Buying house in rural area, is it cruel on childen

Darc19

Rural life is quite different to urban life.

Cons - you need the car, you'll be using taxis if you like to go out and have a few drinks, very little in walking distance, you won't be chatting with neighbors on a daily basis, probably no natural gas, possibly a septic tank.


Pros
Peace and quiet. Rare to have issues with neighbors, more space, connection with nature, neighbors look out for each other more, you'll find a lot of shared lifts available for kids activities.

I used to live in urban Dublin, then rural Cork (work related) , now just moved to rural Kildare and love it. For a few months after moving from Cork we lived in rental house in Kill whilst waiting on the purchase to go through on the new house.

Lovely house, lovely neighbors, but we pined for the peace and tranquility of a rural house which we moved into a little while ago.

SuperS54

I grew up in a rural area, probably best childhood you can give your kids. Am living in a very urbanised area now and feel I'm doing my own kids a huge injustice. Seriously looking at packing in a good job to move to a rural area for their sake.

Wanderer78

Wanderer78 wrote: »

I don't think this act is cruel at all, in fact it could very well be the best thing for your family, be prepared to do a lot of driving though. Best of luck with it

If you look at the bigger picture, the mum/dad taxi is only for a few short years!

Wanderer78

Deleted User wrote: »

If you look at the bigger picture, the mum/dad taxi is only for a few short years!

thats true i guess, but i have met people who eventually couldnt take the taxiing duties no more, and moved back to retirement as urbanites, i think its a very personal decision, and in the ops case, they may have to suck it and see

CelticRambler

Myself, reared in suburban Dublin, moved the children to "middle-of-nowhere" France. Best thing I ever did for the children.

nutjobb wrote: »

Just an observation from my own experience. Out of my group of friends we were all country lads and now art age 29 I can say it's clear that compared to the guys from the town we turned out a lot more successful in terms of jobs/careers.

Exactly what I've observed in my own children, which (having discussed this within the family) we put down to two things:
(1) rural children are expected to help out a lot more with all kinds of what you might call "real" work to make things happen, in the home environment aswell as in the wider community. I hadn't thought of this at all until SonNo.1 remarked on the difference he saw between the country and townie teens who were mixed together in secondary school.
(2) country children socialise with a wider age-range than their townie peers simply because there are fewer individuals of the same age around. This means that they have a natural access to older/more experienced people and (imo) are less hesitant to look for (or reject!) help and guidance when they get to young adulthood.

LirW wrote: »

Depending on where you live and what activities your kids wanna do you will be signing up to be a taxi service until they're driving themselves. I spend a good chunk of the week driving my son around ...

From time-to-time, I look after my sister's suburban children in Dublin. I have never driven as much in the countryside as I do in Dublin. My siblings (and parents) are always in the car, ferrying one or other child from one place to another. Here in the countryside, there's far more car-sharing and logical planning.

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

If you have never lived in the countryside, it will probably be a bigger culture shock to you than for your kids.

Yep!

BarryD2

Deleted User wrote: »

If you look at the bigger picture, the mum/dad taxi is only for a few short years!

Yes, but transport extends to most other facets of life as well - work, shopping, socialising, visiting family, medical appointments and so on. I think that's the big change in Irish rural life in the past few decades. There was a time when many people didn't have a car and/ or even if they did, the majority of their needs were met locally. When we first came to this house about 25 years ago, there were two travelling shops, another three small shops within a couple of miles that have since closed, I can think of three post offices within 5 miles that have gone. If you needed a doctor for any reason, you could get them to do a house visit. Now you may drive to the surgery and wait for a couple of hours even with an appointment. And so on.

Balf

Macha wrote: »

The cost of owning and running an extra car really adds up, plus the environmental impact of driving everywhere is not great.

I think the germ of the issue is here.

The lifestyle depends on the continued availability of affordable private car usage, which isn't a certain assumption.

