39 people found dead in trailer in UK

Calypso Realm

BBC just now announced two more people (no further details) have been arrested in connection with this tragedy.

celt262

Calypso Realm wrote: »

BBC just now announced two more people (no further details) have been arrested in connection with this tragedy.

Ok let us know when you have more info.

Thanks

Calypso Realm

Sky new just now said a man and woman in Warrington, Cheshire.Both late thirties. Lorry driver still in custody.

4068ac1elhodqr

splinter65 wrote: »

Can’t get these poor people out of my head. BBC this morning says that official China are reporting it on official TV but omitting to say that the dead are Chinese.
Obviously official China will never admit that China is not perfect nor will they admit that Chinese people would choose to live anywhere other than China.
Millions of people in rural remote China are living in poverty. These people smuggling gangs apparently show them “The Darling Buds of May” and suchlike and tell them this is what it’s like in UK. Beautiful scenery and good well paid jobs for everyone.
They don’t tell them that you will probably drown while collecting whelks on Morecombe Bay or in a lorry in Essex.

The Chinese state (with a booming economy of their own) should show them episodes of Eastenders insted, to highlight the dreary cockney lifestyle that may await. E.g. Hanging around a launderette gossiping, or stewing the afternoon away in that old q'vic pub - likely void of sunlight, and whiffing of of fags and wee.

There has been another similar story emmerging this week of East African teenagers slowly and steadily appearing around the harbour in Belfast, likely also coming out of some random port containers.

UK officials said on the news this morning they only check 1 out of every 300 or 400 containers, as there is so many. The many dozens of smaller ports in the SE coast are un/under-manned.

partyguinness

I am not a HGV driver but as a matter interest, when a cab driver picks up a sealed refrigerated container do they open it to check contents or does it remain sealed and they simply drive it off no questions asked?

dd973

Won't be the last time such a thing happens, the UK, especially the big English cities and the South East are uniquely vulnerable to mass migration, no language, bureaucracy or culture to get past or navigate as you'd have to in Denmark or Austria. Other nations, even us, to a certain extent play by the rules. Over there is a bottomless pit of toilets like Hounslow, Luton, Slough, Hayes, Wembley, Handsworth, Leicester, Salford, Brent, Tower Hamlets, Bradford et al to vanish into and live in the shadow economy that Blighty Plc admonishes on one hand and actively encourages on the other, cheap labour, uber drivers, etc.

The composition of the UK nation state as well is a factor, most countries are ethnocentric in the sense of having to be from there or naturalised there in order to hold it's passport and call yourself Irish, Dutch, German, Portuguese, etc, 'British' or 'UK' is a nothing no-mark nationality, why shouldn't an Englishman for example have an English passport and a Scot, a Scottish one? British Nationalists abhor such a notion because of the hornet's nest it would open up.

partyguinness

theguzman wrote: »

The young lad looks totally innocent, he loved being a truck driver and had it plastered all over facebook, he even had his truck pimped out too. Not the typical persona of a criminal to me.

From what I understand that cab was leased by him. That is certainly on the news here in England.

mikhail

splinter65 wrote: »

Can’t get these poor people out of my head. BBC this morning says that official China are reporting it on official TV but omitting to say that the dead are Chinese.

I don't know about the Chinese language sources, but China Daily, the English mouthpiece of the party, says

British police said the death of 39 people, reportedly to be Chinese nationals, found in a truck in Essex, United Kingdom, has led to the largest murder investigation in the force's history.

The Chinese Embassy has sent a team led by the minister-counsellor in charge of consular affairs to Essex, England. They have met with the local police. The police said that they are verifying the identity of the deceased, whose nationality still cannot be confirmed.

...

In a statement, Essex Police said, "We have since confirmed that eight of the deceased are women and 31 are men and all are believed to be Chinese nationals." The incident, the statement went on to say, has"led to the largest murder investigation in our force's history".

http://global.chinadaily.com.cn/a/201910/25/WS5db1f15ba310cf3e355737af.html

Further checking is needed to know whether they are Chinese citizens, but judging from the local police's press release, the possibility is quite high.

http://global.chinadaily.com.cn/a/201910/25/WS5db23a2ca310cf3e35573842.html
That second article is an opinion piece, and reads a bit odd to me. It's clearly a reaction to local blogging, but without knowing what it's reacting to it's hard to tell whether it's representing it fairly.

