Cyclists

AndrewJRenko

Achasanai wrote: »

Fair enough, but I was talking more of mounting the curb to cycle on the footpath.

Sorry if I was snappy, and yeah, I do see cyclists on the footpath too. It's often a good indicator of pretty bad road/driving conditions, where people have literally been scared off the road.



And let's not give drivers a free pass when it comes to pavements. Those cars, vans and trucks that we on pavements all the time are not dropped in by helicopter. They drive there.


https://twitter.com/search?f=images&vertical=default&q=%23makewayday&src=typd

Bobblehats

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Sorry if I was snappy, and yeah, I do see cyclists on the footpath too.

I had one of those cross my path, it that it was all rather sudden and by the time I’d reached up to feel what all the commotion was he was a good 30 yards ahead of me leering back twirling my merino knit it on his finger.

Achasanai

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Sorry if I was snappy, and yeah, I do see cyclists on the footpath too. It's often a good indicator of pretty bad road/driving conditions, where people have literally been scared off the road.



And let's not give drivers a free pass when it comes to pavements. Those cars, vans and trucks that we on pavements all the time are not dropped in by helicopter. They drive there.


https://twitter.com/search?f=images&vertical=default&q=%23makewayday&src=typd

Oh I absolutely agree re parking on the curb: I see it often and it is very annoying (and more than just annoying for someone in a wheelchair/with a buggy/on a busy road), but I used 'mounting the curb' as shorthand for cycling on the footpath.


I agree too, that I see instances of cyclists mounting the curb due to bad road design/protecting themselves from bad driving but, like with 'breaking' red lights on a pedestrian green, I think cyclists should use excessive caution while doing so (I speak as an occasional cyclist myself).

Achasanai

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Are you for real? Seriously, are you for real?

Cars can't break lights on Dawson St or Nassau St?

Doyle's Corner in Phibsborough is another 'good' one. Absolute bedlam during rush hour, cars inching along, but you will often find four or five cars breaking the lights.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vc5VGuJvOVk

Rodin

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Are you for real? Seriously, are you for real?

Cars can't break lights on Dawson St or Nassau St? Would you like me to hang out there some mornings and share the video results with you, showing how one or two or three or four drivers push through on the amber and red lights with every change of lights?

Would you like me to spend some time on Leeson St bridge and show you the number of drivers that break the lights to block the pedestrian/cycle crossing? And yes, you're right that traffic is gridlocked, so it doesn't get them anywhere or save them any time. It just gets them to the back of the next queue of cars a few seconds earlier. But that doesn't stop them driving through red lights, or 'getting stuck' when the green light changes to amber or red (which strangely enough, seems to come as a big surprise to many drivers, as if they've never seen a green light go amber/red before).

The findings from the Luas Red Light camera on Benburb St show that you're talking through your hat Hatrick.

http://kerrycyclingcampaign.org/but-all-drivers-break-the-lights/

88% of red light jumpers at the Luas junction at Benburb St, in the heart of the city, were motorists, not cyclists.

So yes, your question about why you have a clear and obvious personal bias against cyclists is an interesting question. Maybe you'd like to do some introspection on that.

Do cars outnumber cyclists 6:1 ?
I'd say the ratio is higher.

Therefore an individual cyclist is actually more likely to break a red than a motorist.

AndrewJRenko

Rodin wrote: »

Do cars outnumber cyclists 6:1 ?
I'd say the ratio is higher.

Therefore an individual cyclist is actually more likely to break a red than a motorist.

Why is the ratio relevant? If you want to improve safety, do you focus on 88% of the problem or 12% of the problem? Do you focus on the 1-5 tonne vehicles doing 20-120 kmph or the 10 kg vehicles doing 10-20 kmph?

But if you do want to look at ratios, bring in the fact that four out of five drivers break speed limits and the majority of drivers use their phones while driving, and let me know how your ratios are looking.

AndrewJRenko

God Of Time wrote: »

Anyone else have close calls with those delivery bike guys?

I really don't want to get mown down by a Brazilian because some fat cnut was too lazy to cook dinner for himself.

When Deliveroo started out, I used to see their cyclists without lights fairly regularly. I haven't noticed that much recently.



I suppose we can be fairly sure that no-one got mowed down by a delivery bike cyclists, given that it hasn't come up in the news or the media.


