oughterard people - see OP for Mod warning 29/09/19

malinheader

fisgon wrote: »

There seems to be a lot of people posting here using the words "chancers" and "spongers" to describe asylum seekers, just like Noel Grealish, as if they know what they are talking about. It is clear that the majority of people using these terms have no direct knowledge of the lives of asylum seekers here.

Let's be clear, asylum seekers get €20 a week and have to live in shared rooms or dorms, many in basic, crowded conditions. They are not being housed in luxury accommodation or given a lot of money. Some can now work, and if they do work they pay taxes and PRSI like everyone else. They are not responsible for the housing crisis and did not cause it.

They are, in general, the best behaved members of any community that they live in and cause almost no trouble. Most integrate well, if they are allowed to. They will not "destroy the fabric of Oughterard" or of any place they go to.

This whole topic is allowing some people to indulge their primal fear of difference and the outsider, and to spread lies and nonsense about anyone who is not white and Irish.

Firstly. This country has to address the serious problem of separating the REAL Asylum seekers and the people who are here for the nice welfare package.
Secondly. Like it or not the truth about direct provision is that it is a massive money making operation for alot of companies with very little thought for the people who stay there.
Thirdly. It's not about being white and Irish, it's about protecting what we have.

vriesmays

fisgon wrote: »

They are, in general, the best behaved members of any community that they live in and cause almost no trouble. Most integrate well, if they are allowed to. They will not "destroy the fabric of Oughterard" or of any place they go to.

Give it a decade and see the state of Oughterard. Once their extended families arrive over that town will be destroyed.

puppieperson1

why are you terrified to be called a racist, we dont like strange cultures we are an island people. embrace your racism thats the only way to beat this government. majority of irish are racist, i dont like these anti women cultures in my country so i am racist so shoot me for ****s sake. the truth of the matter is being racist has another meaning it means loving ireland and wanting to protect it from George Soros wet dream of dumb mixed brown people i ll be struck off for this but so what.....embrace your racism ha ha ha ......

CelticSeaShip

fisgon wrote: »

There seems to be a lot of people posting here using the words "chancers" and "spongers" to describe asylum seekers, just like Noel Grealish, as if they know what they are talking about. It is clear that the majority of people using these terms have no direct knowledge of the lives of asylum seekers here.

Let's be clear, asylum seekers get €20 a week and have to live in shared rooms or dorms, many in basic, crowded conditions. They are not being housed in luxury accommodation or given a lot of money. Some can now work, and if they do work they pay taxes and PRSI like everyone else. They are not responsible for the housing crisis and did not cause it.

They are, in general, the best behaved members of any community that they live in and cause almost no trouble. Most integrate well, if they are allowed to. They will not "destroy the fabric of Oughterard" or of any place they go to.

This whole topic is allowing some people to indulge their primal fear of difference and the outsider, and to spread lies and nonsense about anyone who is not white and Irish.

€20 - is that all?

Yet, posters here think that because oughterard has little /no gp services these people can make their way to salthill or knocknarra or barna which will require taking more than one bus, and on €20 euro.

Honestly how is this going to work? 250 people, each receiving 20 euro a week. If they get sick the local village doesn't have a gp. And magically they have to get from one village to another or into the city on 20 euro. I just cannot see the logistics of this working out.

vriesmays

CelticSeaShip wrote: »

Honestly how is this going to work?

It won't, putting non-Christians from 3rd world countries into small Irish towns will never work. Only the most deluded, PC dopes would think otherwise.

fisgon

malinheader wrote: »

It's not about being white and Irish, it's about protecting what we have.

"What we have" is not under threat in any way. No one is threatening us, or taking anything away from us. This is the great lie behind all of this fear-mongering and hysteria.

In fact, many immigrants bring a huge amount to this country - new ideas, cultures, foods, a window on the world. This tribal fear of anyone different is toxic and self-defeating.

fisgon

puppieperson1 wrote: »

why are you terrified to be called a racist, we dont like strange cultures we are an island people. embrace your racism thats the only way to beat this government. majority of irish are racist, i dont like these anti women cultures in my country ..