Yet at the same time, a peculiar voice emerged. Seemingly knowledgeable about the UK, the voice proudly stated on micro blogs that the UK is a destination for tens of thousands of illegal stowaways every year, and there is high possibility that the 39 victims are illegal immigrants.

Some even guessed the 39 victims entered the lorry "willingly" in the hope of reaching their "dreamland", implying that the 39 should not get sympathy.

That point of view is so unusual that any human with a basic conscience won't agree.

B.A._Baracus

the_pen_turner wrote: »

I don't like talking like this either

I don't see why it would not work
There are holes dug all over rural Ireland every day .
I don't see why uk would be different

I'm not saying an average Joe could do it bit well organised gang easily could.


Your not giving any reason why it couldn't be done

Logical thinking. That's why.
So you say a farm.... Forget "controlled" what you mean to say is know someone who has a field. Cause no joe-human-traffiker is gonna be a farmer in his day job and then bury people on his property. Same goes for "someone you know" - they aint gonna let the scumbag gang roll in with a JCB being told "don't ask" and if its ever discovered its on you the farmer.

suppose where you gonna get that JCB too? Drive to the local plant hire and say you're name is mickey mouse and rent one out?
Gonna drive that big truck and trailer on to some mucky grounds a mile out of sight?

So your plan is to somehow rent a JCB. Call a mate who just automatically has a farm ..... actually. this is messed up i'm talking about this. I'm out.

buttercups88

Calypso Realm wrote: »

BBC just now announced two more people (no further details) have been arrested in connection with this tragedy.

They were the couple who registered the truck in Bulgaria, but this morning claimed theyd sold it to a company based in Monaghan. They presented themselves to the police when they heard it was that truck

armaghlad

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Logical thinking. That's why.
So you say a farm.... Forget "controlled" what you mean to say is know someone who has a field. Cause no joe-human-traffiker is gonna be a farmer in his day job and then bury people on his property. Same goes for "someone you know" - they aint gonna let the scumbag gang roll in with a JCB being told "don't ask" and if its ever discovered its on you the farmer.

suppose where you gonna get that JCB too? Drive to the local plant hire and say you're name is mickey mouse and rent one out?
Gonna drive that big truck and trailer on to some mucky grounds a mile out of sight?

So your plan is to somehow rent a JCB. Call a mate who just automatically has a farm ..... actually. this is messed up i'm talking about this. I'm out.

Considering there was a gang stealing jcbs for fun along the border it’s not beyond the realms of possibility that this snakehead Chinese gang (if it is indeed them responsible) has the means to dispose of 39 bodies if they so wished.

the_pen_turner

Lady Spangles wrote: »

These people do have friends and families. Some are bound to know where they were going and start wondering why they haven't heard from them in a while.

Some would have family members/friends already in the UK and they will be waiting for them to arrive. It is a myth that if an immigrant in the UK has family in another country, they get automatic asylum. So they too would have to stowaway.

Now, the hole big enough to bury 39 bodies. England isn't really like Ireland, there's actually very few huge open spaces where the bodies could be buried. It's all farmland or public parkland. It's a very built up country with a large population. Ground disturbance is very easy to spot. A mass grave would be detected pretty quickly, actually. In fact, you probably wouldn't get away with doing this in rural Ireland, either.

Yes these people have family and friends. But they cant really walk into a police station and report it


I'm not going to get into how big a hole but it wouldn't need to be that big

Of course you wouldn't get away with a huge bare patch in a field but beside a shed with a concrete yard over it wouldn't be questioned unless they were suspects

partyguinness

the_pen_turner wrote: »

Yes these people have family and friends. But they cant really walk into a police station and report it


I'm not going to get into how big a hole but it wouldn't need to be that big

Of course you wouldn't get away with a huge bare patch in a field but beside a shed with a concrete yard over it wouldn't be questioned unless they were suspects

Lads, seriously.

