Man shoots dead neighbour in Co. Mayo

FrankPoll.

Andrew00 wrote: »

If they do get prison, they'll be out after 8 months on good behaviour

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/circuit-court/no-bull-cattle-help-garda%C3%AD-round-up-fleeing-burglar-1.3967305?mode=amp

This is one of them from last year

walshb

We need tough and severe mandatory sentences..

1st time burglary conviction: 10 years

Aggravated: 25...

2nd time burglary conviction: 20 years

2nd time Aggravated: life..

FrankPoll.

walshb wrote: »

We need tough and severe mandatory sentences..

1st time burglary conviction: 10 years

Aggravated: 25...

2nd time burglary conviction: 20 years

2nd time Aggravated: life..

Would need people on the streets to get something done

These guys will be back at at it again and learn from their mistakes

pinkyeye

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

In an apartment block some chap/chapette could be mistaken where they were going, in rural Ireland I'd basically shoot to kill after 6pm, no reason for any unannounced randomer to arrive in winter.

You would shoot to kill after 6pm?? I presume this is sarcasm??

If it's not, it's just crazy. :rolleyes:

jmayo

CrabRevolution wrote: »

There seems to be a notion that rural burglaries are a worse crime and deserve more focus than urban ones for some reason.

The data only goes up to 2016, but play around with these maps and in every single time period, Dublin has half the burglaries in the state, despite having 30% of the population. http://airo.maynoothuniversity.ie/external-content/recorded-crime-monitoring-tool

Where is this notion that Dublin is some safe haven while rural Ireland is some lawless unprotected free for all coming from?

The thing is I would bet a lot of the burglaries in Dublin are quick get in and out.
After all the guys are often druggies just looking for some quick cash or loot they can pawn to get the next fix.

I have even experienced one myself where the guards reckoned they fled out that back when they heard me arrive back.

Also you can't start tying up residents, beating or torturing them or their loved ones because someone next door might hear and phone the guards.
Now rightly said by poster earlier the guards are not the greatest at responding anywhere, but there is higher likelihood of guards arriving, even armed ones, than say if you are in a house out in countryside.

And if someone arrives at isolated house with nearest neighbour anything from 50 yards to half a mile away, the thieves can tie up the occupants and have hours to play with before anyone is the wiser.

And the occupants don't always have to be old as was seen with that family in Tipperary.

This is what especially adds the fear factor.

And lets be quite frank here, there is a certain section of society that travel around the countryside offering to carry out odd jobs, selling some goods of dubious quality and history who the residents know damn well are scoping out the premises.

The least fear is that they rob somethings from a shed when occupants are away or at night and the biggest fear is someone breaks in demanding money with the threat of severe violence.

It has gotten to a stage in rural areas and indeed in small towns, someone has to guard the house of someone getting married or being buried.

I have even heard story of where a person was found to be scoping out the house of the parents of a dead garda on the day of his state funeral.
That is the type of lowlives we are talking about.

Another thing that urban dwellers don't have to deal with AFAIK is the theft of heating oil and diesel.
There was huge problem with this in rural areas and when some were caught they just got slap on wrist.

John_Rambo

jmayo wrote: »

The thing is I would bet a lot of the burglaries in Dublin are quick get in and out.
After all the guys are often druggies just looking for some quick cash or loot they can pawn to get the next fix

In my next door neighbours case they were travellers from the Midlands that had carried out dozens of burglaries stretching from Howth, Sutton, Raheny and Clontarf. They'd beaten a homeowner up in Sutton and another in North County Dublin and got away with 80K in cash from one house!!! :eek:

Nothing reported in mainstream press. Urban burglaries just don't get the coverage and hysteria that rural burglaries get.

John_Rambo

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Same as suggesting rural folk were trigger happy shooting at anyone coming on their property.

But there are actual rural folk logging on here and saying they are happy shooting anyone that comes close to their property.

AulWan

jmayo wrote: »

It has gotten to a stage in rural areas and indeed in small towns, someone has to guard the house of someone getting married or being buried.

