The Farming Protest @ Dublin City Centre

Car99

I read the farmers are planning a slow protest on the M50 with their tractors, surely the Gardai will be stopping tractors going on a motorway as it's against the law and if the tractors make it to the motorway penalise the drivers for breaking the law.

Panch18

weldoninhio wrote: »

So I claim to be an artist and *poof* all of these will subsidise me??

not only will you be subsidised by the very generous tax relief for being an artist but there are a whole host of bodies such as the Arts Council which are further subsidised by the government

You picked a bad sector there i'm afraid!!

FrancieBrady

weldoninhio wrote: »

So I claim to be an artist and *poof* all of these will subsidise me??

Well yes, if you are indeed an artist. If you are bull****ting it's sling yer hook time.

There is subsidy available, is the point. Artists as a collective will protest cuts too.

Panch18

sbsquarepants wrote: »

It's being sold to England and France mostly.

Now remind me, what was the purpose of subsidising farmers again? To secure our food supply, or to bump up profits for export companies?

Are you seriously going to argue that it's in my best interest that we provide cheap meat to England and therefore i need to be pay more to subsidise it?

Where do you think the EU subsidy comes from exactly?

Ireland being a very large net beneficiary for the majority of its life in the EU

So if the Brits and French are paying for it whats your problem with us sending them beef?

sbsquarepants

Panch18 wrote: »

Where do you think the EU subsidy comes from exactly?

Ireland being a very large net beneficiary for the majority of its life in the EU

So if the Brits and French are paying for it whats your problem with us sending them beef?

Ah so we're all good Europeans now are we, the gobshítes in town aren't greedy, they're just concerned about the iron deficiency among the housewives of Surrey and Toulouse:D

I assume we'll we'll stop sending them beef in a couple of weeks though, won't we?

How do EU subsidies apply to milk powder sold to china or beef to the arabs?

Panch18

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Ah so we're all good Europeans now are we, the gobshítes in town aren't greedy, they're just concerned about the iron deficiency among the housewives of Surrey:D

I assume we'll we'll stop sending them beef in a couple of weeks though, won't we?

you do understand how a common market works don't you??

aristotle25

Car99 wrote: »

I read the farmers are planning a slow protest on the M50 with their tractors, surely the Gardai will be stopping tractors going on a motorway as it's against the law and if the tractors make it to the motorway penalise the drivers for breaking the law.

Its not illegal for tractors to go on a motorway. Google tells me "tractors can be driven on the motorway in the Republic of Ireland, providing that the tractor is capable of reaching a minimum speed of 50km/h."

FrancieBrady

Panch18 wrote: »

you do understand how a common market works don't you??

I wouldn't bother. Even if you did explain it. Him/her would probably retort by telling you she/he doesn't like sausages so therefore nobody should be trying to make a living producing sausages...and by the way killing animals is wrong.'

MrMusician18

aristotle25 wrote: »

Its not illegal for tractors to go on a motorway. Google tells me "tractors can be driven on the motorway in the Republic of Ireland, providing that the tractor is capable of reaching a minimum speed of 50km/h."

Would I be correct in saying that an M50 protest has never been attempted before? Have the taxi drivers done it?

I suspect this will backfire badly.

Car99

aristotle25 wrote: »

Its not illegal for tractors to go on a motorway. Google tells me "tractors can be driven on the motorway in the Republic of Ireland, providing that the tractor is capable of reaching a minimum speed of 50km/h."

Is it common that tractors can achieve 50kms per hour?

Panch18

Car99 wrote: »

Is it common that tractors can achieve 50kms per hour?

a significant amount of modern tractors can

MrMusician18

Car99 wrote: »

Is it common that tractors can achieve 50kms per hour?

A lot, if not all of the big tractors on the protest would be capable of doing 50,kmh

seamus

Nothing says "I'm struggling to make ends meet" by paying someone else contract rates to run your business while you drive your spare €100,000 tractor up to Dublin for a couple of days.

aristotle25

Panch18 wrote: »

a significant amount of modern tractors can

The tractors I see them in at Stephens Green certainly will.
But yeah, I would say all modern tractors have a max speed over that,

gozunda

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Some farmer was moaning on rte 1 today that they're seeing none of the benefits of our current boom and they want more money. Neither am i tbh! If i wanted to get rich id probably try and get a job in google or fb or wherever the money is now. I wonder if i can get subsidised for teaching music...

I'd suggest you already are. Nearly all teaching in the state is hugely subsidised. So even if are not directly subsidised for music - then the kids you teach are and you are subsidised by the state for sick pay or health benefits or child care or free travel or redundancy or pensions etc etc - whichever of those which may apply.

I listened to a piece on the radio this morning. And the farmer wasnt saying they wanted 'more money' just a fair price for the goods they produce which are being sold by others at a huge markup. Vegetable growers here - not that long ago - were asking for the same thing.

