RWC 2019 Ireland v Japan Match Thread: Group A - Sat 28th Sep 08:15 Shizuoka

mistermiyagi

It's okay to lose to opponent. It's never okay to lose to fear.

Portsalon

OnTheCouch wrote: »

.... anyone who thinks that Japan will stroll through their remaining fixtures may be mistaken in the next few weeks.

Would that apply to Ireland too?

Portsalon

I'm as unhappy with the Irish performance as the next man (or woman, or transgender bender) but these player ratings really take the biscuit.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/international/japan-19-ireland-12-how-the-ireland-team-rated-in-shizuoka-1.4034001

FrancieBrady

Portsalon wrote: »

Would that apply to Ireland too?

Always did to anyone with a real knowledge of rugby and the history of this tournament.

There is confidence and arrogance, we, as a team, were confident but never arrogant. The rest of the games will, like this one was, will be treated with respect by the team.

joseywhales

Come on, let it all out, I know works been tough lately but now's your chance eviscerate some guy you've never met in your life for not winning a rugby match. Feed the sweet sweet pain.

False Prophet

Portsalon wrote: »

I'm as unhappy with the Irish performance as the next man (or woman, or transgender bender) but these player ratings really take the biscuit.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/international/japan-19-ireland-12-how-the-ireland-team-rated-in-shizuoka-1.4034001

They are generous alright.
Earl's I'd give an extra point as showed great heart to prevent the runaway try.

Portsalon

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Always did to anyone with a real knowledge of rugby and the history of this tournament.

I hadn't realised that you were acquainted with such an individual. Might I suggest that henceforth you pay much more attention to his (or her) wise words?

mistermiyagi

No such thing as bad student, only bad teacher.
Teacher say, student do.

Cork Boy 53

OnTheCouch wrote: »

Scotland could easily beat Japan. For one, they are a lot better than they showed against Ireland and Japan probably aren't as good as they appeared today. In a lot of ways, Japan had everything in their favour earlier, home advantage, absolutely no pressure, the high humidity, not having particularly sparkled in their first game, one or two contentious refereeing decisions going their way etc.

Plus as much as I think Ireland did not in the slightest disrespect Japan, it is fair to say that to some degree they were complacent. Perhaps not all the players, but collectively yes, as much as Japan played well, Ireland just looked not that focused at times.

Even when you consider that the management attempts to always ensure players' heads are in the right place for a game, when you take all the above factors into consideration, plus the fact that Ireland had never lost to Japan before, this is a huge factor which hasn't been mentioned much in my opinion, the "we have never lost to you , why would we start today?' mentality can easily set in.

Samoa could also cause an upset as well, so anyone who thinks Japan will stroll through their remaining fixtures may be mistaken in the next few weeks.

Whatever about refereeing decisions, Japan will have home advantage and high humidity in the rest of the pool matches as well. Scotland will be affected by that as much as Ireland were. Anyway we will see what happens when the Scots play Samoa on Monday. At this point I would say the outcome of that match is 50/50.

Burkie1203

Portsalon wrote: »

I'm as unhappy with the Irish performance as the next man (or woman, or transgender bender) but these player ratings really take the biscuit.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/international/japan-19-ireland-12-how-the-ireland-team-rated-in-shizuoka-1.4034001

Why?

I Think they are accurate. Today was crap. I think Joe referenced the turnaround time a bit yet starts the same pack instead of making a few changes which certainly wouldn't weaken the team.

Beirne at 6 and maybe starting Kilcoyne as two examples.

FrancieBrady

Portsalon wrote: »

I'm as unhappy with the Irish performance as the next man (or woman, or transgender bender) but these player ratings really take the biscuit.

https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/rugby/international/japan-19-ireland-12-how-the-ireland-team-rated-in-shizuoka-1.4034001

Not far off the mark if a little generous. The low marks are were the game was lost.

Portsalon

joseywhales wrote: »

Come on, let it all out, I know works been tough lately but now's your chance eviscerate some guy you've never met in your life for not winning a rugby match. Feed the sweet sweet pain.

Thanks.

Bofelli is a complete w*nker for missing that long range penalty.

Portsalon

Burkie1203 wrote: »

Why? I Think they are accurate.

