Campaign for four-day working week officially launches in Ireland

lleti

B-D-P-- wrote: »

I'm pretty sure we'd enjoy more family days, and time to relax and recharge.
We've moved on greatly from the 70's in ireland, come join us wont you.

I don't understand this thinking there'd be more family days...

Working 9-7 during the week would mean there'd be little time for doing much else once you have a gym session, dinner done. So no meeting up with friends during the week.

And people only meeting family generally 1 day on a weekend anyways, they could have more family days already.

c.p.w.g.w

Quin_Dub wrote: »

But the expectation is that the reduced hours would pay for themselves in increased productivity due to happier/healthier workers offsetting the lost time along with reduced illness and the like.

How does a Bus driver become more productive , or someone flipping burgers in McDonalds?

Also - If there was a way for companies to be 20% more efficient with the staff they have , they'd already have found it.

I'm not saying it wouldn't be nice or that it wouldn't be beneficial to the workforce , but I just don't see this as anything other than increased cost which companies will not take on

Well we're I work there are 13.5 hours we trade that are better off closed. We could open later and close earlier most of the week. Could use a lot of that time for admin and also our team focus on sales. That's how my place could be more productive, literally done a trail run a few years back. We increased sales, improved our admin compliance and increased numerous KPI's. But the company used it as stick to beat us, "why can't you deliver that while open longer"

Mrs OBumble

Some factories in Galway already do short hours on Friday. I've been told that it's a hang-over from the days when workers were paid by cheque, and how to get out early one day a week to get to the bank to cash it.

In extreme cases, people are working 9 hours for 4 days per week, and 4 hours on Friday. Some places the difference is a bit less. But when annual leave is measured in hours, this means that you either get 40 Friday's off, or a bit less than 20 other days of the week (ok, no one quite takes 40 Fridays, but the idea of a whole days leave for the "price" of a half days leave holds).

In these places, it would probably suit the company nicely to get rid of the Friday totally. Some would happily move to a full time shift doing 4 days/week, and a part time shift covering the other 3. (I'm not sure how DEASP would feel about the latter!)

NIMAN

People need to see past the headline.

You'd be expected to do the same hours, except in 4 days instead of 5.

So get ready for longer days if you want 3 off instead of 2.

mariaalice

How would it work for nurses, doctors and care worker, they are 365 days a year working situations.

salmocab

I’ve recently started doing 3 12hour days a week. It’s great, less commuting days and the early start and late finish mean PT is reasonably quiet. Extra time for doing bits and can collect kids early from crèche for swimming etc.
Downside is on those 3 days I pretty much don’t see the kids, maybe the older fella for a half hour before he goes to bed but the pay off for quality time makes that worth it. 12 hour days are long though and can be quite tiring.

Leg End Reject

I'd happily work 3 very long days, it's not as if most of us do much after work. 4 days a week to myself would be great.

Homelander

I used to work 4 days, two 12 hour shifts and two 9 hour shifts. It was brilliant to be honest, having the 3 days off is so much better. I'd very happily work extra hours on the 4 days to go back to that.

Mrs OBumble

mariaalice wrote: »

How would it work for nurses, doctors and care worker, they are 365 days a year working situations.

Many hospital nurses already work 3 or 4 x 12 hours shifts per week.

Lots of jobs provide extended cover and not a 5 day week anyway. Lots already offer combinations of hours based on what workers want.

seamus

ixoy wrote: »

Are 35 hour weeks common? I've a 40 hour week, so that's a 10 hour day, not including lunch, each day. That's very long.

37.5 is the typical in my experience. 9-5:30 with an hour for lunch.

Total non-runner for the overwhelming majority of industries and jobs.

I dunno. I've never come across a company that doesn't have a lot of downtime. You very rarely come across anyone who's flat out from the time they clock in until they clock out. I'm not going to claim this is the majority, but I'd be surprised if half of all companies couldn't implement a four day week to some extent.

