Israel PM Netanyahu vows to annex occupied Jordan Valley

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https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-49655226

A desperate attempt at winning votes or will he see this through, if re-elected.

Image of proposed annex attached, with Israeli annex in blue and the Palestinian region in orange.

This will surely result in massive instability in a region that's fit to blow at any minute.

barrier86

An absolute tyrant. Utter scum!

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barrier86 wrote: »

An absolute tyrant. Utter scum!

It's crazy.

I wonder what the history books will read in 100 years.

With almost every influential person in the world having their hands tied due to the Israeli influence, nothing will be done.

Nika Bolokov

You can't squeeze an enormous population into an ever shrinking territory and expect anything but trouble.

Odhinn

GooglePlus wrote: »

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-49655226

A desperate attempt at winning votes or will he see this through, if re-elected.

Image of proposed annex attached, with Israeli annex in blue and the Palestinian region in orange.

This will surely result in massive instability in a region that's fit to blow at any minute.

It's - unless the US suddenly gains sense - inevitable, either in one blow or a number of occasions in the future. The surrounded patches of Palestinian land will be labelled as "self governing" while being essentially self governing bantustans, providing cheap labour to the Israeli zones.

TommyKnocker

What is that saying again? "All it takes for evil to prosper...."

TheValeyard

He truly is the definition of a cnut

randd1

A bit of a mad bastard, so he is. A total warmonger.

James Brown

It's the disregard for human life and complete lack of morals.

begsbyOnaTrain

Yeah it's sad and all but nothing new, and I fail to get as wound up about this particular conflict as many Irish seem to do.

I've thought about what I would do if I were a young Palestinian. Tbh I don't see this turning out well for them in the long term, better off to move elsewhere and have a decent stab at life.

James Brown

begsbyOnaTrain wrote: »

Yeah it's sad and all but nothing new, and I fail to get as wound up about this particular conflict as many Irish seem to do.

I've thought about what I would do if I were a young Palestinian. Tbh I don't see this turning out well for them in the long term, better off to move elsewhere and have a decent stab at life.

It's about empathy and decency. If we all only cared about what effected us directly we'd be in a very sorry state.

And what if you move elsewhere and you're not wanted or you get treated like dirt?
I wonder when people started saying that about the Jews in Germany eighty odd years ago?

begsbyOnaTrain

Matt Barrett wrote: »

It's about empathy and decency. If we all only cared about what effected us directly we'd be in a very sorry state.

Sure, but that's not it is it? There's plenty of wars and injustice in the world. Yet every Irish third level institute will have a dedicated soc to this particular injustice.

Nothing on the rest of them. I was in college during the last days of the Tamil tigers. A war just as long as the one in the middle east, with mass injustice and terrible crimes and a then defeated people. I must have missed all the freshers signing up to socs supporting the Tamils, or I guess they all just lack empathy and deceny...

James Brown

begsbyOnaTrain wrote: »

Sure, but that's not it is it? There's plenty of wars and injustice in the world. Yet every Irish third level institute will have a dedicated soc to this particular injustice.

Nothing on the rest of them. I was in college during the last days of the Tamil tigers. A war just as long as the one in the middle east, with mass injustice and terrible crimes and a then defeated people. I must have missed all the freshers signing up to socs supporting the Tamils, or I guess they all just lack empathy and deceny...

So do you suggest we all ignore this and stick a pin in a map? Which issues do you think are worthy? Or if we set one up on the plight of Tibet, would you chime in all "There's plenty of wars and injustice in the world. Yet every Irish third level institute will have a dedicated soc to this particular injustice."? Or is it just people pointing out Israeli criminality you've issue with?

Israel is allegedly a first world westerised nation with representation at the highest levels in numerous countries. Maybe that's part of it?
Why do you think it gets attention?

begsbyOnaTrain

Matt Barrett wrote: »

So do you suggest we all ignore this and stick a pin in a map? Which issues do you think are worthy? Or if we set one up on the plight of Tibet, would you chime in all "There's plenty of wars and injustice in the world. Yet every Irish third level institute will have a dedicated soc to this particular injustice."? Or is it just people pointing out Israeli criminality you've issue with?

You seem to have a problem with me pointing out the obvious case of this getting disproportionate attention in Ireland.

You can imagine my reactions to fictional scenarios all you want, it's your brain.

Israel is allegedly a first world westerised nation with representation at the highest levels in numerous countries. Maybe that's part of it?
Why do you think it gets attention?