It looks like it is far more likely that Brazilian cyclists get mowed down or assaulted than they would mow down someone else;


https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/married-life-only-started-two-months-ago-newlywed-critically-injured-in-bicycle-tragedy-36981805.html


https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/news/they-beat-me-with-a-baseball-bat-deliveroo-man-leaves-ireland-following-vicious-assault-37843054.html

Edgware

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

So you're a bit of a bully then? So brave when behind the wheel or behind the keyboard?

S
Some innocent motorist gets done for dangerous driving because he knocks down some **** of a cyclist in the dark thats not wearing hi vizor has or has no lights on the bike. A little reminder does them no harm

Edgware

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Yes that's expected as you've proven yourself to be a total f*cking arsehole in many threads already

Have you no trees to be hugging?

Paddy Cow

punisher5112 wrote: »

I'm much more annoyed these days with YouTube peddling ads constantly..... It's really really getting to me...

They're trying to push people into paying for the premium no ads service. There will come a time when you have to pay for Youtube.

donvito99

Edgware wrote: »

Have you no trees to be hugging?

There's very few left to hug with the amount of cars being wrapped around them in my area week in week out

Chiparus

donvito99 wrote: »

There's very few left to hug with the amount of cars being wrapped around them in my area week in week out

I hear Dublin connects wants to rip up whats left of them so they can put in an extra lane of motor vehicles.

donvito99

Chiparus wrote: »

I hear Dublin connects wants to rip up whats left of them so they can put in an extra lane of motor vehicles.

They're ripping up trees to maintain the status quo for motorists.

AndrewJRenko

Edgware wrote: »

S
Some innocent motorist gets done for dangerous driving because he knocks down some **** of a cyclist in the dark thats not wearing hi vizor has or has no lights on the bike. A little reminder does them no harm

There's no legal requirement to wear hi-vis. If you need people to wear special industrial clothing on the road to be able to see them, maybe driving is not for you. What's the betting that you're driving a black or navy car around complaining about cyclists not having hi-vis?


And has your scenario ever happened - a driver getting done for dangerous driving because he knocks over a cyclist?


Usually it's the other way round - where a driver knocks over and kills a cyclist with lights and hi-vis, but still manages to walk away without jail;


https://www.thejournal.ie/bus-driver-cyclist-death-4335560-Nov2018/


Or the driver who drives blindly over a cyclist in daylight killing them, because 'the sun blinded them' and they still manage to walk away from jail


http://www.stickybottle.com/latest-news/driver-cyclist-ed-duggan-sun-blinded/


But please do share details of these poor drivers getting convicted?

If you want to remind people of something, have the guts to do it face to face, adult to adult. Stop hiding behind your windscreen bullying people.

Peregrine

Rodin wrote: »

Do cars outnumber cyclists 6:1 ?
I'd say the ratio is higher.

Therefore an individual cyclist is actually more likely to break a red than a motorist.

No, they outnumber cyclists by just 4:1 in the city centre according to the most recent canal cordon count (which Benburb Street falls within). They do get allocated space multiples of that and kill several orders of magnitude more. At Benburb Street, they outnumbered cyclists 7.3:1 when it came to breaking red lights.

I hope this helps.

https://www.nationaltransport.ie/publications/statistics/reports/

Spook_ie

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

It's always funny to see people who drive around with an empty couch and an empty armchair all day complaining about cyclists taking up the all the space. Car occupancy rates in Dublin are around 1.2 people.

Have you given much thought to what happens to traffic when the 56k commuting cyclists switch back to their cars instead?

Lot of people would be liking taxis, buses etc to have that much room as 2 arm chairs and a 3 seater sofa, pure cyclist mis-representation as usual.

Rodin

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Why is the ratio relevant? If you want to improve safety, do you focus on 88% of the problem or 12% of the problem? Do you focus on the 1-5 tonne vehicles doing 20-120 kmph or the 10 kg vehicles doing 10-20 kmph?

But if you do want to look at ratios, bring in the fact that four out of five drivers break speed limits and the majority of drivers use their phones while driving, and let me know how your ratios are looking.

I had a cyclist once run three red lights when I was nearby.
If you want to talk safety, it's that cyclist who will come to grief. Not the motorist. Was right outside a hospital too. At the 4th light I had to give him a bollocking.