That's nothing new. My father was buried 35 years ago this week, and one of my cousins volunteered to stay behind in our house while the funeral was ongoing, as it was happening back then. Its also why people are advised not to include complete street addresses in funeral announcements anymore. (Dublin).

bladespin

AulWan wrote: »

That's nothing new. My father was buried 35 years ago this week, and one of my cousins volunteered to stay behind in our house while the funeral was ongoing, as it was happening back then. Its also why people are advised not to include complete street addresses in funeral announcements anymore. (Dublin).

Weddings, 21sts too, pretty much any big occasion means someone has to draw the short straw, IP cameras are becoming the go to gadget if you have coverage.

Galwayguy35

John_Rambo wrote: »

But there are actual rural folk logging on here and saying they are happy shooting anyone that comes close to their property.

I'm sure posters are able to answer for themselves but from what I understood they were saying that if someone came to do them harm they would respond.

You'd be a bow and arrow man yourself I'm guessing going by the name:)

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

jmayo wrote: »

The thing is I would bet a lot of the burglaries in Dublin are quick get in and out.
After all the guys are often druggies just looking for some quick cash or loot they can pawn to get the next fix.

I have even experienced one myself where the guards reckoned they fled out that back when they heard me arrive back.

Also you can't start tying up residents, beating or torturing them or their loved ones because someone next door might hear and phone the guards.
Now rightly said by poster earlier the guards are not the greatest at responding anywhere, but there is higher likelihood of guards arriving, even armed ones, than say if you are in a house out in countryside.

And if someone arrives at isolated house with nearest neighbour anything from 50 yards to half a mile away, the thieves can tie up the occupants and have hours to play with before anyone is the wiser.

And the occupants don't always have to be old as was seen with that family in Tipperary.

This is what especially adds the fear factor.

And lets be quite frank here, there is a certain section of society that travel around the countryside offering to carry out odd jobs, selling some goods of dubious quality and history who the residents know damn well are scoping out the premises.

The least fear is that they rob somethings from a shed when occupants are away or at night and the biggest fear is someone breaks in demanding money with the threat of severe violence.

It has gotten to a stage in rural areas and indeed in small towns, someone has to guard the house of someone getting married or being buried.

I have even heard story of where a person was found to be scoping out the house of the parents of a dead garda on the day of his state funeral.
That is the type of lowlives we are talking about.

Another thing that urban dwellers don't have to deal with AFAIK is the theft of heating oil and diesel.
There was huge problem with this in rural areas and when some were caught they just got slap on wrist.

A couple of years ago, I was out at home one Monday. Lying on the couch, mid afternoon. Dogs outside. Car drives down the drive and dogs start barking.
I stayed on couch and ignored the horn beeping outside. Few minutes pass and I didn’t hear the car leaving. Dogs still going mad. Out I go, and here’s your man, ethnically protected of course, hanging out of his van shouting at the dogs, they weren’t letting him out of his van. He became a bit flustered when I came out and said he wanted to come over to the door to knock but the dogs wouldn’t let him. “Are they cross” he asked, “they’d eat you” I told him.
So he asks me “is the boss around?” I am the boss. He seemed taken aback. “Where’s the older lady?” There is no older lady. I’m the boss. “Where’s your parents?” Not here. “Where is the older woman?” Now, my mother was dead ten years or so at the time, there was no older woman in the house.
Tried half heartedly to sell me saucepans, I told him to **** off.

No doubt he thought nobody was home and if he could have just got passed the dogs I’ve had no doubt he’d have had a good scope out.

Drifter50

John_Rambo wrote: »

Are you not reading the posts Drifter? You're less likely to be burgled in a rural area than in an urban area. Yet you're in bed, wide awake and "petrified" when you hear regular human activities like cars...

Of course you don't "confront" people, leave them be. Talk to a home security company, secure your property, make it safe or face the fact that rural living simply isn't for you.

Here's a link to a well renowned security company.

https://www.securigard.ie/?gclid=CjwKCAjw8ZHsBRA6EiwA7hw_sZLHU0MguLGn7RYP82BfAUoI_55JWPNETX--SN4O48kxrV3LVG5CTRoCHk0QAvD_BwE

Here's a link for grants if you're elderly.

