Substitute Teacher opportunities

Audioh8

Hey guys,

Looking to sub in primary or post primary with my university degree, is this possible and if so what sites can I apply to? I am based in the west of Ireland but I am more than willing to travel.

Or do I simply start going in to each individual school and personally speaking to the principal.

Dorit

Audioh8 wrote: »

Hey guys,

Looking to sub in primary or post primary with my university degree, is this possible and if so what sites can I apply to? I am based in the west of Ireland but I am more than willing to travel.

Or do I simply start going in to each individual school and personally speaking to the principal.

You must be a qualified teacher to sub in schools in Ireland. The PME takes two years to complete. You cannot work as a teacher unless you are one.

Audioh8

Dorit wrote: »

You must be a qualified teacher to sub in schools in Ireland. The PME takes two years to complete. You cannot work as a teacher unless you are one.

I have been granted a teaching number through the Route 3 option by the teaching council. So as far as I am aware I can cover for any short term supervision needed by a school.

I am wondering is there a platform to try and advertise myself from, or do principals call someone they know etc etc

spurious

https://www.teachingcouncil.ie/en/News-Events/Latest-News/Teacher-Education-Qualification-requirement-under-Route-3-%E2%80%93-Further-Education.html

From 01 January 2019, in line with the Teaching Council (Registration) Regulations 2016 and Teaching Council (Registration) (Amendment) Regulations 2016, all applicants for registration under Route 3 Further Education will be required to hold an appropriate Council accredited teacher education qualification. (From TC website).

With hundreds of fully qualified teachers out of work, the TC have surpassed themselves if they are allowing unqualified people take work that qualified people should be getting.

mtoutlemonde

Audioh8 wrote: »

I have been granted a teaching number through the Route 3 option by the teaching council. So as far as I am aware I can cover for any short term supervision needed by a school.

I am wondering is there a platform to try and advertise myself from, or do principals call someone they know etc etc

You may have a Teaching Council number but you are NOT a teacher. Why should you be taking work from people who have trained for two years at huge expense?

Teaching isn't the easy job people think it is and you probably wouldn't last too long as you wouldn't have the techniques for dealing with disruption etc. Students can smell inexperience a mile off. I don't know about primary but definitely at post primary.

spurious wrote: »

https://www.teachingcouncil.ie/en/News-Events/Latest-News/Teacher-Education-Qualification-requirement-under-Route-3-%E2%80%93-Further-Education.html

From 01 January 2019, in line with the Teaching Council (Registration) Regulations 2016 and Teaching Council (Registration) (Amendment) Regulations 2016, all applicants for registration under Route 3 Further Education will be required to hold an appropriate Council accredited teacher education qualification. (From TC website).

With hundreds of fully qualified teachers out of work, the TC have surpassed themselves if they are allowing unqualified people take work that qualified people should be getting.

I was delighted to see this - I have brought it up many times at union meetings.

r93kaey5p2izun

spurious wrote: »

https://www.teachingcouncil.ie/en/News-Events/Latest-News/Teacher-Education-Qualification-requirement-under-Route-3-%E2%80%93-Further-Education.html

From 01 January 2019, in line with the Teaching Council (Registration) Regulations 2016 and Teaching Council (Registration) (Amendment) Regulations 2016, all applicants for registration under Route 3 Further Education will be required to hold an appropriate Council accredited teacher education qualification. (From TC website).

With hundreds of fully qualified teachers out of work, the TC have surpassed themselves if they are allowing unqualified people take work that qualified people should be getting.

They will still register them without a teaching qualification, but give them 3 years to get one. We will have to wait and see whether they ever actually enforce it or whether they just keep extending the time allowed indefinitely.

OP you will definitely get subbing in Dublin if willing to move. Schools are desperate. My former school is currently ringing around all contacts looking for anyone willing to stand in a classroom.

tscul32

If there are so many qualified teachers looking for work then why are so many schools desperate for subs. I'm on the board of management at my boy's primary school and there is a big struggle to get subs. We have a couple of retirees and the odd student, one time we had a secondary teacher in and others we've just had to split classes. One of my secondary son's friends has had several different teachers for geography in one year and many cancelled classes for a lack of subs. Some schools would rather have someone unqualified than noone.

joeharte123

tscul32 wrote: »

If there are so many qualified teachers looking for work then why are so many schools desperate for subs. I'm on the board of management at my boy's primary school and there is a big struggle to get subs. We have a couple of retirees and the odd student, one time we had a secondary teacher in and others we've just had to split classes. One of my secondary son's friends has had several different teachers for geography in one year and many cancelled classes for a lack of subs. Some schools would rather have someone unqualified than noone.

