Redundancy and notice period.

Poula

Hi.

I have recently been told that I'm to be made redundant. I've worked in my job for 23 years. In my contract of employment it says there is 8 weeks notice due as I've worked here so long. My employer is saying that i must stay till the end of January 2020. However I have just secured a new job and they need me to start sooner than that. can I just leave after my 8 weeks are up? any advice greatly appreciated as I dont want to loose out on this new job.

Johnny Sausage

Poula wrote: »

Hi.

I have recently been told

okay

_Brian

Talk to your manager.

They may well be glad for you to be gone after the 8 weeks.

Or, they may want to hold the redundancy payment until the last date to keep you coming in.

Anyway, the first call is talk to them.

What you need to know is does your notice date officially start now, or 8 weeks befoe the last date they have you working.

Poula

_Brian wrote: »

Talk to your manager.

They may well be glad for you to be gone after the 8 weeks.

Or, they may want to hold the redundancy payment until the last date to keep you coming in.

Anyway, the first call is talk to them.

What you need to know is does your notice date officially start now, or 8 weeks befoe the last date they have you working.

I've spoken to my manager and also HR and they're adamant I have to stay till January 31st. I was giving my redundancy notice on October 17th. Surely once I have done my 8 weeks then I have honoured my contract and can leave..

Idleater

Poula wrote: »

Surely once I have done my 8 weeks then I have honoured my contract and can leave..

In terms of your current (albeit ending) contract perhaps. Are you foregoing the redundancy?

When I was in that position I was given an end date 4 months away (others more) depending on the department. The terms of it were that end date.

Poula

Idleater wrote: »

In terms of your current (albeit ending) contract perhaps. Are you foregoing the redundancy?

When I was in that position I was given an end date 4 months away (others more) depending on the department. The terms of it were that end date.

The only mention of notice in my employment contract is that employment contract may be terminated by either party with 1 months notice. I'm not exactly sure what is ment by forgoing redundancy. My understanding is that as there is nothing in my employment contract stating I have to remain for a set period that I can walk after 8 weeks

UrbanFret

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/unemployment_and_redundancy/redundancy/redundancy_procedures.html

Poula

UrbanFret wrote: »

https://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/employment/unemployment_and_redundancy/redundancy/redundancy_procedures.html

I've had a read through that. It mentions nothing about having to stay beond the 8 weeks.

Why do people here always bend backwards to side with companies? If they have 8 weeks on paper then they can leave with their redundancy after 8 weeks if they have been given notice of it. Why would they want to forego it? To save some tight employer a few bob?

Lu Tze

Poula wrote: »

I've had a read through that. It mentions nothing about having to stay beond the 8 weeks.

I'm pretty sure notice periods in contracts are minimum notice periods

Poula

Lu Tze wrote: »

I'm pretty sure notice periods in contracts are minimum notice periods

But with no mention of notice period in my employment contract surely it can't be open ended. If that was the case you could be made redundant but still be stuck in the job for years at the whim of the employer

28064212

Your employer must give you at least 8 weeks notice of when your redundancy will occur. They have done that, you've been notified that your redundancy date is in January.

If you want to leave under the terms of your contract, you can give your 1 month's notice. However, in that situation you are not being made redundant, you are choosing to leave, so you wouldn't be entitled to any redundancy payment.

From the company's point of view, they're doing you a favour. They could have waited until exactly 8 weeks out and told you then, but decided to give you more than the required notice, presumably to give you extra time to get a new position.

Poula wrote: »

But with no mention of notice period in my employment contract surely it can't be open ended. If that was the case you could be made redundant but still be stuck in the job for years at the whim of the employer

No, a redundancy notice must have a date. An employer can not say "you're position is redundant, you'll be let go at some stage in the future".

If you're going to challenge it and claim you're entitled to both redundancy and the ability to leave after 8 weeks, you really need expert advice

Poula

28064212 wrote: »

From the company's point of view, they're doing you a favour. They could have waited until exactly 8 weeks out and told you then, but decided to give you more than the required notice, presumably to give you extra time to get a new position.

Thanks for the reply. But by them doing me a favour, they are preventing me taking up a new position I have been offered.

duffman13

Poula wrote: »

Thanks for the reply. But by them doing me a favour, they are preventing me taking up a new position I have been offered.

They aren't though, you can serve your notice but that means you'll miss a substantial redundancy payment. They aren't going to pay you redunandcy and let you leave early, you can do one or the other

28064212

Poula wrote: »

Thanks for the reply. But by them doing me a favour, they are preventing me taking up a new position I have been offered.

If they weren't doing you a favour, you wouldn't have known about the position at all - you wouldn't have known you were going to be made redundant yet.

