Noel Grealish

Faugheen

Faugheen wrote: »

Christ.

https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-cp7md/p7md/p7dn/

Go here, then go down to the interactive link, which I will link for you here.

https://statbank.cso.ie/px/pxeirestat/Statire/SelectVarVal/Define.asp?maintable=E7047&PLanguage=0

Then put in all ages, both sexes and Irish-Nigerian, and you get the number of Irish-Nigerian which is 6,995, as per the 2016 Census.

Do I have to do everything for you or are you incapable of finding this **** out yourself?

Why you sending me this stuff? I’m not disputing the number of dual nationals but they were not included when the CSO said that there was 17 million remittance from Ireland to Nigeria each year.

Wind yer neck in, yeah?

RandomName2

alastair wrote: »

Given it’s an imaginary €3+ billion, it would make no difference where it’s allocated.

Not really.

The very loud complaints in the Dáil were that it was singling out a single country, and immediate subsequent condemnation was based upon Grealish's assessment discounting the Irish experience of repatriation, and being a danger in terms of xenophobia. The actual truth of the matter seems to play second fiddle to other agendas, by all involved.

But if the claim was that it was €3 billion being sent to Russia, there would be immediate alarm bells sounded. The Dáil would say 'we better get to the bottom of this'. A couple of minor opposition TDs would have soundbites about the risk posed to democracy by large volumes of unchecked Russian monies floating around, that may or may not have a Russian government connection.

Once an investigation spearheaded by the government found the claim to be fairly unsubstantiated, the Dáil would breathe a collective sigh of relief and the matter would not be mentioned again.

alastair

RandomName2 wrote: »

Not really.

The very loud complaints in the Dáil were that it was singling out a single country, and immediate subsequent condemnation was based upon Grealish's assessment discounting the Irish experience of repatriation, and being a danger in terms of xenophobia. The actual truth of the matter seems to play second fiddle to other agendas, by all involved.

But if the claim was that it was €3 billion being sent to Russia, there would be immediate alarm bells sounded. The Dáil would say 'we better get to the bottom of this'. A couple of minor opposition TDs would have soundbites about the risk posed to democracy by large volumes of unchecked Russian monies floating around, that may or may not have a Russian government connection.

Once an investigation spearheaded by the government found the claim to be fairly unsubstantiated, the Dáil would breathe a collective sigh of relief and the matter would not be mentioned again.

Nope. Once the ludicrous basis for the amount was revealed, it would be an equal damp squib - regardless of where it was supposed to be going. Grealish is justifiably getting criticised because this baseless ‘concern’ fits right into his racist narrative.

LillySV

Homelander wrote: »

He said he could understand the UK, but mentioned Nigeria in the context of crime and scams. Listen to the Dáil audio, no point commenting when you clearly haven't.

No point commenting to u, he mentioned more countries but u just say he mentioned uk... u clearly haven’t listened or read the full statement

Boggles

RandomName2 wrote: »

Once an investigation spearheaded by the government found the claim to be fairly unsubstantiated, the Dáil would breathe a collective sigh of relief and the matter would not be mentioned again.

Costly investigations are not established on the back of some muldoon playing Mini Donald.

Homelander

LillySV wrote: »

No point commenting to u, he mentioned more countries but u just say he mentioned uk... u clearly haven’t listened or read the full statement

That's not at all what I said. I said, that he said, he could understand the UK, but that he singled out Nigeria.

He did. Here is the literal transcript. Clearly he is singling out Nigeria, unless Poland left the EU on the quiet recently.

I've bolded the relevant bits to make it easier for you, since you clearly haven't listened to what he said yourself.

I can understand the transfers to other EU countries, for example, money being transferred to the United Kingdom, our nearest neighbour, with over 100,000 British people living in Ireland and over 10,000 Irish students currently studying in the United Kingdom. The fact that people living in Border counties may do their banking in the North is also a factor. But Taoiseach, €3.4 billion transferred to one non-EU country is astronomical. Have Revenue or the Department of Finance any way of tracking this money or where it is coming from?

jay0109

alastair wrote: »

You might also have noted that very few asylum seekers are successful - and that failed asylum seekers are issued with deportation orders. Do that math.

He's back! I'm not going this with you again.

You believe everyone issued with a deportation order leaves Ireland....most voluntarily. I assume you also believe in Santa Claus and that Man Utd will win the Prem Lg this year!

If you want to believe that so as to support your ideological viewpoint, no matter how unbelievable it is, then best of luck to you.

I don't

weisses

Boggles wrote: »

My question was pretty simple, do you want to take another stab at answering it?

Answer is No ... But as i said, that is not the point ..Unless racism is somehow defined by who says what instead of what was said. Agreed?

osarusan

weisses wrote: »

If he is labelled a racist based on his comments then so is FF .... he can be the biggest gob****e walking around, but that is not the point

How are FF involved in this?

weisses

alastair wrote: »

Nope. Once the ludicrous basis for the amount was revealed, it would be an equal damp squib - regardless of where it was supposed to be going. Grealish is justifiably getting criticised because this baseless ‘concern’ fits right into his racist narrative.