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/justice/crime_and_crime_prevention/seniors_alert.html

Sleep well.


Edit... if you're on a farm I appreciate how hard it is to secure sheds, the yard and various outhouses with expensive machinery.

Thanks for the recommendations and I appreciate that but you are missing my point. No-one should be on my property uninvited after dark and late at night. Nothing good is going to come of a stranger wandering around my house. He is trespassing, simply that, he/she have no business being there. Remember this is someone who has come in off the road and wandering about my property. No way no how should they be there and I have a right to keep them off my property. Don`t get where you have this idea to relax and allow people to wander about your own property.

Drifter50

Leighton Acidic Bead wrote: »

A couple of years ago, I was out at home one Monday. Lying on the couch, mid afternoon. Dogs outside. Car drives down the drive and dogs start barking.
I stayed on couch and ignored the horn beeping outside. Few minutes pass and I didn’t hear the car leaving. Dogs still going mad. Out I go, and here’s your man, ethnically protected of course, hanging out of his van shouting at the dogs, they weren’t letting him out of his van. He became a bit flustered when I came out and said he wanted to come over to the door to knock but the dogs wouldn’t let him. “Are they cross” he asked, “they’d eat you” I told him.
So he asks me “is the boss around?” I am the boss. He seemed taken aback. “Where’s the older lady?” There is no older lady. I’m the boss. “Where’s your parents?” Not here. “Where is the older woman?” Now, my mother was dead ten years or so at the time, there was no older woman in the house.
Tried half heartedly to sell me saucepans, I told him to **** off.

No doubt he thought nobody was home and if he could have just got passed the dogs I’ve had no doubt he’d have had a good scope out.

Whats with the saucepans selling. We have this going on in South Leitrim as well, its bizarre if it was`nt so serious

FishOnABike

Drifter50 wrote: »

Whats with the saucepans selling. We have this going on in South Leitrim as well, its bizarre if it was`nt so serious

A bit old to be claiming they're looking for a ball they accidentally kicked over the wall so they need some excuse for a look around.

pinkyeye

Drifter50 wrote: »

Thanks for the recommendations and I appreciate that but you are missing my point. No-one should be on my property uninvited after dark and late at night. Nothing good is going to come of a stranger wandering around my house. He is trespassing, simply that, he/she have no business being there. Remember this is someone who has come in off the road and wandering about my property. No way no how should they be there and I have a right to keep them off my property. Don`t get where you have this idea to relax and allow people to wander about your own property.

What if that someone is lost, broke down, having a heart attack, have an injured person in their car, looking for help calling an ambulance???

How the fcuk do you get to this level of paranoia???

FrankPoll.

pinkyeye wrote: »

What if that someone is lost, broke down, having a heart attack, have an injured person in their car, looking for help calling an ambulance???

How the fcuk do you get to this level of paranoia???

4 Lads down from tallaght with baseball bats and balaclavas on the prowl

Andrew00

6 young lads with machetes and baseball bat's from Limerick hitchhiking the rural scenery in Ireland at 2am

Drifter50

pinkyeye wrote: »

What if that someone is lost, broke down, having a heart attack, have an injured person in their car, looking for help calling an ambulance???

How the fcuk do you get to this level of paranoia???

-Emergency services will all use Eircodes
-Having an injured person in the car ! that would raise ten times the number of red flags
-Medical emergency, stay put and call the emergency services or drive to a hospital, They are the options I have used in the past.
-Looking for help calling an ambulance, come on really
-Broke down, possibility but anyone out in a remote location will have a plan B and would certainly know not to go rambling around someones house all locked up, no lights on etc etc. Imagine facing a couple of dogs defending their territory

You need a reality check

Nekarsulm

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

I think it's in the DPP's hands now what charges if any will be brought against him.

Graces7 wrote: »

You cannot compare that. That man had been tormented by his neighbour for 30 years. 24/7 with a crowbanger. Having suffered from one nearby many times it is far more understandable and utter provocation with no help from local council re noise nuisance etc. There wad serious bad blood between them and he just snapped, whereas the dead man in this was a friend.