But hey fek them - they are all just moaning right?

sbsquarepants

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I wouldn't bother. Even if you did explain it. Him/her would probably retort by telling you she/he doesn't like sausages so therefore nobody should be trying to make a living producing sausages...and by the way killing animals is wrong.'

I love sausages. I've no problem with killing animals for food.

My problem is entitled arseholes making stupid demands. You have no god given right to produce beef for a living, you're argument that it's for the benefit of the country is just bollox, you certainly have no god given right to produce 6 or 7 times more than is needed and demand you're paid over the odds, just cos - that's the crux of it. These people are greedy, deluded and irritating, they are just pandered to by cynical politicians chasing votes.

Coming up here, making a nuisance of yourselves and tormenting people in hospitals ffs. Nobody gives a shít if you're finding things a bit tight - go get a better paying job, just like everybody else would have to.

If there's no living to be made at what you're doing, do something else for a living. Problem solved

Panch18

seamus wrote: »

Nothing says "I'm struggling to make ends meet" by paying someone else contract rates to run your business while you drive your spare €100,000 tractor up to Dublin for a couple of days.

The cost of the tractor is irrelevant to the point you think you are making

However what the 100k tractor does show is that farmers are being ripped off left, right and centre.

In 1970 25 beef cattle sold would buy a new tractor - today a new tractor would cost you 90 cattle

and that is just 1 of many examples which show you where "the Brussels money" is going - because its not going into farmers pockets that's for sure

Panch18

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I love sausages. I've no problem with killing animals for food.

My problem is entitled arseholes making stupid demands. You have no god given right to produce beef for a living, you're argument that it's for the benefit of the country is just bollox, you certainly have no god given right to produce 6 or 7 times more than is needed and demand you're paid over the odds, just cos - that's the crux of it. These people are greedy, deluded and irritating, they are just pandered to by cynical politicians chasing votes.

Coming up here, making a nuisance of yourselves and tormenting people in hospitals ffs. Nobody gives a shít if you're finding things a bit tight - go get a better paying job, just like everybody else would have to.

If there's no living to be made at what you're doing, do something else for a living. Problem solved

The sooner there's another massive financial crash in this country the better - it might wipe the smugness off the face of some on here

Thelonious Monk

gozunda wrote: »

I'd suggest you already are. Nearly all teaching in the state is hugely subsidised. So even if are not directly subsidised for music - then the kids you teach are and you are subsidised by the state for sick pay or health benefits or child care or free travel or redundancy or pensions etc etc - whichever of those which may apply.

I don't think I get any of those tbh.

Car99

Panch18 wrote: »

The sooner there's another massive financial crash in this country the better - it might wipe the smugness off the face of some on here

And add alot of pain to the face of many others .

sbsquarepants

Panch18 wrote: »

In 1970 25 beef cattle sold would buy a new tractor - today a new tractor would cost you 90 cattle

Do you think that producing 6 or 7 times as much as is required could be connected in some way?

Dublin Spur

why are they targeting the general public when they're not happy about beef pricing ?

and if they don't like what they'r being offered for their beef they don't have to sell it do they ?

let the market dictate the price, we live in a capitalist country / continent.

gozunda

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

I don't think I get any of those tbh.

That's just a short list - lots more everyday things is subsidised. And as I said if you're not getting any direct subsidy for teaching or through an educational institution and their set-up - the kids you teach are and part of that spend goes back to you.

Thelonious Monk

I wonder if current beef farmers are encouraging their kids to get into the business. I would imagine not given how tough they apparently have it? Does this mean we'll see a reduction of beef farming in the coming years?

Thelonious Monk

These protests don't affect me at all, but why are the Garda enabling it? I would imagine if anyone else tried to block the port or M50 they wouldn't get close to even starting

Led by a garda escort, the tractors were driven along the quays in the city centre before arriving at Dublin Port. They will later today head for the M50 where a “slow protest” will take place as farmers head back to their respective counties.

gozunda

Dublin Spur wrote: »

why are they targeting the general public when they're not happy about beef pricing ?

and if they don't like what they'r being offered for their beef they don't have to sell it do they ?

let the market dictate the price, we live in a capitalist country / continent.

I dont think they are. Just Dublin is the capital and the seat of government here. It's not just beef either - the vegetable growers were also protesting about the same issues not long ago.

They are producing food which is certainly in demand and making a good price for others - but as a group they are simply looking for a fair price and not a loss on the goods they produce.

The way it's going with that direction - is that we will be eating crap, shipped here from the far side of the world most likley produced by slave labour in whatever hellhole has the least regulation or standards.

sbsquarepants

Panch18 wrote: »

The sooner there's another massive financial crash in this country the better - it might wipe the smugness off the face of some on here

I'm not smug - i just accept that the world doesn't owe me a living. I'm sure you feel no great concern for my financial situation, why would you? I have no problem with that.

