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39 people found dead in trailer in UK

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    #332
    STB.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    Noveight wrote: »
    Nobody on the planet would blame him for bringing a few of the rags to court over it.

    The Sun UK’s cover for tomorrow is disgraceful.


    It is clear that despite the Levinson enquiry and the Jefferies case that the media have learnt nothing. Mirror and the Sun are rags. Guardian not so much, but they are complicit here also as are Sky and the BBC.

    Right now all he is guilty of is picking up a container from a ferry arriving from Belgium. Lets see if the police hold him for 96 hours.

    Arrests and charges are not the same thing. The basic rules of responsible journalism seems to be a dark art these days.

    https://www.pressgazette.co.uk/following-ags-new-advice-how-journalists-can-avoid-contempt-of-court-when-reporting-crime/


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    #333
    Infini
    Registered Users Posts: 4,573 ✭✭✭Infini


    Looking at the reports and so far from what I can see the Driver has absolutely nothing to do with any of this, he's being arrested for something he might as well have had no part in and will likely be released without charge anyways since he's only the courier, the container wasnt even brought into the country by him it was shipped in on its own.

    Media really has dropped to guttertrash levels these days expecially when the initial information all but suggests he had nothing to do with it. Bloody bottomfeeding twats.


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    #334
    Up Donegal
    Registered Users Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭Up Donegal


    Sir Oxman wrote: »
    Yeah, it's now "The force said the lorry came from Bulgaria and entered the country via Holyhead on Saturday."


    I'm not up to date on my ports but how can a trailer enter the UK from Bulgaria via Holyhead - I thought that route was Ireland-UK-Ireland only?


    Perhaps it was the tractor unit that came through Holyhead?


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    #335
    Infini
    Registered Users Posts: 4,573 ✭✭✭Infini


    pinkyeye wrote: »
    As well as the poor 39 souls lost in this tragedy your heart would have to go out to the police, ambulance service, coroners etc. who have to deal with this. It has to be a horrific situation to deal with to have to try and identify these people probably from their phones, photographs, letters etc. they may have with them.

    So sad.

    It's sad indeed of course that it happened but at the same time I do feel it's a little hard to have alot of sympathy either. They're throwing their lives away to enter a country that doesnt want them to be honest. Not only that but because they tried to enter illegally they ended up losing their lives for nothing. Of course the real lowlifes are those who traffic them illegally but at the same time how did they get in there to begin with, because I've heard of stories in the past of people like this breaking into trucks to stow away only to get trapped in the container with noone knowing until they're already dead.


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    #336
    RobertKK
    Registered Users Posts: 33,749 ✭✭✭✭RobertKK


    The problem is we can't have immigration like we had during the migrant crisis of 2015 which is what some advocate, unless people want a shift to the hard right in politics, and sensible people don't want that.
    The best approach is to work to make conditions better for people in the countries where they come from. I have read what the EU wants to do as a result of the migrant crisis, and it is work to help the countries where the people come from. This is the only approach that can work, and then I came across this video which explained it:



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    #337
    FutureTeashock
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 439 ✭✭FutureTeashock


    Had the Brexit vote been properly respected, this probably wouldn't have happened.



    Without strong borders this won't be the last tragedy.


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    #338
    TheChizler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,455 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    Is there any indication the tractor unit has been in Bulgaria since it was registered 2017? The way the media has presented it is that the migrants got on there a few days ago.


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    #339
    kowloon
    Registered Users Posts: 13,479 ✭✭✭✭kowloon


    RobertKK wrote: »
    The problem is we can't have immigration like we had during the migrant crisis of 2015 which is what some advocate, unless people want a shift to the hard right in politics, and sensible people don't want that.
    The best approach is to work to make conditions better for people in the countries where they come from. I have read what the EU wants to do as a result of the migrant crisis, and it is work to help the countries where the people come from. This is the only approach that can work, and then I came across this video which explained it:


    NumbersUSA and Roy Beck are really anti-immigration; I doubt he gives a flying fcuk about helping anyone abroad, just wants them outside US borders.