It's also far from a certain assumption that its feasible for rural housholds to switch en masse to EVs.

So how would the lifestyle work on a bicycle? Would all the elements of the life you expect - work, school, social etc. - be accessible without relatively cheap car transport?

Just a thought, because the cost and availability of these things might be quite different in, say, ten years time.

CelticRambler

Balf wrote: »

So how would the lifestyle work on a bicycle? Would all the elements of the life you expect - work, school, social etc. - be accessible without relatively cheap car transport?

Just a thought, because the cost and availability of these things might be quite different in, say, ten years time.

This point crops up time and again in town-vs-country discussions, but anyone thinking (seriously) about moving to the countryside for a change of lifestyle is ... opting for a change of lifestyle! :rolleyes:

Giving me an EV and a charge point at every corner will not help me move my lifestyle from where I am, surrounded by fields and traffic-free roads to any town centre.

Balf

CelticRambler wrote: »

This point crops up time and again in town-vs-country discussions, but anyone thinking (seriously) about moving to the countryside for a change of lifestyle is ... opting for a change of lifestyle! :rolleyes:

Giving me an EV and a charge point at every corner will not help me move my lifestyle from where I am, surrounded by fields and traffic-free roads to any town centre.

It's good to hear that you feel people have an awareness of the issue, but I'm not clear on what it is you are saying.

If someone makes the move, and has thought it through so that they are confident they can get work locally that satisfies their expectations and that they can easily source whatever material and social needs they have, that's great.

I think the point is more if people make the move on the assumption that they will have affordable private cars to take them to work in a more distant work location every day, and access any other needs they have on daily basis.

Would you agree, they need to think about how safe they feel that assumption is.

CelticRambler

Balf wrote: »

I think the point is more if people make the move on the assumption that they will have affordable private cars to take them to work in a more distant work location every day, and access any other needs they have on daily basis.

Would you agree, they need to think about how safe they feel that assumption is.

Yes, I do agree that they need to "stress test" their assumptions. Your preceding paragraph gives a good example of how assumptions can be wide of the mark:
work ... every day
access any other needs ... on daily basis.
This is something I notice when I go back to visit my family in Dublin: they are soooooo short-termist! I used my car yesterday (Thursday), first time since last Saturday. The time before that, a week before. It's 15km to the nearest decent shop, 25km to the nearest town with all facilities. Those realities won't change, so it's up to me to work around them, which means that when I do my shopping, I buy enough to get me through two, three or even four weeks. That's so much of a habit, it doesn't matter whether I'm crippled with a bad back or I'm cut off by a week's worth of snow, I'm not as dependent on any kind of transport as my city-siblings who've packed their lives with perishable products and entertainment.

You can apply the same principle to almost every other aspect of "lifestyle" - as long as you don't try to force a city rhythm onto country living, there's no need to sacrifice quality of life. Now you'll have to excuse me while I go and pick some totally free, 100% organic salad and fruit for my lunch! :cool:

awec

CelticRambler wrote: »

Yes, I do agree that they need to "stress test" their assumptions. Your preceding paragraph gives a good example of how assumptions can be wide of the mark:
work ... every day
access any other needs ... on daily basis.
This is something I notice when I go back to visit my family in Dublin: they are soooooo short-termist! I used my car yesterday (Thursday), first time since last Saturday. The time before that, a week before. It's 15km to the nearest decent shop, 25km to the nearest town with all facilities. Those realities won't change, so it's up to me to work around them, which means that when I do my shopping, I buy enough to get me through two, three or even four weeks. That's so much of a habit, it doesn't matter whether I'm crippled with a bad back or I'm cut off by a week's worth of snow, I'm not as dependent on any kind of transport as my city-siblings who've packed their lives with perishable products and entertainment.

You can apply the same principle to almost every other aspect of "lifestyle" - as long as you don't try to force a city rhythm onto country living, there's no need to sacrifice quality of life. Now you'll have to excuse me while I go and pick some totally free, 100% organic salad and fruit for my lunch! :cool:

Yes, you get around having to drive everywhere by giving up on modern conveniences, by apparently not having to commute every day, and giving up on "entertainment".