Why on earth should i care about yours?

I'm sick of farmers always whinging and always putting their hands out. Nobody asked you to be a farmer, if it's a shít job why are you doing it?

Why are you borrowing money to buy shiny new machinery, some of which costs almost as much as a house, to do this shítty low paying job?

Could it possibly be that our protesters are in fact..........dun, dun dunnnnnn.... lying?

Dublin Spur

gozunda wrote: »

I dont think they are. Just Dublin is the capital and the seat of government here.

They are producing food which is certainly in demand and making a good price for others - but as a group they are simply looking for a fair price and not a loss on the goods they produce.

The way it's going with that direction - is that we will be eating crap, shipped here from the far side of the world most likley produced by slave labour in whatever hellhole has the least regulation or standards.

okay, but the people being effected by their actions are the general public, very unfair to the public and they won't win many friends this way

also if people want to eat crap that should be their choice.

there's no reason why agriculture should be any different from other industries - let the market dictate or get out of the business. We are a capitalist country not communists.

John_Rambo

The farmers interviewed on RTE Radio one did themselves no favours. Blunt, inarticulate, cagey, vague and belligerent. I believe they're going to target commuters trying to get out of Dublin on the M50 later.

This isn't France. They won't get support with these tactics.

FrancieBrady

Dublin Spur wrote: »

okay, but the people being effected by their actions are the general public, very unfair to the public and they won't win many friends this way
.

All protests of this nature aim to discomfort the public and have done since protesting began.

The idea is to get the conversation going and attention focused on the issues.

Jim 77

seamus wrote: »

Nothing says "I'm struggling to make ends meet" by paying someone else contract rates to run your business while you drive your spare €100,000 tractor up to Dublin for a couple of days.

It's very unlikely they'll be paying contractors to run their business while they're protesting, more likely, family or neighbouring farmers will do it for free. If they're livestock farmers then they could do the necessary checks and/or feeding before heading off for the day and then check them again when they return.

The new or replacement value of the tractor might be €100,000 but with depreciation its real or resale value is probably a lot less than that. Also, I'd say very few farmers have "spare tractors", although they may have a second old tractor (probably not roadworthy) whose resale value made it not worth selling and that can still be used around the farm for emergencies.

They may spend a couple of days protesting in total but for most, not in a contiguous period, so that they leave home and return on the same day.

MrMusician18

Jim 77 wrote: »

It's very unlikely they'll be paying contractors to run their business while they're protesting, more likely, family or neighbouring farmers will do it for free. If they're livestock farmers then they could do the necessary checks and/or feeding before heading off for the day and then check them again when they return.

The new or replacement value of the tractor might be €100,000 but with depreciation its real or resale value is probably a lot less than that. Also, I'd say very few farmers have "spare tractors", although they may have a second old tractor (probably not roadworthy) whose resale value made it not worth selling and that can still be used around the farm for emergencies.

They may spend a couple of days protesting in total but for most, not in a contiguous period, so that they leave home and return on the same day.

I understand that some of the tractors at least are contractors tractors loaned for the protest.

Contractors would be keen to see reversals in carbon tax policy.

Balf

John_Rambo wrote: »

The farmers interviewed on RTE Radio one did themselves no favours. Blunt, inarticulate, cagey, vague and belligerent. I believe they're going to target commuters trying to get out of Dublin on the M50 later.

Its just a small group of ignorant people, a few dozen, doing what ignorant people do when they aren't getting their way.

Obviously, most beef farmers are just working at their on and off farm jobs today, like the rest of us.

I simply don't understand why the Gardaí are facilitating this. Can any few dozen people decide they are going to disrupt the city for two days?

the.red.baron

seamus wrote: »

Nothing says "I'm struggling to make ends meet" by paying someone else contract rates to run your business while you drive your spare €100,000 tractor up to Dublin for a couple of days.

id say they can afford the 2 days off and the tractor isn't really needed in Jan


You can write the deprecation on that off against tax paid, so it might indeed be worth buying a spare

weldoninhio

gozunda wrote: »

I dont think they are. Just Dublin is the capital and the seat of government here. It's not just beef either - the vegetable growers were also protesting about the same issues not long ago.

They are producing food which is certainly in demand and making a good price for others - but as a group they are simply looking for a fair price and not a loss on the goods they produce.

The way it's going with that direction - is that we will be eating crap, shipped here from the far side of the world most likley produced by slave labour in whatever hellhole has the least regulation or standards.

Dublin Port and the M50 aren't "the seat of government". They are intentionally trying to stop the general public from going about their daily errands.

gozunda

Dublin Spur wrote: »

okay, but the people being effected by their actions are the general public, very unfair to the public and they won't win many friends this way

also if people want to eat crap that should be their choice.

there's no reason why agriculture should be any different from other industries - let the market dictate or get out of the business. We are a capitalist country not communists.