Wait a second, so your concern is for women? You're a feminist then?

Mad_maxx

fisgon wrote: »

There seems to be a lot of people posting here using the words "chancers" and "spongers" to describe asylum seekers, just like Noel Grealish, as if they know what they are talking about. It is clear that the majority of people using these terms have no direct knowledge of the lives of asylum seekers here.

Let's be clear, asylum seekers get €20 a week and have to live in shared rooms or dorms, many in basic, crowded conditions. They are not being housed in luxury accommodation or given a lot of money. Some can now work, and if they do work they pay taxes and PRSI like everyone else. They are not responsible for the housing crisis and did not cause it.

They are, in general, the best behaved members of any community that they live in and cause almost no trouble. Most integrate well, if they are allowed to. They will not "destroy the fabric of Oughterard" or of any place they go to.

This whole topic is allowing some people to indulge their primal fear of difference and the outsider, and to spread lies and nonsense about anyone who is not white and Irish.

It's not relevant whether asylum seekers are " the best behaved members of the community"

The question must be asked, what is the point of them being here, this phenomenon of taking in people from far flung places is completely new, who decided it was obligatory?

Yamanoto

fisgon wrote: »

There seems to be a lot of people posting here using the words "chancers" and "spongers" to describe asylum seekers, just like Noel Grealish, as if they know what they are talking about. It is clear that the majority of people using these terms have no direct knowledge of the lives of asylum seekers here.

A large proportion of people who seek asylum within the EU are not refugees fleeing persecution, they are economic migrants who abuse the system to further their chances of permanent settlement.

As such, they most certainly should be called out as chancers and scroungers, who not only constitute a drain on the exchequer but also incontrovertibly worsen the lot of those in very genuine need of international protection

Mad_maxx

fisgon wrote: »

malinheader wrote: »

It's not about being white and Irish, it's about protecting what we have.

"What we have" is not under threat in any way. No one is threatening us, or taking anything away from us. This is the great lie behind all of this fear-mongering and hysteria.

In fact, many immigrants bring a huge amount to this country - new ideas, cultures, foods, a window on the world. This tribal fear of anyone different is toxic and self-defeating.

What sort of "new ideas"

That post could well have been written by the guy in the aras, it's so fluffy

Mad_maxx

Yamanoto wrote: »

fisgon wrote: »

There seems to be a lot of people posting here using the words "chancers" and "spongers" to describe asylum seekers, just like Noel Grealish, as if they know what they are talking about. It is clear that the majority of people using these terms have no direct knowledge of the lives of asylum seekers here.

A large proportion of people who seek asylum within the EU are not refugees fleeing persecution, they are economic migrants who abuse the system to further their chances of permanent settlement.

As such, they most certainly should be called out as chancers and scroungers, who not only constitute a drain on the exchequer but also incontrovertibly worsen the lot of those in very genuine need of international protection

Add to that, our soft system will only encourage more to take the voyage, a country can loose control quickly and when that happens, there is no going back, such is both the naivete and arrogance of the left, they believe they can design their new country to meet their ideals, all the while introducing very different cultures into the mix

Public discourse on many important matters is policed by over indulged children these days

JohnnyFlash

All classic stuff from the propaganda handbook. Take the concerns of local residents and ordinary people and apply negative labels such as racist or nimby to their opinions. Denigrate those that seek to represent them. Control the narrative so anything other than complete positivity about immigration is seen as being old fashioned at best.

It’s not even particularly sophisticated stuff. Machiavelli wrote about this type of thing hundreds of years ago.

The goal of all this is to make huge amounts of money. It’s always about the money. Immigration is the wet dream of the free market ideological capitalist.

vriesmays

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

All classic stuff from the propaganda handbook.

The Irish emigrated to Canada/Britain/Australia/America so the Albanians/Georgians/Nigerians/Somalians/Pakistanis are entitled to come here.

The_Kew_Tour

Ask many Genuine Refugees especially Women and Children who went to Europe and they also be angry at the people trying chance their arm.