Of course country living will work if they are happy to be in the house every single day, and have no expectations of any level of convenience in terms of shops. That is pretty much just repeating what everyone has said, rural living works so long as you put the effort in, because everything needs to be planned in advance.

Once you sit your arse on that sofa in the evening after having a glass of wine or a beer that's it, you're not going anywhere. If you realise you've no milk or no bread, or that what you thought you had has actually gone off, tough ****, you go without. If the kids come to you and say they want to go meet their mate, tough ****, the taxi is parked up for tonight.

On the other hand, you have a big garden. But there's no point pretending that there's no trade off to be made, or that it's a small trade off. It's fairly huge, especially for someone who is not used to the level of isolation that country living brings.

Some people love it, many people hate it, I think people need to be careful as there is a tendency to picture it as this idyllic setting, completely peaceful with huge open spaces and lovely sunshine, but not so much thought goes into the relative loneliness and what it's like in the middle of winter.

I think most people, when they say they want to move from urban life to the quiet countryside, are really after a happy medium. A house on the edge of a village, versus a house in the middle of nowhere.

krissovo

awec wrote: »

Yes, you get around having to drive everywhere by giving up on modern conveniences, by apparently not having to commute every day, and giving up on "entertainment".

Of course country living will work if they are happy to be in the house every single day, and have no expectations of any level of convenience in terms of shops. That is pretty much just repeating what everyone has said, rural living works so long as you put the effort in, because everything needs to be planned in advance.

There is some shoite being spouted about rural living, do you all think we live hundreds of miles from civilization? We are not Canada or Australia, we are a small island and the reality is most of us live a few miles from a convenience store.

awec

krissovo wrote: »

There is some shoite being spouted about rural living, do you all think we live hundreds of miles from civilization? We are not Canada or Australia, we are a small island and the reality is most of us live a few miles from a convenience store.

A few miles is a long way to have to go to get to a convenience store.

Lux23

I hated living outside of my town growing up and it definitely affected me socially. I was extremely shy into my twenties even and struggled to relate to other kids as I didn't have siblings until I was six.

Lux23

krissovo wrote: »

There is some shoite being spouted about rural living, do you all think we live hundreds of miles from civilization? We are not Canada or Australia, we are a small island and the reality is most of us live a few miles from a convenience store.

Miles. I wouldn't want to live 500 metres from a store.

Plumbthedepths

My wife and I moved 14 miles from our hometown when our oldest was 14 and our youngest 4. Quite a rural area but close to to three very small villages. Both my sons will attest to how much they love where we live compare to where we lived. They both got involved in the local sports clubs and I believe the isolation ( further away from other houses) made both of them more outgoing and open to friendships which I believe has given them a greater confidence than they would have otherwise had. Just my experience though.

CelticRambler

awec wrote: »

Yes, you get around having to drive everywhere by giving up on modern conveniences, by apparently not having to commute every day, and giving up on "entertainment".

What conveniences have I had to give up? What "entertainment" ?

I place my orders on Amazon just like my Dublin siblings, using 4G broadband (110mb/s), they're delivered to my door the same as anyone else. If I get a sudden urge to buy a power drill or a wet suit or a garden shredder, they're all there in the middle aisle of either of the two Lidl's in the area, one 25 minutes to the north, one 25 minutes to the south. I can be in either one in 25 minutes, 18 if I'm really desperate. There are two cinemas in the same location, if I fancy paying good money to watch the same rubbish sequel that's showing in London. And yes, it'll cost me 3€ for a craft beer (250ml) at the next village ho-down where I'll be limited to mingling with a crowd of only 500 people and have to pay 12€ to see a selection of only 5 live acts instead of enjoying a megaboozendrugsfest in Marlay Park ... but then again, I'll be saving on the babysitter's fee because the children get in for free and can stay up till 3am like the adults ...