Question you should ask,is his baseless concern racist ? If so then FF is a party that harbours racists as well

Seathrun66

alastair wrote: »

Grealish definitely singled out Nigeria, following on from his ‘African spongers’ bit a couple of months back. And no, about half of Nigerians here have Irish citizenship - which is not a ‘vast majority’.

The fact is that there will never be checks on ‘where people are getting their money’, beyond the normal anti-laundering measures that apply to all transactions. And where there’s precisely zero evidence of unusual volumes, there isn’t actually anything to investigate.

Disparaging Africans in general and Nigerians in particular in an attempt to profit at the election may rebound on him. His constituency (West Galway) includes the most multi-cultural city in the country and his invective is not playing well here. Unfortunately he's calculated that this stuff plays well to 10/15% of the population and that's enough for his re-election.

Seathrun66

jay0109 wrote: »

He's back! I'm not going this with you again.

You believe everyone issued with a deportation order leaves Ireland....most voluntarily. I assume you also believe in Santa Claus and that Man Utd will win the Prem Lg this year!

If you want to believe that so as to support your ideological viewpoint, no matter how unbelievable it is, then best of luck to you.

I don't

Please provide examples of anyone arrested for overstaying a deportation order or evidence of any such overstayers.

weisses

osarusan wrote: »

How are FF involved in this?

Because in 2013 ..

Fianna Fail's justice spokesman, Niall Collins, will raise the issue of Nigerian remittances with Justice Minister Alan Shatter.

He said: "It raises a number of questions. There may be legitimate and valid reason for the extremely large amounts of money being sent from Ireland to Nigeria, compared with the amounts sent by other nationalities.

"On the face of it, it has to be questioned. I will be asking the minister to investigate and find out why."

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/nigerians-send-nearly-500m-a-year-home-from-ireland-29278045.html

By using logic applied in this thread the now FF spokesperson for justice is a racist ... unless i am missing something

osarusan

weisses wrote: »

Because in 2013 ..



https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/nigerians-send-nearly-500m-a-year-home-from-ireland-29278045.html

By using logic applied in this thread the now FF spokesperson for justice is a racist ... unless i am missing something

As I said in an earlier post, if somebody simply found the WB figures without knowing anything about the CSO figures, I can understand their surprise and subsequent questions.

Here is the question that Collins actually asked of Noonan 2 weeks later:

https://www.kildarestreet.com/wrans/?id=2013-05-28a.275

144. To ask the Minister for Finance if he has studied the World Bank report on global remittances; the level of discrepancies here with regard to per capita remittances; and if he will make a statement on the matter.

But in this case Grealish already knew of the CSO figures, he had been provided with them. But he made no mention of them. Instead he just treated the WB figures as fact and based his questions about crime and fraud on that, even though he knew the figures were seriously disputed. And, as I also said earlier, I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt that he simply doesn't remember the same topic arising in 2013.

So I don't think that what Collins did in 2013 and what Grealish did this time really are that similar.

James Brown

high_king wrote: »

Sounds like you think you know what the word racist means. What does it mean ? and I don't mean making up what it means as it suits, what is the actual legal definition ?

For me it's treating a person differently based on skin colour, religion or nationality. I go by that.
What do you think?

high_king wrote: »

So the real issue is who's telling porkie pies, the world bank, the Irish independent, or the CSO ?

Again, If Grealish explains his intent regarding bringing Nigeria into it, it should blow over regardless.
Seems like he's stirring for attention.

James Brown

high_king wrote: »

Looks like the World Bank got their figures wrong, which is a bit worrying for international finance.

I trust the world bank, IMF and all that shower as much as I would Bertie Ahern with my savings. I take someone citing 'facts' in good faith until proven otherwise. Liars get caught out, mistakes get made.

osarusan

Matt Barrett wrote: »

For me it's treating a person differently based on skin colour, religion or nationality. I go by that.

Religion? If a white Irish catholic discriminates against a white Irish protestant, you'd consider that racism?

James Brown

osarusan wrote: »

Religion? If a white Irish catholic discriminates against a white Irish protestant, you'd consider that racism?

It's discrimination. By religion I'm talking about racists hiding behind 'religion isn't a race', when being racist about Muslims or Jews for example.

This Grealish issue is another vehicle for the aul' stuck in the 50's lads not wanting to change IMO.

weisses

osarusan wrote: »

So I don't think that what Collins did in 2013 and what Grealish did this time really are that similar.

There are two sets available just as in 2013 No one has a clue which one is the accurate one although it is said the CSO figures look more reliable ... Probably also depending who you ask

Even Noonan in his answer didn't have a clue back then

Minister for Justice Charlie Flanagan has called on Galway West TD Noel Grealish to “correct the record” for overstating figures on personal remittances sent home by Nigerians living in Ireland.

