Car valuation

New Home

The second-hand car I bought from a garage 5 months ago has a rake of weird problems. I brought it back to them to get it fixed, but neither time have they actually repaired it, and the first time they actually dented it (which they're refusing to admit). I'm now considering returning the car to them under the Sales of Goods Act.

I know I've done about 6,000km on it, so I wouldn't expect to get the full amount back, but how much less should I be expecting to get?

Thanks.

New Home wrote: »

I'm not looking for an exact valuation here, just an idea of what I should be expecting (roughly), and maybe where (websites, etc) to get advice/actual valuations.

colm_mcm

How old is the car?

New Home

It's a 161.

Dia_Anseo

What are the "rake of weird problems"?

What make and model? UK import? Mileage? What did you pay for it?

New Home

New Home wrote: »

It's a 161.

Any possibility it's still under the manufacturer warranty?

Irishphotodesk

Wild guess you are looking at a drop of about 15-20% of your purchase price and could potentially face a battle for your money.... They might offer credit instead of cash back.

New Home

Deleted User wrote: »

Any possibility it's still under the manufacturer warranty?

No, unfortunately.

Dia_Anseo wrote: »

What are the "rake of weird problems"?

What make and model? UK import? Mileage? What did you pay for it?

Electrical, and they haven't fixed them.

I'm not looking for an exact valuation here, just an idea of what I should be expecting (roughly), and maybe where (websites, etc) to get advice/actual valuations.

Irishphotodesk wrote: »

Wild guess you are looking at a drop of about 15-20% of your purchase price and could potentially face a battle for your money.... They might offer credit instead of cash back.

Thank you, that's what I was looking for. I won't accept credit (there's nothing in the Consumers' Act, AFAIK, that says I should accept credit), I don't trust them any more.

I suppose I'd have to bring it to another garage to get an estimated value, won't I?

New Home

New Home wrote: »

I suppose I'd have to bring it to another garage to get an estimated value, won't I?

Personally, if a car had such problems my starting position would be full refund, let them negotiate from there or fix the problem.



If not getting anywhere with them I'd rather get a solicitor to contact them rather than getting a valuation from another garage. That valuation will possibly be a trade in value which works in a resale profit for them.

PsychoPete

What kind of car is it ? Was it purchased from a franchise dealer or independent dealer?

New Home

From a SIMI dealer.

colm_mcm

Have you done a history check on the car?

Dia_Anseo

Why won't the OP state the Make/Model of the vehicle?

New Home

colm_mcm wrote: »

Have you done a history check on the car?

I got a full Motorcheck report from the dealer when I bought it.

Dia_Anseo wrote: »

Why won't the OP state the Make/Model of the vehicle?

Because this is an outstanding issue I have with a specific dealer.

Why do you want to know?

Dia_Anseo

New Home wrote: »

I got a full Motorcheck report from the dealer when I bought it.



Because this is an outstanding issue I have with a specific dealer.

Why do you want to know?

Surely there's more than one dealer that sells that particular make/model, if you're afraid of outting the dealer.

If you actually share the make/model of the vehicle we can advice if that make/model has a common electrical fault or a generally reliable make.

But because of your attitude I don't want to help anymore. No wonder the dealer doesn't want to help you either!

New Home

Dia_Anseo wrote: »

Surely there's more than one dealer that sells that particular make/model, if you're afraid of outting the dealer.

If you actually share the make/model of the vehicle we can advice if that make/model has a common electrical fault or a generally reliable make.

But because of your attitude I don't want to help anymore. No wonder the dealer doesn't want to help you either!

Thank you, that was very helpful.

Toyotafanboi

New Home wrote: »

The second-hand car I bought from a garage 5 months ago has a rake of weird problems. I brought it back to them to get it fixed, but neither time have they actually repaired it, and the first time they actually dented it (which they're refusing to admit). I'm now considering returning the car to them under the Sales of Goods Act.

I know I've done about 6,000km on it, so I wouldn't expect to get the full amount back, but how much less should I be expecting to get?

Thanks.

The question cant really be answered without knowing the make and model and approx mileage.

Could you better define "a rake of weird problems"?

How many times have you had it back with the dealer? What is the nature of each fault? Did they repair the dent and does the dent further entitle you to return the car or should you consider treating it as a separate issue?

Truckermal

New Home wrote: »

Thank you, that was very helpful.

Well to be fair the thread title is Car valuation?

It could be a Audi A8 or a Hyundai I10...

Tacitus Kilgore

Has anyone said tree fiddy yet?




Make/model won't out you or the dealer unless its a tesla model 3 you're after picking up or something - go for it, even if the dealer somehow comes across the thread and suspects that it's you who has been talking about them - they will have a long way to go to prove it.

New Home

Toyotafanboi wrote: »

The question cant really be answered without knowing the make and model and approx mileage.

Could you better define "a rake of weird problems"?

How many times have you had it back with the dealer? What is the nature of each fault? Did they repair the dent and does the dent further entitle you to return the car or should you consider treating it as a separate issue?

PM sent.

rn

Just word of warning on sale of goods act. It's a common misunderstanding that you are entitled to money back under this.

You are entitled to a repair, a replacement or a refund, but it's the decision of the seller about which is offered, not the buyers choice.

This will be a complex application of consumer law because there's multiple factors effecting the outcome including length of time since purchase.

New Home

Truckermal wrote: »

Well to be fair the thread title is Car valuation?

It could be a Audi A8 or a Hyundai I10...

Tacitus Kilgore wrote: »

Has anyone said tree fiddy yet?

Make/model won't out you or the dealer unless its a tesla model 3 you're after picking up or something - go for it, even if the dealer somehow comes across the thread and suspects that it's you who has been talking about them - they will have a long way to go to prove it.