No idea. I could put forth a whole list of items I may think mix it up but I really have no idea.

James Brown

begsbyOnaTrain wrote: »

You seem to have a problem with me pointing out the obvious case of this getting disproportionate attention in Ireland.

You can imagine my reactions to fictional scenarios all you want, it's your brain.



No idea. I could put forth a whole list of items I may think mix it up but I really have no idea.

So you basically want this to get less attention? I'm not sure what your point is. Likely those interested in this, like myself, are, well interested in this. That doesn't mean other issues are less important. It should be noted Netenyahu came out with this bold statement last week, I reckon that's why this particular thread is running.

begsbyOnaTrain

Matt Barrett wrote: »

So you basically want this to get less attention?

I don't believe I said that.

I'm not sure what your point is. Likely those interested in this, like myself, are, well interested in this. That doesn't mean other issues are less important. It should be noted Netenyahu came out with this bold statement last week, I reckon that's why this particular thread is running.

My point? Well that this is nothing new, pretty much what I said in my opening post in this thread. Even this exact plan has been spouted by Bibi before. This kinda crap will continue on and on. He's appealing to the far right base for the next election. Saw that with the racist FB campaign.

For some reason this issue gets a massive interest in Ireland, above other conflicts both comparable and worse-than. I think it's interesting to note that and ponder on it. Why do you think that is? You seem to imply that it was because of empathy and decency, but somehow that doesn't apply to other conflicts/injustices. And the "representation at highest levels of government" is well yeah, but you have a big Red Chinese panda bear sitting beside that which makes your argument... well yeah.

James Brown

begsbyOnaTrain wrote: »

I don't believe I said that.

No you didn't I asked it. You didn't answer.

begsbyOnaTrain wrote: »

My point? Well that this is nothing new, pretty much what I said in my opening post in this thread. Even this exact plan has been spouted by Bibi before. This kinda crap will continue on and on. He's appealing to the far right base for the next election. Saw that with the racist FB campaign.

For some reason this issue gets a massive interest in Ireland, above other conflicts both comparable and worse-than. I think it's interesting to note that and ponder on it. Why do you think that is? You seem to imply that it was because of empathy and decency, but somehow that doesn't apply to other conflicts/injustices. And the "representation at highest levels of government" is well yeah, but you have a big Red Chinese panda bear sitting beside that which makes your argument... well yeah.

I can only speak for myself. I've big problems with the way Israel conducts itself and as I said, his statement started this particular thread.
Like all news items new developments bring it to the fore. The Chinese are constantly treating their people like work horses with anyone pipping up getting disappeared. They came to prominence when they locked up a couple of Canadians a few months back.
I think it's only right what Israel does gets noted. They try pass themselves off as a westernised democracy but have more in common with apartheid era South Africa. Using whataboutery is grand and all but does not take away from Israeli criminality and murder. Nobody but China defends China's abuses, Israel however is defended by the White House.
Best you just ignore it if you're not interested?

antix80

The land is part of Area C which is under Israeli control. A main highway runs through it. It's not smart having Palestine border with Jordan, or giving the Palestinian's control of a water supply relied on by Israel. Israel also won a bunch of wars so, there's that.

Not saying any of this is "fair" - just giving it some context.

I don't think it will bring any instability in the region. Israel showed a lot of restraint and patience getting to where they are today and it seems to have paid off for them.

James Brown

antix80 wrote: »

The land is part of Area C which is under Israeli control. A main highway runs through it. It's not smart having Palestine border with Jordan, or giving the Palestinian's control of a water supply relied on by Israel. Israel also won a bunch of wars so, there's that.

Not saying any of this is "fair" - just giving it some context.

I don't think it will bring any instability in the region. Israel showed a lot of restraint and patience getting to where they are today and it seems to have paid off for them.

Yeah, that doesn't justify their criminal behaviour for me.

Keeping up the pretense of restraint while slowly taking more land and lives.

Matt Barrett

Matt Barrett wrote: »

So you basically want this to get less attention?

Matt Barrett wrote: »

So do you suggest we all ignore this and stick a pin in a map? Which issues do you think are worthy?

Matt Barrett wrote: »

I wonder when people started saying that about the Jews in Germany eighty odd years ago?

begsbyOnaTrain

Matt Barrett wrote: »

No you didn't I asked it. You didn't answer.

Do I want it to have less attention? That's a loaded question really. It gets the lion's share. As said, other conflicts don't get a fraction of what it gets especially in Ireland. Maybe it'd be nice for people to be as aware of other conflicts, as the amount of time that's given to Palestinians?

