's not the British Empire, nor is it the US or China. It also amplified a lot of that power through the EU arrangements in terms of economic and diplomatic clout.
A bit of perspective is very necessary. It could well end up being a world power like Australia, only without the natural resources and entirely dependent on trade.
What's going on is without precedent. So the outcome is likely to be somewhat unpredictable and chaotic but none of the forecasts look positive, except for the imaginary ones.
It could also go the other way with the eventual break up of the EU. Uncharted territory goes both ways. I do appreciate what you are saying but we have a lot going for us going forward, once we get through this current problem, we have survived much, much worse as a nation.
The EU is in the ascendancy.
The UK has been in decline since 1945.0 -
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Race_(human_categorization)Forty Seven wrote: »I would suggest anyone willing to stoop to 'race is a social construct' to attempt to win a losing battle has very little to add to any debate. A good day to you sir. I hope you get over your hatred of my ancestors one day. Hating the long dead is unhealthy.
"Modern scholarship regards race as a social construct..."
But as you were.0 -
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listermint wrote: »
With all due respect. Your partner wouldn't be indicative of what's going on in the wider Scottish vote all polls indicate that. And the style of your posting here would also suggest a very leavery conversation set despite your assertions of the opposite.
So I'd expect nothing more.
You however brushing those feelings onto the rest of the younger vote is very questionable
I am a remainer resigned to my fate. There is no way we will stay in the EU now. This is too far gone. My sole wish now is to not see Scottish independence. Just because I am pragmatic about my situation and can see both sides of an argument does not give you the right to imply I am anything more than what I claim to be.
I offered some anecdotal evidence to a one sided debate that you don't like. It does not make it false or my intentions suspect. I did give you some specifics so you could check for yourself. It is the only option to keep out the snp. She is not a Tory. Some of us have more to think about than simply brexit. The break up of the union is just as catastrophic. Voting Labour in this seat will not stop brexit. It might stop the SNP gaining a seat.
As for the polls, and with all due respect to you, would you care to remind me what the polls said of Trumps chances?0 -
Arlene apparently won't stand in the next election (as I assume she knows she probably won't get in due to her pro-Brexit stance doesn't go down too well in her constituency).
However she also.claims that the Brits won't put in any border infrastructure as that is what the UK government has said :rolleyes:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-northern-ireland-496161340 -
Forty Seven wrote: »I am a remainer resigned to my fate. There is no way we will stay in the EU now. This is too far gone. My sole wish now is to not see Scottish independence. Just because I am pragmatic about my situation and can see both sides of an argument does not give you the right to imply I am anything more than what I claim to be.
I offered some anecdotal evidence to a one sided debate that you don't like. It does not make it false or my intentions suspect. I did give you some specifics so you could check for yourself. It is the only option to keep out the snp. She is not a Tory. Some of us have more to think about than simply brexit. The break up of the union is just as catastrophic. Voting Labour in this seat will not stop brexit. It might stop the SNP gaining a seat.
As for the polls, and with all due respect to you, would you care to remind me what the polls said of Trumps chances?
To be clear. You are fully aware the younger vote has consistently shown always to be pro remain.polls and votes.
So you have zero basis for your assertion based on your partner alone.
I've no idea what trump has to do with anything can you explain a bit more how trump polls have anything to do with the younger voter being pro EU.
Please0 -
Hypothetically but facts point to the opposite.Forty Seven wrote: »ElectronVolt wrote: »So was the Soviet Union, so was Rome, so was Turkey not that long ago too. Circumstances can change enormously when idiots get into power.
At present it's a minor world power, comparable to France in reach and scale and that's all it is. It's not the British Empire, nor is it the US or China. It also amplified a lot of that power through the EU arrangements in terms of economic and diplomatic clout.
A bit of perspective is very necessary. It could well end up being a world power like Australia, only without the natural resources and entirely dependent on trade.
What's going on is without precedent. So the outcome is likely to be somewhat unpredictable and chaotic but none of the forecasts look positive, except for the imaginary ones.
