A Working Definition of Hate Crime - Garda

Sir Oxman

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2019/1009/1082167-hate-crime/


"The strategy defines a hate crime as any criminal offence perceived by the victim or any other person to be motivated by hostility or prejudice based on disability, race, colour, nationality, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation or gender."


Will this result in cops knocking on peoples doors over tweets?
Like in the UK?

It seems very open ended to me but the full picture is not out yet.
Let me also say, I'm not into hate criming anyone in real life or online on the above grounds!

And what does this bit mean:

"Over the next three years there will be enhanced reporting, recording, investigating and prosecuting mechanisms put in place for dealing with hate crimes, along with a pulse record for non-hate crimes."

blanch152

There is a concept in law of what a reasonable person might think or do.

https://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Reasonable+Person

Rather than enshrining the offence in terms of what a victim might feel, especially because the feelings may come from more than just the alleged act, surely the test of what a reasonable person thinks or perceives would be more appropriate?

Enough is Enough!

So if a woman call me a 'bastard' can I report it is a hate crime?

Yer Da sells Avon

Enough is Enough! wrote: »

So if a woman call me a 'bastard' can I report it is a hate crime?

Only if you can prove that she called you that because of your parents marital situation at the time of your birth.

osarusan

If this is similar to the UK, then people can report them as hate crimes (and not just crimes) because of the perceived motivation, but that motivation still needs to be proven in court for it to become a hate crime, although they might be convicted of a non-hate crime anyway.

I think that's the UK system, but might be wrong about it.

Eric Cartman

blanch152 wrote: »

There is a concept in law of what a reasonable person might think or do.

https://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Reasonable+Person

Rather than enshrining the offence in terms of what a victim might feel, especially because the feelings may come from more than just the alleged act, surely the test of what a reasonable person thinks or perceives would be more appropriate?

the problem is that is quite questionable. If we define Una Mullally or Paul Murphy as reasonable, ill be away for life.

blanch152

Eric Cartman wrote: »

the problem is that is quite questionable. If we define Una Mullally or Paul Murphy as reasonable, ill be away for life.

It is questionable, but it becomes a matter for the judge to decide what a reasonable person might think, rather than for a victim to say what the crime is.

The danger in the definition as proposed is that an accusation becomes a conviction by virtue of the belief of the victim.

blueshade

A SF TD was shown on RTE news just now saying that we're a racist country with a growing racism problem and that we've all seen videos on Social Media of people going around all the towns in Ireland recording black people and complaining that we've too many black people. I think that's utter horse manure. I really don't think that the vast majority of people in Ireland are in any way racist, what they are is sick and tired of being forced to pay for illegal migrants posing as refugees. Lets be frank here, asylum seeker numbers have fallen all across Europe but have risen here this year by 59%, why is that if we are so racist?

These Hate Crime laws only started springing up when people in host nations stopped being afraid to speak out about the failures of multiculturalism and the failure of migrants/refugees/asylum seekers to integrate. Referring to any issue of about or around ethnicity or Islam is now perceived as a Hate Crime thanks to the NGO quangos and the likes of the Refugee Council who do very well financially from the taxpayer from this alleged racism. It's just a way of trying to silence dissent. Racism is never acceptable, playing the race card is never acceptable either.

Stop moaning ffs

We already live in a country where RTE pays out huge money cos certain people felt slandered for someone suggesting they were homophobic assholes on air (which they were and are)

About time we put this in place and make it broad reaching especially with relation to internet abuse and Gemma o Doherty of it all

Enough is Enough!

Yer Da sells Avon wrote: »

Only if you can prove that she called you that because of your parents marital situation at the time of your birth.

From the article:

"The strategy defines a hate crime as any criminal offence perceived by the victim or any other person to be motivated by hostility or prejudice based on disability, race, colour, nationality, ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation or gender.

If I perceive it as gendered insult, then it looks like I can report it as a hate crime.

Enough is Enough!

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

We already live in a country where RTE pays out huge money cos certain people felt slandered for someone suggesting they were homophobic assholes on air (which they were and are)

About time we put this in place and make it broad reaching especially with relation to internet abuse and Gemma o Doherty of it all

Good lad. Allow the state to control what you can say.

Eric Cartman

blueshade wrote: »

A SF TD was shown on RTE news just now saying that we're a racist country with a growing racism problem and that we've all seen videos on Social Media of people going around all the towns in Ireland recording black people and complaining that we've too many black people. I think that's utter horse manure. I really don't think that the vast majority of people in Ireland are in any way racist, what they are is sick and tired of being forced to pay for illegal migrants posing as refugees. Lets be frank here, asylum seeker numbers have fallen all across Europe but have risen here this year by 59%, why is that if we are so racist?

These Hate Crime laws only started springing up when people in host nations stopped being afraid to speak out about the failures of multiculturalism and the failure of migrants/refugees/asylum seekers to integrate. Referring to any issue of about or around ethnicity or Islam is now perceived as a Hate Crime thanks to the NGO quangos and the likes of the Refugee Council who do very well financially from the taxpayer from this alleged racism. It's just a way of trying to silence dissent. Racism is never acceptable, playing the race card is never acceptable either.

