General Election December, 2019 (U.K.)

A Dub in Glasgo

Inquitus wrote: »

Aye terrible, why is Bojo not taking on Corbyn, this is a stupid idea and doesn't give each other an opportunity to challenge each other, as well as allowing Boris to see Corbyn's performance and shape his own in light of it.

I think Johnson is refusing to do head to head debates

liamtech

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

I think Johnson is refusing to do head to head debates

This needs to be highlighted - CLEARLY highlighted

Professor Moriarty

johnnyskeleton wrote: »

You misunderstood. Class warfare is the technique of Labour. Setting up a false narrative there are distinct groups of "the many" and "the few" and that "the few" are exploiting "the many". This is a modern variant of classic Marxism, seeking to otherise the "capitalists" and the "bourgeoisie" so that the "proletariat" have an enemy to smash.

I am not saying that this guy being charged an extra £5 a week is evidence of a class war.

I am saying that Labour are trying to create a narrative of class war, and they are putting him on the wrong side of it.

Take a giant step back. They're suggesting that someone who earns £85000 a year can afford to pay £230 extra tax. That's all. No Marxism, no proletariat, no bourgeoise. No "false narrative". No wrong side of a "class war". Just pay an extra £5 a week because you won't miss it and it will help other people.

Rjd2

liamtech wrote: »

Well the question time thing has started and straight away - GHASTLY format

No such thing as a good question time whatsoever.

Is this format that bad though?

Grill the hell out of the main leaders,,if good enough they should be able to bat away the smears and may win some voters.

liamtech

Rjd2 wrote: »

No such thing as a good question time whatsoever.

Is this format that bad though?

Grill the hell out of the main leaders,,if good enough they should be able to bat away the smears and may win some voters.

Well this is NOT question time

This is 30 mins a pop

with Boris At the end

who will then get to slag, jeer, and insult those that have come before him

Say what you want about question time and i agree in a sense - but this is not a debate - its a 30 minute meet and greet

Rjd2

liamtech wrote: »

Well this is NOT question time

This is 30 mins a pop

with Boris At the end

who will then get to slag, jeer, and insult those that have come before him

Say what you want about question time and i agree in a sense - but this is not a debate - its a 30 minute meet and greet

Its crap but the Brits can't put on good debates.

Ideally no audience because you are going to get people cheer their guy no matter what and populists can't always go for cheap pops when in hassle.

Also a chance that plenty will tune out before Boris as its a friday night and a long show. I'd probably want to go first tbh.

Is Boris here tonight? Thought it was Rushi Sunak.

liamtech

Rjd2 wrote: »

Its crap but the Brits can't put on good debates.

Ideally no audience because you are going to get people cheer their guy no matter what and populists can't always go for cheap pops when in hassle.

Also a chance that plenty will tune out before Boris as its a friday night and a long show. I'd probably want to go first tbh.

Is Boris here tonight? Thought it was Rushi Sunak.

I dont believe its the UK's inability to put on good debates

I think its CLEARLY that Boris Johnson cannot debate - Period -

just wait it will be - jeering, teasing, insulting, joking, trying to get a laugh - the man is a comedian - honestly i am not trying to receive a warning - im describing the man accurately - that's what he is/does

Joe_ Public

Think the formats ok. Dont get leaders sniping at each other which can be good for entertainment value rather than any worthwhile insight. Thought corbyn did pretty well but made a slip up there when mentioning the tax on the "richest 5%". He means highest earners of course and that distinction is important.

LuckyLloyd

Corbyn was brilliant there! Really rose to the occasion. Clear, direct and human. Seems to genuinely believe in his policies, a mad concept for a politician!

liamtech

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Think the formats ok. Dont get leaders sniping at each other which can be good for entertainment value rather than any worthwhile insight. Thought corbyn did pretty well but made a slip up there when mentioning the tax on the "richest 5%". He means highest earners of course and that distinction is important.

I agree he did well - but i dont like the format - especially with BJ at the end - as i said i predict he just comes out and jokes and shouts about 'Getting Brexit Done'

and insults and jokes - thats what he does

EDIT

STURGEON - fantastic - the caliber of the people in the SNP - her and Blackford - awesome

Joe_ Public

liamtech wrote: »

I agree he did well - but i dont like the format - especially with BJ at the end - as i said i predict he just comes out and jokes and shouts about 'Getting Brexit Done'

and insults and jokes - thats what he does

Looks like an audience that might give johnson hell i think. At least i hope so anyway! See can he bluff and bluster his way out of it.

liamtech

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Looks like an audience that might give johnson hell i think. At least i hope so anyway! See can he bluff and bluster his way out of it.