Ultimately the goal should not be here to create a new "standard" week. The days of a standard working week are coming to an end. The goal here should be to get companies to be more open to considering alternative arrangements, be they 4-day weeks, 3-day weeks, home working, etc.

We're at the point now where the realities of life don't really slot into a five-day, 9-5 week. So the companies that learn to be more flexible and allow employees to drive their own schedules, at the ones that'll attract the best people.

Sonics2k

I worked a four day working week for years in an old job, and it was fantastic.

Yes, the longer days could be a drag at times, but realistically it worked out much better. At the time I did Tuesday to Friday, which meant I had Monday to do all the things I'd have a trickier time doing, such as going to the bank or arranging car/bike insurance, doctors appointments without booking a full day off etc.

It also meant I could bring my daughter, then just a toddler to pre-school and collect her myself and spend a lot more time with her. It meant I could do the weekly shop while she was at school and not waste what time I had having to drag her around with me.

My previous job was actively reviewing moving to a four day week and the trial ran proved the staff on it were far more efficient and happy in their roles for the four month run, however the client we represented in my office decided against it for no real reason at all, they just didn't like it. However in the other offices they did approve it and the four day system is still in place and people absolutely love it, as well as having some of the highest stats across the business.

My current job is considering it, however given the basis of the actual job itself it's hard to arrange.

c.p.w.g.w

Sonics2k wrote: »

I worked a four day working week for years in an old job, and it was fantastic.

Yes, the longer days could be a drag at times, but realistically it worked out much better. At the time I did Tuesday to Friday, which meant I had Monday to do all the things I'd have a trickier time doing, such as going to the bank or arranging car/bike insurance, doctors appointments without booking a full day off etc.

It also meant I could bring my daughter, then just a toddler to pre-school and collect her myself and spend a lot more time with her. It meant I could do the weekly shop while she was at school and not waste what time I had having to drag her around with me.

My previous job was actively reviewing moving to a four day week and the trial ran proved the staff on it were far more efficient and happy in their roles for the four month run, however the client we represented in my office decided against it for no real reason at all, they just didn't like it. However in the other offices they did approve it and the four day system is still in place and people absolutely love it, as well as having some of the highest stats across the business.

My current job is considering it, however given the basis of the actual job itself it's hard to arrange.

I did a half day a few weeks back to cover a colleague, and got the same amount of work done as I'd normally do in an 8 hour shift. Didn't have to break my back doing it neither. Currently in work and have spent most of my day playing Football Manager and on boards. Will have the football on at 2. We get very few customers on Sundays and there is 3 of us here, barely need 1 of us on. It's only retail today, no b2b stuff

suicide_circus

how will this work with customer facing roles?

seamus

suicide_circus wrote: »

how will this work with customer facing roles?

Honestly a lot of places could close between 10 and 3 Monday to Friday and customers wouldn't be that affected. Most of your consumers are working during those hours anyway. Very rare to hear of a customer facing role that's a 9-5 anymore.

A four day week would be easy for customer facing roles because so many are open 7 days anyway.

The supermarket beside me for example is open 7am to 10pm, 7 days a week. Under an 8 hour working day they need 3 shifts to cover the day; morning, afternoon and part timers at night. With a 10 hour working day you can cover the whole day with two shifts.

Dravokivich

seamus wrote: »

Honestly a lot of places could close between 10 and 3 Monday to Friday and customers wouldn't be that affected. Most of your consumers are working during those hours anyway. Very rare to hear of a customer facing role that's a 9-5 anymore.

A four day week would be easy for customer facing roles because so many are open 7 days anyway.

The supermarket beside me for example is open 7am to 10pm, 7 days a week. Under an 8 hour working day they need 3 shifts to cover the day; morning, afternoon and part timers at night. With a 10 hour working day you can cover the whole day with two shifts.

Customers arent just in shops. Mine tend to be in their office when they need me.

seamus

I'm guessing by "customer-facing" though he generally means ones where people ring or call in when the place is open.

