Fire in Douglas - See Mod note in post #506

Gru

The damage to some of the cross beams seems pretty severe, could shut the car park down for quite some time.

Cork Trucker

Gru wrote: »

The damage to some of the cross beams seems pretty severe, could shut the car park down for quite some time.

As i've mentioned over on Twitter, i'm at a loss as to how planning permission was granted to this development considering it is little more than 10 years old and as has now been proven could not accommodate access to emergency vehicles, if such access was possible the damage would have been far less in all likelihood.

I'm no expert regarding the cross beams but what type of work is needed to sort it? a simple case of unbolt and replace of will it involve some demolition and reconstruction?

namloc1980

Cork Trucker wrote: »

As i've mentioned over on Twitter, i'm at a loss as to how planning permission was granted to this development considering it is little more than 10 years old and as has now been proven could not accommodate access to emergency vehicles, if such access was possible the damage would have been far less in all likelihood.

I'm no expert regarding the cross beams but what type of work is needed to sort it? a simple case of unbolt and replace of will it involve some demolition and reconstruction?

Multistorey car parks don't have access for fire vehicles. They aren't designed for truck access.

The bigger question is about sprinkler system (or lack of) and dry risers.

Gru

I'm no expert either, it looks to be in a bad way and it may be necessary to remove adjacent beams/columns as well to ensure structural stability. I wasnt expecting to see that kind of damage, always assumed steel would hold up better given the fire only lasted about 2-3 hours.

Hopefully the cost/time for repair doesn't impact the future of the center too badly.

Parking will be significantly worse around douglas area until it's back in business.

TheChizler

Most Irish fire brigade's policies is to not send their own people into an uncontained fire with no people in danger, I'd be surprised if even with full access they would ever chose to send one of their own appliances and personnel in there. They had decent access from either side.

There are rising mains and hoses in the car park for when they send people in to finish it off, what advantage would sending a massive truck in bring?

There are pictures of hoses unfurled this morning so they either managed to bring their own from the truck or get something inside working.

FishOnABike

I could see it taking days just to remove the damaged cars from there. They'll have to be trailered out one by one and the roof would be too low for a tow truck. Even on a trailer behind a towing vehicle would be difficult due to height and width restrictions and maneuverability getting around exit ramps. Burnt out cars can also contain some very toxic byproducts so would need to be handled as hazardous waste.

TheDriver

I wonder will they drive out people's cars for them?

Darc19

Cork Trucker wrote: »

As i've mentioned over on Twitter, i'm at a loss as to how planning permission was granted to this development considering it is little more than 10 years old and as has now been proven could not accommodate access to emergency vehicles,?

Can you give an example of a multistory carpark that does have the room and turning circle for emergency vehicles such as a fire engine.

Just one would suffice and it can be anywhere in the world.

I'd delete the tweet before you get too much ridicule.

flazio

lisasimpson wrote: »

Was thinking the same if your car was caught up in it your better off it was fully burnt out. I wouldn't like to be someone with a practically damaged car that has damage car on a PCPplan.. Who's insurance would cover the cars impacted tonight

Car park probably has a disclaimer that the car is parked at the owner's own risk. It'll be down to each vehicles individual insurance policies.

cantalach

Assuming there's an extended closure of the centre, this will be very tough for some of the smaller independent retailers and their employees. I'm thinking the likes of the indy record shop, the various butchers, fruit shop, etc. And I guess depending on the type of employment contract, employees of the big chain retailers could be affected too. To my mind, that's a much bigger issue than how many days Mary from the Well Road will have to wait to get her C-class back...

FrancieBrady

flazio wrote: »

Car park probably has a disclaimer that the car is parked at the owner's own risk. It'll be down to each vehicles individual insurance policies.

Disclaimer isn't worth diddly if somebody messed up.

Gru

Cork city fire brigade have shared a video on Facebook. Structural damage on both levels significant and far worse than can be seen from the photos. Massive repairs required.

https://www.facebook.com/corkcityfire/videos/374818513189286/

Twitter version for anyone who doesn't do facebook:

https://twitter.com/CorkCityFire/status/1168091850676297728?s=19

flazio

Would explain why they couldn't get close to the fire. Level 2 looks as if it could collapse at any moment.

namloc1980

Wow. That's unreal. Serious damage to the car park.

_Kaiser_

Gru wrote: »

Cork city fire brigade have shared a video on Facebook. Structural damage on both levels significant and far worse than can be seen from the photos. Massive repairs required.

https://www.facebook.com/corkcityfire/videos/374818513189286/

I was down that way yesterday with the little fella and we were thinking about heading over to the shops for a wander... Glad we didn't!

