New Bus

1984baby

citykat wrote: »

Ir wasn't the motorists, it was the business owners in the city. One high profile publican on John Street was particularly vociferous. Once he objected, it got knocked on the head.

They need to complete the full ring road first (probably will never happen) before they even think of bringing back in the one way or any pedestrian only streets.
None of it will work before there’s a proper road network in place.

1984baby

BlackandGreen wrote: »

The amount of traffic and fumes around kilkenny city centre is a health hazard and just an utter nuisance.

😂😂 you’d swear we were a city in China/India!!

Geog1234

road_high wrote: »

My first time using it today so a few observations- overall happy with it but room for improvements but that's ok give it's infancy;

- first off the Info at the stops is poor and not stop specific- telling me the bus leaves every thirty mins from St Lukes or Purcellsinch means very little as I don't know necessarily know how long it takes to get to my stop

- the TFI real time app times appeared to be way off and not accurate

- The Leap card system on-board is stupid- defeats the purpose of one- I assumed it would be the same as Dublin Bus but on this you have to hand it to the driver and he taps it into his machine. Unnecessarily wasting time when it should be set up to tap on/off by the passenger/s

-No info on the front of the buses telling you where it's going (just reads blank or Coming into Service)- again unnecessarily confusing for people especially where routes intersect. Why would the management not have that set up (whole thing still has a slightly amateur feel)??

- No route info on-board anywhere in the bus

- A passenger asked the driver today where they could buy a Leap Card - he hadn't a clue and just said "You can get them online"- not very informative as I even know you can buy them now in shops around town. Basic info and briefing that they should know

- Traffic in Kilkenny was very busy and you can see the difficulty with junctions and also parked cars


If they can sort these issues though I think it has the makings of a great service once it gets bedded in properly. It does feel like they weren't fully prepared and had done very little set up and organisational work. I never saw trial buses on the routes

Interesting feedback - thanks for posting. Could I respectfully suggest you e-mail this to info@nationaltransport.ie for the attention of the NTA team who designed the service.

BlackandGreen

1984baby wrote: »

���� you’d swear we were a city in China/India!!

No but I'm still allowed to point out how much of a nuisance traffic is in small towns/cities in this country.
Believe it or not, all the dirty diesel and petrol fumes from cars, vans and trucks clogging the town are a health hazard. Even if it's not india level smog.


It's stupid to dismiss it because we're not at crisis level pollution.

Dymo

road_high wrote: »

My first time using it today so a few observations- overall happy with it but room for improvements but that's ok give it's infancy;

- first off the Info at the stops is poor and not stop specific- telling me the bus leaves every thirty mins from St Lukes or Purcellsinch means very little as I don't know necessarily know how long it takes to get to my stop

On the Bus Stops my understanding is it tells you the time to expect the Bus.

i.e.
Loughboy says it will arrive at 10 past the hour and 40 past the hour.

so 8:10 and 8:40
9:10 and 9:40
10:10 and 10:40
11:10 and 11:40
12:10 and 12:40 etc...

The next stop will then say
8:15 and 8:45
9:15 and 9:45
10:15 and 10:45 etc...

road_high

BlackandGreen wrote: »

Sickens me when you visit any other country/city in europe and the world and you see how miles ahead they are with small town public transport and cycling infrastructure.


I'm of the opinion the entirety of High street should be pedestrianised only.
Hell even Waterford could do it for John Roberts square and surrounding streets.

The amount of traffic and fumes around kilkenny city centre is a health hazard and just an utter nuisance.

We need a massive mindset change in Kilkenny- Kilkenny used to be fairly small and easy get around with the luxury of just jumping into the car but that’s not the case anymore.

road_high

BlackandGreen wrote: »

Sickens me when you visit any other country/city in europe and the world and you see how miles ahead they are with small town public transport and cycling infrastructure.


I'm of the opinion the entirety of High street should be pedestrianised only.
Hell even Waterford could do it for John Roberts square and surrounding streets.

The amount of traffic and fumes around kilkenny city centre is a health hazard and just an utter nuisance.

I absolutely think high st should be pedestrianised from James st to William st at least- outside of daytime hours then arrangements can be made for deliveries etc. Kilkenny and business are absolutely wedded to cars and the notion you can drive anywhere you want rather than the bigger picture which would be so much better overall for town. They did do it in Waterford and I think it’s great the way they did it - really pleasant to walk around the city centre

FanLarkin12

Its a great service to have hopefully it will be used.

Nokia6230i

Does the KK 1 or 2 Bus go from Train Stn. to Leggetsrath Bus. Pk.? Have to go to KCLR in near future; I presume it has a terminus theree to drop off/collect?

greenspurs

BlackandGreen wrote: »

Sickens me when you visit any other country/city in europe and the world and you see how miles ahead they are with small town public transport and cycling infrastructure.


I'm of the opinion the entirety of High street should be pedestrianised only.
Hell even Waterford could do it for John Roberts square and surrounding streets.

The amount of traffic and fumes around kilkenny city centre is a health hazard and just an utter nuisance.

And killed off the city centre.