Any road, it doesn't really matter; unless you're under contract then it's not important that your work schedule matches your customers' exactly. There are only so many hours in a week, so there will always be some overlap in which to engage them.

Like I say above, the goal shouldn't be a compete conversion to a 4 day week but rather a recognition that there's no real need for a hard five day schedule any more.

Most customer facing roles which are 9-5 Mon-Fri are like that because that's what their customers are doing. When customers stop doing that, the customer facing roles won't need it either.

shesty

Customer facing you could let people choose their four days, within reason.So you would always have staff present.Probably not much different to arranging shifts etc.

I work a four day week at the moment.Works brilliantly.Three day weekend is good for me, my kids and my employer (I am not jumping ship for at least ten years!!!!).I am far more efficient in work and I work an 8 hour day -fully, with no dossing!!!Life happens even when you have a job, employers have to accept this (thankfully many have).The days of being chained to a desk 9-5 are gone, especially if you have kids and both parents work (as the tax man likes us to...)

Time was that there was nothing open on a Sunday in this country and we all survived, so why couldn't we survive a four day week?

4068ac1elhodqr

In the UK Labour are recommending this (4day max) with costs of 100bn or so, however ( conviniently) in small print they say it'll take 12yrs i.e. multiple terms without the Torys.

More likely is Yang for POTUS20, who will supports P-T or gig/enterprise with his Freedom Dividend.

Eric Cartman

AulWan wrote: »

I have yet to meet one single person who reduced their number of working days who says they use their extra time off to get pissed.

Most of these arrangements are made for family commitments.

thats the people who have made this arrangement to suit a need, if we just as a nation transitioned to it, you best believe me and the others who don't have a need for it will be propping up the bar.

LoughNeagh2017

I'd rather not work at all but I would prefer to work three 12 hour shifts in a row or three 10 hour shifts even if I get less money.

Working will be the reason my neck will be tied to a tree in an Ulster forest when I'm in my 50s, 60s. At that age if you are a single man you have no reason to keep on living in this grim world and you would be faced with another 10 years of work until you get a pension if you are lucky.

What I plan to do in 25-30 years is to apply for disability payments for depression and if they refuse I wlll get everything in order for the grave.

Plopsu

LoughNeagh2017 wrote: »

I'd rather not work at all but I would prefer to work three 12 hour shifts in a row or three 10 hour shifts even if I get less money.

Working will be the reason my neck will be tied to a tree in an Ulster forest when I'm in my 50s, 60s. At that age if you are a single man you have no reason to keep on living in this grim world and you would be faced with another 10 years of work until you get a pension if you are lucky.

What I plan to do in 25-30 years is to apply for disability payments for depression and if they refuse I wlll get everything in order for the grave.

There is as much to live for in your fifties as there ever was. If you're having thoughts like these you need to talk to somebody face to face.

salonfire

mariaalice wrote: »

How would it work for nurses, doctors and care worker, they are 365 days a year working situations.

Lol, that's what nurses would have you believe.

After doing their night shifts, they have a full week off after on top of annual leave.

On the night shift they work half the hours as the rest of us do over the two week period.

Luis21

Forsa want a 4 day week ?

They cant even negotiate a reversal of the 7.24 back to 6.57 week for ****s sake. Apart from income continuence what do Forsa actually do for their members?

The Haddington Road and Lansdowne Road agreements were such a con. Why pay union dues whilst those agreements are in place?

AulWan

Luis21 wrote: »

Forsa want a 4 day week ?

They cant even negotiate a reversal of the 7.24 back to 6.57 week for ****s sake. Apart from income continuence what do Forsa actually do for their members?

The Haddington Road and Lansdowne Road agreements were such a con. Why pay union dues whilst those agreements are in place?