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    #340
    Nekarsulm
    Registered Users Posts: 11,219 ✭✭✭✭Nekarsulm


    TheChizler wrote: »
    Is there any indication the tractor unit has been in Bulgaria since it was registered 2017? The way the media has presented it is that the migrants got on there a few days ago.

    Tractor unit could have been in every country in the EU twenty times over since 2017.
    Many transport companies set up offices in other countries to cut costs.
    Annual motor tax on a truck was up to €5100 until a couple of years ago, and it was the mass exodus of trucks being registered abroad ( and the total loss of tax revenue) that forced the Govt to reduce annual motor tax to €900.


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    #341
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,339 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    FutureTeashock wrote: »
    Had the Brexit vote been properly respected, this probably wouldn't have happened.



    Without strong borders this won't be the last tragedy.

    If that's the case then how is it that the migrants in calais are being stopped from coming over to Dover?


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    #342
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,339 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    The drivers sister is quoted in saying that he just picked up the container from the docks and he was the one who discovered the bodies when he stopped and checked the load.

    He was incredibly distraught, was the one who rang emergency services and has since been released from custody.

    Its clear that he had nothing to do with the actual smuggling and only the cab was brought over via holyhead.

    But the news media and social media outburst is disgraceful.


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    #343
    Quantum Erasure
    Registered Users Posts: 8,557 ✭✭✭Quantum Erasure


    jimmycrackcorm wrote: »
    The drivers sister is quoted ....

    where do you see that?


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    #344
    jimmycrackcorm
    Registered Users Posts: 14,339 ✭✭✭✭jimmycrackcorm


    Quantum Erasure wrote: »
    where do you see that?

    Her Facebook.


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    #345
    Obvious Desperate Breakfasts
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,474 ✭✭✭Obvious Desperate Breakfasts


    An absolutely horrific death. :(


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    #346
    STB.
    Registered Users Posts: 5,380 ✭✭✭STB.


    FutureTeashock wrote: »
    Had the Brexit vote been properly respected, this probably wouldn't have happened.

    Without strong borders this won't be the last tragedy.


    You are a prime example of the clueless people who didn't know what they were voting for.


    Its fúck all to do with Brexit anyway.


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    #347
    FutureTeashock
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 439 ✭✭FutureTeashock


    STB. wrote: »
    You are a prime example of the clueless people who didn't know what they were voting for.


    Its fúck all to do with Brexit anyway.


    Being called clueless by a moron like you is more than a bit rich.


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    #348
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    splinter65 wrote: »
    I can’t imagine anything worse. They can’t be paid too much as far as I’m concerned.

    They are well trained, you dont need to worry about them.


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    #349
    Quantum Erasure
    Registered Users Posts: 8,557 ✭✭✭Quantum Erasure


    jimmycrackcorm wrote: »
    The drivers sister is quoted in saying that... He was incredibly distraught, was the one who rang emergency services and has since been released from custody..
    still in custody as of BBC 7AM news


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    #350
    Sir Oxman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,492 ✭✭✭Sir Oxman


    Up Donegal wrote: »
    Perhaps it was the tractor unit that came through Holyhead?


    Yeah, we know the two routes taken now but during the morning the reporting was all over the place.


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    #351
    Sir Oxman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,492 ✭✭✭Sir Oxman


    TheChizler wrote: »
    Is there any indication the tractor unit has been in Bulgaria since it was registered 2017? The way the media has presented it is that the migrants got on there a few days ago.


    According to Bulgaria, no.
    It was registered there in 2017 and hasn't entered Bulgaria since.