It could also go the other way with the eventual break up of the EU. Uncharted territory goes both ways. I do appreciate what you are saying but we have a lot going for us going forward, once we get through this current problem, we have survived much, much worse as a nation.
The EU is the ascendancy.
The UK has been in decline since 1945.
Granted but laws of unintended consequences tend not to follow trends by their very definition. Nobody knows how this is going to be viewed in the history books. We can but speculate. The national nature of boards and our shared history has at times resulted in this discussion becoming a bit of an echo chamber. A bit of devil's advocacy and alternate opinion cannot be bad for debate.
Polls are often wrong, outcomes are often unexpected. The referendum itself being a case in point.0 -
Latest from Iain Duncan Smith:
Former Conservative leader Iain Duncan Smith encouraged Mr Johnson to break the law, saying he would be seen as a Brexit "martyr" if judges opted to put him jail for breaching Parliament's terms.
Honestly it's going to full out dictatorship being encouraged now and the Telegraph are now saying that Labour are to blame as they are forcing Boris to break the law and causing a constitutional crisis.
If Boris disobeys the law there will be very ugly scenes I predict. All out full civil war and mayhem on the streets.0 -
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Forty Seven wrote: »Granted but laws of unintended consequences tend not to follow trends by their very definition. Nobody knows how this is going to be viewed in the history books. We can but speculate. The national nature of boards and our shared history has at times resulted in this discussion becoming a bit of an echo chamber. A bit of devil's advocacy and alternate opinion cannot be bad for debate.
Polls are often wrong, outcomes are often unexpected. The referendum itself being a case in point.
Ah yes. We should use the illegally infiltrated referendum as a guiding light of outcomes.
I wonder what he outcome would have been if illegal dark practices were not deployed with foreign money and influence.
You'd almost think a rerun of it would work.with the former leave promoters who participated in literal illegal activities banned from working in any capacity0 -
Latest from Iain Duncan Smith:
Former Conservative leader Iain Duncan Smith encouraged Mr Johnson to break the law, saying he would be seen as a Brexit "martyr" if judges opted to put him jail for breaching Parliament's terms.
Honestly it's going to full out dictatorship being encouraged now and the Telegraph are now saying that Labour are to blame as they are forcing Boris to break the law and causing a constitutional crisis.
If Boris disobeys the law there will be very ugly scenes I predict. All out full civil war and mayhem on the streets.
I'd look into Smith's investments , because frankly he's been extremely out spoken for the past year on a no deal.0 -
Major revisionism in your posts.Forty Seven wrote: »
Neither Newcastle but Nottingham are subject to a peace treaty based on membership of the EU to resolve a centuries long racist murderous oppression and suppression of Irish people by British.ThePanjandrum wrote: »So did Newcastle's but Nottingham voted to Leave.
The Referendum was UK wide so the fact that different areas voted different ways is meaningless.
Irish are not a seperate race so you can shuffle that card right back into your pack.
In 19th century, the British, aka the English, championed pseudoscientific race theories, which they leveraged throughout the Empire. In fact, the whole Aryan race nonsense later on in Germany has a link to this - the later German "thinkers" were looking at previous English attempts and developed them further.
You may need to check the documented race "assessments" of Irish, Indians, South African etc from this period. Also kindly note that the English developed de facto concentration camps in South Africa. This is all well documented.
Now back to the Irish, from the Victorian period:In much of the pseudo-scientific literature of the day the Irish were held to be inferior, an example of a lower evolutionary form, closer to the apes than their "superiors", the Anglo-Saxons.
...
John Beddoe, who later became the President of the Anthropological Institute (1889-1891), wrote in his Races of Britain (1862) that all men of genius were orthognathous (less prominent jaw bones) while the Irish and the Welsh were prognathous and that the Celt was closely related to Cromagnon man, who, in turn, was linked, according to Beddoe, to the "Africanoid". The position of the Celt in Beddoe's "Index of Nigrescence" was very different from that of the Anglo-Saxon. These ideas were not confined to a lunatic fringe of the scientific community, for although they never won over the mainstream of British scientists they were disseminated broadly and it was even hinted that the Irish might be the elusive missing link!0 -
The EU is in continuous ascendancy since the 1951 Schuman declaration of the intent to (eventually) unite Europe.Forty Seven wrote: »
Hypothetically but facts point to the opposite.Forty Seven wrote: »ElectronVolt wrote: »So was the Soviet Union, so was Rome, so was Turkey not that long ago too. Circumstances can change enormously when idiots get into power.
