Galway traffic

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

Note, I say this as someone who lives out in the county and uses a private car to access the city center currently. I am dreaming of the day when I can park outside the city, unlock my bike from secure storage and cycle the rest of the way in.

I just cannot understand why someone would want to bring this hardship on themselves, it’s mind boggling to me as it’s just so far removed from anything I would want to do.

Like cycling to work if it’s within 5km or so of home and the weather is good is certainly something that makes sense some of the time anyway or similar scenarios but P&R or P&C are just horrible prospects with nothing but compromise and disadvantages compared to driving door to door.

Pinch Flat

The problem though with driving door to door is when everyone wants to do it. Then you end up with a congested city full of 20% full vehicles.

Mrs OBumble

Deleted User wrote: »

I am dreaming of the day when I can park outside the city, unlock my bike from secure storage and cycle the rest of the way in.

Where will you leave the bicycle when you get to your destination? Because if a substantial number are cycling, your journey will need to end with a walk from the cycle-park to the end-point.


Personally I'm dreaming of the day when people living outside the city rarely have to travel to the city-centre at all. Ideally, outside-the-city residents get jobs near where they live. Worse case, they usually remote work and only travel in occasionally. City-suburbs residents walk, use shared transport (which needs a re-design for social distancing), or cycle or drive (personal vehicles further down the hierarchy than shared). City-centre residents walk.

gordongekko

Deleted User wrote: »

That is the opposite of balanced.

That is saying, do not inconvenience private cars until there is a ring road, in the meantime, leave buses stuck in traffic, cyclists afraid to cycle and pedestrians being relegated to third class citizens.

That pov also does not take account of the fact that the roads were at or above capacity prior to covid and with the reduced numbers using buses due to dfistancing, some other solution is required.

Sorry, the day of the private car having primacy in terms of Galway city center are numbered.

Galway city has simply run out of time and can no longer sit on its collective hands.

The new "balanced approach" is as follows

1. Pedestrians first
2. Cyclists second
3. Buses third
4. Private cars last and only as an afterthought once all of the above have been catered for

Note, I say this as someone who lives out in the county and uses a private car to access the city center currently. I am dreaming of the day when I can park outside the city, unlock my bike from secure storage and cycle the rest of the way in.

The 5 odd busses travelling along the corridor per hour wont ship someone from donegal to NUHG for cancer treatment. The 5 busses or taxis wont have bike storage for your bike. The bus corridor wont have a roof on it for pedestrians getting soaked on their way to work. Busses will only work if they are efficient and run on time. This wont happen if they are stuck further out in traffic as car are being forced down roads that cant handle the traffic. Closing the bridge solves nothing and only adds to problems.

what_traffic

gordongekko wrote: »

The 5 odd busses travelling along the corridor per hour .... The 5 busses or taxis wont have bike storage ....

Where are you going with this 5 no? It weakens your argument. Whats the exact no right now?
I'm sure Mrs OBumble who has indepth knowledge of the bus services will be able to inform us here that far more bus's than that use the Salmon Weir Bridge, even during Covid.

The logic you talk about of bus network clogging up outside the corridor?
Looks like City Council are starting to address aspects of that on the East Side of City?
https://connachttribune.ie/proposed-city-bus-corridor-on-dublin-road-to-go-to-public-consultation/

For the West - Western Distributor Road can handle Bus and Cycle Lanes as far as Cappagh Road similar to that along Seamus Quirke Road/Bishop O Donnell Road. 11yrs ago Council submitted a proposal for that (Western Distributor Road) to Dept of Transport. A Smarter Travel City Submission, was costed then at €10million

Launched back in late July, the "Bike Life" report was completed by Sustrans, the UK sustainable transport charity in partnership with the NTA in Ireland.

The information in the report comes from local cycling data, modelling and an independent, demographically representative survey of more than 1,100 residents from across the Dublin Metropolitan Area, whether they cycled or not.

Key findings from Bike Life Dublin include:

• Nearly a quarter of adults cycle at least once a week in the Dublin metropolitan area, with 11% cycling five days a week or more
• 21% of adults don’t currently cycle but would like to
• Residents want segregated cycling infrastructure to cycle more
• 70% would find more traffic-free cycle routes away from roads, e.g. through parks or along waterways useful to help them cycle more
• 69% would find more cycle tracks along roads, physically separated from traffic and pedestrians useful to help them cycle more
• 84% of residents also support building more physically separated on-road cycle tracks, even when this would mean less space for other road traffic
• Cycling in the Dublin area takes up to 60,000 cars off the roads each day
• Every year cycling in Dublin saves 28,000 tonnes of greenhouse gas emissions, equivalent to carbon footprint of 400,000 people taking flights from Dublin to London Heathrow
• Cycling creates €258.5 million in economic benefits for the individual and society annually

Full info, including the main report, methodology, maps etc all available here

xckjoo

Jazmin Harsh Gold wrote: »

I just cannot understand why someone would want to bring this hardship on themselves, it’s mind boggling to me as it’s just so far removed from anything I would want to do.

Like cycling to work if it’s within 5km or so of home and the weather is good is certainly something that makes sense some of the time anyway or similar scenarios but P&R or P&C are just horrible prospects with nothing but compromise and disadvantages compared to driving door to door.

Because a lot of people don't see it as a hardship. Or at least would pick it over the hardship of wasting their lives sitting in traffic staring at brake lights. Door to door in a car is not feasible large scale without massive traffic jams. Even the likes of LA which grew up with the car have this issue and they've roads everywhere. It's just not possible. They're too inefficient and moving volumes of people around

gordongekko

what_traffic wrote: »

Where are you going with this 5 no? It weakens your argument. Whats the exact no right now?

Apologies its 11 during the week and a grand total of 4 on a sunday. And of course the bus corridor covers all of newcastle, dangan, shantalla, salthill ...... It does in its bleep.

TwoWheeledTim

gordongekko wrote: »

Apologies its 11 during the week and a grand total of 4 on a sunday. And of course the bus corridor covers all of newcastle, dangan, shantalla, salthill ...... It does in its bleep.

It's 24 city buses crossing the bridge per hour, currently getting held up in traffic from private motorists and screwing with the timetables.

Edit: And between 12 and 14 per hour on a Sunday (as some services are every 40mins).

(ignoring that City Direct are reglecting their services at the moment)

"gordongekko

"gordongekko wrote: »

And of course the bus corridor covers all of newcastle, dangan, shantalla, salthill ...... It does in its bleep.

Dead right, we DO need more bus priority infrastructure

what_traffic

gordongekko wrote: »

Apologies its 11 during the week and a grand total of 4 on a sunday.

Might be handy to list them all for others on the thread here.
Bus's that use Salmon Weir Bridge
#404 (Newcastle -> Oranmore)
#405 (Rahoon -> Ballybane)
#402 (Seacrest - Eyre Square)
#410 CITY DIRECT *
#411 CITY DIRECT *
#412 CITY DIRECT *
Have Connemara Regional bus services as well.
CityLink North Connemara and Bus Eireann South Connemara

* CITY DIRECT services not operating during Pandemic.

TwoWheeledTim

Midweek
404 - 2/hr outbound, 2/hr inbound
405 - 3/hr outbound, 3/hr inbound
412 - 2/hr outbound, 2/hr inbound
411 - 2/hr outbound, 2/hr inbound
402 - 2/hr outbound, 2/hr inbound
410 - 1/hr outbound, 1/hr inbound

Sundays
404 - 2/hr outbound, 2/hr inbound
405 - 1.5/hr outbound, 1.5/hr inbound (every 40mins)
411 - 2/hr outbound, 2/hr inbound
402 - 1/hr outbound, 1/hr inbound

Mrs OBumble

Also:

GoBus Ballina service, which is suspended due to the pandemic, 4 buses per day.

Lots of Thurs/Friday and Sunday services thst operate during college terms ( too many to list).

In the summer lots of tour coaches which park near the cathedral.






I still don't believe that closing the bridge to cars is the right approach, though.

TwoWheeledTim

Also pretty sure the Citylink to Clifden uses that bridge, 12 buses a day. And 419 regional bus goes that route, another 22 buses per day.

I’m surprised there isn’t more uproar of the fact that no bus service is operating to one of the biggest residential areas in the city now that city direct are refusing to operate.

I think this demonstrates why a private operator should not be running city centre bus routes unless they are to be compelled by contract to operate which they obviously are not.

TwoWheeledTim

There's growing anger in Knocknacarra and there will be pressure to resolve it before the schools open.

They should have the routes taken off them. It should be like the airline routes, use them and provide the service or lose them.

It would have some advantages if BE took them over, would allow for a single monthly ticket to cover the city.

gordongekko

TwoWheeledTim wrote: »

Midweek
404 - 2/hr outbound, 2/hr inbound
405 - 3/hr outbound, 3/hr inbound
412 - 2/hr outbound, 2/hr inbound
411 - 2/hr outbound, 2/hr inbound
402 - 2/hr outbound, 2/hr inbound
410 - 1/hr outbound, 1/hr inbound

Sundays
404 - 2/hr outbound, 2/hr inbound
405 - 1.5/hr outbound, 1.5/hr inbound (every 40mins)
411 - 2/hr outbound, 2/hr inbound
402 - 1/hr outbound, 1/hr inbound

I was talking about outbound

401 1 an hour on sundays
404 1 an hour on sundays
405 1 an hour on sundays
410 1 an hour on sundays
I missed the 411 which is hourly on a sunday
Clearly there is no such thing as a half bus.

Wow 5 busses an hour, closing down this bridge and running this service will really solve the transport requirements for about 30000 people.

Do they still only run until 7pm also? Madness if so.

A route like that should have busses until late for people getting home from nights out etc.

TwoWheeledTim

Where are you getting your info??

gordongekko wrote: »

I was talking about outbound

Why? The bridge is 2-way.

gordongekko wrote: »

401 1 an hour on sundays

401 doesn't go that way.

gordongekko wrote: »

404 1 an hour on sundays

It's 2 an hour each way on Sundays.
https://www.buseireann.ie/inner.php?id=406&form-view-timetables-from=&form-view-timetables-to=&form-view-timetables-route=404&form-view-timetables-submit=1

gordongekko wrote: »

405 1 an hour on sundays

It's 1.5 an hour each way on Sundays, every 40mins.
https://www.buseireann.ie/inner.php?id=406&form-view-timetables-from=Shangort+Rd+%28Church%29&form-view-timetables-to=&form-view-timetables-route=405&form-view-timetables-submit=1

gordongekko wrote: »

410 1 an hour on sundays

410 doesn't run Sundays.

gordongekko wrote: »

I missed the 411 which is hourly on a sunday

You did, and it runs 2 an hour each way on a Sunday.
https://www.citydirect.ie/route-411

You also forgot the 402.
That runs 1 an hour each way on a Sunday.
https://www.buseireann.ie/inner.php?id=406&form-view-timetables-from=&form-view-timetables-to=&form-view-timetables-route=402&form-view-timetables-submit=1

gordongekko wrote: »

Clearly there is no such thing as a half bus.

There is if you're breaking it down to an hourly rate. Otherwise your calculations would show a bus every 40 mins being 2 buses in 2 hours... you'd skip a bus.

gordongekko wrote: »

Wow 5 busses an hour, closing down this bridge and running this service will really solve the transport requirements for about 30000 people.

These aren't empty buses, they can transport people.

Also you're ignoring all the regional buses that use the route.

gordongekko

gordongekko wrote: »

I was talking about outbound

401 1 an hour on sundays
404 1 an hour on sundays
405 1 an hour on sundays
410 1 an hour on sundays
I missed the 411 which is hourly on a sunday
Clearly there is no such thing as a half bus.

Wow 5 busses an hour, closing down this bridge and running this service will really solve the transport requirements for about 30000 people.

Ah stop willya, you're making yourself look awful silly.

You made a silly claim, got called on it and now you are narrowing your definition to make it as small as possible to fit your original bogus claim.

You might disagree with the plan to remove private cars from the Salmon Weir, thats fine, but it looks like its going to be happening no matter what as no further increase in bus services or routes will occur in Galway without it. It's a significant part of the main bus priority corridor through the city center so its either fully implemented or its not implemented at all. The Salmon Weir bridge changes are only one small part of it.

what_traffic

Could be a strong chance this BUS gate on Salmon Weir will only operate 12h a day seven days a week?
08h00->20h00 or 07h00 -> 19h00

Mrs OBumble

Jazmin Harsh Gold wrote: »

I’m surprised there isn’t more uproar of the fact that no bus service is operating to one of the biggest residential areas in the city now that city direct are refusing to operate.

