Ireland Team Talk XI: Team of nervoUS MOD warning Post 1

Faugheen

Paul Weller wrote: »

Many would rightly argue that O'Gara dragged a lesser quality side over the line many times compared to the fantastic players Sexton had around him

Anyone who says that is chatting absolute bollocks.

O’Gara played with some of the best players Ireland has ever produced and all in their prime. O’Driscoll, O’Connell, D’Arcy etc.

They were called the golden generation for god’s sake.

aloooof

swiwi_ wrote: »

Think those are mutually exclusive. If Irish pack doesn’t gain some advantage I don’t see Byrne having the game of his life. He’s just not the sort of player to deliver a statement performance with a beaten pack.

Completely agree. I'm hopeful that a better performance from our pack (I'd take parity), coupled with some quicker service from JGP will give Byrne a better platform than he did in that RWC warm-up game. If he gets that, he'll need to have a good game if we're to have any chance of a win.

aloooof

Deleted User wrote: »

Ross Byrne could have the game of his life but if the Irish pack don't gain some advantage in contact and hold parity at the set piece then it wont matter.

Byrne will deliver a competent, professional but not game changing performance and that's fine - Ireland enjoyed plenty of success with O'Gara doing the same thing but we'll need to hammer them up front if we want to win in Twickenham.

Venjur, is this your not-so-subtle attempt at trying to start a ROG v Ross Byrne argument on here??

TRC10

Paul Weller wrote: »

I don't think they are the best team in the world..if you say top 4 ..then maybe

Who's better? The Springboks haven't played in over a year so you cant say its them. All Blacks have lost 2 on the bounce. The only other contender is france but I think England would have their number if they were the to play tomorrow.

AbusesToilets

I'm most interested in two things. If we can meet the English with some aggression for a change, and not get smashed behind the gainline all game. Also, if we have learnt from previous thrashings and made adjustments to counter their game plan. Kicks against their defensive rush, and how to defend against their kicking game.

aloooof

TRC10 wrote: »

Who's better? The Springboks haven't played in over a year so you cant say its them. All Blacks have lost 2 on the bounce. The only other contender is france but I think England would have their number if they were the to play tomorrow.

Equally, I think the All Blacks would have England's number if they were to play tomorrow. They're certainly among the best in the world (along with NZ and SA for me), but I don't think it's definitive.

Paul Weller

Faugheen wrote: »

Anyone who says that is chatting absolute bollocks.

O’Gara played with some of the best players Ireland has ever produced and all in their prime. O’Driscoll, O’Connell, D’Arcy etc.

They were called the golden generation for god’s sake.

Sexton played with all those in their actual prime....and many more...it's not even a close run thing if you're being honest

awec

2020 has been bad enough, we do not need a Sexton v ROG debate to go along with everything else.

Don't even go down this road. No more posts on this topic.

Interested Observer

Anyone else really surprised about Murray? He's actually been left out of a full strength team away to England. Never thought I'd see the day. It's very difficult for a player of his stature to find themselves out of the team. Fwiw I think it's the right call.

swiwi_

Interested Observer wrote: »

Anyone else really surprised about Murray? He's actually been left out of a full strength team away to England. Never thought I'd see the day. It's very difficult for a player of his stature to find themselves out of the team. Fwiw I think it's the right call.

I thought JGP was really good last week. Not surprised he’s been retained. TBH I think it was a bit overdue. The game has moved and I don’t think Murray’s game has evolved.

As an aside I really like the look of Keenan. Reckon he’s a keeper.

Ross Byrne hopefully has gotten over the nightmares from his last start for Ireland and can display more composure

Tuilagi being out undoubtedly a help

Some form calls from AF - good to see that in any case.



5 project player starters - it's a bit... h-Ireland

Interested Observer

swiwi_ wrote: »

I thought JGP was really good last week. Not surprised he’s been retained. TBH I think it was a bit overdue. The game has moved and I don’t think Murray’s game has evolved.

As an aside I really like the look of Keenan. Reckon he’s a keeper.

This is all true but it's still just very unusual for Ireland to drop a player like Murray. I think it's the right call I'm just very surprised.

Actually if the subs go the wrong way - 10, hooker and prop and more than half the team on the field would be non-Irish :eek:

England vs the Baba's?

jacothelad

glasso wrote: »

Actually if the subs go the wrong way - 10, hooker and prop and more than half the team on the field would be non-Irish :eek:

England vs the Baba's?

The 10 is Irish, the hooker is Irish and the prop is Irish, at least according to their passports.

jacothelad

jacothelad wrote: »

The 10 is Irish, the hooker is Irish and the prop is Irish, at least according to their passports.

regardless of semantics this sort of situation was not really the plan was it?

accensi0n

glasso wrote: »

regardless of semantics this sort of situation was not really the plan was it?

