Brexit discussion thread XI (Please read OP before posting)

Professor Moriarty

dePeatrick wrote: »

600 to 24



In favour of having the right to remove the backstop...

Oh right. A unicorn proposal.

dePeatrick

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Oh right. A unicorn proposal.

Sprinkled with fairy dust with cherries on it...after all they were an empire once and they have not forgotten.

Water John

The reality is the EU see pigs having a better chance of flying than this,
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2019/oct/02/boris-johnson-unveils-brexit-plan-for-alternative-to-backstop

Politically they are not foolish enough to fall for pit trap in the jungle.

VinLieger

God Jeffrey Donaldson on Newtalk this morning was just lying through his teeth, the DUP are picking and choosing what they want to hear from Johnson also were back to magical "technology"

jimmycrackcorm

VinLieger wrote: »

God Jeffrey Donaldson on Newtalk this morning was just lying through his teeth, the DUP are picking and choosing what they want to hear from Johnson also were back to magical "technology"

Entry time the magic technology is mentioned, they should be asked, why not just support the Backstop until this technology is in place

dePeatrick

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Entry time the magic technology is mentioned, they should be asked, why not just support the Backstop until this technology is in place

Sounds good to me...but there must also a criteria in place too...UK not to be trusted on absolutely anything.

TCDStudent1

VinLieger wrote: »

God Jeffrey Donaldson on Newtalk this morning was just lying through his teeth, the DUP are picking and choosing what they want to hear from Johnson also were back to magical "technology"

What show was that on? Might listen back to it

VinLieger

TCDStudent1 wrote: »

What show was that on? Might listen back to it

Newstalk breakfast first 30 mins

Winters

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Entry time the magic technology is mentioned, they should be asked, why not just support the Backstop until this technology is in place

The UK thinks the EU will change the WA. I assume the EU's approach at the moment is if the UK comes up with legally acceptable alternatives to the backstop then the EU will just say 'great, now sign the WA'.

An Ciarraioch

We're definitely getting thrown under the bus!

https://twitter.com/DanielFerrie/status/1179702740869668864

Tea Shock

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=

gooch2k9 wrote: »

If a PoC is presented it requires a 60% overall majority plus at least 40% support from each community. It's not a matter of counter-PoC. DUP and TUV make 28/40 so 70% against and so the vote falls.

Obviously the make up may be different come the voting date.

Maybe I am a bit thick here. But how can people interpret it as a DUP veto if 40% of nationalist MLA's have to support it?

gooch2k9

Tea Shock wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=

Maybe I am a bit thick here. But how can people interpret it as a DUP veto if 40% of nationalist MLA's have to support it?

Nationalists would be supporting staying in the EU regulations. The vote will fall because 40% of Unionists won't support it, thus the north shifts to UK regulations.

What happens by default is what makes it a unionist veto.

An Ciarraioch

Tea Shock wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=

Maybe I am a bit thick here. But how can people interpret it as a DUP veto if 40% of nationalist MLA's have to support it?

No, it's a blocking minority of 30 MLAs, which unionists can muster.

Tea Shock

gooch2k9 wrote: »

Nationalists would be supporting staying in the EU regulations. The vote will fall because 40% of Unionists won't support it, thus the north shifts to UK regulations.

What happens by default is what makes it a unionist veto.

OK....had it the wrong way around. Got it now. Thanks!

PropJoe10

Much more conciliatory tone from Boris today which is good to see, but I can't see him making much progress with these proposals.

gooch2k9

PropJoe10 wrote: »

Much more conciliatory tone from Boris today which is good to see, but I can't see him making much progress with these proposals.

https://twitter.com/JGForsyth/status/1179685799517999105?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1179685799517999105&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.theguardian.com%2Fpolitics%2Flive%2F2019%2Foct%2F03%2Fbrexit-latest-news-boris-johnson-to-address-mps-as-gove-clams-new-plan-could-get-pretty-solid-majority-in-commons-live-news

Mark Francois reportedly backing this. EU may give up the pretence of "reading the proposals carefully". That lad wouldn't back anything less than EU capitulation. His Dad fought the Germans don't you know.