I'm happy to help those who are in most need, I'm happy to pay my taxes towards that, but that's as good as it goes. Would anyone here pay for me to sit on my arse all day and get everything for free?and why would you...

Wibbs

Mad_maxx wrote: »

What sort of "new ideas"

That post could well have been written by the guy in the aras, it's so fluffy

Indeed, so many of the proponents for this failed politic go on about nebulous guff like "new ideas" and "culture". Food tops lists often enough too and it reinforces my opinion that a load of the type think "multiculturalism" means they get better restaurants in their leafy suburbs. "Oh wow Prionsias, you won't believe the flavours from this authentic Uzbek cafe I found". As for a "window on the world", yep there is one you can look through; every European country with "multiculturalism" and how that's panning out for them. Never mind the minorities not exactly getting the best deal. About the only people benefiting are a tiny minority that live off them.

vriesmays

This country had lots of Japanese managers in the 1980s but they closed their factories and left because the workers couldn't adapt to the advanced management techniques.

Now we're importing the wrong immigrants, minimum-wage workers and welfare spongers.

Mad_maxx

Ireland is a wealthy country, if some sort of plan designed to genuinely help people fleeing conflict were put together and every tax payer in the EU contributed through the tax system, I'd have no problem, perhaps a number of safe zones could be set up, I'm just floating broad ideas here

This resettlement plan is good for no-one however, it's no good for the africans either

Zorya

To the people who say " be kind" , which is intended to make those who look at the broader demographic picture feel like monsters, what is your number? The amount you will be kind to before forced to pull down the barrier in this very modern hunger games?

Be clear. Dont just emote. How many? Remember now, we dont live in a Star Trek Utopia where I can get my earthling UBI in the wilds of Canada and make art and love to my hearts content.

So how many? There are 1.2 billion in Africa, 60% under 25. 50 % of people under 25 in Africa say they want to emigrate. Many within the continent, but a good chunk fancy the EU or US. Then theres China, why do we forget the poor enslaved Chinese who labour to produce our cheap luxuries. Theres all of Asia, in fact, slaving away on the plantations so we can have fine foods and goods. How many? Why exclude some? This is not just about a raggle taggle of Albanian blokes who are likely lovely fellows.

Theres the Middle East, fcuked by resource war games, theres South America, fcuked by other war games, what about the vast swathes of Russia and America where life is a drag.

So whats your number in this game of social engineering by those who have gathered vast wealth and influence about themselves and disguise this manipulated creation of cheap labour forces and new consumers as - disgustingly -empathy. How many?


This is just economics. Not even touching on the importation of any people whose belief systems have been helplessly encultured since childhood by the fundamentalist revolutions of religious ideas that happened 50 years ago elsewhere. Accepting medieval ideas of human life that gravely contrast with the hard won beliefs of modern democratic people - I cant even get my head around that. Shuttered women, child marriages, FGM, etc.

malinheader

vriesmays wrote: »

The Irish emigrated to Canada/Britain/Australia/America so the Albanians/Georgians/Nigerians/Somalians/Pakistanis are entitled to come here.

Agreed if you're coming here to work and embrace our culture and way of life.
Disagree if coming here for the generous social welfare benefits and to practice medieval beliefs and look down your nose at the Irish culture.

biko

Zorya wrote: »

To the people who say " be kind" , which is intended to make those who look at the broader demographic picture feel like monsters, what is your number?

They don't have a number because if they mention one then someone else even more woke will call them racist and we need "open borders, not closed minds".

fisgon

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

It’s not even particularly sophisticated stuff. Machiavelli wrote about this type of thing hundreds of years ago.

The goal of all this is to make huge amounts of money. It’s always about the money. Immigration is the wet dream of the free market ideological capitalist.

Classic conspiracy theory.

fisgon

malinheader wrote: »

Agreed if you're coming here to work and embrace our culture and way of life.
Disagree if coming here for the generous social welfare benefits and to practice medieval beliefs and look down your nose at the Irish culture.

Who is looking down their nose at Irish culture?