At present it's a minor world power, comparable to France in reach and scale and that's all it is. It's not the British Empire, nor is it the US or China. It also amplified a lot of that power through the EU arrangements in terms of economic and diplomatic clout.
A bit of perspective is very necessary. It could well end up being a world power like Australia, only without the natural resources and entirely dependent on trade.
What's going on is without precedent. So the outcome is likely to be somewhat unpredictable and chaotic but none of the forecasts look positive, except for the imaginary ones.
It could also go the other way with the eventual break up of the EU. Uncharted territory goes both ways. I do appreciate what you are saying but we have a lot going for us going forward, once we get through this current problem, we have survived much, much worse as a nation.
The EU is the ascendancy.
The UK has been in decline since 1945.
Granted but laws of unintended consequences tend not to follow trends by their very definition. Nobody knows how this is going to be viewed in the history books. We can but speculate. The national nature of boards and our shared history has at times resulted in this discussion becoming a bit of an echo chamber. A bit of devil's advocacy and alternate opinion cannot be bad for debate.
Polls are often wrong, outcomes are often unexpected. The referendum itself being a case in point.
The Euro is the second largest reserve currency. The Euro is also second largest IMF SDR at 31% of XDR basket, USD is 42% of the XDR basket - this confirms the prime reserve currency status. This was achieved in less than 20 years without any military domination or denomination unlike the USD status.
The EU is the largest single market in the world and with Japan deep FTA is now a free trade area worth of 21% global GDP (US is 24% and China 15%).
The EU consolidates further and is a global soft power able to take on the US or China.
Now how about UK since 1951? It's a story of continuous decline from former world super power. Ironically, the only period of a significant development and success is late 1980s to 2009 brought fully about by the EU membership and the ability of the UK government to leverage it.0 -
Latest from Iain Duncan Smith:
Former Conservative leader Iain Duncan Smith encouraged Mr Johnson to break the law, saying he would be seen as a Brexit "martyr" if judges opted to put him jail for breaching Parliament's terms.
Honestly it's going to full out dictatorship being encouraged now and the Telegraph are now saying that Labour are to blame as they are forcing Boris to break the law and causing a constitutional crisis.
If Boris disobeys the law there will be very ugly scenes I predict. All out full civil war and mayhem on the streets.
That type of stunt pulled by some rogue actor in a failed state would have British people tut tutting over their breakfast muffins..
Wouldn't ever happen here of course
Just like naked populism wouldn't ever take hold here.. that's for 'Europeans'0 -
Despite the best attempts of English cartoonists to show that we are actually a different species of course...Forty Seven wrote: »Irish are not a seperate race so you can shuffle that card right back into your pack.
https://cain.ulster.ac.uk/images/cartoons/douglas3.gif
Irish people have been depicted as ape like in British newspapers up until living memory as the attached image shows.0 -
If Boris disobeys the law there will be very ugly scenes I predict. All out full civil war and mayhem on the streets.
And if brexit isn't delivered? The side that feel they won a democratic vote will meekly turn the other cheek?
Righteous anger on both sides and no credible leadership for either. A very dangerous situation.0 -
Forty Seven wrote: »And if brexit isn't delivered? The side that feel they won a democratic vote will meekly turn the other cheek?
Righteous anger on both sides and no credible leadership for either. A very dangerous situation.
I think people over-estimate the propensity of modern Westerners to stage revolutions. Lets look at Catalonia, which went through with a full declaration of independence and even had a little state repression and ended up snuffed out with little more than a whimper. I think in modern times control of the institutions of state has a good deal more importance than previous eras, which probably makes it important that they are representative and not artificially bound up in anachronisms like FPTP or Electoral Colleges.0 -
Forty Seven wrote: »And if brexit isn't delivered? The side that feel they won a democratic vote will meekly turn the other cheek?