Why he chose to call at that late hour?

Don't forget that the man killed by his neighbor in that case was subsequently found to have an illegally owned shotgun in the boot of his car at the time. (his own legally owned gun having been confiscated by the Gardai some time earlier after he threatened someone else with it)

Graces7

Drifter50 wrote: »

-Emergency services will all use Eircodes
-Having an injured person in the car ! that would raise ten times the number of red flags
-Medical emergency, stay put and call the emergency services or drive to a hospital, They are the options I have used in the past.
-Looking for help calling an ambulance, come on really
-Broke down, possibility but anyone out in a remote location will have a plan B and would certainly know not to go rambling around someones house all locked up, no lights on etc etc. Imagine facing a couple of dogs defending their territory

You need a reality check

Maybe you need...not everyone plans for a breakdown or carries a phone with them and if you break down at night in the middle of nowhere of course you will try to get help from a nearby house. I have, in recent years, when I still lived on the mainland, had someone in that situation at my door . No problem helping them. letting them use the phone.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k

I live in an estate now and there’s not a hope in hell I would answer the door to anyone who wasn’t in uniform past 9pm

Graces7

jmayo wrote: »

The thing is I would bet a lot of the burglaries in Dublin are quick get in and out.
After all the guys are often druggies just looking for some quick cash or loot they can pawn to get the next fix.

I have even experienced one myself where the guards reckoned they fled out that back when they heard me arrive back.

Also you can't start tying up residents, beating or torturing them or their loved ones because someone next door might hear and phone the guards.
Now rightly said by poster earlier the guards are not the greatest at responding anywhere, but there is higher likelihood of guards arriving, even armed ones, than say if you are in a house out in countryside.

And if someone arrives at isolated house with nearest neighbour anything from 50 yards to half a mile away, the thieves can tie up the occupants and have hours to play with before anyone is the wiser.

And the occupants don't always have to be old as was seen with that family in Tipperary.

This is what especially adds the fear factor.

And lets be quite frank here, there is a certain section of society that travel around the countryside offering to carry out odd jobs, selling some goods of dubious quality and history who the residents know damn well are scoping out the premises.

The least fear is that they rob somethings from a shed when occupants are away or at night and the biggest fear is someone breaks in demanding money with the threat of severe violence.

Can I please ask respectfully if you live or have ever lived rural? Only I have lived in rural Ireland in various places for almost 20 years and never any of the dramatic issues or threats you aver are common. Well before I came to the island where I live now … in places easily accessible by road and no houses anywhere near. Once someone knocked at the door asking to use the phpne as his car had broken down; fine.



Another thing that urban dwellers don't have to deal with AFAIK is the theft of heating oil and diesel.
There was huge problem with this in rural areas and when some were caught they just got slap on wrist.

Also only once any theft and that was a gas cylinder and we knew who took it! Clearly you prefer urban living with all its problems. Which is fine. For you! You would live in terror out here, needlessly. And this tragedy was not by some incoming stranger but a neighbour and a friend.

John_Rambo

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

I'm sure posters are able to answer for themselves but from what I understood they were saying that if someone came to do them harm they would respond.

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

in rural Ireland I'd basically shoot to kill after 6pm, no reason for any unannounced randomer to arrive in winter.

Well be sure to choose carefully if you ever break down or get lost!! Now, maybe the fabric of society in some areas have changed, do people/neighbours not call in to each other unannounced any more? How do you check on your elderly neighbours? Mind never answer their messages on their phones so we call in.

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

You'd be a bow and arrow man yourself I'm guessing going by the name:)

They brought the war to me!!

Graces7

John_Rambo wrote: »

Well be sure to choose carefully if you ever break down or get lost!! Now, maybe the fabric of society in some areas have changed, do people/neighbours not call in to each other unannounced any more? How do you check on your elderly neighbours? Mind never answer their messages on their phones so we call in.



They brought the war to me!!