Lady Spangles

the_pen_turner wrote: »

Yes these people have family and friends. But they cant really walk into a police station and report it


I'm not going to get into how big a hole but it wouldn't need to be that big

Of course you wouldn't get away with a huge bare patch in a field but beside a shed with a concrete yard over it wouldn't be questioned unless they were suspects

Wait, so not only is the driver digging a mass grave, but now you also have him concreting over said mass grave. In a farmer's field. Don't you think the farmer will notice that one of his fields is suddenly concreted over? He might get a bit pissed about that, don't you think? The same goes for public parklands - you can't just rock up in Hyde Park or whatever and dig a mass grave.

And if the family members already in the UK have had their asylum applications accepted (likely, btw), then yes they can go to the police. Or they can go to a support charity (if they're illegally staying in the country) and raise concerns through a third party. Family members in China who suspect something amiss can also contact British authorities.

No one exists in isolation anymore. No one. If 39 people suddenly poof into thin air, it will be noticed.

Like others have stated, your theory is a great crime/thriller novel. But it has no basis in the real world.

Gynoid

I dunno, maybe I watch too much Scandinavian crime drama and my head is a dark place , but I don't think it is completely unfeasible for bad people to get rid of 39 bodies. A hole back filled with cement, pulping, acid, whatever - if there is gang involvement one would imagine there are ways and means. If this lad was involved I would have thought the first person he would have called was his handlers or boss, or someone up the chain in the gang - not the ambulance. Anyways maybe there are details left out which implicate him more. But getting rid of bodies, doesn't seem a stretch to me. I remember when foot and mouth hit the UK in 2001, there was a cull of 6 million animals in a short space of time and I travelled by train to London and the huge lines of pyres stretched smouldering to the horizon. Grim. Made me think pretty much anything can happen or be done.

the_pen_turner

Lady Spangles wrote: »

Wait, so not only is the driver digging a mass grave, but now you also have him concreting over said mass grave. In a farmer's field. Don't you think the farmer will notice that one of his fields is suddenly concreted over? He might get a bit pissed about that, don't you think? The same goes for public parklands - you can't just rock up in Hyde Park or whatever and dig a mass grave.

And if the family members already in the UK have had their asylum applications accepted (likely, btw), then yes they can go to the police. Family members in China who suspect something amiss can also contact British authorities.

No exists in isolation anymore. No one. If 39 people suddenly poof into thin air, it will be noticed.

Like others have stated, your theory is a great crime/thriller novel. But it has no basis in the real world.

Where are you getting this random field or park from.
I'm saying that a gang involved in these things would have remote places available to them. Look at all the money printing places and fuel laundering places that exist. Not to mention drugs grow houses.

By the time families notice or get anyone to listen a week or 2 will have passed and it will be very hard to track down.

Lady Spangles

the_pen_turner wrote: »

Where are you getting this random field or park from.
I'm saying that a gang involved in these things would have remote places available to them. Look at all the money printing places and fuel laundering places that exist. Not to mention drugs grow houses.

By the time families notice or get anyone to listen a week or 2 will have passed and it will be very hard to track down.

You're the one coming off with all this stuff about bodies being buried in farmer's fields and remote locations. Don't try and deflect onto me. You asked for reasons why your theory could not possibly work and now I, and several others, have told you.

It is impossible. It is impractical. It's a little bit silly, too. Are you winding us up?

Cushie Butterfield

The bodies have been recovered, so there's little point in sharing these fantasies. Certain posters need to take a nap. Either that or watch some reruns of Brookside.

According to RTE NewsNow the couple from Warrington have been arrested on suspicion of manslaughter and conspiracy to traffic people

https://www.rte.ie/news/2019/1025/1085517-essex-post-mortem/

Calypso Realm

Interesting update on ITV now about arrest of two in Warrington. Arrested on suspicion of manslaughter and conspiracy to traffic while the driver has been detained on suspicion of murder.

Reckon the net is closing in here and we'll have more updates fairly shortly.

