Achill asylum centre cancelled - mod warning in OP (01/11/19)

zell12

Is that the first time a government minister/Taoiseach has ever mentioned 'illegal immigration' 'illegal entry' 'fake documents' 'stepping up controls at the airports to stop them coming in' ?

enricoh

By Jaysus, the Sunday indo is doing their level best to keep the asylum spoofer industry going anyway! No mention of 30 odd males that were originally meant to go there, that were replaced by 13 women.
Shameful reporting, as per usual. Now every town shut up n take what we deem as your quota.

suicide_circus

two decades of gross governmental mismanagement of the asylum process fostering chronic abuse of the system by applicants and profiteers. People are saying "No".

xckjoo

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

Not really bothered about their leanings tbh, the information shared was from the first day the thing was announced. This was the same information that was shared with the community. It states up to 70 asylum seekers would be arriving the next day. The meeting was called for that evening. The guy claimed what I was saying was barstool talk, but this shows that this is in fact not the case.

You should care about their leanings if you care about being told the truth like said previously. I haven't been following the story too closely but from what I've heard from my Achill relatives, it was this crowd that were the only original source and they were clearly exaggerating everything to cause a panic. To me the real issue here is that the government are allowing this kind of nonsense to flourish by not being forthcoming with the information in the first place. But they're also in a tough place since there's an established risk of extremists doing thing like burning places down.
I only posted that because I thought you seemed reasonable and were complaining about the information being by officials as being downplayed over time. This crowd are not official and have established biases and alterior motives. I don't normally bother posting in these kinds of threads as most of the posters that do are borderline unhinged and only interested in furthering their own biased beliefs.

high_king wrote: »

I wouldn't worry, said poster, like many others, has a history of hating any Irish person not from Dublin and jumping on or making up any anti "rural" (or rather so called rural) Ireland story he can find.

Me? Lol. I'm as wesht as they come mate. Any more and my ancestors would have been fish.

Hal3000

I don’t care if this is an election stunt by Leo, once it’s followed up with robust procedures, integration plans and accountability and deportation for scam artists and immigrants - asylum seekers if they commit serious crimes then it’s all good. Weeding out the bad who ruin it for the good. You know the DOJ actually following through and doing it’s job.

RandomName2

I like to see the figures Leo is looking at.

Also this leads to additional questions. If this is true, how are Albanians and Georgians getting here? Albania is on the border of the EU, so do they just inter-rail and get on a ferry to Ireland. What about Georgians? Are either of these countries actually eligble in general for refugee status? If these are the two biggest sources of growth, does that mean that they account for the largest sources of asylum seekers, or that they have merely been increasing faster than other sources?

Ah. I know that we aren't going to get answers to any of this. It's frustrating.

lola85

RandomName2 wrote: »

I like to see the figures Leo is looking at.

Also this leads to additional questions. If this is true, how are Albanians and Georgians getting here? Albania is on the border of the EU, so do they just inter-rail and get on a ferry to Ireland. What about Georgians? Are either of these countries actually eligble in general for refugee status? If these are the two biggest sources of growth, does that mean that they account for the largest sources of asylum seekers, or that they have merely been increasing faster than other sources?

Ah. I know that we aren't going to get answers to any of this. It's frustrating.

And how many of these are accounted in the “homeless” figures.

We’re led to believe we have 10,000 Irish people homeless which is absolute nonsense.

enricoh

Hal3000 wrote: »

I don’t care if this is an election stunt by Leo, once it’s followed up with robust procedures, integration plans and accountability and deportation for scam artists and immigrants - asylum seekers if they commit serious crimes then it’s all good. Weeding out the bad who ruin it for the good. You know the DOJ actually following through and doing it’s job.

Complete election stunt,
next he's going to deal with rediculous compo payouts n then he going to look after the people who get up early n go to work.
All this will happen after the election of course, there was no time to do it the last 5 years!

lola85

enricoh wrote: »

Complete election stunt,
next he's going to deal with rediculous compo payouts n then he going to look after the people who get up early n go to work.
All this will happen after the election of course, there was no time to do it the last 5 years!

5 years?

Has he been Taoiseach 5 years?

Mad how time flies.

RandomName2

lola85 wrote: »

And how many of these are accounted in the “homeless” figures.

We’re led to believe we have 10,000 Irish people homeless which is absolute nonsense.

Yes, a bit more clarity all round would do wonders.

Even if the government's action are 100% in good faith, a bit more transparency would really improve matters. We are given fig leaves of information.

I accept that some figures are hard to come by, particularly when you are dealing with undocumented people, but the figures that we do have access to would be a start, at least.