Righteous anger on both sides and no credible leadership for either. A very dangerous situation.
The only way to break the deadlock is another referendum on the deal. If Vote Leave doesn't want the deal on offer then they should put forward no-deal against remain. But they don't want to do that so either we have a PM breaking the law or riots from Brexiteers.0 -
Forty Seven wrote: »And if brexit isn't delivered? The side that feel they won a democratic vote will meekly turn the other cheek?
Righteous anger on both sides and no credible leadership for either. A very dangerous situation.
Righteous anger ...
Frankly the leave side isn't as big as is made out on social media.
I'd say the large majority are sick of hearing about this crap and just want it washed from the news. That's deal or stay or no. No meaning it stays in the news.
So tbh. The whole resistance talk is absolute tosh made up on twitter and Facebook. People want to wash the word brexit from existence.0 -
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There's no chance Johnson will break the law. His whole life has been about avoiding personal responsibility and lying to preserve himself. The chances he'd 'martyr' himself with the possibility of jail are ludicrously small. Ironic that they're trying to goad Corbyn with 'chicken' insults. There's a yellow streak a mile wide down Johnson's back.The only way to break the deadlock is another referendum on the deal. If Vote Leave doesn't want the deal on offer then they should put forward no-deal against remain. But they don't want to do that so either we have a PM breaking the law or riots from Brexiteers.0 -
Major revisionism in your posts.Forty Seven wrote: »
Neither Newcastle but Nottingham are subject to a peace treaty based on membership of the EU to resolve a centuries long racist murderous oppression and suppression of Irish people by British.ThePanjandrum wrote: »So did Newcastle's but Nottingham voted to Leave.
The Referendum was UK wide so the fact that different areas voted different ways is meaningless.
Irish are not a seperate race so you can shuffle that card right back into your pack.
In 19th century, the British, aka the English, championed pseudoscientific race theories, which they leveraged throughout the Empire. In fact, the whole Aryan race nonsense later on in Germany has a link to this - the later German "thinkers" were looking at previous English attempts and developed them further.
You may need to check the documented race "assessments" of Irish, Indians, South African etc from this period. Also kindly note that the English developed de facto concentration camps in South Africa. This is all well documented.
Now back to the Irish, from the Victorian period:In much of the pseudo-scientific literature of the day the Irish were held to be inferior, an example of a lower evolutionary form, closer to the apes than their "superiors", the Anglo-Saxons.
...
John Beddoe, who later became the President of the Anthropological Institute (1889-1891), wrote in his Races of Britain (1862) that all men of genius were orthognathous (less prominent jaw bones) while the Irish and the Welsh were prognathous and that the Celt was closely related to Cromagnon man, who, in turn, was linked, according to Beddoe, to the "Africanoid". The position of the Celt in Beddoe's "Index of Nigrescence" was very different from that of the Anglo-Saxon. These ideas were not confined to a lunatic fringe of the scientific community, for although they never won over the mainstream of British scientists they were disseminated broadly and it was even hinted that the Irish might be the elusive missing link!
I appreciate the time you have taken to further my education. I have always taken the side of the Irish having read the history and I'm well aware of the atrocities committed by my country in the past. I was however not aware of this particular vein of history. I concede. I was wrong about racism being used to demonize Ireland. I stand corrected.
I stand by my ascertation that imperialism was put to bed some decades ago and attempts at reconciliation have been in good faith. Dragging Cromwell and the likes into this present day debacle will not assist in anyway with the debate.0 -
Another prime example of why the UK finds itself in the trouble it does,
https://twitter.com/Telegraph/status/1170086060568846338?s=20
It takes some creative thinking to think that defying the law and ignoring a law passed by parliament as PM is not the reason for a constitutional crises, but the opposition somehow is to blame for that.
Well he did say "When we leave the EU we can make our own laws".
Reminds me of something. Just scanning in a history book.