4068ac1elhodqr

Would it not be more likely these poor people were trafficked in for some 'black market slave labour' type scenario. e.g. Agriculture or fisheries.
China seems a very, very long and diffuclt way to travel for the other secondary explanation (of refugee application) in the distant island of Britian.

No Bills

buttercups88 wrote: »

They were the couple who registered the truck in Bulgaria, but this morning claimed theyd sold it to a company based in Monaghan. They presented themselves to the police when they heard it was that truck

This report names the previous owner of the truck:
https://www.cheshire-live.co.uk/news/chester-cheshire-news/warrington-woman-named-previous-owner-17145770

Calypso Realm

Esperanza Whispering Receiver wrote: »

Would it not be more likely these poor people were trafficked in for some 'black market slave labour' type scenario. e.g. Agriculture or fisheries.
China seems a very, very long and diffuclt way to travel for the other secondary explanation (of refugee application) in the distant island of Britian.

Interestingly they interview a (Chinese) solicitor last night on BBC news who explained it was very probable a lot of these poor people were hoping to join relatives already here in UK. Cited areas in London like Chinatown/Soho as likely desitnations. Could easily be immersed into society there, plenty of work in restaurants etc amongst their own community.

4068ac1elhodqr

Calypso Realm wrote: »

Interestingly they interview a (Chinese) solicitor last night on BBC news who explained it was very probable a lot of these poor people were hoping to join relatives already here in UK. Cited areas in London like Chinatown/Soho as likely desitnations. Could easily be immersed into society there, plenty of work in restaurants etc amongst their own community.

Interesting that the media instantly adopted the term 'refugees' when there was an organised crime signature to it.

And yes these (all) Chinese (like other Far East regions), are often used as cheap labour, in non-public facing industries from agri-fishing or back of house catering.

Strange to consider with that major superpower (growing GDP at nearly 7%), and not 'at war', wouldn't offer endless opportunites to progress.

the_pen_turner

Lady Spangles wrote: »

You're the one coming off with all this stuff about bodies being buried in farmer's fields and remote locations. Don't try and deflect onto me. You asked for reasons why your theory could not possibly work and now I, and several others, have told you.

It is impossible. It is impractical. It's a little bit silly, too. Are you winding us up?

Are you winding up.

My theory is very possible and, very practical. Nothing wrong with silly.

My point is that a well run gang could have hidden this whole situation . To me that shows the driver have very little to do with how they got to him

Calypso Realm

Latest is Human Rights group in Hanoi on Sky News said a Vietnamese woman fears her daughter is one of the victims. Sent a text saying she couldn't breathe (horrific thought) at one point to her. Last she heard from her.

splinter65

Breaking news on the BBC is that 3 Vietnamese families have contacted them regarding their loved ones who they last heard from on Tuesday,
One family said that their daughter phoned them to say that she was suffocating.
They’ve not heard from her since.
Two other families said that the people traffickers have returned their money.

splinter65

the_pen_turner wrote: »

Are you winding up.

My theory is very possible and, very practical. Nothing wrong with silly.

My point is that a well run gang could have hidden this whole situation . To me that shows the driver have very little to do with how they got to him

It’s one of the most riduculous things I’ve ever read here.

buttercups88

splinter65 wrote: »

Breaking news on the BBC is that 3 Vietnamese families have contacted them regarding their loved ones who they last heard from on Tuesday,
One family said that their daughter phoned them to say that she was suffocating.
They’ve not heard from her since.
Two other families said that the people traffickers have returned their money.

That is horrific to hear imagine getting that phone call and being helpless to do anything. And then as for the traffickers returning money

Calypso Realm

buttercups88 wrote: »

That is horrific to hear imagine getting that phone call and being helpless to do anything. And then as for the traffickers returning money

Yes, and apparently it was £30,000. Jeez.

splinter65

buttercups88 wrote: »

That is horrific to hear imagine getting that phone call and being helpless to do anything. And then as for the traffickers returning money

Yeah. “Bit of a hitch Mrs your kid is dead. Lookit I’m in a generous mood today and I’m a decent guy so here’s your money back. Sure listen, you can try again with one of your other kids next year when the heat dies down. Have a good weekend now”.