Using whataboutery is grand and all but does not take away from Israeli criminality and murder. Nobody but China defends China's abuses, Israel however is defended by the White House.

Whataboutery, haha. What are you on about? I've presented similar conflicts (Tamils are way more on the nose) and the complete lack of public interest, you opined its due to governmental interests and I presented another direct comparison. Is that whataboutery? Questioning answers with comparable situations?

Best you just ignore it if you're not interested?

Pretty much impossible in Ireland which is what I'm asking about. Can't put on a soccer match or clubs finals without the inevitable Palestinian flags in the crowd.

Is there any other country on the planet which has such an obsession with another's flag as we do?

Odhinn

antix80 wrote: »

The land is part of Area C which is under Israeli control. A main highway runs through it. It's not smart having Palestine border with Jordan, or giving the Palestinian's control of a water supply relied on by Israel. Israel also won a bunch of wars so, there's that.

Not saying any of this is "fair" - just giving it some context.

I don't think it will bring any instability in the region. Israel showed a lot of restraint and patience getting to where they are today and it seems to have paid off for them.

The aquistion of territory by force has been illegal according to international law since the 1940's.


Comedy time already, is it? I suppose assination, detention without trial (not even what passes for a trial in the OT), the night raids, the beatings, torture, the turning of the blind eye towards settler violence and the running of the OT along apartheid lines requires "restraint and patience", but not from Israel.

James Brown

Deleted User wrote: »

That your Ma?

James Brown

begsbyOnaTrain wrote: »

Do I want it to have less attention? That's a loaded question really. It gets the lion's share. As said, other conflicts don't get a fraction of what it gets especially in Ireland. Maybe it'd be nice for people to be as aware of other conflicts, as the amount of time that's given to Palestinians?

You go tell the victims of Israeli aggression they get too much attention. In fact try tell any group suffering they get too much attention :rolleyes:
They'd be getting too much attention if there wasn't a problem. Maybe tell the Israeli's to cut it out because it's getting too much attention?

begsbyOnaTrain wrote: »

Whataboutery, haha. What are you on about? I've presented similar conflicts (Tamils are way more on the nose) and the complete lack of public interest, you opined its due to governmental interests and I presented another direct comparison. Is that whataboutery? Questioning answers with comparable situations?

Whataboutery is exactly what you are engaging in. Wrong thread so. Start a Tamil thread maybe?

begsbyOnaTrain wrote: »

Pretty much impossible in Ireland which is what I'm asking about. Can't put on a soccer match or clubs finals without the inevitable Palestinian flags in the crowd.

Is there any other country on the planet which has such an obsession with another's flag as we do?

Look, it's obvious you don't like it, fair enough.

Matt Barrett

Matt Barrett wrote: »

That your Ma?

Good one.

begsbyOnaTrain

Matt Barrett wrote: »

Maybe tell the Israeli's to cut it out because it's getting too much attention?

I think the Israeli actions have been totally scumbaggish.

Look, it's obvious you don't like it, fair enough.

Is it? I'm still struggling to think of another country with such a fetish for a foreign flag. Hardcore yanks and the Israeli flag maybe?

James Brown

begsbyOnaTrain wrote: »

I think the Israeli actions have been totally scumbaggish.



Is it? I'm still struggling to think of another country with such a fetish for a foreign flag. Hardcore yanks and the Israeli flag maybe?

Yes it is. You are critical of people supporting Palestine, too much in your view and that's fair enough. Not sure why you came into the Netenyahu thread to voice that. We weren't going to be discussing Brexit.

Wibbs

I reckon the Irish interest among some anyway is down to parallels with the plantations here and how that went, though Israel's version has been much more complete and the links between the Republican movement here and the PLO back in the day.

Danzy

If they annex it won't those areas be Israel then, have Knesset seats and votes.

That would give the Arabic and Jewish vote near equal numbers.

That is a recipe for Israel to have a civil war.

No one seriously believes that an Israel with an Arabic majority wouldn't end in that region being cleansed of Jews.

I support the 2 State solution as reflecting reality today but my sympathy is with the Palestinians who had their l a nd stolen.

antix80

Danzy wrote: »

If they annex it won't those areas be Israel then, have Knesset seats and votes.

Doubt there's much of a Palestinian population in the area he wants to annex.

James Brown

antix80 wrote: »

Doubt there's much of a Palestinian population in the area he wants to annex.

And if there is there soon won't be.