We have one very vocal loon who has a handful of followers, she'll say anything to get a reaction. Thats the extent of 'overt' racism in Ireland. We have institutional racism in which many public servants are afraid to enforce laws and rules upon minorities for fear of being branded racist but thats really the extent of it. There is one person recording videos 'up and down the country'

realistically if we put Gemma in pats, 80% of the racism here is gone.

Stop moaning ffs

blueshade wrote: »

A SF TD was shown on RTE news just now saying that we're a racist country with a growing racism problem and that we've all seen videos on Social Media of people going around all the towns in Ireland recording black people and complaining that we've too many black people. I think that's utter horse manure. I really don't think that the vast majority of people in Ireland are in any way racist, what they are is sick and tired of being forced to pay for illegal migrants posing as refugees. Lets be frank here, asylum seeker numbers have fallen all across Europe but have risen here this year by 59%, why is that if we are so racist?

These Hate Crime laws only started springing up when people in host nations stopped being afraid to speak out about the failures of multiculturalism and the failure of migrants/refugees/asylum seekers to integrate. Referring to any issue of about or around ethnicity or Islam is now perceived as a Hate Crime thanks to the NGO quangos and the likes of the Refugee Council who do very well financially from the taxpayer from this alleged racism. It's just a way of trying to silence dissent. Racism is never acceptable, playing the race card is never acceptable either.

TLDR- he’s not a racist. But....

Stop moaning ffs

Enough is Enough! wrote: »

Good lad. Allow the state to control what you can say.

I can say what I like already. You’re an idiotic far right fantasist and a bit of a cockwomble. Hey. Free speech.

Enough is Enough!

How the fcuk is Ireland a racist country? What other small country has taken in as many migrants as we have, in such a small period of time?

Enough is Enough!

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

I can say what I like already. You’re an idiotic far right fantasist and a bit of a cockwomble. Hey. Free speech.

And I think you're a mentally ill, self hating leftist.

You're the kind person who'd rat on his neighbour to the Stasi.

Harvey Weinstein

This is to shut people up about immigration, migrant crime and anything similar..its as simple as that.

Eric Cartman

Harvey Weinstein wrote: »

This is to shut people up about immigration, migrant crime and anything similar..its as simple as that.

I bet this has come about as the gardai and some solicitors sat down and tried to find something to charge Gemma with and failed, now they'll wait till her next outburst and boom, she'll be away in the dochas centre for 2-4

Sir Oxman

Harvey Weinstein wrote: »

This is to shut people up about immigration, migrant crime and anything similar..its as simple as that.

But people can talk about all of that without resorting to racial abuse.


However, the 'perception' bit needs to be dropped IMO.
That appears to me to be very dangerous.

Harvey Weinstein

Sir Oxman wrote: »

But people can talk about all of that without resorting to racial abuse.


However, the 'perception' bit needs to be dropped IMO.
That appears to me to be very dangerous.

Yes thats the whole point..the Perception bit. Very very dangerous.

Stop moaning ffs

Enough is Enough! wrote: »

And I think you're a mentally ill, self hating leftist.

You're the kind person who'd rat on his neighbour to the Stasi.

You actually nailed me. But not the last part. Wouldn’t rat on anyone even the worst. There’s a certain priest still walking free cos I never ratfed on him.

Gatling

Harvey Weinstein wrote: »

Yes thats the whole point..the Perception bit. Very very dangerous.

I'd imagine how many complaints would be made by boardsies because they don't like another posters opinion

Stop moaning ffs

Gatling wrote: »

I'd imagine how many complaints would be made by boardsies because they don't like another posters opinion

There are countless threads on here populated by right wing wannabe fantasists out to get Muslims and travelers and gays and women etc

Bout time they had their coughs well and truly softened once and for all.

You’ll see them all clam up and keep their views to themselves as soon as that law comes in and actual consequences become a reality.

Gatling

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

There are countless threads on here populated by right wing wannabe fantasists

Perceived ?


You have an obsession with the word right wing

Stop moaning ffs

Gatling wrote: »

Perceived ?


You have an obsession with the word right wing

What would your word be for them??

Please say patriots. Please

Eric Cartman

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

There are countless threads on here populated by right wing wannabe fantasists out to get Muslims and travelers and gays and women etc

Bout time they had their coughs well and truly softened once and for all.

You’ll see them all clam up and keep their views to themselves as soon as that law comes in and actual consequences become a reality.

don't really think anyone has had a go at gay people or women. The other two absolutely , but i must be missing a few threads.

Gatling

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

Please say patriots. Please

What are you on

Harvey Weinstein

Stop moaning ffs wrote: »

What would your word be for them??

Please say patriots. Please

You think patriotism is a bad thing?

BarryD2

Reads like it could be a field day for the perpetually offended.

Stop moaning ffs

BarryD2 wrote: »

Reads like it could be a field day for the perpetually offended.

Wrong thread haha

Gatling

BarryD2 wrote: »

Reads like it could be a field day for the perpetually offended.

Generation snowflake