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    #352
    prunudo
    Registered Users Posts: 7,475 ✭✭✭prunudo


    2 things this shows. 1: This press are scum and gutter journalists/editors fishing for likes instead of the truth. Whether the driver is involved or not, he shouldn't be named and they should be respecting the privacy of the people whos houses they are searching up north. Remember the couple who were ousted as the drone fliers last year only to be totally cleared some time later.
    2: How did they expect technology to solve the border issue when they originally thought the lorry came from Bulgaria via ireland to Holyhead. I'm sure the driver told them exactly what happened yet the police release misinformation.


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    #353
    Cunning Stunt
    Registered Users Posts: 1,292 ✭✭✭Cunning Stunt


    HGV Lorry drivers Norhern Ireland FB page claims all charges have been dropped?
    I cant find any post from the sister as someone mentioned earlier..but would be interesting to know if it is true that it was the driver himself, who alerted police..
    Sky News meanwhile doing an opinion piece from someone who successfully made it to England in a lorry and how he is now Chief executive of a Refugee organisation in Scotland. Does the media not have a duty to discourage people from trying these dangerous journeys in the wake of this tragedy?!


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    #354
    Sir Oxman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,492 ✭✭✭Sir Oxman


    contrary_devil wrote: »
    I'm after reading quite a few posts on this thread and to be frank there are a lot of posts on this thread made by people who know sfa about how the transport and logistics industry works but yet seem to think they are knowledgable on the subject. As an example someone posted about buying seals online to replace broken seals, it is entirely possible that seals can be bought but you'd have to be damned lucky to have the exact type of seal with matching number.
    Smuggling gangs/clandestines get people into trailers all the time and pass through security checks even at Calais which would be one of the more heavily secured ports. Haulage companies are these days having to instruct drivers to only park at paid secure parking areas when on the homeward journey to miminise the risk of illegal entry, service areas are no go areas for freight vehicles en route for the UK or Ireland. Only a few months ago a transport company had a new fridge trailer, costing in the region of €100,000 ruined when clandestines cut the roof to gain entry, this was in a service area parking in the middle of France.
    The trailer these poor souls were found in had not come through Ireland or Holyhead as were the indications of some posts but had come from Zeebrugge to Purfleet and was picked up by the driver of the truck there for onward delivery. I suggest it might be beneficial if some people quit trying to be heros rushing to be the first to post about every tit bit they hear/see in media reports with subsequent additions or deletions of the facts as what should be well known by now is that the media reporters don't always have things right and don't always use the correct language or terminology in their reports. An example of incorrect terminology in this instance was using the word container when in fact the correct term is refrigerated (fridge) trailer, as the term container is used to describe a steel box that is lifted on or off a carrying vehicle.
    I apologise for the long post but as I have spent most of my working life in the transport/logistics industry I'm very vexed at the inaccurices here and in the media and a man nearly being convicted without trial.
    RIP to the poor souls that died in such a horrible way.


    Yes, we now know the two routes involved but as with all threads on a developing story people will post rolling updates.
    For instance, a few posters knew something was up with the initial story as the route being touted at first was truck+trailer ex-Bulgaria to UK via Holyhead which raised eyebrows.


    We're at the stage we now know the trailer, the unit, the driver are Irish/Irish registered.
    We don't know for sure the process of how/who/why trailer was opened in that spot, that's for the cops and the driver.



    The topic diverted a bit with talk of seals by interested posters and a clatter of trolls waffling on about fenians and loyalists but thankfully looks like it's back on track.


    I saw the C4 news last night and what they did was wrong knocking on drivers house for sure and the papers were wrong also.


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    #355
    Annasopra
    Registered Users Posts: 41,080 ✭✭✭✭Annasopra


    derrymcorry wrote: »
    He is a UVF member according to social media.

    Wow. I didnt know people were so gullible to believe everything on social media.

    It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.

    Terry Pratchet



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    #356
    LillySV
    Registered Users Posts: 1,750 ✭✭✭LillySV


    Sir Oxman wrote: »
    Yes, we now know the two routes involved but as with all threads on a developing story people will post rolling updates.
    For instance, a few posters knew something was up with the initial story as the route being touted at first was truck+trailer ex-Bulgaria to UK via Holyhead which raised eyebrows.


