Brexit discussion thread X (Please read OP before posting)

BonnieSituation

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

In the context of Brexit - very little

In the context of elections in Scotland - probably a loss for the media as they were hyping her up as the next First Minister of Scotland (was never going to happen anyway)

As for the MPs, most of them know their time is up at the next election so hard to tell but their previous actions will indicate they will back Johnson

There's merit to think that while there will be no MPs for the Tories at the next GE there's going to be a few MSP seats worth fighting over. Some may consider making the move "North".

Enzokk

awec wrote: »

I don't really see the significance of Davidson quitting. A bit of a non-event, and Johnson won't care.

More interested in knowing what the Scottish tory MPs will do

It will not change much, but she was the face of the Conservatives in Scotland. She was their voice and for a long time she was trying to juggle being a Conservative member and being in Scotland, where the view seemed to split from her party.

It was of interest to see her trying to put the knife into the SNP when she shared a lot of their views on Brexit, but her party and her fellow Scottish Conservatives helped vote through the policies she knows her fellow citizens were opposed to. Call it a curious development more than earth shattering in terms of Brexit.

Mr.Nice Guy

Davidson quitting is massive in the context of the Scottish independence debate.

I see a parallel with the Home Rulers walking out of Westminster in 1918 and adopting the Sinn Fein tactic of abstention. That confirmed to many in Ireland that the Sinn Fein approach was the one to support.

Now you have a Scottish Tory leader walking away as leader in Scotland to presumably oppose Johnson's tactics. It will further confirm to many in Scotland that the SNP approach is the one to support.

Scotland is about to move further away from England and the Union is truly creaking.

Laois_Man

The court of session has set a date of September 6th to hear the case of disallowing the proroguing of parliament! An interim order has been requested in case the court cannot arrive at a decision in time, or in case Downing Street moves the date!

darem93

Yeah in terms of Scottish independence, Davidson quitting is a massive deal. Now even the biggest Unionist party in Scotland is distancing themselves from the Westminster system and seeing the problems that comes with being tied to it. It doesn't exactly look good for the anti-independence camp.

Plus Davidson basically revived (or at least semi-revived) the Tories in Scotland. With her being gone now they'll more than likely be looking at a total wipe out.

Itssoeasy

Sky news is reporting that the leader of the Scottish conservatives Ruth Davidson is standing down as leader.

woejus

LeinsterDub wrote: »

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/269157

A petition to not prorogue is gaining signatures at the rate of 1,000 per minute at the moment. I'd expect it to top several million by the end of the week

Interestingly, (or maybe not), that number isn't the real number, the site was crashing so much because people were refreshing it so many times, so it's kind of lagged.

Here's the actual number in real time

briany

woejus wrote: »

Interestingly, (or maybe not), that number isn't the real number, the site was crashing so much because people were refreshing it so many times, so it's kind of lagged.

Here's the actual number in real time

I wouldn't bother with those petitions. If the UK government doesn't heed thousands upon thousands of people descending upon Westminster, why the hell would they even give a petition more than the bare minimum of acknowledgement?

Tangatagamadda Chaddabinga Bonga Bungo

murphaph wrote: »

I really hope Johnson gets his strong majority and can dump the DUP and go for a WTO Brexit for Britain with NI getting special status. Time for the UK to get out of the EU at least for a few years. They are beyond help right now.

The UK will most likely leave the EU. Whether it be on Halloween or whatever date. I agree they will come back someday.

Northern Ireland deserves special status. They've been through the wringer for decades.

boggerman1

My god the beeb is terrible.laura whatsoever her name is spinning like mad saying that Johnson just extending the holidays for parliamentarians.

Spanish Eyes

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Sky news is reporting that the leader of the Scottish conservatives Ruth Davidson is standing down as leader.

If true, and I am not contradicting you, will there be another Tory leader elected/placed for Scotland now? I don't blame her. There is little future for the Tories in Scotland these days really AFAIS.

Limpy

If gove didn't backstab Boris Brexit would already be a done deal.

Stop moaning ffs

Farage on LBC trying to hide his glee at Davidson stepping down. Saying it’s a disaster to the Torres in Scotland.

Laois_Man

Assuming the HoC doesn't suddenly agree to the WA (which seems a fairly secure assumption) - Just browsing the UK news outlets, it doesn't seem to have occurred to a single journalist (or politician opposing Johnson's move today) that the HoC, sitting or not, doesn't have the power to prevent the no-deal Brexit if the EU doesn't agree to another extension. They just assume it would be granted - even if they could force Johnson to request one!