AndrewJRenko

Spook_ie wrote: »

Lot of people would be liking taxis, buses etc to have that much room as 2 arm chairs and a 3 seater sofa, pure cyclist mis-representation as usual.

Would this be a more accurate representation?

AndrewJRenko

Rodin wrote: »

I had a cyclist once run three red lights when I was nearby.
If you want to talk safety, it's that cyclist who will come to grief. Not the motorist. Was right outside a hospital too. At the 4th light I had to give him a bollocking.

The road death figures suggest that you're wrong. An awful lot more motorists come to grief than cyclists.



I recently had a taxi driver using his phone seven times in five minutes. He got a fixed charge penalty notice for it in recent weeks, so we'll see whether he pays up or goes to Court where we can all watch the video of him with the phone in his hand.


But we can swap anecdotes till the cows come home if you like. It is motorists that kill and maim on the road.

Rodin

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

The road death figures suggest that you're wrong. An awful lot more motorists come to grief than cyclists.



I recently had a taxi driver using his phone seven times in five minutes. He got a fixed charge penalty notice for it in recent weeks, so we'll see whether he pays up or goes to Court where we can all watch the video of him with the phone in his hand.


But we can swap anecdotes till the cows come home if you like. It is motorists that kill and maim on the road.

From breaking red lights ? Or is the argument being expanded?

Spook_ie

beauf wrote: »

Who cares. Fact is your observations do not mirror factual studies.

Except for the Trinity study that found 98% of cyclists ignore some specified red lights and 60% do so on average of other redlights

https://www.tcd.ie/news_events/articles/60-of-dublins-cyclists-run-red-lights/

AndrewJRenko

Rodin wrote: »

From breaking red lights ? Or is the argument being expanded?

Yes, it's been expanded for quite some time now, if you read the discussions.


Once people noticed that the evidence shows clearly that motorists are the real danger on the road, it expanded fairly swiftly.


If you have any real interest in safety on the road, you'd presumably be happy enough with focusing on what the evidence reveals?

Spook_ie

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

There's no legal requirement to wear hi-vis. If you need people to wear special industrial clothing on the road to be able to see them, maybe driving is not for you. What's the betting that you're driving a black or navy car around complaining about cyclists not having hi-vis?


And has your scenario ever happened - a driver getting done for dangerous driving because he knocks over a cyclist?


Usually it's the other way round - where a driver knocks over and kills a cyclist with lights and hi-vis, but still manages to walk away without jail;


https://www.thejournal.ie/bus-driver-cyclist-death-4335560-Nov2018/


Or the driver who drives blindly over a cyclist in daylight killing them, because 'the sun blinded them' and they still manage to walk away from jail


http://www.stickybottle.com/latest-news/driver-cyclist-ed-duggan-sun-blinded/


But please do share details of these poor drivers getting convicted?

If you want to remind people of something, have the guts to do it face to face, adult to adult. Stop hiding behind your windscreen bullying people.

The first article quoted the driver was convicted, just because they don't have hanging anymore doesn't mean they aren't convicted.

AndrewJRenko

Spook_ie wrote: »

The first article quoted the driver was convicted, just because they don't have hanging anymore doesn't mean they aren't convicted.

I didn't say anything about whether he was convicted or not. He drove his bus over a lady cycling with hi-vis and lights, killing her. He got a suspended sentence.



Is there any other way of killing someone that will avoid jail time?

beauf

Spook_ie wrote: »

Except for the Trinity study that found 98% of cyclists ignore some specified red lights and 60% do so on average of other redlights

https://www.tcd.ie/news_events/articles/60-of-dublins-cyclists-run-red-lights/

That's another commentary suggesting it's a safety issue with no facts to back assertion up.

https://youtu.be/Brh9Dv_5NaA

Spook_ie

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Would this be a more accurate representation?

Not really, seeing as a bus would be around 2.5 meters in width and the majority of cars under 2.0 meters, again with the misrepresentation by you running an anti car/public transport agenda

donvito99

Spook_ie wrote: »

Not really, seeing as a bus would be around 2.5 meters in width and the majority of cars under 2.0 meters, again with the misrepresentation by you running an anti car/public transport agenda

That image perfectly illustrates the situation in Dublin, loads of lanes for cars to make it easier for them to navigate and park, meanwhile only one parallel bus lane carries 9x what one normal lane full of cars does (this is the case on Inns Quay last I read).