Or, if you were planning on leaving already, and that's how you found out about the position, then you can still give your 1 month's notice. You just won't be entitled to redundancy, which you wouldn't have been entitled to anyway

Poula

28064212 wrote: »

If they weren't doing you a favour, you wouldn't have known about the position at all - you wouldn't have known you were going to be made redundant yet.

Or, if you were planning on leaving already, and that's how you found out about the position, then you can still give your 1 month's notice. You just won't be entitled to redundancy, which you wouldn't have been entitled to anyway

No I see this completely different. My position was made redundant on October 17th. As we're 10 others. There is nothing in my contract that states that I am obliged to stay for any predetermined time so therefore I have honoured the terms of my contract on December 27th and can go. I mean what kind of employee do they expect to turn up for work
being completelyy disgruntled and determined to be obstinate..

Idleater

Poula wrote: »

No I see this completely different. My position was made redundant on October 17th. As we're 10 others. There is nothing in my contract that states that I am obliged to stay for any predetermined time so therefore I have honoured the terms of my contract on December 27th and can go.

Do the terms of the redundancy say it's effective date is 31 January (or whatever it is)?

If so you're welcome to abide by your contract and leave, on your terms, but forego the redundancy.

I think you should get some proper advise (no offense to the internet - myself included)

Salary Negotiator

OP you can leave whenever you want and if you want to start this new job then do.

But if you want to get your redundancy payment you’ll need to abide by the terms of the redundancy i.e. stay until the end of January or whatever date is on the redundancy notice.

Poula

Idleater wrote: »

Do the terms of the redundancy say it's effective date is 31 January (or whatever it is)?

If so you're welcome to abide by your contract and leave, on your terms, but forego the redundancy.

I think you should get some proper advise (no offense to the internet - myself included)

I'm hoping I don't have to go down the legal route and that somebody will see sense..

Stheno

Poula wrote: »

I'm hoping I don't have to go down the legal route and that somebody will see sense..

Tbh you need to see sense here. If you were told your position is redundant from the end of January and you leave before that you are not entitled to redundancy payment is my understanding here

Salary Negotiator

Poula wrote: »

I'm hoping I don't have to go down the legal route and that somebody will see sense..

Fill in an RP6 form and submit it to your employer, it is a request to leave during your redundancy notice period and retail your payment.

Your employer may not allow it but it’s how you request it.

ForestFire

There are not terminating your contract, they are making you redundant and have given you your redundancy date that you must work until if you want redundancy, as stated in contact (minimum 8 Weeks)

Presumable you know this when you went looking for jobs, so it was your obligation to inform your potential new employees of this??

You can leave when you want (1 month), without redundancy, so no one is stopping you getting a new job, just like anyone else who leaves a company. I left a company about 2 months before they made my whole department redundant and got nothing!!

If you have worked there for 23 years, you are getting minimum 46 weeks pay, of which a lot will be tax free?

If I was you I would not pass this up, unless your been offered a directors position in the new company.

Inform your new employee of the situation and if they really want you, they will understand.

28064212

Poula wrote: »

I'm hoping I don't have to go down the legal route and that somebody will see sense..

You're talking about a fairly substantial sum that the company is likely under no obligation to pay.

From the RP6 form:

If you have been given Notice of proposed dismissal for Redundancy and you wish to leave your job sooner than the date you are to become redundant (as set out on the redundancy notice) you should, if you want to preserve your entitlement to redundancy payment, fill in form overleaf and send it or give it to your employer.

This must be done within (not before) your obligatory period of notice. Normally this period is the two weeks immediately before the date you are to become redundant but if you have been in the job for between 5 and 10 years, this period is extended to 4 weeks; if you have been in the job 10 to 15 years the period is 6 weeks and if you have been in the job more than 15 years the period is 8 weeks. If your contract of employment lays down a longer period of notice, this longer period is the obligatory period of notice in your case.

You may leave your job before the date specified in your redundancy notice and still preserve your redundancy entitlement only if the dates on which you give notice and on which you leave are within your obligatory period of notice as set out in the previous paragraph. Furthermore if your employer gives you a counter-notice in form similar to the 'counter-notice by employer' overleaf you will not be entitled to redundancy payment if you unreasonably refuse to comply with his request. (Any dispute on this matter may be referred to the Employment Appeals Tribunal).

jimmycrackcorm

Poula wrote: »

No I see this completely different. My position was made redundant on October 17th. As we're 10 others. There is nothing in my contract that states that I am obliged to stay for any predetermined time so therefore I have honoured the terms of my contract on December 27th and can go. I mean what kind of employee do they expect to turn up for work
being completelyy disgruntled and determined to be obstinate..

You will have gotten a written notice of your redundancy when you were notified. It will have given you a termination date. that is what counts.
What does it say?

_Brian

Poula wrote: »

I've had a read through that. It mentions nothing about having to stay beond the 8 weeks.

at what stage do they propose to pay the redundancy ?