Its the one of the main things that keeps a city centre look/seem alive is traffic going through it.
Waterford is missing that , big time. And the fact that they destroyed their own magnificent Quay !!!

BlackandGreen

greenspurs wrote: »

And killed off the city centre.

Its the one of the main things that keeps a city centre look/seem alive is traffic going through it.
Waterford is missing that , big time. And the fact that they destroyed their own magnificent Quay !!!

The traffic on the quay is an absolute scourge. And not to mention how anybody EVER allowed the entire quay to be destroyed by putting car parks along the entire thing.
Removing the absolute eye sore that was the two lanes has improved the city.

Unfortunately, the stubbornness and obsession with cars in the country means people continue to clog the quay and sit in their cars at peak hours rather than using the outer ring road for a measly €1.90

Most Irish people are too stuck in their own ways and dog ignorant of what constitutes good infrastructure, so we will never catch up with modern european towns and cities regarding public transport, infrastructure and reduction of traffic.

Also, the reduction of traffic is not the reason why the city centre in Waterford struggled at all.

Every morning the dual carriage way is backed up to the top of Ferrybank.
On the other side around 8:30am it backs up to the Newrath roundabout.
It takes nearly 40 minutes to drive from WIT to Rice bridge at peak hours.
The fact that Lombard street is a major road for all traffic heading out to the hospital is madness. That junction is gridlock and people regularly can't even make it through the red lights without blocking the entire junction.
Heading out to the hospital and the Dunmore road in both directions is the same story every day.

The lack of pedestrian walkways from across the river is crazy. And walking along the foothpath from ferrybank into town is deadly dangerous.
Cycling in Waterford is lethal. Painted lines on the quays don't count.
The excuses of bus lanes generally serve as "stick on the hazards and abandon the car" parking spots. Not that they're even any use to the busses and people who are trying to go about their business.
The only saving grace of waterford is the pedestrianized city centre.

Also, with the new north quay developments and all the other building going on in Waterford at the moment, and with the ever increasing amount of cars on the road we've already gone beyond capacity for what the city was designed to facilitate.
It's going to only get worse. Have fun sitting on the quay for an hour polluting the place.


If I had my way I'd remove the toll from the bypass bridge in Waterford, and in place I'd put a surcharge for traffic going over Rice bridge instead. You'd see the change in people's behaviour overnight.

anyway, what I'm saying is Kilkenny is turning into a similar mess regarding over saturation of traffic. It's been researched and reported time and time again that traffic is detrimental to quality of life and the key to a good city like you'd find in germany, netherlands, denmark etc is good cycle infrastructure, pedestrian routes, restriction of traffic, lots of bus and train services.

road_high

greenspurs wrote: »

And killed off the city centre.

Its the one of the main things that keeps a city centre look/seem alive is traffic going through it.
Waterford is missing that , big time. And the fact that they destroyed their own magnificent Quay !!!

No it’s the incessant traffic that kills city and town centres stone dead.

finlma

greenspurs wrote: »

And killed off the city centre.

Its the one of the main things that keeps a city centre look/seem alive is traffic going through it.
Waterford is missing that , big time. And the fact that they destroyed their own magnificent Quay !!!

That's nonsense. Look at Shop Street in Galway to see just what pedestrianisation can do for a city.

Sirsok

Nokia6230i wrote: »

Does the KK 1 or 2 Bus go from Train Stn. to Leggetsrath Bus. Pk.? Have to go to KCLR in near future; I presume it has a terminus theree to drop off/collect?

Drops right across the street from entrance to kclr

greenspurs

finlma wrote: »

That's nonsense. Look at Shop Street in Galway to see just what pedestrianisation can do for a city.

Hasn't work for Waterford...…

FanLarkin12

greenspurs wrote: »

Hasn't work for Waterford...…

Will the new development on the quay in Waterford work if it goes ahead .

greenspurs

FanLarkin12 wrote: »

Will the new development on the quay in Waterford work if it goes ahead .

Its hard to say.

KK co council and Waterford corporation , abandoned the white elephant of a Shopping centre in Ferrybank.
MAssive building meant for chain stores to move into (dunnes stores was one I think?) but no one went in there due to rates and over costing.

I think there is only a library in there ?

https://fora.ie/dunnes-stores-disputes-with-landlords-3392623-May2017/

So, hopefully the North Quay development will work, but going on their past record, and how the town is looking , it will be tough.

azimuth17

I don't normally comment in anything except the Waterford city thread. The Ferrybank Shopping Centre has nothing to do with Waterford city council. It is built in Co Kilkenny on the boundary with Waterford city. It has not opened in my understanding from reading much comment in Waterford newspapers, because it breached Regional Planning Guidelines. Following a similar breach with a development of the Butlerstown Retail Park on Cork Road in Waterford, which was granted permission by the then Waterford County Council and referred to Bord Pleanala (by a local developer) for opening comparison retail space and refused Ferrybank could not open. Kilkenny Co Co in my understanding anyway, knew that a district level shopping centre was required (and agreed by Waterford city council) in Ferrybank. KCC went ahead and gave permission for a town centre development although over several planning applications they had been told by ABP that Ferrybank, despite being intersected by county/city boundary, was a de facto suburb of Waterford city. A distrct centre would be something like Supervalu on the Tramore Road in Waterford for those who know the area. Ferrybank was a Dundrum style "town centre" development. It is worth saying that retail space in Waterford city is probably at an all time high and is over twice or more the level of retail floor space of any other urban centre in south east. That is of course across the whole city.