"In the presidential election held on March 13, 1932, there were four candidates: the incumbent, Field Marshall Paul von Hindenburg, Hitler, and two minor candidates, Ernst Thaelmann and Theodore Duesterberg. The results were:
Hindenburg 49.6 percent
Hitler 30.1 percent
Thaelmann 13.2 percent
Duesterberg 6.8 percent
At the risk of belaboring the obvious, almost 70 percent of the German people voted against Hitler, causing his supporter Joseph Goebbels, who would later become Hitler’s minister of propaganda, to lament in his journal, “We’re beaten; terrible outlook. Party circles badly depressed and dejected.”
Since Hindenberg had not received a majority of the vote, however, a runoff election had to be held among the top three vote-getters. On April 19, 1932, the runoff results were:
Hindenburg 53.0 percent
Hitler 36.8 percent
Thaelmann 10.2 percent
Thus, even though Hitler’fs vote total had risen, he still had been decisively rejected by the German people.
On June 1, 1932, Hindenberg appointed Franz von Papen as chancellor of Germany, whom Shirer described as an unexpected and ludicrous figure. Papen immediately dissolved the Reichstag (the national congress) and called for new elections, the third legislative election in five months.
Hitler and his fellow members of the National Socialist (Nazi) Party, who were determined to bring down the republic and establish dictatorial rule in Germany, did everything they could to create chaos in the streets, including initiating political violence and murder. The situation got so bad that martial law was proclaimed in Berlin.
Even though Hitler had badly lost the presidential election, he was drawing ever-larger crowds during the congressional election. As Shirer points out,
In one day, July 27, he spoke to 60,000 persons in Brandenburg, to nearly as many in Potsdam, and that evening to 120,000 massed in the giant Grunewald Stadium in Berlin while outside an additional 100,000 heard his voice by loudspeaker.0 -
Our shared what? I thought you were a Scottish unionist?Forty Seven wrote: »The national nature of boards and our shared history has at times resulted in this discussion becoming a bit of an echo chamber.
Ah.A bit of devil's advocacy and alternate opinion cannot be bad for debate.0 -
prawnsambo wrote: »
There's no chance Johnson will break the law. His whole life has been about avoiding personal responsibility and lying to preserve himself. The chances he'd 'martyr' himself with the possibility of jail are ludicrously small. Ironic that they're trying to goad Corbyn with 'chicken' insults. There's a yellow streak a mile wide down Johnson's back.The only way to break the deadlock is another referendum on the deal. If Vote Leave doesn't want the deal on offer then they should put forward no-deal against remain. But they don't want to do that so either we have a PM breaking the law or riots from Brexiteers.
And one needs to question why he fought so hard against the bill, not forgetting that he prorogued parliament in order to try to limit the ability to pass such a bill, and in the process lose the majority and end up kicking out 21 MPs from the party on the basis that he wouldn't care anyway.
Just like the 3rd Runway vanishing act, Johnson will find a way to avoid personally asking for an extension. He will claim the HoC went over his head, that he didn't want it but is duty bound to carry out the orders of Her Majesty.
Johnson is many things but brave is not one of them. This is the guy who failed to contest the previous Tory leadership race, allowing the Remainer TM (tm) to seize control and try to thwart Brexit!
The man that ran away on a foreign trip rather that vote as he had promised against 3rd Runway.0 -
Forty Seven wrote: »
I stand by my ascertation that imperialism was put to bed some decades ago and attempts at reconciliation have been in good faith. Dragging Cromwell and the likes into this present day debacle will not assist in anyway with the debate.
In the current context where it is suggested that Ireland leaves the EU to facilitate Britain doing so, where the UK has attempted to enforce its trade and foreign policy on Ireland, where much of the narrative and policy around Brexit focused on Empire 2.0, you cannot consider reconciliation as being in good faith.
As for Cromwell, the issue lies in Britain's inability to address its own atrocities. This lack of self awareness is a key contributor to Brexit and the country's inability to address Brexit. Britain has been an extremely nasty colonial power but rarely if ever faces up to its atrocities.