I suppose it depends on whether one starts at 10 and marks down, or at 0 and marks up.

baas baa

irishbucsfan wrote: »

The attacking kicking made complete sense to me and we should have done far more of it imo

Great to see Carty having the confidence to play what's in front of him especially considering the Midas touch he's had with his kicking this year. But when the camera panned out after he kicked the penalty I couldn't believe how marginal an opportunity it was, the Japanese had it well covered with 2 players in the vicinity, had that kick being even slightly misdirected it could easily have led to 7 points the other way. It was a bit too maverick.

blinding

First well done Japan , deserved winners .

Out of curiosity was the Ref particularly hard on Ireland today . I’m no expert but we certainly did not seem to get the ‘ rub of the green ‘ on decisions today .

Have we an impartial rule geek to give his / her opinions ?

ErnestBorgnine

mistermiyagi wrote: »

It's okay to lose to opponent. It's never okay to lose to fear.

Good thing they lost to Japan so, gave them a right beating

FrancieBrady

Portsalon wrote: »

I hadn't realised that you were acquainted with such an individual. Might I suggest that henceforth you pay much more attention to his (or her) wise words?

You haven't the wherewithal to even assess player rankings properly. Stabbing yourself in a frenzy to stab others isn't an edifying sight.

Clegg

The rating for VdF is harsh. He was good in the first half and while he faded as the game went in, he at least made some impact. Thought after Ryan he was out best forward. Not that it means that much.

Ringrose, Ryan and Farrell were the pick of the bunch.

blinding

Is Henderson an 80 minute international player ?

Rockbeast2

"Is Henderson an 80 minute international player ?"

It's just not stopping, is it?

Portsalon

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You haven't the wherewithal to even assess player rankings properly. Stabbing yourself in a frenzy to stab others isn't an edifying sight.

You'd be better off sticking to posting pro-IRA sh1te elsewhere on Boards, Francie - you're so far out of your depth in this thread that it's not even amusing.

joseywhales

Rockbeast2 wrote: »

"Is Henderson an 80 minute international player ?"

It's just not stopping, is it?

I was dissapointed but these threads are at least adding some humour.

FrancieBrady

Portsalon wrote: »

You'd be better off sticking to posting pro-IRA sh1te elsewhere on Boards, Francie - you're so far out of your depth in this thread that it's not even amusing.

:D:D:D:D:D:D a beaten docket is a beaten docket.

blinding

Rockbeast2 wrote: »

"Is Henderson an 80 minute international player ?"

It's just not stopping, is it?

He probably has the ability to be an International Player .

But he does not have the physical body fitness to play 80 minutes . Some players do not have the physical body ability to play 80 minutes .

Its tough and fast out there . It certainly looks like he cannot last 80 minutes .

False Prophet

False Prophet wrote: »

They are generous alright.
Earl's I'd give an extra point as showed great heart to prevent the runaway try.

Yeah, he did well to get back, but it's absolutely shocking that he wasn't penalised. He never released the tackled man, then proceeded to try to play the ball.

Rockbeast2

"He probably has the ability to be an International Player ."

I shouldn't bother typing a response to this.

Weepsie

Very few of them looked like 80mins was possible today. They likely would never have played in that type of heat though you'd think.

It was a leveller. Something to be said for heading out to Japan earlier maybe, but last week the weather was torrential rain so they can't prepare for every element.


Might have been a game to try a different 15, try a quick game with the fastest and fittest of player and get scores on the boards and then bring on the senior heads to game manage.


Missed someone like sexton being a nuisance to the ref too. Murray gave up after Gardner allowed the 7 stand over the ball. I think a few heads dropped that moment

blinding

Rockbeast2 wrote: »

"He probably has the ability to be an International Player ."

I shouldn't bother typing a response to this.

His body shape/ fitness is not at the level of other top tier International Second Rows .

He has a long record of injuries and this shows . He is certainly not fit enough to play 80 minutes against good teams .

walshb

I think Scotland can beat Japan..

We win our remaining games, and top the group!

blinding

Weepsie wrote: »

Very few of them looked like 80mins was possible today. They likely would never have played in that type of heat though you'd think.

It was a leveller. Something to be said for heading out to Japan earlier maybe, but last week the weather was torrential rain so they can't prepare for every element.