That won't be opening up again anytime soon The cost to business will be huge. Parking around there is hard enough as it is (and I hate using that multistory myself as I find the entrance ramp a bit tight and the spots a bit small) so it'll affect the other end (Douglas Court) as well.

TheDriver

cantalach wrote: »

Assuming there's an extended closure of the centre, this will be very tough for some of the smaller independent retailers and their employees. I'm thinking the likes of the indy record shop, the various butchers, fruit shop, etc. And I guess depending on the type of employment contract, employees of the big chain retailers could be affected too. To my mind, that's a much bigger issue than how many days Mary from the Well Road will have to wait to get her C-class back...

Mary might need her c class for work or has a boot full of stuff for work. Theres a trades van burnt so that's another person.

namloc1980

Been a good few issues in that shopping centre between the flooding a few years, the fire in the hairdresser unit a while back and now this. Very tough time for the retailers.

cantalach

TheDriver wrote: »

Mary might need her c class for work or has a boot full of stuff for work. Theres a trades van burnt so that's another person.

Obviously. I was picking up on the fact that half the commentary on this thread related to how and when people might get their cars back. Some even talking about resale values of cars!? Nobody seems to give a monkeys about those whose livelihoods are destroyed.

gifted

That development is only there around 11 years....there was a sprinkler system installed....a lot of questions need to be asked why this fire escalated so much ....

TheChizler

cantalach wrote: »

Obviously. I was picking up on the fact that half the commentary on this thread related to how and when people might get their cars back. Some even talking about resale values of cars!? Nobody seems to give a monkeys about those whose livelihoods are destroyed.

You're assuming the entire centre will be closed for an extended period, but I haven't seen any reports of anything beyond the car park being affected. They'll have to do safety checks sure but they might not take that long.

Mushy

TheChizler wrote: »

You're assuming the entire centre will be closed for an extended period, but I haven't seen any reports of anything beyond the car park being affected. They'll have to do safety checks sure but they might not take that long.

Not many will go there with little to no parking. With the damage as seen in the last video, I'd be surprised if it opens too soon (although I'm no expert).

airy fairy

Would it be right for a 12 year old building to warp with steel structures that quickly?
It looks like a demolition project more than a fixer upper?

beer enigma

TheChizler wrote: »

You're assuming the entire centre will be closed for an extended period, but I haven't seen any reports of anything beyond the car park being affected. They'll have to do safety checks sure but they might not take that long.

Local Councillor told me this morning that there is significant water damage to quite a few units but the bigger worry is structural damage to the roof of the centre especially with the fire being on level one

ScrubsfanChris

Looks like the carpark will be closed for months.






Amazing how there were no cars parked overhead on level 2
Might be good thing all this happen after 7pm and not earlier in the day.
.

_Kaiser_

ScrubsfanChris wrote: »

Looks like the carpark will be closed for months.






Amazing how there were no cars parked overhead on level 2
Might be good thing all this happen after 7pm and not earlier in the day.
.

Maybe the L2 car owners got out as soon as it started?

ScrubsfanChris

airy fairy wrote: »

Would it be right for a 12 year old building to warp with steel structures that quickly?
It looks like a demolition project more than a fixer upper?

Quick search shows average temp of a gasoline fire is 950 degrees C and upwards with steel starting the fail around 1100 degrees C, that steel is also holding up quite a mass of concrete which could add to it failing quicker.

drunkmonkey

ScrubsfanChris wrote: »

Quick search shows average temp of a gasoline fire is 950 degrees C and upwards with steel starting the fail around 1100 degrees C, that steel is also holding up quite a mass of concrete.

Any lithium powered cars in there (Tesla, leaf etc) would explain the higher tempatures.
Why the new children's hospital is being built with an underground car park I'll never understand.

namloc1980

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

Maybe the L2 car owners got out as soon as it started?

7pm in the evening L2 would be very quiet especially down that end.

Topgear on Dave

airy fairy wrote: »

Would it be right for a 12 year old building to warp with steel structures that quickly?
It looks like a demolition project more than a fixer upper?

Yup, if you heat a piece of steel it will get pretty soft pretty quickly before it melts.

FrancieBrady

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Yup, if you heat a piece of steel it will get pretty soft pretty quickly before it melts.

That's the problem...it is the temp that it begins to soften is the critical one, not the melt temp. The weight on top of it then comes into play as it softens.