Contrary to a lot of people on this thread, I have personal experience of asylum seekers, and most attempt to integrate and show interest in Irish culture and history.

malinheader

fisgon wrote: »

Classic conspiracy theory.

Do you really think no one is making a massive profit from direct provision centres

tayto lover

The whole immigrant thing needs far more discussion and debate.
It’s seemingly being run without any thought or planning. No consultation at all.
The people need to know what’s being foisted on them and we all need to know what the costs are because we’re paying for it all.

fisgon

Yamanoto wrote: »

A large proportion of people who seek asylum within the EU are not refugees fleeing persecution, they are economic migrants who abuse the system to further their chances of permanent settlement.

n

And your proof for this is.......?. (besides of course what you want to believe is true)

malinheader

fisgon wrote: »

Who is looking down their nose at Irish culture?

Contrary to a lot of people on this thread, I have personal experience of asylum seekers, and most attempt to integrate and show interest in Irish culture and history.

As you stated most, not all. Whoever doesn't should be sent packing on first flight back.

Zorya

Zorya wrote: »

To the people who say " be kind" , which is intended to make those who look at the broader demographic picture feel like monsters, what is your number? The amount you will be kind to before forced to pull down the barrier in this very modern hunger games?

Be clear. Dont just emote. How many? Remember now, we dont live in a Star Trek Utopia where I can get my earthling UBI in the wilds of Canada and make art and love to my hearts content.

So how many? There are 1.2 billion in Africa, 60% under 25. 50 % of people under 25 in Africa say they want to emigrate. Many within the continent, but a good chunk fancy the EU or US. Then theres China, why do we forget the poor enslaved Chinese who labour to produce our cheap luxuries. Theres all of Asia, in fact, slaving away on the plantations so we can have fine foods and goods. How many? Why exclude some? This is not just about a raggle taggle of Albanian blokes who are likely lovely fellows.

Theres the Middle East, fcuked by resource war games, theres South America, fcuked by other war games, what about the vast swathes of Russia and America where life is a drag.

So whats your number in this game of social engineering by those who have gathered vast wealth and influence about themselves and disguise this manipulated creation of cheap labour forces and new consumers as - disgustingly -empathy. How many?


This is just economics. Not even touching on the importation of any people whose belief systems have been helplessly encultured since childhood by the fundamentalist revolutions of religious ideas that happened 50 years ago elsewhere. Accepting medieval ideas of human life that gravely contrast with the hard won beliefs of modern democratic people - I cant even get my head around that. Shuttered women, child marriages, FGM, etc.

Pretty much, FGM is so widespread in the UK that they have had to open clinics to deal with it. Wtf like?

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-49677983

woohoo!!!

It should be determined pretty quickly between the economic migrant and the asylum seeker fleeing from danger. The burden of proof should be on the applicant, not the state. Separate those who are deemed to be asylum seekers and those who are economic migrants.

Within the economic migrant group, again up to the applicant to prove they've a skill Ireland needs/shortage here. Make clear that it's on a temporary basis, our needs for skills will change with time. All who do not satisfy our needs, deport.

The above complies with international law and EU agreements. No need to apologise for deporting those who don't fit the criteria. Over time the message gets out, we welcome genuine people and will boot out those we don't need and watch the numbers and budget for same, dropping.

speckled_park

tayto lover wrote: »

The whole immigrant thing needs far more discussion and debate.
It’s seemingly being run without any thought or planning. No consultation at all.
The people need to know what’s being foisted on them and we all need to know what the costs are because we’re paying for it all.

Unfortunately you'll be called a racist if you try to debate it, see last weeks Tonight show on tv3. There is no consultation as its coming from EU level, government trys to keep it hush hush cause they have no say over what EU says.

Won't see any reasonable debate from rte anyway. Don't think they had any mention of gardai being assaulted by black gangs in Louth last month, that news doesn't suit their agenda.

Zorya

Dont know how those clinics can reverse Fgm. Not like a clitoris can be rebuilt once its been hacked off.

Edit - i cant seem to quote posts, this reply is to the chap mrntioning bbc article re fgm clinics