Mules

Id be suspicious about varadkar's sudden interest in this. It's under his leadership that the weekly amount of money given to asylum seekers has doubled against advice from the department of finance. They said it would increase the numbers claiming asylum. He has also given them the right to work on top of keeping the weekly allowance and child benefit. He has also said he wants a large population increase. As Irish people aren't having enough children the increase will have to come from immigration.

John_Rambo

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

Actually the opposite was the case. It started as 70 'single' men arriving the next day. Then when people, understandably, starting querying it, it became 40 men in a few days

So to dispel the info as rumour, hearsay and barstool talk, who exactly told you there were 70 men arriving in Achill?

lola85

Mules wrote: »

Id be suspicious about varadkar's sudden interest in this. It's under his leadership that the weekly amount of money given to asylum seekers has doubled against advice from the department of finance. They said it would increase the numbers claiming asylum. He has also given them the right to work on top of keeping the weekly allowance and child benefit. He has also said he wants a large population increase. As Irish people aren't having enough children the increase will have to come from immigration.

Have you a link to where he said he wants a large population increase?

tuxy

lola85 wrote: »

5 years?

Has he been Taoiseach 5 years?

Mad how time flies.

Yup 14 June 2017 - 3 November 2019
5 years to the day, mad.

lola85

tuxy wrote: »

Yup 14 June 2017 - 3 November 2019
5 years to the day, mad.

Yep.

More fake news to add to the mountains of fake news in this thread.

Beechwoodspark

So what, he is suddenly getting interested in it with an election coming up the tracks. Fool me once...

lola85

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

So what, he is suddenly getting interested in it with an election coming up the tracks. Fool me once...

An election in may?

How dare the leader of a country get involved in a huge controversial topic 7 months out from an election.

Beasty

Please do not quote full articles from newspapers as that content is copyrighted

Only a single paragraph is permitted and there should also be a link to the source

Any questions PM me

Thanks

jay0109

I was speaking to someone in the Dept of Justice the other day who I had not seen in a while and we started discussing Achill and Ballinamore.
This person told me of the crack down on Georgians and Albanians and how they were not not being allowed to disembark until checks were carried out and that in fact, they were being mostly turned back around. This is as a direct result of the accommodation crisis. Otherwise they'd still be allowed to come in and claim asylum.
Just shows you the joke of a system that asylum is.

This person also told me that the budget for asylum accomm in 2019 is 70m and as we know from media reports, that budget has been blown and is expected to come in at 130m this year. A lot of that down to emergency accommodation in hotels for asylum seekers.
So the Dept asked Finance for an increase on that 130m for 2020 i.e. around 200m, as they say the numbers coming here are only going to keep increasing. What has Finance given them for next year.....80m in total :rolleyes:

The Dept aren't happy with the numbers coming here and the general feeling within that area is that the vast majority are economic and shouldn't be allowed through but the Legal industry and how it all looks with the UN and EU are major factors in letting them into the never ending system that the rest of us have to pay for

Balf

lola85 wrote: »

Have you a link to where he said he wants a large population increase?

I think what folk mean by this is population increase is announced by Government as a sign of success, and migration is a significant driver of this

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/irish-population-rises-by-64500-bringing-it-to-almost-5m-946672.html

... of the 54,900 people who emigrated from Ireland in the year ending April 2019, more than half —29,000 — were Irish nationals. As such, there was a decline of 2,100 in the number of Irish nationals in Ireland.

In comparison, there was a net increase of non-Irish nationals of 35,800 in the year ending April 2019. This now means non-Irish nationals represent 12.7% of the population, some 622,700.....

Taoiseach Leo Varadkar said: “Ireland’s population now approaching 5m. More people living, working, and raising families in Ireland than at any point since independence. Our people are our greatest strength.”

Balf

John_Rambo wrote: »

So to dispel the info as rumour, hearsay and barstool talk, who exactly told you there were 70 men arriving in Achill?

I don't think the figure of 70 was ever officially confirmed or denied.

https://midwestradio.ie/index.php/news/34434-confusing-response-from-dept-of-justice-re-asylum-seekers-being-housed-in-achill

If you check back on the thread you'll see where the official confirmation initially spoke of 40 men, then 38 people before finally trumpeting it was 13 vulnerable women.

How this rests with the original statement saying "To protect the identification and privacy of applicants and other guests, we do not publicly identify these premises." is not clear at this point.