Fair point, apologies. I reread my initial post, and I probably should have added this bit from the start:

New Home wrote: »

I'm not looking for an exact valuation here, just an idea of what I should be expecting (roughly), and maybe where (websites, etc) to get advice/actual valuations.

New Home

rn wrote: »

Just word of warning on sale of goods act. It's a common misunderstanding that you are entitled to money back under this.

You are entitled to a repair, a replacement or a refund, but it's the decision of the seller about which is offered, not the buyers choice.

This will be a complex application of consumer law because there's multiple factors effecting the outcome including length of time since purchase.

Not necessarily:

Know your Rights:

Under the Sale of Goods and Supply of Services Act 1980, anything you buy from a retailer must be:

• of merchantable quality
• fit for its normal purpose, and reasonably durable
• as described, whether the description is part of the advertising or wrapping, on a label, or something said by the salesperson.
• When you buy goods from a retailer, you make a contract with him. He agrees to provide certain goods to you for a certain price. If your purchase turns out to be faulty, the retailer, not the manufacturer, is responsible to you and must sort out your complaint. You are entitled to a refund, a replacement or a repair.

You do not have to take a credit note if your complaint is covered by the Sale of Goods Act. You can insist on a refund, a replacement or a repair.

If you have a genuine complaint about faulty goods, you can ignore shop notices such as ‘No Refunds’ or ‘No Exchanges’. Such notices cannot take away any of your statutory rights under the Sale of Goods Act see Retailers’ responses.
You have no rights under the Sale of Goods Act if you simply change your mind about wanting the goods. You also have no rights if faults are due to misuse of the product after purchase, or if faults should have been seen on examination or were pointed out at the time of purchase.
The person who purchased the goods holds the rights under the Act. If you receive the goods as a gift, you have no contract with the retailer and don’t have the same rights. In practice, most retailers will oblige the user of the goods but this is a gesture of goodwill, not a legal requirement.
Your rights under the Act also apply to goods purchased at sale prices. They must be of merchantable quality, fit for their particular purpose and as described. If goods are being sold as seconds or shop-soiled, however, you cannot expect the same standard.

Henry Ford III

This is the car

rn

You do not have accept a credit note, you can insist the retailer produce one of the three options outlined under the law is my interpretation of that line. Bear in mind that paragraph is itself from an interpretation from consumer association of Ireland, not the actual law.

This isn't small claims court stuff, so you could be looking at considerable cost to get compensation from this car dealer. If you start waving sale of goods act, you have to be prepared to get legal advice and pay for that advice.

What I'm really trying to warn you about is that you need proper legal advice here. Not a website or boards advice.

grogi

New Home wrote: »

The second-hand car I bought from a garage 5 months ago has a rake of weird problems. I brought it back to them to get it fixed, but neither time have they actually repaired it, and the first time they actually dented it (which they're refusing to admit). I'm now considering returning the car to them under the Sales of Goods Act.

I know I've done about 6,000km on it, so I wouldn't expect to get the full amount back, but how much less should I be expecting to get?

Thanks.

You should expect a full refund, nothing less. You are not looking to have the car bought back, you are looking for having the initial transaction reverted.

The moment you start talking about valuation etc - you are on a lost position. Because you admit the car had the value for you.

colm_mcm

grogi wrote: »

You should expect a full refund, nothing less. You are not looking to have the car bought back, you are looking for having the initial transaction reverted.

The moment you start talking about valuation etc - you are on a lost position. Because you admit the car had the value for you.

That’s not how sales of goods act works though.

ice.cube

grogi wrote: »

You should expect a full refund, nothing less. You are not looking to have the car bought back, you are looking for having the initial transaction reverted.

The moment you start talking about valuation etc - you are on a lost position. Because you admit the car had the value for you.

Unless the car wasn't functioning at all it seems it would be very unlikely to get a full refund. It looks like it would have to be purely down to goodwill alone.

Here is a court decision where the car had issues but was still drivable (Low fuel consumption). The court put some value on the use the customer got out of it. Granted he got three years use of course!

"The issue to be decided is what damages the plaintiff should be entitled to recover. He has sold the car now, and he had the use of the car since January 2003 until March 2006 and he travelled 56,000 miles in it over that period. In my view the level of damages cannot equate to the cost of the car less what he sold it for, or less that what he ought according to the defendant to have been able to sell it for, namely about €18,000. That would be unfair to the defendant, since there was not a complete failure of consideration."

http://www.bailii.org/ie/cases/IEHC/2007/H395.html

mankteln

Input all the car details into the revenue VRT calculator and it'll give you the Open Market Price for the car

New Home

In my case it's like a Christmas extravaganza of warning lights. It's not about fuel consumption, it's the safety of the car that's in doubt.

Lofidelity

New Home wrote: »

In my case it's like a Christmas extravaganza of warning lights. It's not about fuel consumption, it's the safety of the car that's in doubt.

Electrical gremlins may suggest flooding damage.

rn

I think your best hope is if there's a hidden incident, like flood damage. Best of luck on your quest. It's a terrible situation to be in and I hope you get some resolution sooner rather than later.

colm_mcm

This is why I’d suggest doing your own history check and inspection if necessary.

endacl

New Home wrote: »

Thank you, that was very helpful.

Might have been...

colm_mcm

endacl wrote: »

Might have been...

Very unlikely.

New Home

Henry Ford III wrote: »

This is the car

It's not a Fiat Multipla.

New Home

mankteln wrote: »

Input all the car details into the revenue VRT calculator and it'll give you the Open Market Price for the car

I only saw this now - thank you for that, that's good to know.

kravmaga

New Home wrote: »

I only saw this now - thank you for that, that's good to know.

Plus the "Rate of depreciation"% as determined by Revenue figure for the vehicle make and model

New Home

Excellent, thanks.