Achill asylum centre cancelled - mod warning in OP (01/11/19)

Topgear on Dave

Aodhan is outraged. Why shouldn't he say that Aodhan?


Aodhan..... I know fine rightly Irish people have gone and chanced their arm with Australian and American immigration, Iv talked with lads who did it!
I wouldn't be outraged at all by the allegation.

Kivaro

Geuze wrote: »

What worries me is that it is now labelled "dangerous" to speak the truth.

I am no fan of Varadkar, but I support him telling the truth.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/varadkars-remarks-on-asylum-seekers-branded-gaslighting-and-dangerous-38657818.html

The chief executive of the Irish Refugee Council (IRC) Nick Henderson said that what the Taoiseach said is "dangerous", even though it is the truth.

I hope the taxpayer is not funding this organisation.

Nick is the CEO of the Council, and he certainly does not want any negative press (even when it highlights the truth) that might negatively effect his fundraising ........... and CEO salary.
And yes, we are all paying money into this organisation. Funding comes from a multitude of sources and various government departments including the Department of Housing, Department of Rural and Community Development etc.

Topgear on Dave

Sean taking a surprisingly strong line here.

Balf

Calhoun wrote: »

Do we know if this is actually the case? I would have assumed economic migrants was not limited to just males. Just seen the post you were quoting and it makes sense in this case.

There's always a few complications. General migration - i.e. folk legitimately coming here from other EU States, or returning Irish emigrants would be both male and female in equal proportions (more or less).

On the other hand, twice as many men than women make asylum applications. And the overwhelming majority of those applications are found to be false - the applicants are just economic migrants.

Incidently, applications from Syria are overwhelmingly accepted. So Ireland did grant refugee status to folk fleeing the troubles there, as you would expect.

The issue is nothing at all to do with us having obligations to extend protection to people fleeing persecution - because we do that.

What we're bad at is communicating the facts around the situation. I found the link below helpful:

https://www.asylumineurope.org/reports/country/republic-ireland/statistics

MayoAreMagic

John_Rambo wrote: »

@Mayoaremagic.

You may have missed this. Busy thread, busy weekend.

Addressed that already.
Will you he addressing the questions posed to yourself?

MayoAreMagic

Geuze wrote: »

What worries me is that it is now labelled "dangerous" to speak the truth.

I am no fan of Varadkar, but I support him telling the truth.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/varadkars-remarks-on-asylum-seekers-branded-gaslighting-and-dangerous-38657818.html

The chief executive of the Irish Refugee Council (IRC) Nick Henderson said that what the Taoiseach said is "dangerous", even though it is the truth.

I hope the taxpayer is not funding this organisation.

Could the people making such statements be referred to as the Alt Left?

jmayo

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

Actually the opposite was the case. It started as 70 'single' men arriving the next day. Then when people, understandably, starting querying it, it became 40 men in a few days. Then when the press got wind of it, 38 men over two days. Finally when the national press heard about it, it was 13 women and 25 'families' (men).
When they finally got around to inspecting the place, it was 13 vulnerable women and the thing was 'abandoned'. Then it was changed to 'postponed'. Funny enough the inspection part never made the story in the paper.

Seeing a pattern? The more questions were asked, the lower the numbers got. Most likely a 'thin end of the wedge' type tactic, like something you would see at some dodgey salesman at street market.

Lying untrustworthy basta**s who have tried to push this through.

There is a lesson here for every other town and village that suddenly has a hotelier or celtic tiger landlord trying to house asylum seekers.

ThunbergsAreGo wrote: »

It's pretty shameful how this has been reported.

And then people wonder why the meeting fecked the member of the media out.
Peter Casey's election bid showed Irish people exactly what to expect from our media.

John_Rambo wrote: »

So to dispel the info as rumour, hearsay and barstool talk, who exactly told you there were 70 men arriving in Achill?

Ah yes using the usual stunt of trying to discredit one particular point to try discredit everything and everybody of an opposing argument.

After the first public meeting a public representative came out and stated 38 MEN were due to move into the centre.
He even gave the breakdown of when and how many were coming.
There was no mention of WOMEN.