Schools do struggle to get subs and of course they would turn to the unqualified to get them out of a hole and keep things moving. I have also heard the other side of the argument too where there are teachers leaving the profession as they cannot find work in their subjects.
Maybe it is down to poor management across the board? There still appears to be an inflated amount of teachers qualifying from the PME with the same 2 or 3 subjects and they’re fighting over hours in schools, which aren’t in there for them. I don’t know why these teachers don’t sub full time!

spurious

Because a sub to come to Dublin and get even basic accommodation would need to be GUARANTEED hours. The landlords don't want to know about S and S robbing the sub hours from part-time teachers.

Looking for work and looking for subbing are not at all the same thing.

Put up a proper, full hours job and people will apply. Split in into three crappy hours 'jobs' and there is a crisis.

Look at education posts (a week before school starts).
THREE permanent posts on offer.
ZERO full hour CIDs
TEN RPT contract jobs
THIRTY ONE Fixed term

Something very rotten in the whole thing.

r93kaey5p2izun

They won't apply in Dublin spurious. There are plenty of unfilled 22h vacancies in Dublin, including some permanent. My old school has dropped Spanish, Metalwork and Chemistry as impossible to recruit - all were advertised as permanent. Yes, it's due to costs in Dublin - even proper job offers won't overcome this. Meanwhile, subs of any sort are in demand.

spurious

There is also the added complication of the TC rejecting so many people with 'foreign' qualifications.

mtoutlemonde

spurious wrote: »

There is also the added complication of the TC rejecting so many people with 'foreign' qualifications.

Who are actually teachers unlike the OP who considers himself/herself qualified to sub in schools. I wonder can they do temp nursing or locum work as a GP.

tscul32

So the system is the problem, not the OP. If a school would rather have the op in than send students home then why should the op refuse the work. The op won't be taking work from anyone else as was implied in the first few replies.

mtoutlemonde

tscul32 wrote: »

So the system is the problem, not the OP. If a school would rather have the op in than send students home then why should the op refuse the work. The op won't be taking work from anyone else as was implied in the first few replies.

For me, it's the 'I have a degree ... I'll chance my arm as a teacher' that annoys me. People think that teaching is a handy number. Why does the OP want to want work as a teacher and not in the area they trained? In my previous example I said that you can't sub as a nurse or a doctor just because you have a degree but it's ok to do so as a teacher because anyone can do it.

I can't see any school really taking on unqualified people to cover classes as I said previously they are not qualified to deal with behaviour etc. and if something serious happens i.e. a student gets injured - the school would have a lot of answers to give and the publicity who are always ready to knock teachers and schools.

joeharte123

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

For me, it's the 'I have a degree ... I'll chance my arm as a teacher' that annoys me. People think that teaching is a handy number. Why does the OP want to want work as a teacher and not in the area they trained? In my previous example I said that you can't sub as a nurse or a doctor just because you have a degree but it's ok to do so as a teacher because anyone can do it.

I can't see any school really taking on unqualified people to cover classes as I said previously they are not qualified to deal with behaviour etc. and if something serious happens i.e. a student gets injured - the school would have a lot of answers to give and the publicity who are always ready to knock teachers and schools.

Anyone unqualified in a classroom will only ever be there as a last resort to bridge the gap until they find someone qualified and thus, more suited to the position. OP is chancing his/her arm getting into a school to cover the odd class here and there and not actually teach. Over the years I’ve heard it does happens but literally for the last 4 weeks of the year when schools are stuck.
I haven’t heard of this happening in a long time so maybe the TC are addressing the issue.

tscul32

There are two things needed for teaching as far as I see it - the skills to teach, and the knowledge of what you're teaching. Say the op has a degree in Spanish and a school needs a sub for a Spanish class. They're missing the teaching skills but have the knowledge. A maths teacher subbing in that class has the skills but not the knowledge. When I was in school (not an overt amount of challenging behaviour), we'd have preferred someone who might be able to help us if we'd upcoming exams or had been left worksheets, etc.. Of course this wouldn't work in all classes and neither person would be ideal, but sometimes the qualified teacher who has no Spanish wouldn't necessarily be the best choice.
Maybe the op has had no luck finding employment in their own field. If I'm correct Route 3 involves qualification in further education, so not totally ignorant of education. Maybe they're deciding whether or not to go for a PME and want to see if they'd like it. It's a two year fulltime expensive course, not to be undertaken unless you're sure about it.
The op hasn't decided they are eligible to sub.... the DOE has. And the principal who takes them on has decided it's better than having an empty classroom. I presume the op is unemployed, would rather not be, is eligible to sub and earn some wages, but you're acting like they should turn down any offers they get.
None of this should be the case, the system is massively flawed but that is not on the OP who would be stupid to turn down a day's work if they're offered it.