Stop moaning ffs

Does this mean they have to have a bye election to fill Davidson’s seat does anyone know?

interlocked

She's not a MP.

Dyr

I'm starting to wonder what the mood in the DUP camp is like, loyalism has a long history of cutting off its nose to spite its face but, given the effect a no deal brexit will have on their constituents and their votes, you wonder if Alrene et al are getting a dose of the yips now.

Shelga

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

Does this mean they have to have a bye election to fill Davidson’s seat does anyone know?

I guess so, but she’s a member of the Scottish parliament, not an MP in Westminster.

Professor Moriarty

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

Does this mean they have to have a bye election to fill Davidson’s seat does anyone know?

She's not an MP, she's a MSP.

0gac3yjefb5sv7

Is there any good summary of what's going on? Very lost in this thread between Scottish MPs resigning and haven't a clue why or what that means for Brexit.

is_that_so

Guardian have a feed with all of today's actions you could check out!

Professor Moriarty

Bambi wrote: »

I'm starting to wonder what the mood in the DUP camp is like, loyalism has a long history of cutting off its nose to spite its face but, given the effect a no deal brexit will have on their constituents and their votes, you wonder if Alrene et al are getting a dose of the yips now.

I wonder how they feel as they look at the portrait of Her Majesty over the mantlepiece. Cognitive dissonance is hard.

woejus

Pheonix10 wrote: »

Is there any good summary of what's going on? Very lost in this thread between Scottish MPs resigning and haven't a clue why or what that means for Brexit.

Steve Bannon - "flood the zone with ****"

"The Democrats don’t matter. The real opposition is the media. And the way to deal with them is to flood the zone with ****.”

That's what's going on now. Some MPs who couldn't work a shift as a roadsweeper (Marc Francois, Fabricant et al) are gleefully soaking up the limelight.

awec

Pheonix10 wrote: »

Is there any good summary of what's going on? Very lost in this thread between Scottish MPs resigning and haven't a clue why or what that means for Brexit.

Ruth Davidson is allegedly set to quit.

She is not an MP, she sits in the Scottish Parliament, but she's the leader of the Scottish tories.

It means almost nothing for brexit.

briany

Bambi wrote: »

I'm starting to wonder what the mood in the DUP camp is like, loyalism has a long history of cutting off its nose to spite its face but, given the effect a no deal brexit will have on their constituents and their votes, you wonder if Alrene et al are getting a dose of the yips now.

I suspect that the correlation between those in NI who voted for Brexit and those who vote for the DUP is quite strong. DUP always have the tribal fallback of "If you don't vote for us, then that other shower will get a majority.". This will always mitigate the electoral blowback for their horrendous mishandling of Brexit.

A Dub in Glasgo

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

Does this mean they have to have a bye election to fill Davidson’s seat does anyone know?

Davidson is an constituency MSP in the Scottish Parliament and unless she also resigns as an MSP there will be no by-election

She is not an MP so her relevance wrt to Brexit is minimal

Forty Seven

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

Does this mean they have to have a bye election to fill Davidson’s seat does anyone know?

Is she quitting as an MSP or just quitting as leader? I guess we will find out tomorrow.

MrMusician18

briany wrote: »

I suspect that the correlation between those in NI who voted for Brexit and those who vote for the DUP is quite strong. DUP always have the tribal fallback of "If you don't vote for us, then that other shower will get a majority.". This will always mitigate the electoral blowback for their horrendous mishandling of Brexit.

Is shouldn't be forgotten that 44% in NI voted for Brexit. The DUP will be fine.

GM228

woejus wrote: »

Interestingly, (or maybe not), that number isn't the real number, the site was crashing so much because people were refreshing it so many times, so it's kind of lagged.

Here's the actual number in real time

Then you have to discount those who are not British Citizens or resident in the UK which is difficult to do like in the last few Brexit related votes where 1000s of the millions of votes were from all over the world. Granted some will fit the criteria, but I doubt for example in the Article 50 petition that the 84 who signed from Nigeria, or the 78 in Pakistan or the 228 in South Korea were all eligible to do so? Even North Korea provided 34 signatories (which is a surprise considering the restricted access allowed there).

The numbers whilst high are not accurate and voted in the thousands from nearly every country in the world.

VinLieger

MrMusician18 wrote: »

Is shouldn't be forgotten that 44% in NI voted for Brexit. The DUP will be fine.

Do we really need to keep pointing out that voting leave does not mean they voted for no deal?

Also that number has massively dropped in the intervening years and by all accounts many ardent unionists are furious with how they have completely mishandled the situation thus far.