holyhead

azimuth17 wrote: »

I don't normally comment in anything except the Waterford city thread. The Ferrybank Shopping Centre has nothing to do with Waterford city council. It is built in Co Kilkenny on the boundary with Waterford city. It has not opened in my understanding from reading much comment in Waterford newspapers, because it breached Regional Planning Guidelines. Following a similar breach with a development of the Butlerstown Retail Park on Cork Road in Waterford, which was granted permission by the then Waterford County Council and referred to Bord Pleanala (by a local developer) for opening comparison retail space and refused Ferrybank could not open. Kilkenny Co Co in my understanding anyway, knew that a district level shopping centre was required (and agreed by Waterford city council) in Ferrybank. KCC went ahead and gave permission for a town centre development although over several planning applications they had been told by ABP that Ferrybank, despite being intersected by county/city boundary, was a de facto suburb of Waterford city. A distrct centre would be something like Supervalu on the Tramore Road in Waterford for those who know the area. Ferrybank was a Dundrum style "town centre" development. It is worth saying that retail space in Waterford city is probably at an all time high and is over twice or more the level of retail floor space of any other urban centre in south east. That is of course across the whole city.

Is that currently or if/when the north quay gets built? My other observation is I think retail in the physical sense of stores will decline with the continual switch to online shopping.

azimuth17

Current retail floor space. Retail is obviously under threat from internet etc, but places like Kildare Village are thriving. Some form of local retailing will obviously survive even if only as leisure spaces to physically see goods before ordering
on line. Rationale for Waterford North Quays is verified huge leakage from local economy to places like Dundrum, Mahon Point and Kildare. Convenience retailing in Waterford City is very large, but comparison retailing is relatively weak. Planning for the development has been submitted. Link attached:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QGbqb16YjqI

Dymo

Any chance this can go back on topic, there's more talk about Waterford than the Kilkenny bus service.

finlma

I got stuck behind the bus on John St for 5-10 minutes the other evening. It must have been ahead of schedule and had stopped at the "bus stop". There was a line of cars behind the bus and with oncoming traffic it was not possible to overtake.

Surely there is a need for dedicated stops where the bus can pull in from the road?

blackcard

finlma wrote: »

I got stuck behind the bus on John St for 5-10 minutes the other evening. It must have been ahead of schedule and had stopped at the "bus stop". There was a line of cars behind the bus and with oncoming traffic it was not possible to overtake.

Surely there is a need for dedicated stops where the bus can pull in from the road?

There are dedicated stops in the Market Yard where buses could pull in and not interfere with traffic

finlma

blackcard wrote: »

There are dedicated stops in the Market Yard where buses could pull in and not interfere with traffic

That may be the case but it doesn't stop people getting stuck at the other "stops"

blackcard

finlma wrote: »

That may be the case but it doesn't stop people getting stuck at the other "stops"

Fair enough but I don't see why there should be a 5 to 10 minute delay in John Street, not that many getting on the bus there. You would think that the driver could park up in the Market Yard if he/she is ahead of schedule

finlma

blackcard wrote: »

Fair enough but I don't see why there should be a 5 to 10 minute delay in John Street, not that many getting on the bus there. You would think that the driver could park up in the Market Yard if he/she is ahead of schedule

Agreed. Maybe they were just keen to impress in the new job. Hopefully problems like this will be ironed out.

Snorlaxx

blackcard wrote: »

Fair enough but I don't see why there should be a 5 to 10 minute delay in John Street, not that many getting on the bus there.

If its anything like Waterford its because the drivers have a strict Depart timetable to adhere to i.e they have to leave johns street at x:00, patrick st at x:10, lochboy at x:50 etc etc etc, so could just be the case that their killing time to meet the timetable requirement

PaulKK

In fairness, since the buses only run every 30/60 minutes depending on the day, the drivers should wait until the scheduled time to depart each stop.

If the timetable says the bus stops at Langtons at 3, and you turn up at 2:58 and it's gone, you'd be pretty annoyed.

If they are regularly waiting for 5+ minutes at a stop to match the schedule though, maybe the timetable needs some fine tuning.


I have to say, I got the bus in to town Saturday night and it was very handy. Bus arrived bang on schedule too. I can imagine the taxi drivers won't be impressed if people start using it to its full capacity.

Snorlaxx

PaulKK wrote: »

I have to say, I got the bus in to town Saturday night and it was very handy. Bus arrived bang on schedule too. I can imagine the taxi drivers won't be impressed if people start using it to its full capacity.

Beats payin stupid taxi prices anyway

Deathwish4

Every timetable for this service - online and at the stops themselves - states it stops at Loughboy Retail park (Woodies etc.). This is incorrect; it stops at Loughboy Business park (Banking 365 etc). Very misleading.

It's a shame; but every single map box at the stops needs replacing. :pac::pac: