oughterard people - see OP for Mod warning 29/09/19

alastair

Wibbs wrote: »

Northern Ireland as an example of how cultures mix or don't as the case may be is a lot less overblown than the stuff we read from you. Unless you completely write off the centuries of inter-ethnic strife up there. Strife that is still there just under the surface.

Then again given your continuing penchant for nebulous "positives" like "cultural vibrancy" which you fire out willy nilly but can't seem to follow up with much by way of explanation or argument, I would suggest not throwing too many rocks in that glass house of yours.

I’d suggest you hitch your wagon to ideas that don’t require aligning yourself to regimes like Saudi and claiming that the north is doomed. But ymmv.

Wibbs

alastair wrote: »

China isn’t monocultural, as much as it tries to intern and ‘redeucate’ it’s Muslim minorities. Japan offers no great model of monoculturalism, given the suppression if it’s own minority cultures and the treatment of Koreans and Chinese as part of it’s imperial adventures.

Indeed. Thank you for proving my point for me as far as human tribalism goes and has always gone. Pity that China, Korea and Japan are economic powerhouses with far fewer of the social issues of the multi-ethnic west.

For the craic then; please point us all to western multicultural success stories, where the non White ethnic minorities are not the more likely to live in enclaves and feature more in crime and social problem stats. France? Nope. Germany? Nope. Britain? Nope. Holland? Nope. The US? Nope. Canada? Nope. Generally the only exception to this general rule are the East Asian minorities. But for some reason the naive or vested interests are hellbent on repeating those ills here on the altar of vague hope notions of "cultural vibrancy"?

Wibbs

alastair wrote: »

I’d suggest you hitch your wagon to ideas that don’t require aligning yourself to regimes like Saudi and claiming that the north is doomed. But ymmv.

Man you're thrashing around like a drowning man looking for a twig at this stage. 1) I didn't bring up Saudi Arabia. You did. In a mad leap that was worthy of the Olympics, and made zero sense. 2) Decades of misery, death and injury, built on centuries of enmity is hardly a great example of cultures coexisting, but a good example of how they often don't, even when their ethnic and cultural differences are positively minute. But keep flailing around looking for a defensible position not based on hope and airyfairy notions.

alastair

Wibbs wrote: »

Indeed. Thank you for proving my point for me as far as human tribalism goes and has always gone. Pity that China, Korea and Japan are economic powerhouses with far fewer of the social issues of the multi-ethnic west.

For the craic then; please point us all to western multicultural success stories, where the non White ethnic minorities are not the more likely to live in enclaves and feature more in crime and social problem stats. France? Nope. Germany? Nope. Britain? Nope. Holland? Nope. The US? Nope. Canada? Nope. Generally the only exception to this general rule are the East Asian minorities. But for some reason the naive or vested interests are hellbent on repeating those ills here on the altar of vague hope notions of "cultural vibrancy"?

Multiculturalism works just fine in those counties you mention, with the exception of France, which promoted a monocultural laïcité notion of what being French meant, to the detriment of anyone who fell outside those criteria, and were consequently, and understandably, made to feel like second class citizens.

alastair

Wibbs wrote: »

Man you're thrashing around like a drowning man looking for a twig at this stage. 1) I didn't bring up Saudi Arabia. You did. In a mad leap that was worthy of the Olympics, and made zero sense. 2) Decades of misery, death and injury, built on centuries of enmity is hardly a great example of cultures coexisting, but a good example of how they often don't, even when their ethnic and cultural differences are positively minute. But keep flailing around looking for a defensible position not based on hope and airyfairy notions.

Yes, I did. Not flailing however. I’m not so desperate as to write off N.I. 😂

Wibbs

alastair wrote: »

Multiculturalism works just fine in those counties you mention

Now I just can't begin to take your position seriously at all. Not when you are wilfully denying plain facts regarding minorities, their issues and the wider societal issues caused by multiculturalism in every single one of those countries listed.

I note you avoided addressing this part:Where the non White ethnic minorities are not the more likely to live in enclaves and feature more in crime and social problem stats.

Are you actually trying to tell us that in the UK for example Afro-Caribbean and Sub Continental ethnicities don't tend to build ethnic enclaves over time and feature more prominently than ethnic Brits in poverty and crime stats? Really? If so I really don't know what to say. You're either so blinkered by this naive politic, so are happy to ignore plain facts, or have a neck as hard as a jockey's bollocks to claim that.

4068ac1elhodqr

alastair wrote: »

Might as well write off N.I. then eh? Overblown guff.

You're the expert on searching for typos & spelling (perhaps from teaching the elementary ABC's at one of these centres on an inflated €€€p/hr rate).

However your modules on recent history sure do need a brush up:
The current GFA (now at an elevated risk, factored primarily by the uk's 2016 view on migration), took a 'slight bit of effort' after significant time and cost the first time, any GFA2.0 might be more decade(s) in the making.

eagle eye

alastair wrote: »

The Garda in drogheda didn’t get any facial scars for life. Stop talking ****e. The suspects in Courtown are not Africans, they’re Travellers from Kilkenny. Stop talking ****e.

You are wrong about the Garda.



Provide links to prove I'm wrong on the Courtown incident please.

Wibbs

alastair wrote: »

The Garda in drogheda didn’t get any facial scars for life. Stop talking ****e.

Apparently not, however..

" FIVE teenagers were arrested and a garda was viciously assaulted after a party in a Drogheda pub descended into violence this weekend.

Shocking video footage of the incident shows teens kicking a garda multiple times as he lies on the ground on Friday night.

“I f**king love my young drillers. Good enough for em f**ing pigs. Feckkkkk these guys are dumb. They done skiddy bop on the pigs head””.

Ah sure that's OK then. Thriving Cultural Vibrancy dontcha know.

The suspects in Courtown are not Africans, they’re Travellers from Kilkenny. Stop talking ****e.

Indeed they apparently were, and look how well Travellers are integrated and loved and involved as an ethnic minority in our wonderful Ireland. Same colour, creed and breed as the rest too. You'd think this would be so much easier, but.. Stop talking sh1te indeed.

alastair

Wibbs wrote: »

Now I just can't begin to take your position seriously at all. Not when you are wilfully denying plain facts regarding minorities, their issues and the wider societal issues caused by multiculturalism in every single one of those countries listed.

I note you avoided addressing this part:Where the non White ethnic minorities are not the more likely to live in enclaves and feature more in crime and social problem stats.

Are you actually trying to tell us that in the UK for example Afro-Caribbean and Sub Continental ethnicities don't tend to build ethnic enclaves over time and feature more prominently than ethnic Brits in poverty and crime stats? Really? If so I really don't know what to say. You're either so blinkered by this naive politic, so are happy to ignore plain facts, or have a neck as hard as a jockey's bollocks to claim that.

There’s been Irish and Jewish enclaves in the UK too - some in the exact locations of current ethnic minority enclaves. Doesn’t mean they will there forever. Plenty of ethnic minorities not in any enclaves too. take off your blinkers.

alastair

Wibbs wrote: »

Apparently not, however..

" FIVE teenagers were arrested and a garda was viciously assaulted after a party in a Drogheda pub descended into violence this weekend.

Shocking video footage of the incident shows teens kicking a garda multiple times as he lies on the ground on Friday night.

“I f**king love my young drillers. Good enough for em f**ing pigs. Feckkkkk these guys are dumb. They done skiddy bop on the pigs head””.

Ah sure that's OK then. Thriving Cultural Vibrancy dontcha know.

Indeed they apparently were, and look how well Travellers are integrated and loved and involved as an ethnic minority in our wonderful Ireland. Same colour, creed and breed as the rest too. You'd think this would be so much easier, but.. Stop talking sh1te indeed.

Still ****e. Morto that you feel the need to defend it.

alastair

eagle eye wrote: »

You are wrong about the Garda.



Provide links to prove I'm wrong on the Courtown incident please.

Suggest you stop posting nonsense that you can easily fact check to avoid looking like a dupe. Whoever told you this ****e is playing you like a violin.

alastair

Lawson Ambitious Condo wrote: »

You're the expert on searching for typos & spelling (perhaps from teaching the elementary ABC's at one of these centres on an inflated €€€p/hr rate).

However your modules on recent history sure do need a brush up:
The current GFA (now at an elevated risk, factored primarily by the uk's 2016 view on migration), took a 'slight bit of effort' after significant time and cost the first time, any GFA2.0 might be more decade(s) in the making.