Might have been a game to try a different 15, try a quick game with the fastest and fittest of player and get scores on the boards and then bring on the senior heads to game manage.


Missed someone like sexton being a nuisance to the ref too. Murray gave up after Gardner allowed the 7 stand over the ball. I think a few heads dropped that moment

Probably no harm to drop Murray for the next game . He looks like a fella that needs a kick in the ar$e .

Rockbeast2

"He is certainly not fit enough to play 80 minutes against good teams ."

HA HA HA

Thanks for the laugh! I needed that after this morning's result!

Heres Johnny

Is Joe Schmidts record as Irish boss any better than his 2 predecessors Kidney and O Sullivan?
I'll concede the 2 wins against all blacks is unprecedented but what of his overall win/loss record? Anyone know the stats?
I just don't think he's the maestro many make him out to be in the media.

FrancieBrady

Basil3 wrote: »

Yeah, he did well to get back, but it's absolutely shocking that he wasn't penalised. He never released the tackled man, then proceeded to try to play the ball.

Looked at it there again and his two hands let go and went either side of player.

FrancieBrady

Weepsie wrote: »

Very few of them looked like 80mins was possible today. They likely would never have played in that type of heat though you'd think.

It was a leveller. Something to be said for heading out to Japan earlier maybe, but last week the weather was torrential rain so they can't prepare for every element.


Might have been a game to try a different 15, try a quick game with the fastest and fittest of player and get scores on the boards and then bring on the senior heads to game manage.


Missed someone like sexton being a nuisance to the ref too. Murray gave up after Gardner allowed the 7 stand over the ball. I think a few heads dropped that moment

Ref told Murray to let it go at one stage...he did immediately but got a penalty against him anyway. 3 points to Japan.

We got decisions like that against us all day. **** happens, annoying in a tight game.

FrancieBrady

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Looked at it there again and his two hands let go and went either side of player.

Come on...he could pinged for so many things there. Even if what you say is true (which I don't believe, because he's never not in contact with the tackled man), a ruck had formed since there were 2 Irish players there, and he was never supporting his weight on his feet while he's scrambling around to grab the ball.

blinding

Rockbeast2 wrote: »

"He is certainly not fit enough to play 80 minutes against good teams ."

HA HA HA

Thanks for the laugh! I needed that after this morning's result!

Henderson is not as fit or capable ( probably due to his historic injuries , they are many ) as his opponents especially against the better teams . He can’t play 80 minutes at that level . Why did Schmidt not replace him today . It doesn’t say much for the possible replacements .

Former Former

Heres Johnny wrote: »

Is Joe Schmidts record as Irish boss any better than his 2 predecessors Kidney and O Sullivan?
I'll concede the 2 wins against all blacks is unprecedented but what of his overall win/loss record? Anyone know the stats?
I just don't think he's the maestro many make him out to be in the media.

Yes. His win ratio is the best we've ever had.

Croohur

As Incredibly frustrated and disappointed as I am , I would just like to commend the Japanese team and management on what happened today, irrespective of how Ireland SHOULD have responded. I believed before the game that they would let this game go to a certain extent and concentrate on beating Scotland and taking the second place spot.
I thought Leitch starting on the bench was to bring him on in case the game was getting away slightly from Japan, not to finish us off.
To target us as they did with that gameplan, and win, is an amazing achievement. I wonder was the plan always to try and top the group, especially after seeing NZ beat SA, as they have that experience of beating SA already...

Anyway, I thought being a bit magnanimous to our victors would calm me down. No. Hasnt worked.

Podge_irl

Heres Johnny wrote: »

Is Joe Schmidts record as Irish boss any better than his 2 predecessors Kidney and O Sullivan?
I'll concede the 2 wins against all blacks is unprecedented but what of his overall win/loss record? Anyone know the stats?
I just don't think he's the maestro many make him out to be in the media.

Phenomenally better. Thanks for asking.

joseywhales

I'm not sure if this game any material impact on our chances of progressing deep into the world cup.

In fact you could argue that low injuries and citations were more important than the result.

awec

blinding wrote: »

Henderson is not as fit or capable ( probably due to his historic injuries , they are many ) as his opponents especially against the better teams . He can’t play 80 minutes at that level . Why did Schmidt not replace him today . It doesn’t say much for the possible replacements .