I think this demonstrates why a private operator should not be running city centre bus routes unless they are to be compelled by contract to operate which they obviously are not.

It's a topic for a different thread.


Whether it's city or country buses is irrelevant.

The core issue is that private companies cannot run at a loss. If the government wants guaranteed services, they need to subsidise them.

BE kept running because they are subsidised. (But it was mad how many empty buses were on the road in April/May.)

Other companies pulled all or most of their services, because there was such little demand.

GoBus are still stopped, with no sign of a return. Ditto BusFeda and Healys. Farrells tried restarting, but demand was too low so they stopped again. N63 have a limited service. Burkes have restarted a lot of their services. Citylink started again last Friday.


Remember, if it wasn't for private companies, most of these services would not have started ever. BE had no interest in running services to thev north end of Knocknacarra.

what_traffic

what_traffic wrote: »

Could be a strong chance this BUS gate on Salmon Weir will only operate 12h a day seven days a week?
08h00->20h00 or 07h00 -> 19h00

That would probably suffice in terms of allowing free flow of buses but it would also be a bit of a bad move given the history of the bus gates in Dublin where they tried something similar

timmyntc

what_traffic wrote: »

Could be a strong chance this BUS gate on Salmon Weir will only operate 12h a day seven days a week?
08h00->20h00 or 07h00 -> 19h00

Nice idea, but would never have the enforcement required.

timmyntc

timmyntc wrote: »

Nice idea, but would never have the enforcement required.

No enforcement required, access is controlled by retractable bollards, same system in use around the world for the last 2 decades

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iNCiO4tB-_Y

what_traffic

Deleted User wrote: »

That would probably suffice in terms of allowing free flow of buses but it would also be a bit of a bad move given the history of the bus gates in Dublin where they tried something similar

Could see the engineers in City Hall go we want 24/7 Bus Lane and then Cllrs kick up and then Engineers say - meet us half way. Go with a 12h Bus gate. Could see a bit of horse trading going with it.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

No enforcement required, access is controlled by retractable bollards, same system in use around the world for the last 2 decades

Hmm, Its possible this will be light controlled based on the bus connects videos below. Guess we'll have to wait and see whats implemented

timmyntc

Deleted User wrote: »

No enforcement required, access is controlled by retractable bollards, same system in use around the world for the last 2 decades

Would cause havoc for all the county/private buses - can't imagine all of them bangers of buses being upgraded to work with the rectractable bollards.

Youtube link isnt working, so I dont know does that address it - are these retractable bollards the RFID or similar short range wireless ones to detect a bus?
Because getting that stuff retrofitted onto a handful of private bus operators would be a stretch.

gordongekko

Deleted User wrote: »

You made a silly claim, got called on it and now you are narrowing your definition to make it as small as possible to fit your original bogus claim.

I was asked about my calculation and i explained it. People are expanding the calculation to include county busses to suit their argument. This is the city forum hence why i didn't include them.

At the end of the day if a few small businesses in salthill can get a nice addition of a cycle lane stopped there is noway this is happen as it will discommode thousands of people and harm businesses west of the corrib.

https://galwaybayfm.ie/galway-bay-fm-news-desk/proposed-city-bus-corridor-on-dublin-road-to-go-to-public-consultation/

Proposed city bus corridor on Dublin Road to go to public consultation

Plans for the development of a bus corridor on the Dublin Road in the city are to go to public consultation at the end of this month.

The proposed development would see the construction of a 4 kilometre multi-modal corridor, accommodating buses, motorists, cyclists and pedestrians.

The corridor would run from Martin Roundabout out to Moneenageisha, and would serve as the main route for bus services to Renmore, Merlin Park, Doughiska, Parkmore and Oranmore, as well as all regional bus services from Galway City.

Skerritt Roundabout would also be upgraded to a junction as part of the project.

The development aims to improve journey times for motorists, provide cycling facilities along the road and improve pedestrian infrastructure.

The proposal is due to go to public consultation at the end of the month and remain open for six weeks.

Local Councillor Owen Hanley says the development will benefit all road users….