Blaizes

I really hope they are closing off this loop hole now. Allowing unqualified people to sub isn’t right. Earlier in the year here on boards qualified teachers were talking about waiting by the phone to get called in to school to sub. These people should get first priority for work, they have trained and qualified, they deserve it. Hopefully principals are seeing it this way as well.

joeharte123

Blaizes wrote: »

I really hope they are closing off this loop hole now. Allowing unqualified people to sub isn’t right. Earlier in the year here on boards qualified teachers were talking about waiting by the phone to get called in to school to sub. These people should get first priority for work, they have trained and qualified, they deserve it. Hopefully principals are seeing it this way as well.

I 100% agree with you. However, why are there people waiting by the phone to get called for subbing when there is any amount of subbing out there?

I can only imagine the vast majority principals only use unqualified people as a last resort.

spurious

joeharte123 wrote: »

I 100% agree with you. However, why are there people waiting by the phone to get called for subbing when there is any amount of subbing out there?

I can only imagine the vast majority principals only use unqualified people as a last resort.

In the old days, it was worth a sub's time to hang around the staff room and they could pick up classes all over the place, often getting a full day's work out of it.
With the S&S scheme, most potential subbing hours are covered in house, which might leave one or two classes uncovered in a day. It simply isn't worth a sub's time to travel for two or three classes.

howareyakid

There has been a subbing crisis going on for the last few years now which is in stark contrast with the situation about four or five years ago when qualified teachers (including myself) were scrapping around for subbing days and texasub offers would be snapped up in seconds. These things are cyclical I guess and it might not be long until it’s back to that. I agree that I unqualified teachers should be the last resort for schools but I don’t necessarily agree with posters saying that they wouldn’t have the skills. I personally think it comes down to the personality and common sense of the individual and often, candidates with skills and training in other areas have a lot to offer.

joeharte123

spurious wrote: »

In the old days, it was worth a sub's time to hang around the staff room and they could pick up classes all over the place, often getting a full day's work out of it.
With the S&S scheme, most potential subbing hours are covered in house, which might leave one or two classes uncovered in a day. It simply isn't worth a sub's time to travel for two or three classes.

Things have changed over the years, S&S is one of the major issues that is for sure. I suppose the rate of pay for teachers today is quite poor relative to most other professions in Ireland, so I understand that going to a school to sit in one 40 minute class isn't economical and really is quite impractical. Principals are better off using teachers within the respective school to cover that class, PME student teachers etc.

What I'm talking about is what I see posted up on educationposts - especially from now until Christmas. Schools have been advertising for full time substitute teachers that would cover another teacher within the school for paid sick leave, school trips etc. These advertisements have been posted throughout the summer for the coming year. ETBs have a panel of substitute teachers they select from too (although I believe it is rather difficult to get selected from this depending on your ETB). So, basically I'm wondering how there are still teachers still without work when we are led to believe there are loads of subbing hours.

rainbowtrout

joeharte123 wrote: »

Things have changed over the years, S&S is one of the major issues that is for sure. I suppose the rate of pay for teachers today is quite poor relative to most other professions in Ireland, so I understand that going to a school to sit in one 40 minute class isn't economical and really is quite impractical. Principals are better off using teachers within the respective school to cover that class, PME student teachers etc.

What I'm talking about is what I see posted up on educationposts - especially from now until Christmas. Schools have been advertising for full time substitute teachers that would cover another teacher within the school for paid sick leave, school trips etc. These advertisements have been posted throughout the summer for the coming year. ETBs have a panel of substitute teachers they select from too (although I believe it is rather difficult to get selected from this depending on your ETB). So, basically I'm wondering how there are still teachers still without work when we are led to believe there are loads of subbing hours.

Plenty of work in Dublin, but you can't live in the most expensive part of the country on unreliable subbing wages. A lot don't want to live in Dublin and pay extortionate rent even on a full contract.

Dickie10

i have a feeling that its policy now to drop teachers after one year in a job and give them to another teacher starting out not in contract. 5 others that were teaching there subjects like me in there first qualified year were given no contract this year and let go.

joeharte123

Dickie10 wrote: »

i have a feeling that its policy now to drop teachers after one year in a job and give them to another teacher starting out not in contract. 5 others that were teaching there subjects like me in there first qualified year were given no contract this year and let go.

Subjects play a huge role in chances of getting hours. There are huge amounts of qualified teachers (and qualifying 'soon-to-be teachers) with particular subjects that spend 10 years trying to nail down a job, never do so and end up leaving the profession due to lack of employment security.
On the other hand subjects like French, Irish, German, Spanish and Home Ec would walk into subbing hours anywhere in the country and would have a good shot at a contract teaching their subjects in a school anywhere in the country outside of Dublin.