And as for planning? My Dublin siblings have timetables on their fridges so that they know who's doing what and when. You can't get more planified that that! :pac:

In terms of cultural awareness, there's no significant difference between my children and their cousins on account of the living in the country - except that my children know the value of keeping/wearing old clothes.

Ursus Horribilis

awec wrote: »

A few miles is a long way to have to go to get to a convenience store.

It is if you are rubbish at ensuring what you need is in the house. And if you're incapable of popping into a shop on your way home from work to buy milk.

Plumbthedepths

awec wrote: »

A few miles is a long way to have to go to get to a convenience store.

I can only assume from your posts you have no experience of rural living.

Strumms

It’s a tough one, he won’t have the luxury of say just knocking over to friends when at a loose end to have a game of football, an hour on the PlayStation or hanging out or whatever... it might get frustrating all round the organization and effort to just go and hang with friends... for them too.

It might be a great house you are thinking of buying but can it be a great home for the little one and you ? You need to think carefully. If it will be isolating maybe not, you have to look deeper then just bricks and mortar.

awec

Ursus Horribilis wrote: »

It is if you are rubbish at ensuring what you need is in the house. And if you're incapable of popping into a shop on your way home from work to buy milk.

It's a long way to go, full stop.

Fian

I lived in Dublin until I was 10. then we moved to Connemara. My closest friend and nearest neighbour (who was in my class) was probably 2.5 miles away by road. But only 10 minutes walking across the fields and climbing over the walls to get to the next bohereen over instead of going all the way up to the main road and all the way back down again. We had loads of free space to play in. When I was a bit older everybody from the whole village would congregate an the local school (for the sports facilities etc) or the pub (to play pool we were all known and nobody would have gotten away with drinking underage) or at the beach each day, depending on the time of year.

Now living in Dublin again with my kids, who are teenagers/adults now.

I'm honestly not sure whether it would have been a nicer childhood for my kids to live in rural Ireland rather than an urban area. There are pros and cons to both. Both can be managed fine.

If you move to a rural area get them bikes and encourage them to use them. Rural kids are probably more independent in lots of ways, because they probably have to be. And you will spend a good portion of your life ferrying your kids around in cars whether you live urban or rural. Distances may be a bit longer but the time taken can be shorter in rural areas.

Ursus Horribilis

awec wrote: »

It's a long way to go, full stop.

Have you ever lived in the countryside?

Balf

Grew up in a rural area and wouldn't change it for anything, absolute best place to grow up and wouldnt even consider bringing up a child anywhere but in the country myself.

The having to drive them everywhere is latched onto and made out to be a far bigger deal than it is. For a start the vast majority of town and suburb dwellers drive their kids everywhere also and secondly its just second nature to you anyway that you have to drive it doesn't even register as an issue.

It's also far better when kids become teens and they can't just walk palces and start hanging around, they have to be dropped off and collected giving parents far more control over them. Also people in the country sit down and watch tv most evenings the same as people in cities, its not just constant going

Balf wrote: »

It's good to hear that you feel people have an awareness of the issue, but I'm not clear on what it is you are saying.

If someone makes the move, and has thought it through so that they are confident they can get work locally that satisfies their expectations and that they can easily source whatever material and social needs they have, that's great.

I think the point is more if people make the move on the assumption that they will have affordable private cars to take them to work in a more distant work location every day, and access any other needs they have on daily basis.

Would you agree, they need to think about how safe they feel that assumption is.

I have no idea where you are getting these outlandish ideas from. It's an absolute 100% certainty that affordable private cars will be available indefinitely.

awec wrote: »

It's a long way to go, full stop.

Its an absolute non-issue made up by those living in cities as a way to feel they have great advantages over rural dwellers, most of whom live in estates and have to drive to the shop anyway as even if there is one walkable its most likley a decent walk and not open late by the time something is forgotten.