More guff.

Galwayguy35

alastair wrote: »

Yeah. There have been plenty of centres closed over the years. Does it make it, or them, imaginary?

It certainly didn't last too long there, interesting that it was up to Ballymun they moved them instead of another posh neighbourhood.

Wonder why that was.

Wibbs

Look G, this Alistair and his chums in denial on the thread can't respond to direct questions and instead deflect, deny, ignore, misdirect and even go for the insult route in order to avoid said direct questions. QV his last few enlightening posts today. Like I said earlier if their position was so strong, was so right, one would think it far easier to defend. And yet here we are.

alastair

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

It certainly didn't last too long there, interesting that it was up to Ballymun they moved them instead of another posh neighbourhood.

Wonder why that was.

Because they had built a nice new tailor-made centre on a greenfield site? Just a guess.

alastair

Wibbs wrote: »

Look G, this Alistair and his chums in denial on the thread can't respond to direct questions and instead deflect, deny, ignore, misdirect and even go for the insult route in order to avoid said direct questions. QV his last few enlightening posts today. Like I said earlier if their position was so strong, was so right, one would think it far easier to defend. And yet here we are.

Making up ****e? Not much of an endorsement for your argument.

Galwayguy35

alastair wrote: »

Because they had built a nice new tailor-made centre on a greenfield site? Just a guess.

So in other words you don't know.

alastair

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

So in other words you don't know.

Try a bit of comprehension. For the novelty.

ShamNNspace

Uncle Charlie wrote: »

Its funny how they never put these asylum centres in rich areas.

But that's double standards for you.

The head of the refugee council wouldn't even allow a housing development to built in her area in the middle of a housing crisis.


But these are the same kind of people who will call the little people racist if they object to asylum centres.


https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/denise-charlton-joins-pat-kenny-in-opposing-plan-to-develop-her-family-lands-d80krfxvc[/quote
One would imagine it would be a perfect fit. Might even be room for a hardstand in Dalkey or Blackrock or Rathgar even
They couldn't object now could they... Could they??

WB Yokes

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

It certainly didn't last too long there, interesting that it was up to Ballymun they moved them instead of another posh neighbourhood.

Wonder why that was.

I wasnt aware there was one in Ballymun, this one is nearby.

https://extra.ie/2018/04/04/news/irish-news/balseskin-reception-centre-drugs-prostitution-probe

Wibbs

Hmmm..

alastair wrote: »

Still ****e. Morto that you feel the need to defend it.

alastair wrote: »

Suggest you stop posting nonsense that you can easily fact check to avoid looking like a dupe. Whoever told you this ****e is playing you like a violin.

alastair wrote: »

More guff.

alastair wrote: »

Try a bit of comprehension. For the novelty.

alastair wrote: »

Making up ****e? Not much of an endorsement for your argument.

So still on the same tack proving my last point for all to see? And that's only the last hour.

I'm making stuff up eh Alastair? All that comes from you seems to be airyfairy vagueness about cultural vibrancy, if you respond directly at all. Earlier I pointed out the *trigger warning!* facts that in multicultural societies ethnic minorities are much higher in the poverty and crime and social issues stats than the native ethnicity(in the west Whites). No? I'm making stuff, sorry "****e" up again?


From the above link from Poverty UK: Around two-fifths of people from ethnic minorities live in low-income households, twice the rate for White people.
Within this, there are big variations by ethnic group. More specifically, the proportion of people who live in low-income households is:

20% for White people.
30% for Indians and Black Caribbeans.
50% for Black Africans.
60% for Pakistanis.
70% for Bangladeshis.

Do you want me to dig up the stats that show while Afro-Caribbeans make up 3% of the UK population they make up 14 % of the UK prison population? And yep there are all sorts of reasons for this, not least racism within the justice system and society in general, but after many decades of trying to solve that knotty problem it's still there and in the case of some crimes getting worse. Not many whities on stabbing sprees, or acid attacks. The Pakistani minorities are way overrepresented in rape and sexual assault cases. When authorities have been bothered to investigate, when not afraid of being seen as "racist". Oh and those stats will be similarly reflected in every single "multicultural" nation in Europe.