Dickie10

yes very true most of the people i mentioned are geography, history, business. has anyone got any tips on what type of schools to do subbing in, if faced with plenty of choice

joeharte123

Dickie10 wrote: »

yes very true most of the people i mentioned are geography, history, business. has anyone got any tips on what type of schools to do subbing in, if faced with plenty of choice

Geography is the most common followed by History I believe. So many Geog & History teachers qualify and leave the profession after not even being able to get subbing hours. Waste of money training up.

Regarding Business, I'm not too sure as I haven't heard of teachers qualified in this having the same degree of trouble finding hours as the latter two subjects.

Schools in Dublin are the most in demand. Anywhere outside of Dublin is significantly more difficult.

spurious

Outside the Dublin accommodation issue, it really is not that difficult to use timetable info/teacher retirement requests/ages of existing staff/information from teaching colleges etc. to maintain and plan for a supply of teachers in the necessary subject areas.

A small little section of the Department used to manage it, before we got inundated with quangos.

joeharte123

spurious wrote: »

Outside the Dublin accommodation issue, it really is not that difficult to use timetable info/teacher retirement requests/ages of existing staff/information from teaching colleges etc. to maintain and plan for a supply of teachers in the necessary subject areas.

A small little section of the Department used to manage it, before we got inundated with quangos.

Agree. Would save many wasting money training up with subjects they'll never get a job in. Other professions do it.

emilymemily

Where are all these subbing jobs? I had a meltdown today stressing about being unemployed for the coming year, ive reached the stage were im refusing to fill out anymore ridiculous applications, one wants me to list all of my grades from each subject from each of the 4 years of my undergrad, I had to go route out 6 year old transcripts, and for what? Theyre never going to contact me anyway.
I had one interview this Summer for a tutor panel, the requirements were a train the trainer level 6, im a qualified teacher, I never heard back from the interview, assuming now I didnt get placed on the panel, interview wasnt bad, not great there was room for improvement but ive had worse, im very knowledgeable in my subject, im qualified with experience but it still wasnt good enough for them.
I have teacher friends living in Dublin who couldnt get work in Dublin, one got a handful of hours a week in Atlone, another got a few hours in Arklow.
A Youthreach where I did placement had a teacher out on Maternity, the job was advertised, I didnt apply as I was working at the time but I know for a fact the job was applied to as I know two girls who were interviewed, excellent teachers with a great way with the kids, they didnt get the job, soon discovered that instead of just hiring a teacher they decided to stop running the class for the year.

I cant understand it, are schools and ETB's excessively picky? What are they looking for?

As for the FE regulations, having fully qualified in this area it sickens me that theyre still allowing people without qualifications to register under route 3, theyve been saying we had 3 years to get a qualification for years now and it still hasnt been implemented, after these tutors 3 years is up, they can apply for extensions.

Ive seen it time and time again, unqualified people getting teaching jobs in ETB's and schools over qualified teachers because they know someone in the ETB or on the panel.

Excuse the rant but im so incredibly frustrated with this shambles of a system, no wonder so many teachers are leaving the profession.

Snapgal

In the last few years I have not been able to go out doing orals as was told I had to find a TC registered teacher to sub who is impossible to find especially only for two weeks. Even for subbing like maternity have noticed all advertised on education.ie Saw an ad yesterday for German in school in Dublin for job for two weeks for 2.4 hrs!! Thought what a joke. Why can’t there be a sub panel in each county/area and principals can check there first.

Snapgal

joeharte123 wrote: »

Subjects play a huge role in chances of getting hours. There are huge amounts of qualified teachers (and qualifying 'soon-to-be teachers) with particular subjects that spend 10 years trying to nail down a job, never do so and end up leaving the profession due to lack of employment security.
On the other hand subjects like French, Irish, German, Spanish and Home Ec would walk into subbing hours anywhere in the country and would have a good shot at a contract teaching their subjects in a school anywhere in the country outside of Dublin.

This is not true I have Gaeilge plus MFL subjects,16 years experience - 5 years in different schools since relocating closer to home and nowhere near CID. Have been applying for very few jobs in 3 different counties - an hr commute from me and other teachers I know with those subjects have no proper RPT jobs for next year. It’s not your subject it’s who you know especially. A very low hour Irish RPT contract I went for recently principal was not there. Not one word of Irish spoken to me. Knew deep down I didn’t have job but emailed the school later to see if was successful- no manners to even reply to my email. This thing that you will walk into a job with Irish and other so called in demand subjects really annoys me - people nearly look at me now as if something wrong with me that must be a very bad teacher when I can’t get work. I’’m so close to leaving teaching now after all my years.