He was replaced...

blinding

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Ref told Murray to let it go at one stage...he did immediately but got a penalty against him anyway. 3 points to Japan.

We got decisions like that against us all day. **** happens, annoying in a tight game.

It doesn’t look good bitchin when you lose but I thought we got a hard ride from that ref today .:eek:

Simms

thebaz wrote: »

The RTE live player is dreadfull, just keeps buffering -

Yep, same last week. What a bunch of amateurs. Maybe they should dock the salaries of that tit Tubridy and the rest of the prima donnas and invest iin some decent technicans

blinding

awec wrote: »

He was replaced...

Who replaced him and how much time left . His replacement must have been auditioning for the invisible man .

Devon Toner must be getting Taller in Temper :eek:

NewRed2

To start at the end and work backwards, I was a bit disappointed at the time that we kicked it and accepted the bonus point loss. But now that I've digested it all a bit, it was probably the smart thing to do. We hadn't scored for an hour so why would we suddenly score a try from our own end line at that stage? More likely than that would be the Japanese scoring again as their tails were up big time.
So it was probably the correct decision, made quite well in the heat of battle.
It was a poor display but that 2nd half performance (in particular) by Japan was outstanding. I was ok-ish about things at half time to be honest. We weren't great 1st half but I didn't see us losing at that stage. It was really the 2nd half where we fluffed our lines and Japan took full advantage to be fair.
To be fair to Joe he pointed out during the week that the short turnaround from the Scottish game to this one was a concern. Add to that the stifling humidity and little wonder we looked out on our feet whereas Japan looked like they could have kept going for another half hour. Emptying our subs bench made sense under the circumstances but it had no effect because we bizarrely just kept repeatedly giving Japan the ball back all 2nd half and that just made things go from bad to worse and played into their hands. That was the real killer, not the ref or anything else.

It's a hard one to take, full credit to Japan. But it's turned a hugely promising situation in the pool and potentially very difficult quarter final against SA into what's now a worrying situation in the pool and a probable mammoth task against NZ.
I think Japan will just about beat the Scots so I think we'll be 2nd and wouldn't give us a prayer against New Zealand personally.
Hope I'm wrong....

blinding

Simms wrote: »

Yep, same last week. What a bunch of amateurs. Maybe they should dock the salaries of that tit Tubridy and the rest of the prima donnas and invest iin some decent technicans

Never expect too much from RTE Royalty :eek:

awec

blinding wrote: »

Who replaced him and how much time left . His replacement must have been auditioning for the invisible man .

Devon Toner must be getting Taller in Temper :eek:

Tadhg Beirne replaced him with 15 minutes to go.

Ryan and Henderson are, IMO, better than Beirne and Kleyn by a distance, so it's not surprising they waited as long as possible to make that sub. As for whether or not Henderson is a 80 minute man, I believe he can be. But given he plays beside James Ryan, who is a freak when it comes to fitness, I reckon Henderson is told by the coaches to go and empty the tank in 60 minutes.

FrancieBrady

Basil3 wrote: »

Come on...he could pinged for so many things there. Even if what you say is true (which I don't believe, because he's never not in contact with the tackled man), a ruck had formed since there were 2 Irish players there, and he was never supporting his weight on his feet while he's scrambling around to grab the ball.

Earls releases, player lets ball go, Earls gets up and comes through and plays the loose ball. Not seeing much wrong there tbh.

snotboogie

Heres Johnny wrote: »

Is Joe Schmidts record as Irish boss any better than his 2 predecessors Kidney and O Sullivan?
I'll concede the 2 wins against all blacks is unprecedented but what of his overall win/loss record? Anyone know the stats?
I just don't think he's the maestro many make him out to be in the media.

Kidney has a better RWC record for sure, this loss cements that. Schmidt has the best six nations record but he has benefited massively from the total capitulation of French rugby

Burkie1203

snotboogie wrote: »

Kidney has a better RWC record for sure, this loss cements that. Schmidt has the best six nations record but he has benefited massively from the total capitulation of French rugby

Kidney RWC record very much the same as anyone else's