Again these are *trigger warning!* facts, not conjecture. And those facts lead me to firmly believe this multicultural pipe dream is just that, a pipe dream, not least for the minority folks. It's no wonder some of them seek to set themselves apart in such nations. If I were a third generation Pakistani Muslim guy in England I would, because I would know I was born into a half truth.

Again, why are some of us so hellbent in wanting to import that nonsense here? Yes we have our own social problems and no mistake, so why the hell import more of them???

enricoh

Ah wibbs, u had to go and ruin it with uncomfortable facts! Tumbleweed will ensue!

Wibbs

More likely a litany of posts with "****e" writ often.

Seathrun66

eagle eye wrote: »

Yeah a Garda in Drogheda gets kicked on the ground and has facial scars for life from a gang of Balbriggan thugs. Suspects in the Courtown rape and sexual assault if young teenage girls are of African decent. There's a big gang of youths of African decent terrorising people in Galway. Some of these have been jailed but it's still going on.
We have lots of foreign nationals locked up for rape and murder.
We have lots of gangs of foreign nationals heavily involved in the drugs trade.
Our country is getting more seedy by the day.

What Galway gang? And links to crime reports? More nonsense from hysterical anti-immigrants without any factual basis.

Galway is the most multi-cultural city in the country. And amongst the lowest crime in the country. All good down here lads and happy for the integration to continue.

https://connachttribune.ie/crime-rate-in-galway-drops-by-10-percent-600/

Seathrun66

Wibbs wrote: »

Indeed. Thank you for proving my point for me as far as human tribalism goes and has always gone. Pity that China, Korea and Japan are economic powerhouses with far fewer of the social issues of the multi-ethnic west.

For the craic then; please point us all to western multicultural success stories, where the non White ethnic minorities are not the more likely to live in enclaves and feature more in crime and social problem stats. France? Nope. Germany? Nope. Britain? Nope. Holland? Nope. The US? Nope. Canada? Nope. Generally the only exception to this general rule are the East Asian minorities. But for some reason the naive or vested interests are hellbent on repeating those ills here on the altar of vague hope notions of "cultural vibrancy"?

The political representation at the highest levels of the UK parliament, London mayoralty and UK business suggest that multiculturalism is indeed working very well thank you.

Seathrun66

eagle eye wrote: »

You are wrong about the Garda.



Provide links to prove I'm wrong on the Courtown incident please.

How about this from the Irish Independent? From the Garda spokesperson - A Garda member received a minor facial injury during the incident

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/five-arrested-and-garda-viciously-assaulted-after-public-order-incident-at-drogheda-pub-38392037.html

Stick to the facts lads, the facts.

Seathrun66

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

It certainly didn't last too long there, interesting that it was up to Ballymun they moved them instead of another posh neighbourhood.

Wonder why that was.

As a Galway guy what about the one in Salthill? Not a rough area by any means.

Seathrun66

Wibbs wrote: »

Look G, this Alistair and his chums in denial on the thread can't respond to direct questions and instead deflect, deny, ignore, misdirect and even go for the insult route in order to avoid said direct questions. QV his last few enlightening posts today. Like I said earlier if their position was so strong, was so right, one would think it far easier to defend. And yet here we are.

Try spelling his name right. It's on every page as an aid to you.

Those in opposition to you are posting respected media links and easily verifiable facts.

Though your congnitive dissonance leads you to prefer guff to back up your views, guff from Putinist and racist sites that aim to sow discontent. You'll probably not be convinced but to convince us please post something other than lies and YouTube nonsense.

4068ac1elhodqr

Seathrun66 wrote: »

Galway is the most multi-cultural city in the country. And amongst the lowest crime in the country. All good down here lads and happy for the integration to continue.

18.6% vs 17% in Dublin, not much difference. Of course the non-EU homeless family issues in Dub (20%+), is of a concern

Also:

Crime on the rise in Galway

https://connachttribune.ie/crime-on-the-rise-in-galway-687/

There were more than 2,000 burglaries and thefts recorded in Galway last year (2018) – a rise of more than 12% on the previous year. The total of 122 rape and sexual assault reports, marked an increase from 109 the previous year.
General indications (bar the odd exception), is it not the case, that on average it's actually going up?