This number was never contradicted by anyone in DOJ or any other body.

Then it materialises that suddenly 13 WOMEN were to be included in the 38.
And lo and behold they were the first to arrive.

And when the locals still were refusing to roll over the authorities, the politicians, the media lackies and the useful eejits on the likes of these sites are wailing that the bad racists in Mayo and on here who do not want to take in 13 vulnerable WOMEN.

No mention at all of the original 38 MEN or the now other 25 MEN.

Geuze

Balf wrote: »

T

On the other hand, twice as many men than women make asylum applications. And the overwhelming majority of those applications are found to be false - the applicants are just economic migrants.

Incidently, applications from Syria are overwhelmingly accepted. So Ireland did grant refugee status to folk fleeing the troubles there, as you would expect.

The issue is nothing at all to do with us having obligations to extend protection to people fleeing persecution - because we do that.

What we're bad at is communicating the facts around the situation. I found the link below helpful:

https://www.asylumineurope.org/reports/country/republic-ireland/statistics

That website is good.

It's good to see the bogus AS being rejected.

It's good to see the genuine cases from Syria being accepted.

Fann Linn

So Leo finally agreeing with what the dogs in the street knew for years.
Slow learner or else an impending election.

ShamNNspace

Fann Linn wrote: »

So Leo finally agreeing with what the dogs in the street knew for years.
Slow learner or else an impending election.

Or... Ring has had a quiet word in his ear
A wily old character who knows the feelings among the grassroots that one

nuac

Deleted User wrote: »

there are two towns on achill

There are some villages, no towns.

v638sg7k1a92bx

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

But conveniently silent when asked if they would be ok with the asy seekers in their locality !

Absolute brazen hypocrisy from these virtue signallers.

Or should they all just be housed in Dublin and let the local communities there deal with it?

BumperD

Leo speaking cleary on the subject and calling it as it is.

He must be a racist.

How many asylum seekers are there if you take out the Georgians and Albanians?
How many of the new number are eligible for work permits?

Could those that can work not be assisted in finding employment around the country whilst they wait on the result of their application? Don’t bombard one small area with a large amount who (statistically speaking) will be a drain on the taxpayer and local services as they will their application will be rejected anyway.

Ciaranis

ThunbergsAreGo wrote:

I think Ireland like most of boards are centrist. Though it is in vogue to say everything right of communism is right wing

Nothing centrist about many of the posts on this thread. Uninformed ranting, thinly veiled racism and xenophobia, rampant Islamophobia, hoary old tropes about spongers and chancers without a shred of evidence to back up any such assertions. Not a great reflection on the Irish education system, all in all

John_Rambo

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

Addressed that already.

No you haven't. Who told you 70 men were being put up in the hotel? Or was it simply barstool gossip?

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

Will you he addressing the questions posed to yourself?

Of course. Ask away.

tylercheribini

Ciaranis wrote: »

Nothing centrist about many of the posts on this thread. Uninformed ranting, thinly veiled racism and xenophobia, rampant Islamophobia, hoary old tropes about spongers and chancers without a shred of evidence to back up any such assertions. Not a great reflection on the Irish education system, all in all

All wrapped up in a nice, easy to swallow "human rights concern" pill.

Lefty Bicek

Ciaranis wrote: »

Nothing centrist about many of the posts on this thread. Uninformed ranting, thinly veiled racism and xenophobia, rampant Islamophobia, hoary old tropes about spongers and chancers without a shred of evidence to back up any such assertions. Not a great reflection on the Irish education system, all in all

That's no way to talk about the Georgian ambassador.

Lefty Bicek

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

How many asylum seekers are there if you take out the Georgians and Albanians?
How many of the new number are eligible for work permits?

Could those that can work not be assisted in finding employment around the country whilst they wait on the result of their application? Don’t bombard one small area with a large amount who (statistically speaking) will be a drain on the taxpayer and local services as they will their application will be rejected anyway.

The German Federal minister of Labour and Social Affairs at the time, said of the huge influx into Germany a few years ago, that only about 10% of them were fit for work or training.