Hurrache

I wonder if what some see as him being conciliatory is due to the wind being taken out of his sails by the EU's reaction yesterday? He had possibly planned on his usual bluster of leaving no matter what/first and final offer and had nothing planned for the current situation.

Professor Moriarty

PropJoe10 wrote: »

Much more conciliatory tone from Boris today which is good to see, but I can't see him making much progress with these proposals.

He promised "glutinous emollience" towards the HoC and the EU. Struggled not to vomit up my breakfast.

lawred2

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

He promised "glutinous emollience" towards the HoC and the EU. Struggled not to vomit up my breakfast.

I'm at sea as to what that is supposed to mean? And does it differ from his usual arrogant aloofness?

ancapailldorcha

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

He promised "glutinous emollience" towards the HoC and the EU. Struggled not to vomit up my breakfast.

His party have tried to turn the UK into an extension of itself, ie the nasty country. Senior Conservatives have compared the EU to the Soviet Union, decried the backstop that they themselves proposed and described any sort of compromise as some sort of surrender that, again they themselves have negotiated.

I don't think Johnson is stupid enough to think that this will work. He comes across as just a would-be despot clinging to power. His reign is over and he didn't pass a single bill.

dePeatrick

lawred2 wrote: »

I'm at sea as to what that is supposed to mean? And does it differ from his usual arrogant aloofness?

I think it means he is going to be soft...and kinda gluey ??? Bojo speak?

gooch2k9

Both Scotland and Wales (SNP and Plaid Cymru) seeking a veto as well now.

Something I noticed during coverage of the Conservative conference was they had the all the nation secretaries on stage at one point; Welsh, Scottish and NI. No English secretary? I'm surprised this point hasn't been pushed before by nationalist parties in UK.

strandroad

lawred2 wrote: »

I'm at sea as to what that is supposed to mean? And does it differ from his usual arrogant aloofness?

Anyone else would say smarmy stickiness, but Boris must include Latin.

Professor Moriarty

lawred2 wrote: »

I'm at sea as to what that is supposed to mean? And does it differ from his usual arrogant aloofness?

It actually means 'sticky skin softener'.

Professor Moriarty

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

His party have tried to turn the UK into an extension of itself, ie the nasty country. Senior Conservatives have compared the EU to the Soviet Union, decried the backstop that they themselves proposed and described any sort of compromise as some sort of surrender that, again they themselves have negotiated.

I don't think Johnson is stupid enough to think that this will work. He comes across as just a would-be despot clinging to power. His reign is over and he didn't pass a single bill.

Dunno about his reign being over. The Tories continue to do relatively well in the polls and his approval ratings are relatively good. If he can dissuade or eliminate the Brexit party before the next GE, he'll get a decent majority.

ancapailldorcha

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Dunno about his reign being over. The Tories continue to do relatively well in the polls and his approval ratings are relatively good. If he can dissuade or eliminate the Brexit party before the next GE, he'll get a decent majority.

Polls are one thing. GE campaigns are another and he has absolutely nothing to run on save for no deal.

Threatening that Corbyn will trash the economy won't work if you do it first.

Infini

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

Dunno about his reign being over. The Tories continue to do relatively well in the polls and his approval ratings are relatively good. If he can dissuade or eliminate the Brexit party before the next GE, he'll get a decent majority.

If he doesnt request the extention it's likely he'll be voted out of no10 in short order, he doesn't have majority so if the oppositon get behind someone they can unite behind hes done.

Professor Moriarty

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

Polls are one thing. GE campaigns are another and he has absolutely nothing to run on save for no deal.

Threatening that Corbyn will trash the economy won't work if you do it first.

The Brexit party, whose only raison d'etre is to get Brexit done, are key. They are polling about 12% If they step aside, the only party who will 'get Brexit done' for Leavers will be the Tories. If that's the case, because of FPTP, the Tories will get a commanding majority.

dePeatrick

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

It actually means 'sticky skin softener'.

Crap?

Igotadose

Well, Boris is being less confrontative this time in Parliament. JRM looks bored. The DUP aren't even there. It's a sales pitch for this fatuous proposal.

The NI representative that are there, so far, have rubbished this "deal."