I hope your right - and i am REALLY hoping thats the case

but My goodness - this is a tour de Sturgeon - if she was running the labour party - this would be over -

• articulate
• snappy
• not dodging
• hiting the points CLEARLY
• fantastic

A Dub in Glasgo

I thought Corbyn done really well

A Dub in Glasgo

Sturgeon should just have answered the man with 'nobody promised a once in a generation referendum'

Joe_ Public

Is it me or is there a very high scottish representation in the audience? Not sure that's good news for Jo Swinson if the case.

liamtech

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

Sturgeon should just have answered the man with 'nobody promised a once in a generation referendum'

It was a slight misstep - her only one - but yet she actually used it to her advantage by highlighting the faulty nature of locking Scotland into a RADICALLY different UK

Im looking forward to swinson - and hoping that she concentrates on attacking Boris Johnson - obviously she will attack all - but her main enemy is Johnson - not Corbyn - regardless of the lack of a pact (which i have given out stink about for a while, and blamed labour i should say)

But tonight needs, for me, to be about punching Johnson - as much as possible - he was bruised on Monday- lets land some shots now

Joe_ Public wrote: »

Is it me or is there a very high scottish representation in the audience? Not sure that's good news for Jo Swinson if the case.

thats a good point - i agree - but for me if the audience was packed with Maoists or members of Putins party -fine! as long as they primarily attack Johnson

A Dub in Glasgo

liamtech wrote: »

It was a slight misstep - her only one - but yet she actually used it to her advantage by highlighting the faulty nature of locking Scotland into a RADICALLY different UK

Definitely, it would appear to me that the chap in the audience was offering an open goal and she almost missed it but she then done much better than a tap in

A Dub in Glasgo

Almost feel sorry for Swinson... almost

She is struggling

DoctorEdgeWild

Enjoying this format more than the 'tired children fighting in the back of a car' style.

So far, I have nobody to vote for! Of the three so far, I think Corbyn has presented his views best, but unfortunately for my vote, there's not enough for me to agree on.

Joe_ Public

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

Almost feel sorry for Swinson... almost

She is struggling

I'll say fair play to her if she gets through it. Bruising encounter so far.

But she talks about not going into a deal with Johnson under any circumstances, that's not what Ed Davey said talking with Andrew Neil on wednesday and Phillip Lee also talked about it in another interview. So their position seems a bit confusing to me to say the least.

Indestructable

Excellent format, far better than the crap itv debate. Corbyn his usual, human and decent self. Sturgeon a class above , absolutely wonderful politician, could listen to her for ages. Swinson sinking like a stone, really getting showed up here.

DoctorEdgeWild

I didn't get the same feeling about Sturgeon as it appears most here were, I found her to be very 'politician', but think I'm in the minority so I'm sure she won't mind.

Swinson is losing votes here. First time I've seen her speak, I usually follow politics on the radio, and she just seems unprepared.

Rjd2

Joe_ Public wrote: »

I'll say fair play to her if she gets through it. Bruising encounter so far.

But she talks about not going into a deal with Johnson under any circumstances, that's not what Ed Davey said talking with Andrew Neil on wednesday and Phillip Lee also talked about it in another interview. So their position seems a bit confusing to me to say the least.

I think they would ask for some other Tory as leader. It would satisfy those who left Tories due to Boris. That and maybe another second referendum would the price for the Lib Dems to prop up the tories.

Strazdas

DoctorEdgeWild wrote: »

I didn't get the same feeling about Sturgeon as it appears most here were, I found her to be very 'politician', but think I'm in the minority so I'm sure she won't mind.

Swinson is losing votes here. First time I've seen her speak, I usually follow politics on the radio, and she just seems unprepared.

Sturgeon is still very professional and accomplished sounding

Swinson sounding lightweight and out of her depth

Indestructable

Swinson is doing more for the Labour party here than Corbyn could ever have hoped to achieve. She is sending her voters back over in droves.

A Dub in Glasgo

Swinson should get her husband to phone and get her off the stage.... terrible performance

Roger_007

Indestructable wrote: »

Excellent format, far better than the crap itv debate. Corbyn his usual, human and decent self. Sturgeon a class above , absolutely wonderful politician, could listen to her for ages. Swinson sinking like a stone, really getting showed up here.

Swinson is a really poor leader of the Lib Dems. But I suppose that at the time she was elected there was nobody else in that party who would be any better.
That's the big problem for them, they have no one with any real leadership qualities.
I can see Chuka Umunna taking over the leadership in the not too distant future.

liamtech

Roger_007 wrote: »

Swinson is a really poor leader of the Lib Dems. But I suppose that at the time she was elected there was nobody else in that party who would be any better.
That's the big problem for them, they have no one with any real leadership qualities.
I can see Chuka Umunna taking over the leadership in the not too distant future.

agreed but not for at least 5 years - way too soon considering 12 months ago he was in the Labour party

This right here though, Swinson tonight - has just unsplit the remain vote in my view - shes gone - wouldnt be surprised if she loses her seat

Strazdas

liamtech wrote: »

agreed but not for at least 5 years - way too soon considering 12 months ago he was in the Labour party

This right here though, Swinson tonight - has just unsplit the remain vote in my view - shes gone - wouldnt be surprised if she loses her seat

She's a surprisingly poor speaker....no conviction or passion to her

Corbyn had a stormer by comparison

Indestructable

Roger_007 wrote: »

Swinson is a really poor leader of the Lib Dems. But I suppose that at the time she was elected there was nobody else in that party who would be any better.
That's the big problem for them, they have no one with any real leadership qualities.
I can see Chuka Umunna taking over the leadership in the not too distant future.