The plan? To play the best team available and try to win?

accensi0n

accensi0n wrote: »

The plan? To play the best team available and try to win?

yes but if it was one of Eng, Wales or Scotland it would be commented that they are taking the absolute piss.

kingofthekong

aloooof wrote: »

I'm a massive fan of Aki, but I think the biggest downside to having him against England is his lack of kicking game. Intelligent grubbers, crossfield kicks etc. are a brilliant way to turn England's line speed against them.

I’d love a kicking game from 12 but with the guys we have available we can’t , he’s the best we’ve got , Frawley is probably the best option for that and he’s a while off I reckon

Akrasia

AbusesToilets wrote: »

yes and no. Is he any less dynamic than POM or Stander? Perhaps a touch less explosive than CJ, but he's more capable with the ball. He's much better overall than POM, outside of the lineout. Obviously my opinion, but I've never managed to grasp just where he's so deficient relative to his peers.

Sorry to dig up a week old post but Stander is one of the most dynamic players to ever wear a green Jersey

Akrasia

Interested Observer wrote: »

This is all true but it's still just very unusual for Ireland to drop a player like Murray. I think it's the right call I'm just very surprised.

JGP is a good player to tide us over until Craig Casey gets a few Heineken cup games under his belt and is ready to take his rightful spot as the Munster and Ireland starting Scrum Half

kingofthekong

Dubinusa wrote: »

I wonder if not playing Beirne at 6 is a missed opportunity. England would be a great opposition to try this out. Maybe go with
6. Beirne
7 VDF
8. Stander
20. Doris.

That is probably the worst backrow combination you could’ve come up with with what’s available it’s almost a troll

kingofthekong

Akrasia wrote: »

JGP is a good player to tide us over until Craig Casey gets a few Heineken cup games under his belt and is ready to take his rightful spot as the Munster and Ireland starting Scrum Half

Casey is quality and I can’t wait to see him in a green jersey , but to say a player of the quality of Jgp is a hold over is not accurate, he’s currently the best scrum half in the country and may also get better again from his international exposure

irishbucsfan

glasso wrote: »

yes but if it was one of Eng, Wales or Scotland it would be commented that they are taking the absolute piss.

What do you mean “if”, England make use of players born overseas all the time?

clsmooth

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

To be clear, I don't want to see Hendo at six.

But he's put in superb performances in the HEC at blindside, against the likes of Sarries. I know how you love to pooh-pooh, but don't get carried away with the pooh-pooh.

When was the last time he played at 6? Not sure he’d have the mobility to play it these days at international level but I wouldn’t be adverse to seeing it.

Paul Smeenus

clsmooth wrote: »

When was the last time he played at 6? Not sure he’d have the mobility to play it these days at international level but I wouldn’t be adverse to seeing it.

Ach, I really don't think it would be a good idea.

But when he broke through, he was playing internationally at both positions. Whenever he settled on second row, he would still line out in the back row at HEC for Ulster, and there were folk that thought he was much more suited to it. He put in some superb performances for us there.

That has become "do a job at Pro14 level".

ionadnapokot

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

To be clear, I don't want to see Hendo at six.

But he's put in superb performances in the HEC at blindside, against the likes of Sarries. I know how you love to pooh-pooh, but don't get carried away with the pooh-pooh.

it's a very old chestnut Henderson at 6 isnt it?
i would back you up there though. No doubts whatsoever he could tag on the side of a scrum and get around the pitch a bit more in an emergency.

With Baird coming through soon it appears like we will have two similar players in Henderson and him.

Interested Observer

Akrasia wrote: »

JGP is a good player to tide us over until Craig Casey gets a few Heineken cup games under his belt and is ready to take his rightful spot as the Munster and Ireland starting Scrum Half

Eh relax there chief.

IAmTheReign

glasso wrote: »

yes but if it was one of Eng, Wales or Scotland it would be commented that they are taking the absolute piss.

Huh? Some of Englands best players are foreign born. Off the top of my head the 2 Vuniploas, Tuilagi, Willi Heinz and Joe Cokanasiga are all foreign born.

Tuilagi was an illegal immigrant when he signed for Tigers and almost got deported but the RFU intervened. He's probably the only Samoan asylum seeker in the UK. Can't say I've ever heard that get brought up when he lines out for England.

Bazzo

And Scotland?? Pretty hilarious attempt.

Wales don't put out a huge amount of foreign born players to be fair but there are still some fairly high profile names there.

sydthebeat

In the last 10 years England have capped Hape, Fourie, corbisiero, tuilagi, botha, sharples, barritt, 2 vunipola, kvesic, waldrom, yarde, rokodunguni, Harrison, Hughes, Hill, teo, heinze, cokanisinga, shields, solomana.....

All of who are non-uk born.... Seeing as that's now a thing