Spook_ie

beauf wrote: »

That's another commentary suggesting it's a safety issue with no facts to back assertion up.

https://youtu.be/Brh9Dv_5NaA

You said there was no factual evidence or reports to back up a posters opinion, I say there is and you produce a French YouTube link.

Do you still dispute that posters view of cyclists breaking redlights as often as he thinks they do?

Chiparus

Spook_ie wrote: »

Not really, seeing as a bus would be around 2.5 meters in width and the majority of cars under 2.0 meters, again with the misrepresentation by you running an anti car/public transport agenda

Using Dublin roads for people to coommute by car is a an enormous waste, If they introduced congestion charge like they do in the port tunnel to cross the canals , commuting times would decrease substantially.
https://www.businessinsider.com/cities-going-car-free-ban-2018-12?r=US&IR=T#in-paris-the-first-sunday-of-every-month-is-free-of-cars-2

Spook_ie

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

There's no legal requirement to wear hi-vis. If you need people to wear special industrial clothing on the road to be able to see them, maybe driving is not for you. What's the betting that you're driving a black or navy car around complaining about cyclists not having hi-vis?


And has your scenario ever happened - a driver getting done for dangerous driving because he knocks over a cyclist?


Usually it's the other way round - where a driver knocks over and kills a cyclist with lights and hi-vis, but still manages to walk away without jail;


https://www.thejournal.ie/bus-driver-cyclist-death-4335560-Nov2018/


Or the driver who drives blindly over a cyclist in daylight killing them, because 'the sun blinded them' and they still manage to walk away from jail


http://www.stickybottle.com/latest-news/driver-cyclist-ed-duggan-sun-blinded/


But please do share details of these poor drivers getting convicted?

If you want to remind people of something, have the guts to do it face to face, adult to adult. Stop hiding behind your windscreen bullying people.

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

I didn't say anything about whether he was convicted or not. He drove his bus over a lady cycling with hi-vis and lights, killing her. He got a suspended sentence.



Is there any other way of killing someone that will avoid jail time?

Didn't you, looks to me that is what you said. Many times drivers are charged with careless or dangerous driving just because on conviction they don't have capital punishment doesn't mean they aren't convicted.

Spook_ie

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

I'll ask for the third time: As a person who has never driven a car and walks extensively day in and day out, what reason could I possibly have to dislike cyclists and be ambivalent towards motorists apart from genuine personal experience?

beauf wrote: »

Not that you are making it up. It could be true for your journey or perhaps you're only paying attention to cyclists. Who knows for what reason. Perhaps you only notice people breaking red to green and not green to red. Perhaps your journey has a lot of junctions with lot of cycling traffic. Lots of factors.

beauf wrote: »

Who cares. Fact is your observations do not mirror factual studies.

beauf wrote: »

That's another commentary suggesting it's a safety issue with no facts to back assertion up.

https://youtu.be/Brh9Dv_5NaA

You said there was no factual evidence or reports to back up a posters opinion, I say there is and you produce a French YouTube link.

Do you still dispute that posters view of cyclists breaking redlights as often as he thinks they do?

micar

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Would this be a more accurate representation?

3 car parking spaces at work are designated for bike racks?

How may bikes can fit into the 3 space takes up by bike racks?

Answer: 64

Spook_ie

donvito99 wrote: »

That image perfectly illustrates the situation in Dublin, loads of lanes for cars to make it easier for them to navigate and park, meanwhile only one parallel bus lane carries 9x what one normal lane full of cars does (this is the case on Inns Quay last I read).

But it doesn't because it's visually false, buses are not narrower than standard cars, unless you're trying to make out that all cars are HumVee sized, it's propaganda just like people use in all arguments to enhance a view point

Spook_ie

micar wrote: »

3 car parking spaces at work are designated for bike racks?

How may bikes can fit into the 3 space takes up by bike racks?

Answer: 64

And in relation to a propaganda image, how?

And just out of interest how many bikes are actually there?

donvito99

Spook_ie wrote: »

But it doesn't because it's visually false, buses are not narrower than standard cars, unless you're trying to make out that all cars are HumVee sized, it's propaganda just like people use in all arguments to enhance a view point

Do you go around measuring the proportions of cartoons?

It perfectly "illustrates" the reality that bus lanes and cycle lanes are massively more efficient than lanes that private cars are allowed to use, and yet motorists will give out about said bus and cycle lanes til the cows come home

Spook_ie

Spook_ie wrote: »

And in relation to a propaganda image, how?