You're probably absolutely right, I think the Lib Dems have missed a golden opportunity here to really gain a strong foothold. Chuka would make and excellent leader, but they obviously couldn't parachute him in as leader and so the danger is in 5 years, after a Tory majority, the Lib Dems have become irrelevant again.

They should have rebranded on the very centre of politics and offered a legitimate alternative.

A Dub in Glasgo

Prince Andrew must be watching this and saying to himself that Swinson one is having a worse time than me

If this was a boxing match, Bruce would have stopped this after 10 minutes

Joe_ Public

Rjd2 wrote: »

I think they would ask for some other Tory as leader. It would satisfy those who left Tories due to Boris. That and maybe another second referendum would the price for the Lib Dems to prop up the tories.

Frankly, though, the idea of the lib dems dictating the leadership of other parties post-election seems ludicrous to me. And the fact that she is obviusly on a completely different page on the issue of doing a deal with Johnson to her deputy leader and another mp seems amateurish until you see her performance here tonight.

Roger_007

Boris is off to a bad start!

liamtech

liamtech wrote: »

agreed but not for at least 5 years - way too soon considering 12 months ago he was in the Labour party

This right here though, Swinson tonight - has just unsplit the remain vote in my view - shes gone - wouldnt be surprised if she loses her seat

I thought Swinson was the remain vote.

A Dub in Glasgo

Bruce allowed Johnson to waffle and not answer the questions. He completely dodged the Russian report question!

Rjd2

Roger_007 wrote: »

Boris is off to a bad start!

Yes but Bruce not making him answer the questions about Russia and vote leave is dire and that is from someone who is relatively skeptical about those 2 POVS.

liamtech

Aegir wrote: »

I thought Swinson was the remain vote.

She is parroting the revoke vote and she is just too inarticulate to get that message out

It doesnt make sense - its not credible

sid waddell

Fiona Bruce was so poor there.

She desperately intervened to take the heat off Johnson by taking multiple questions at a time so the immediacy and effect of the first question about the Russia report was dispelled.

That way Johnson was able to completely avoid the Russia question because over a minute had passed since it was asked, and he just waffled.

You HAVE to pin him on one question.

Joe_ Public

Why not one question at a time? Three or four at a go just gives him a free pass to answer which ones he fancies and ignore the googlies.

Roger_007

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

Bruce allowed Johnson to waffle and not answer the questions. He completely dodged the Russian report question!

Bruce is not very good at this format. She is allowing Johnson to avoid questions by taking several questions at a time. He can then choose to avoid whatever he doesn't want to answer and she lets him get away with it.

Joe_ Public

Why is it his "we have more people in work than ever before" is never followed with the obvious "we also have more in-work poverty than ever before and more working people than ever before accessing food banks"?

Roger_007

Roger_007 wrote: »

Bruce is not very good at this format. She is allowing Johnson to avoid questions by taking several questions at a time. He can then choose to avoid whatever he doesn't want to answer and she lets him get away with it.

She did that with all of them I thought. Certainly did with Sturgeon

DoctorEdgeWild

Fair play to that chap making sure his question gets on.

Joe_ Public

Fair play that guy in the audience. Doing Bruce's job for her, she should shake his hand.

A Dub in Glasgo

Aegir wrote: »

Certainly did with Sturgeon

Sturgeon answered all the questions, which one did you think she did not answer?

sid waddell

Bruce allowed Johnson waffle and avoid the Russia question AGAIN.

Yer man in the audience came back in and asked the question, Johnson waffled about Brexit.

There's enough here so far though to call this car crash though.

He's SO bad.

A Dub in Glasgo

Decending into farce because Bruce does not hold him to account

A Dub in Glasgo

A Dub in Glasgo wrote: »

Sturgeon answered all the questions, which one did you think she did not answer?

Bruce took several questions at once was my point.

In fairness, she did try to dodge the question about a confirmatory referendum on any deal an independent Scotland negotiated, but did confirm that she would not give one.

liamtech

Boris has lost tonight - in a massive way

Which answers why he wont take part in the Channel4 debate on Sunday

Winners tonight for me - Sturgeon and Corbyn - if you had to push me for one i would have to say Sturgeon. She just edged it in my view

Damaged - Swinson - shockingly inarticulate and not at all convincing

Complete Loss - Johnson - im typing this at 8:48 - and he is losing 6-0 in football terms - a laughing stock

Gringo180

Corbyn is the only honest leader of these 4 Parties on show tonight. Its just a pity the sheep parrot the tabloid garbage that try and blacken his good name.