It's not an encouraging proportion.

tylercheribini

Lefty Bicek wrote: »

The German Federal minister of Labour and Social Affairs at the time, said of the huge influx into Germany a few years ago, that only about 10% of them were fit for work or training.

It's not an encouraging proportion.

Were the Syrian doctors and dentists included in that 10% as I'd imagine they were already fully trained.

4068ac1elhodqr

Ciaranis wrote: »

.... spongers and chancers without a shred of evidence to back up any such assertions.

Ah indeed, if only there was some official gov stats or The IPO published figures from 2018 that could highlight the levels of chancery of some certain chancers.

Oh wait...

https://www.asylumineurope.org/reports/country/republic-ireland/statistics

Lefty Bicek

tylercheribini wrote: »

Were the Syrian doctors and dentists included in that 10% as I'd imagine they were already fully trained.

Fully trained in medicine in their own language would not of itself make them eligible to work in a hospital in Germany.

tylercheribini

Danna Brief Underclothing wrote: »

Ah indeed, if only there was some official gov stats or The IPO published figures from 2018 that could highlight the levels of chancery of some certain chancers.

Oh wait...

https://www.asylumineurope.org/reports/country/republic-ireland/statistics

Then why is your problem? Is that not proof the system is weeding out these "chancers" and functioning the way you want?

tylercheribini

Lefty Bicek wrote: »

Fully trained in medicine in their own language would not of itself make them eligible to work in a hospital in Germany.

Like Bashar al-Assad? Many have trained in the U.K.

4068ac1elhodqr

tylercheribini wrote: »

Then why is your problem? Is that not proof the system is weeding out these "chancers" and functioning the way you want?

Good, so you clearly also now agree the 0.03% success rate indicates these are most likely chancers and a problematic issue.

That there is also clear displays of a key sources of chancery, in this case Albania & Georgia display the very, very highest percentiles.
Actually Nigeria (94%) and Zim (82%) are very high also.

However all this does take considerable time and cost, and at the expense and suffering of genuine cases such as the Syrians, who (up untiil very recently) came from an active war zone.

Weeding out? Unless you have proof of removal, there is also a chance that many haven't left.
Even if not granted IPO or full asylum status, 'leave to remain' is still an option, as is the lenthy and costly appeals process.

Thus a more streamlined, quicker, even remote process, would solve this 'non-problem, problem' you kindly highlight.

Eric Cartman

tylercheribini wrote: »

Were the Syrian doctors and dentists included in that 10% as I'd imagine they were already fully trained.

you mean the 12% of them showing up who have even attended college. Completed college (which is what id assume is required to be a dentist/doctor) is single digit percentages of them....

Balf

Danna Brief Underclothing wrote: »

Unless you have proof of removal, there is also a chance that many haven't left.
Even if not granted IPO or full asylum status, 'leave to remain' is still an option, as is the lenthy and costly appeals process.

And, even beyond that, actually implementing a deportation order is challenging. As was pointed out on another thread

Tea drinker wrote: »

While 736 deportation orders have been made so far in 2018, only 133 people had been removed from the country by October. In 2017, 140 of the 932 people who received deportation orders were removed from the State. In 2016, just over a third of the 1,196 people who received orders to leave were deported.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/less-than-a-fifth-of-deportation-orders-carried-out-1.3680876

Complex issues - nothing is easy or simple on either side of the discussion.

And, tbh, a much deeper issue than whether Achill has suitable facilities.

tylercheribini

The obsession with the public purse in all of this is comical, far greater sums routinely pissed away by the governments.

Eric Cartman

tylercheribini wrote: »

The obsession with the public purse in all of this is comical, far greater sums routinely pissed away by the governments.

you'll notice most who give out about the public purse in this instance are consistent in giving out about it in those other cases too.

Lefty Bicek

tylercheribini wrote: »

The obsession with the public purse in all of this is comical, far greater sums routinely pissed away by the governments.

Are you a taxpayer yourself ?

It brings it's own valid perspective.