Brexit is a pure expression of imperialism. Most of its narrative is pitched in buccaneering free trade skullduggery. But the global geopolitical context has changed from the days of the East India trading companies.
Britain's strength lay in its partnerships. The truth is India probably merits a permanent seat on the UN Security Council more than the UK does.
But more than anything, the UK population needs a new media and more language skills. We, the EN speaking nations, need to lose our insular view of the world and the Anglocentric view of the world needs challenging.0 -
Zubeneschamali wrote: »
Our shared what? I thought you were a Scottish unionist?Forty Seven wrote: »The national nature of boards and our shared history has at times resulted in this discussion becoming a bit of an echo chamber.
The bad feeling the Irish have towards my country due to the history between us. 'Shared' was the wrong choice of word it seems.0 -
John McDonnell famously got in hot water for his less than complimentary comments on Churchill. But as sacred cows go, Churchill is not far removed from Cromwell, except that his reach was far wider than Cromwell's. His involvement, either directly or indirectly in atrocities in India, Kenya and Afghanistan is well documented, but now he's invoked regularly by Johnson, Leave supporters etc. as the gold standard of leadership that they aspire to be or to have.Brexit is a pure expression of imperialism. Most of its narrative is pitched in buccaneering free trade skullduggery. But the global geopolitical context has changed from the days of the East India trading companies.
As this article in Bloomberg points out (often in his own words) there was more to Churchill than our own experience of the Black and Tans:At the start of his career, as a young cavalry officer on the northwest frontier of India, he declared the Pashtuns needed to recognize “the superiority of [the British] race” and that those who resisted would “be killed without quarter.” He wrote happily about how he and his comrades “systematically, village by village, destroyed the houses, filled up the wells, blew down the towers, cut down the great shady trees, burned the crops and broke the reservoirs in punitive devastation. Every tribesman caught was speared or cut down at once.”0 -
This whole dam situation has been ridiculous right from the start. It’s simple to clear this blockage of democracy, and it should have absolutely been done months ago now.
And if it had have done, by now we would have already left or stayed.
The public decided to leave, but now the government cannot come to any kind of decision as to how to leave.
Or if to leave at all.
Put together 4/5 simple options that the government can agree on as being credible and allow the public to vote on them.
If the government cannot come to a decision, or if they cannot get to a majority, they simply have to cast it to a wider audience. This effects everyone, and once the public has been informed and has voted the government can get on with just that one thing.0 -
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Forty Seven wrote: »
I stand by my ascertation that imperialism was put to bed some decades ago and attempts at reconciliation have been in good faith. Dragging Cromwell and the likes into this present day debacle will not assist in anyway with the debate.
In the current context where it is suggested that Ireland leaves the EU to facilitate Britain doing so, where the UK has attempted to enforce its trade and foreign policy on Ireland, where much of the narrative and policy around Brexit focused on Empire 2.0, you cannot consider reconciliation as being in good faith.
As for Cromwell, the issue lies in Britain's inability to address its own atrocities. This lack of self awareness is a key contributor to Brexit and the country's inability to address Brexit. Britain has been an extremely nasty colonial power but rarely if ever faces up to its atrocities.
Brexit is a pure expression of imperialism. Most of its narrative is pitched in buccaneering free trade skullduggery. But the global geopolitical context has changed from the days of the East India trading companies.
Britain's strength lay in its partnerships. The truth is India probably merits a permanent seat on the UN Security Council more than the UK does.
But more than anything, the UK population needs a new media and more language skills. We, the EN speaking nations, need to lose our insular view of the world and the Anglocentric view of the world needs challenging.
Wow. I don't know where that came from but brexit is not imperialism. It is inward looking nationalism.
The GFA appeared to me to be brought about in good faith. Many got away with murder not just on our side.
What do you suggest we do to muzzle the media? Sounds very dictatorial to me. There are many sources of news from both sides. The public is free to pick and choose. Print media is in its death throes anyway.
I will have to come back to this. I have things to do now its finally stopped raining. Hopefully there will not be 6 pages requiring my attention when I return. It's hard to reply to everything.0
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This discussion has been closed.
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