They did "negotiate" a reversal - only reverting to those hours comes with an additional 5% pay cut and a knock on effect on your annual leave entitlement and service record (which affects your pension) none of which was ever mentioned would be a factor at the time of the increase.

margo321

Looking at it from an employer's point of view its just outrageous. Why stop at 4, go for 3 days.

Captain_Crash

I work a 4 day week and have done for years and can honestly say its amazing. I work 10 hour days, which from a fatigue perspective are not much different to an 8hr day but you adjust to it pretty quick. Because I'm coming in a bit earlier I skip rush hour in the mornings. Others work later and skip rush hour on the way home in the evening.

Other benefits are the longer weekend leaves me recharged and fresher and thus more productive when I am working meaning more bonuses and pay rises. I save on petrol and lunch expenses one day a week which adds up, if I want to take a 10 day holiday I only need to take 4 days annual leave & bank holidays are 4 day weekends by default to name but a few.

I can guarantee you if you go from a 5 day to a 4 day, you'll never want to go back to the 5.

Quin_Dub

Captain_Crash wrote: »

I work a 4 day week and have done for years and can honestly say its amazing. I work 10 hour days, which from a fatigue perspective are not much different to an 8hr day but you adjust to it pretty quick. Because I'm coming in a bit earlier I skip rush hour in the mornings. Others work later and skip rush hour on the way home in the evening.

Other benefits are the longer weekend leaves me recharged and fresher and thus more productive when I am working meaning more bonuses and pay rises. I save on petrol and lunch expenses one day a week which adds up, if I want to take a 10 day holiday I only need to take 4 days annual leave & bank holidays are 4 day weekends by default to name but a few.

I can guarantee you if you go from a 5 day to a 4 day, you'll never want to go back to the 5.

Which is perfectly fine and lots of people do similar things - 4X10 , 3X12 etc. and it works extremely well in a whole host of industries.

But that is not what is being asked for here - The suggestion here is to simply reduce the number of hours whilst retaining the same total pay.

e.g. 32hrs work for 40 hours pay.

The logic being that people will somehow be magically 20& more efficient because of the extra time off thereby delivering a win win all round , entirely missing the point that lots of businesses would now have to hire more people to cover those missing hours , driving up costs and decreasing margins and that's before you get into discussing how exactly an extra day off per week actually makes you 20% more efficient...

It's a non-runner.

AulWan

Captain_Crash wrote: »

I work a 4 day week and have done for years and can honestly say its amazing. I work 10 hour days, which from a fatigue perspective are not much different to an 8hr day but you adjust to it pretty quick. Because I'm coming in a bit earlier I skip rush hour in the mornings. Others work later and skip rush hour on the way home in the evening.

Other benefits are the longer weekend leaves me recharged and fresher and thus more productive when I am working meaning more bonuses and pay rises. I save on petrol and lunch expenses one day a week which adds up, if I want to take a 10 day holiday I only need to take 4 days annual leave & bank holidays are 4 day weekends by default to name but a few.

I can guarantee you if you go from a 5 day to a 4 day, you'll never want to go back to the 5.

Same.

Luis21

AulWan wrote: »

They did "negotiate" a reversal - only reverting to those hours comes with an additional 5% pay cut and a knock on effect on your annual leave entitlement and service record (which affects your pension) none of which was ever mentioned would be a factor at the time of the increase.

The reversal cost you money ffs. Thats not a reversal.



They are a bunch of chancers.

ArnoldJRimmer

I think flexible working arrangements should be at least looked at by employers. There's no 'one size fits all' but an array of options which could work. And in some instances, none at all

In my workplace, there are people who work 4 days out of 5, or 9 days out of 10, with their hours adjusted so that they receive full pay. There are others, such as those with young children, who have taken a temporary pay cut to work shorter hours for a few years. Others such as myself, work from home one or two days a week, which makes a huge difference.

I work for a large organisation, so there are enough staff to keep the place open for five days and organise everyone into designated days, so that won't necessarily work for smaller companies. If its feasible to only operate for four days a week, then great