MayoAreMagic

xckjoo wrote: »

You should care about their leanings if you care about being told the truth like said previously. I haven't been following the story too closely but from what I've heard from my Achill relatives, it was this crowd that were the only original source and they were clearly exaggerating everything to cause a panic. To me the real issue here is that the government are allowing this kind of nonsense to flourish by not being forthcoming with the information in the first place. But they're also in a tough place since there's an established risk of extremists doing thing like burning places down.
I only posted that because I thought you seemed reasonable and were complaining about the information being by officials as being downplayed over time. This crowd are not official and have established biases and alterior motives. I don't normally bother posting in these kinds of threads as most of the posters that do are borderline unhinged and only interested in furthering their own biased beliefs.

I get what you are saying, but when those figures were put to the DoJ, they werent dispelled or corrected. If you look at the local counciller's fb page, who chaired the meeting, he was seemingly just told that they would not be arriving the next day after all. After subsequent meetings and protests for a couple of days the information that '38 single males aged 20 to 50' would be arriving, was put out, but was that the original figure? Nobody has ever claimed it was and the DoJ seem to have been deliberately vague around the figures throughout.

These are the same guys who then done an ol switcheroo a few days later in the media, with their 38 men now identifying as 13 vulnerable women, again without any proper confirmation as regards figures. I dont see how people can be so sure that this was indeed the first change in figures that took place. It seems to be that people feel this way because the DoJ never explicitly admitted it. In light of what we have seen from them, Id consider that quite naive.

I have subsequently heard that the original number signed off on was 50. That has never been confirmed either - like every other figure - but if you look at the details, it seems to make the most sense and it is what I believe personally.

However, my point regards the local people is, this is what they were led to believe, and nobody in the DoJ or any other authority, thought it worth doing to confirm/deny this or dispel this if it was in fact misinformation. So for all intents and purposes, at the time the original figure being discussed was indeed 70, and this was the belief in the room when press were ejected - something I think we can all now see was completely justified and a lesson to everyone when dealing with the press.

jay0109

Being discussed now on the Newstalk sunday show. The presenter saying he's surprised to now that so many Albanians and Georgians are coming in....said he wasn't aware of that!
That is the level of thickness we're dealing with in the Irish Media. And yet they feel they can comment authoritatively on subjects such as this.

Collete Browne of The Indo just saying that the Taoiseach's comments are very regrettable and he shouldn't have made them. At least she's consistent in her open border views and in her disdain for people having to bother with getting work visas etc

Colette also went as far as to say that she wouldn't visit Achill again as a result of the protests!

zell12

Radio1 now discussing the 38 men changing to 13 vulnerable women

Beechwoodspark

It’s been a PR disaster at this stage.

Ash.J.Williams

jay0109 wrote: »

I was speaking to someone in the Dept of Justice the other day who I had not seen in a while and we started discussing Achill and Ballinamore.
This person told me of the crack down on Georgians and Albanians and how they were not not being allowed to disembark until checks were carried out and that in fact, they were being mostly turned back around. This is as a direct result of the accommodation crisis. Otherwise they'd still be allowed to come in and claim asylum.
Just shows you the joke of a system that asylum is.

This person also told me that the budget for asylum accomm in 2019 is 70m and as we know from media reports, that budget has been blown and is expected to come in at 130m this year. A lot of that down to emergency accommodation in hotels for asylum seekers.
So the Dept asked Finance for an increase on that 130m for 2020 i.e. around 200m, as they say the numbers coming here are only going to keep increasing. What has Finance given them for next year.....80m in total :rolleyes:

The Dept aren't happy with the numbers coming here and the general feeling within that area is that the vast majority are economic and shouldn't be allowed through but the Legal industry and how it all looks with the UN and EU are major factors in letting them into the never ending system that the rest of us have to pay for

is that why the communication to the public is poor? they actually want resistance ?

jay0109

zell12 wrote: »

Radio1 now discussing the 38 men changing to 13 vulnerable women

An Asylum Accomm Consultant (who also owns the DP hotel in Wicklow town) is now speaking....hes going to be the main focus of this 'debate'.
The switch from hotel to DP centre in Wicklow has been very profitable for him and and his business partner he admits. He doesn't live in Wicklow town...he's based in Dublin.

jay0109

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

is that why the communication to the public is poor? they actually want resistance ?

No, don't know how you read that from what I said. The Dept just don't have the finances to plan for the numbers coming in and seem to b reacting rather than planning.

Beechwoodspark

Yer man is saying they are looking at independent living facilities for asylum seekers, that was news to me.

zell12

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Yer man is saying they are looking at independent living facilities for asylum seekers, that was news to me.

Varadkar mentioned it too, purpose built accommodation for asylum seekers