    We're at the stage we now know the trailer, the unit, the driver are Irish/Irish registered.
    We don't know for sure the process of how/who/why trailer was opened in that spot, that's for the cops and the driver.



    The topic diverted a bit with talk of seals by interested posters and a clatter of trolls waffling on about fenians and loyalists but thankfully looks like it's back on track.


    I saw the C4 news last night and what they did was wrong knocking on drivers house for sure and the papers were wrong also.

    I stopped watching channel 4 news a long time ago... they’re more interested in pushing their left leaning bull**** than they are about publishing actual factual news. The media In General were terrible in this case and it is this kind of case that proves that the mainstream media are no longer interested in publishing truthful unbiased news ... and there seems to be no penalty for them when they publish untruths or stories that hint or lead people to incorrect in conclusions.

    I don’t read the Irish indo anymore either... more interested in agendas than news...


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    #357
    TheChizler
    Registered Users Posts: 9,455 ✭✭✭TheChizler


    Sir Oxman wrote: »
    According to Bulgaria, no.
    It was registered there in 2017 and hasn't entered Bulgaria since.
    Several news outlets have published a map of the route with a line drawn directly between Bulgaria and Rosslare, that's like me saying I go via China on my route to work because I was there a few years ago. Effin stupid reporting, they're all rushing to be first with a timeline and details, doesn't matter if they're correct.

    And that's bottom of the list of things I should be outraged about, I can't comprehend the bigger tragedy right now.


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    #358
    Sir Oxman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,492 ✭✭✭Sir Oxman


    LillySV wrote: »
    I stopped watching channel 4 news a long time ago... they’re more interested in pushing their left leaning bull**** than they are about publishing actual factual news. The media In General were terrible in this case and it is this kind of case that proves that the mainstream media are no longer interested in publishing truthful unbiased news ... and there seems to be no penalty for them when they publish untruths or stories that hint or lead people to incorrect in conclusions.

    I don’t read the Irish indo anymore either... more interested in agendas than news...
    I actually like C4 News to be honest but that bit of gouging last night was totally wrong.


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    #359
    Bob the Seducer
    Registered Users Posts: 1,178 ✭✭✭Bob the Seducer


    Having followed the coverage over the past 24 hours, it feels like there are a number of key details missing from the reporting of this incident that a good journalist would seek to establish.

    From what we know, the driver being held was in possession of the trailer for at most 35 minutes, why is that never properly highlighted?

    A number of articles reference the emergency services "discovering" the bodies at 1:40, did they? or did the person who reported the incident to them?

    Who is the person who made that report?

    The refrigerated trailer is allegedly owned by a haulage leasing company, who was it leased to?

    When was the trailer delivered to the port at Zeebrugge?

    Who delivered it to the port there?

    Are they currently being held in custody somewhere?

    Where did the trailer come from before it got to Zeebrugge?

    Instead of answers to those questions, we get the initial misinformation from the police followed by a day of half edited and at best half researched articles...


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    #360
    McMurphy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,365 ✭✭✭✭McMurphy


    I'm not one for conspiracy theories, but would the UK press, especially the more rabid brexiteer peddling ones be zoning in on the "Irish connection" both in a case of one upmanship, due to the EU having Ireland's back during their negotiations, but also to drive home the illegal migrants message they want to reinforce ref their borders?


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    #361
    weldoninhio
    Closed Accounts Posts: 14,311 ✭✭✭✭weldoninhio


    kravmaga wrote: »
    The owner of the truck who is allegedly an Irish woman according to the Bulgarian embassy should be arrested imo.

    The truck is registered in Bulgaria but has not been seen in Bulgaria since 2017??

    On what charge?? Irish Ferries ships are registered in Cyprus, how often do you think they are used over there?? :rolleyes:


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