“It is unacceptable for any elected leader to present on the floor of Dáil Éireann a misstatement of facts,” the minister told The Irish Times ahead of delivering a speech at a defamation conference hosted by his department.

How did Graelish misstated facts when the facts are that both sets of data are not factual and only estimates ?

IS the world bank also engaging in racist activities by floating these numbers ?

James Brown

weisses wrote: »

There are two sets available just as in 2013 No one has a clue which one is the accurate one although it is said the CSO figures look more reliable ... Probably also depending who you ask

Even Noonan in his answer didn't have a clue back then



How did Graelish misstated facts when the facts are that both sets of data are not factual and only estimates ?

IS the world bank also engaging in racist activities by floating these numbers ?

Easy fix, Grealish can reset the parameters to suit like Murphy did to lower the homeless numbers. FG are some lads to be talking about misquoting.

blanch152

weisses wrote: »

There are two sets available just as in 2013 No one has a clue which one is the accurate one although it is said the CSO figures look more reliable ... Probably also depending who you ask

Even Noonan in his answer didn't have a clue back then



How did Graelish misstated facts when the facts are that both sets of data are not factual and only estimates ?

IS the world bank also engaging in racist activities by floating these numbers ?

"Quite clearly our white Irish CSO is so much better at statistics than the black Nigerian CSO who reported figures to the World Bank. How can you expect people like them to calculate correct figures? Aren't they all corrupt down there?"

That is what we are effectively hearing from the Noel Grealish critics, quite astonishing and hypocritical.

BENDYBINN

blanch152 wrote: »

"Quite clearly our white Irish CSO is so much better at statistics than the black Nigerian CSO who reported figures to the World Bank. How can you expect people like them to calculate correct figures? Aren't they all corrupt down there?"

That is what we are effectively hearing from the Noel Grealish critics, quite astonishing and hypocritical.

An extremely large amount of money being sent to Nigeria every year compared to any other country and nobody has the right to question it?....are you for real?

weisses

weisses wrote: »

There are two sets available just as in 2013 No one has a clue which one is the accurate one although it is said the CSO figures look more reliable ... Probably also depending who you ask

Even Noonan in his answer didn't have a clue back then



How did Graelish misstated facts when the facts are that both sets of data are not factual and only estimates ?

IS the world bank also engaging in racist activities by floating these numbers ?

So is Charlie Flanagan saying that the world bank are liars? The world bank get their info from the IMF. Does Charlie Flanagan want us to relinquish our membership from the world bank group?

Would be interesting to see previous times that the government have used world bank statistics for their own benefit.

noinc

Matt Barrett wrote: »

It's discrimination. By religion I'm talking about racists hiding behind 'religion isn't a race', when being racist about Muslims or Jews for example.

This Grealish issue is another vehicle for the aul' stuck in the 50's lads not wanting to change IMO.

Was it not fear of beig accused of racism that allowed a group of Muslims continue with grooming young girls across The UK?

terrydel

osarusan wrote: »

Religion? If a white Irish catholic discriminates against a white Irish protestant, you'd consider that racism?

Go and look up the definition of racism.

Boggles

weisses wrote: »

Answer is No ... But as i said, that is not the point ..Unless racism is somehow defined by who says what instead of what was said. Agreed?

With Noel it's pure opportunism, racism just happens to be the vehicle.

I'd actually have more respect for a full on card carrying racist.

But sure it's hardly surprising the absolute cretin calling people spongers and he creaming 100s of 1000s in unvouched expenses. You couldn't make it up.

PinotNero

Here is an article from the Irish Times in 2015.
https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/migrant-workers-in-ireland-sent-home-1-3bn-last-year-1.2250468

It states:
The agency’s Sending Money Home: European flows and markets report showed more than 30 per cent of the outflow from Ireland, equating to $392 million, went to Nigeria.

The source is the UN’s International Fund for Agricultural Development (IFAD)

enricoh

Ha, the indo have a headline that " minister says asylum seeker protests give encouragement to the far right" and a photo of noel Grealish under it!
Great attempted hatchet job from the indo! Pity there isnt an election next week, n we'd see what the public really thinks. I'd say Grealish would be unbackable with the bookies. (with the Twitterati he'd be on 1% of the vote though!)
https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/asylumseeker-protests-give-encouragement-to-the-farright-minister-38691176.html

is_that_so

blanch152 wrote: »

"Quite clearly our white Irish CSO is so much better at statistics than the black Nigerian CSO who reported figures to the World Bank. How can you expect people like them to calculate correct figures? Aren't they all corrupt down there?"

That is what we are effectively hearing from the Noel Grealish critics, quite astonishing and hypocritical.

Hmm. From the WB themselves apparently. Note the "urgent need" to improve such "data collection".

https://www.thejournal.ie/personal-remittance-ireland-to-nigeria-world-bank-4891522-Nov2019/

So the CSO says 17 million and the United Nations say 392 million.

Lol