Out here privacy is deeply respected. But if I forget to take post in from the mailbox, there is a knock at the door...And in winter turf smoke from the chimney is a clue. They know I am fine to cope. A watching brief I think they call it!

jmayo

John_Rambo wrote: »

In my next door neighbours case they were travellers from the Midlands that had carried out dozens of burglaries stretching from Howth, Sutton, Raheny and Clontarf. They'd beaten a homeowner up in Sutton and another in North County Dublin and got away with 80K in cash from one house!!! :eek:

Nothing reported in mainstream press. Urban burglaries just don't get the coverage and hysteria that rural burglaries get.

There are rural areas in North County Dublin and there are also houses that are in their own grounds in places like Sutton.
These type of places allow someone more time to go about their nefarious activities.

Also rural Ireland, as opposed to rural County Dublin or especially urban Dublin, I would say would have local radio stations, small local papers that offer more exposure to these stories initially.
Then it attacts more widespread countrywide coverage.

Graces7 wrote: »

Also only once any theft and that was a gas cylinder and we knew who took it! Clearly you prefer urban living with all its problems. Which is fine. For you! You would live in terror out here, needlessly. And this tragedy was not by some incoming stranger but a neighbour and a friend.

I live in rural location and grew up in very rural location.
I definitely do not prefer urban living having lived in numerous cities.

In fact I am not even a fan of city tourism, bar maybe for the odd museum.
Give me countrysides anytime.

John_Rambo

jmayo wrote: »

There are rural areas in North County Dublin and there are also houses that are in their own grounds in places like Sutton.
These type of places allow someone more time to go about their nefarious activities.

Not the houses that were burgled, my next door neighbour.. main road, the one in Sutton in an estate, the one in Howth was a terraced house (A very large one) and the one in NCD was a semi D. They're the ones the Gardai told me about anyway.

Urban burglaries are just common, in fact more common but the hysteria about rural burglary is far more intense. Oh, and junkies don't really burgle houses! They may walk into an open door and take a chance, but they usually can barely open a paper bag.

I know all this info doesn't suit your narrative and view of what urban and suburban living is like, but it's the truth! Still doesn't have us absolutely sheetting ourselves in bed and greeting people with double barrel shotguns!

Drifter50

walshb wrote: »

We need tough and severe mandatory sentences..

1st time burglary conviction: 10 years

Aggravated: 25...

2nd time burglary conviction: 20 years

2nd time Aggravated: life..

Thats a good start but I`ll improve on that

1. Return of capital punishment. If you take someones life you lose the right to keep your own
2. Return of corporal punishment. 50 lashes on a bare body in a cold wet yard would make someone think before they committed burglary or larceny next time.
3. Compulsory military service for the youth of today both male and female
4. Empty the prisons, chain the inmates together and make them break rocks on the road for all the bypasses currently being planned.

AulWan

Drifter50 wrote: »

-Medical emergency, stay put and call the emergency services or drive to a hospital, They are the options I have used in the past.
-Looking for help calling an ambulance, come on really
-Broke down, possibly ...

Phone battery died? Or no signal?

Its not wildly outside the realms of possibility.

walshb

Drifter50 wrote: »

Thats a good start but I`ll improve on that

1. Return of capital punishment. If you take someones life you lose the right to keep your own
2. Return of corporal punishment. 50 lashes on a bare body in a cold wet yard would make someone think before they committed burglary or larceny next time.
3. Compulsory military service for the youth of today both male and female
4. Empty the prisons, chain the inmates together and make them break rocks on the road for all the bypasses currently being planned.

Maybe a little extreme, but I get it..

Bottom line: there seems to be no deterrent whatsoever for these people committing these crimes, some very serious...

Your suggestions will absolutely make these people think twice before destroying other people's lives...

AulWan

Drifter50 wrote: »

Thats a good start but I`ll improve on that

1. Return of capital punishment. If you take someones life you lose the right to keep your own

And the elderly man in the case that started this thread?

He took a life, and while I believe there should be consequences for that, I wouldn't want him to be executed for it.

Be careful what you wish for.