I honestly can't remember the last time I was at home and suddenly realised I need to get to a shop as I didn't have something.

awec

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I can only assume from your posts you have no experience of rural living.

Missus grew up in the sticks, family live in a rural village. Go and stay there often.

It's lovely for a while. But the lack of convenience is obvious, and after a few days it gets really, really boring. There are three pubs in walking distance and that is it. If you want to do anything except go to the pub you have to organise lifts or taxis, and it's not like a town where you can walk out the door and be in a taxi in 5 minutes.

That said, I grew up around convenience, being able to just go places on a whim, not needing ferried about in cars, so my expectations are different.

I'm not dismissing it, obviously plenty of people like it, just people seem to want to pretend there's not a huge lifestyle change and sacrifices required to live in the country. You sacrifice convenience, you sacrifice having things to do, everything needs to be planned more than it otherwise would be, and in exchange it's quieter, you'll have a bigger house and a bigger garden.

Ursus Horribilis

The hogwash I see on these urban v rural threads never ceases to surprise me.

Plumbthedepths

awec wrote: »

Missus grew up in the sticks, family live in a rural village. Go and stay there often.

It's lovely for a while. But the lack of convenience is obvious, and after a few days it gets really, really boring. There are three pubs in walking distance and that is it. If you want to do anything except go to the pub you have to organise lifts or taxis, and it's not like a town where you can walk out the door and be in a taxi in 5 minutes.

That said, I grew up around convenience, being able to just go places on a whim, not needing ferried about in cars, so my expectations are different.

I'm not dismissing it, obviously plenty of people like it, just people seem to want to pretend there's not a huge lifestyle change and sacrifices required to live in the country. You sacrifice convenience, you sacrifice having things to do, everything needs to be planned more than it otherwise would be, and in exchange it's quieter, you'll have a bigger house and a bigger garden.

So that's a No then, thanks. The rest is waffle and negativity.

Balf

Adam Uptight Kindle wrote: »

It's an absolute 100% certainty that affordable private cars will be available indefinitely.

If you've satisfied yourself of that, it's fine. I just think its an obvious question that folk have to ask themselves.

Just as, if someone's personal strategy depended on turf cutting as a source of employment and/or fuel, they might want to ask themselves if they were confident that would continue indefinitely.

jester77

Grew up rurally and wouldn't wish that on any kid. It was a sad lonely existence, my friends were too far away to walk or cycle to. We only had 1 car that my father would have to get to work, so there was no way for me to get driven somewhere. There was really nothing to do, I was able to get to the local library once in a while and would rent out as many books as was allowed, that kept me somewhat sane.

It's probably easier now for kids, back then there was no TV until RTE 2 came on mid afternoon, no such thing as internet. There wasn't even a phone in the house until I was 8 or 9 years old. Kids now have video games and on-demand all day TV with the likes of Sky, Netflix, etc. and can keep in contact with friends through social media and instant messaging.

I now live in the city and the kids have everything they need within walking distance. It's great for them.

Mango Joe

OP there's a lot of glib replies on here and 99% of them have totally disregarded your wording where you said this house is "very secluded" & then they go on to say ah sure it'll all be grand, sure we moved to the country and our child is marvellous etc.... The fact is that no it mightn't all be magically fine especially if your child is significantly isolated and you've mentioned having no other children !?

Ideally children should be able to walk or cycle to and from friends houses whenever suits them (from an appropriate age obviously). If this isn't possible then structured play-dates involving availability of friends and other parents agreeing to commit and driving a lot is required.

- In my experience these children are often too busy for this as they're off playing with the other kids on their road or in their estate and why would they or their parents bother with the hassle?

Often times when we view houses strange emotional rules and motivations grab us and move us in directions we shouldn't necessarily give in to.

Our personalities and psyches are formed at this time....we're shaped to a large extent by a myriad of interactions with our peers, not just at home by Mummy and Daddys sides.