And just out of interest how many bikes are actually there?

Mind you i do find it hard to visulise 21 bikes in a parking space

Spook_ie

donvito99 wrote: »

Do you go around measuring the proportions of cartoons?

It perfectly "illustrates" the reality that bus lanes and cycle lanes are massively more efficient than lanes that private cars are allowed to use, and yet motorists will give out about said bus and cycle lanes til the cows come home

I note and I comment when the visual misrepresentation is used as a propaganda tool, or would you have been on the anti german side after WW1

beauf

Spook_ie wrote: »

You said there was no factual evidence or reports to back up a posters opinion, I say there is and you produce a French YouTube link.

Do you still dispute that posters view of cyclists breaking redlights as often as he thinks they do?

I wasn't disputing that cyclists break red lights or frequently. I also said one (unlikely considering the stats) possibility is that he's correct, that no cars break lights just lots of cyclists.

The report in your link doesn't address the issue at all. How ever does imply a safety issue without anything to back it up. Whereas the YouTube video does talk about the safety aspect of breaking red lights.

Ireland is pretty much a joke internationally now about how backward it is not just on cycling. But on a litany of issues. Most people seem happy with that.

Feisar

Cyclists are like dogs, ya don’t swerve.

beauf

Feisar wrote: »

Cyclists are like dogs, ya don’t swerve.

Good auld after hours

https://images.app.goo.gl/zo2SXBCwz4ktrqUK6

Defensive cycling...

Spook_ie

Spook_ie wrote: »

You said there was no factual evidence or reports to back up a posters opinion, I say there is and you produce a French YouTube link.

Do you still dispute that posters view of cyclists breaking redlights as often as he thinks they do?

beauf wrote: »

Who cares. Fact is your observations do not mirror factual studies.

As I said Trinity studies do show his obversations miiror factual studies, I'm not the one who said they didn't

Spook_ie

Feisar wrote: »

Cyclists are like dogs, ya don’t swerve.

Actually when I can, I swerve to avoid dogs, they can easily dent a wing or crack a headlight but then this is AH and I suppose people post all sorts of views.

beauf

Spook_ie wrote: »

As I said Trinity studies do show his obversations miiror factual studies, I'm not the one who said they didn't

It didn't mention cars... or pedestrians. His observations were about cars AND cyclists...and pedestrians. And peak time also.

Keep digging though...

beauf

Spook_ie wrote: »

Actually when I can, I swerve to avoid dogs, they can easily dent a wing or crack a headlight but then this is AH and I suppose people post all sorts of views.

So when you feel like it you don't basically.

But I'm impressed so many dogs have learnt to cycle.

beauf

One More Toy wrote: »

Why do they never ...adhere to road signs/traffic lights?

Not sticky enough...

Duckjob

Edgware wrote: »

I quite enjoy roaring at some gob****e on his/her bike with no lights or hi viz. Or just as I pass give them a great blast of the horn.

Stop it. You're making me wet as I tremble for your uber manliness. Seriously.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Edgware wrote: »

I quite enjoy roaring at some gob****e on his/her bike with no lights or hi viz. Or just as I pass give them a great blast of the horn.

And what happens when that cyclist who is bigger, meaner and nastier than you dismounts and approaches you when you're stuck in your car at a red light?.

Do you fertilize your pants?.

Duckjob

Dean Loose Spaceship wrote: »

And what happens when that cyclist who is bigger, meaner and nastier than you dismounts and approaches you when you're stuck in your car at a red light?.

Do you fertilize your pants?.

Tail between the legs and run (drive) away fast.

Intimating unprotected people whilst encased in 2 tonnes of metal and using your vehicle to make a speedy getaway if it looks like someone who would kick his arse. You really can't get more manly than that.

Chiparus

Dean Loose Spaceship wrote: »

And what happens when that cyclist who is bigger, meaner and nastier than you dismounts and approaches you when you're stuck in your car at a red light?.

Do you fertilize your pants?.

While engaging the central lock😷

YFlyer

Spook_ie wrote: »

Not really, seeing as a bus would be around 2.5 meters in width and the majority of cars under 2.0 meters, again with the misrepresentation by you running an anti car/public transport agenda

Lol. Length is the issue.