I think that goes with all protests tbh. Just saying

The thing is if we let this go to its logical conclusions- the only thing available will be crap produced in some hellhole most likley with slave labour and bugger all standards or regulations.
Not the direction I would like to see us going tbh.

Plenty of market regulation of capitalist ecomonies already

Most countries support food production in some firm or other.
The system needs to change because at the moment it's only supporting good man & co and orther massive resellers.

gozunda

weldoninhio wrote: »

Dublin Port and the M50 aren't "the seat of government". They are intentionally trying to stop the general public from going about their daily errands.

It's still Dublin. But no I didnt set their route. But I suppose they are looking for maximum exposure. Thats just an objective view btw.

sbsquarepants

the.red.baron wrote: »

id say they can afford the 2 days off and the tractor isn't really needed in Jan


You can write the deprecation on that off against tax paid, so it might indeed be worth buying a spare

Must be terrible, you know, being that broke.

We should have a whip around!

weldoninhio

gozunda wrote: »

It's still Dublin. But no I didnt set their route. But I suppose they are looking for maximum exposure. Thats just an objective view btw.

A few years ago I was out for a spin with a friend. The radiator was overheating and threatening to blow up, we were about 4km from home so he nursed it home at about 10/15mph. Unfortunately a bus was behind us and couldn't get past us as the roads were quite narrow.

About 2 hours after we got back to my mates house, the Gardai arrived. The bus driver had taken the reg and reported my friend thinking he was taking the pi55. Luckily he was under the car trying to figure out what was wrong with it and the cops took him at his word. I wonder will the Gardai be charging these people who are purposely blocking traffic on the motorway later.

Thelonious Monk

weldoninhio wrote: »

A few years ago I was out for a spin with a friend. The radiator was overheating and threatening to blow up, we were about 4km from home so he nursed it home at about 10/15mph. Unfortunately a bus was behind us and couldn't get past us as the roads were quite narrow.

About 2 hours after we got back to my mates house, the Gardai arrived. The bus driver had taken the reg and reported my friend thinking he was taking the pi55. Luckily he was under the car trying to figure out what was wrong with it and the cops took him at his word. I wonder will the Gardai be charging these people who are purposely blocking traffic on the motorway later.

I doubt they'll do anything, they seem to get a free pass. At lunchtime I cycled towards St Stephen's Green down Merrion Row, which was closed off to traffic, and some prick Garda started shouting at me that it was a one way street - I said it's closed to traffic what does it matter, and he insisted I walk with the bike. Meanwhile there's a tonne of tractors blocking off streets and they do nothing about it. It's all very odd.

Panch18

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

I doubt they'll do anything, they seem to get a free pass. At lunchtime I cycled towards St Stephen's Green down Merrion Row, which was closed off to traffic, and some prick Garda started shouting at me that it was a one way street - I said it's closed to traffic what does it matter, and he insisted I walk with the bike. Meanwhile there's a tonne of tractors blocking off streets and they do nothing about it. It's all very odd.

So you were going the wrong way down a 1 way street and you wonder why the Garda was shouting at you??

jmayo

sbsquarepants wrote: »

I'm not attacking you, i'm just asking you a question. Lots of jobs are difficult, have unsociable hours and so on - who cares?

If you don't like the hours, they pay, the conditions and so on - get a different job. Problem solved!

Nobody owes anyone else a living.

For someone lecturing farmers to give up and change jobs because they are not paying very well, why don't you take your own fooking advice.

BTW where do you suggest they go look for work and do you suggest they sell their family home in the process?

I am sick of this type of shyte that is often laced with they were/are rich and only want more money.
Yes they want more money because at the moment the vast majority of them are operating at a loss.

And yes they do get taxpayer subsidies, but so has lots of areas including ordinary citizens who own homes and get grants to improve insulation, etc.
Every fooking foreign multinational in this state has been subsidised in some way or another.
Some obviously more than others.
And yes they create jobs, but so do farmers in their own way.

They use contractors, they buy supplies in local coops, local hardware stores, fuel suppliers, etc.
The raw materials they produce keep people in work in meat factories and creameries.

sbsquarepants wrote: »

...
My point is that beef farming is already very well subsidised, we are producing 6 or 7 times as much beef as we need. Enough is enough.

It's basic supply and demand - If you're making way too much of a product, why on earth would the price be high?

And yet more shyte pedaled around here, usually by certain vegan loons, about why we produce so much more beef and dairy than we eat.

If that argument was used world wide no fooker outside of the Carribbean would have a banana or we would never see oranges, pineapples or grapes to name but a few.

It is infantile lunacy.

We produce stuff for export, actually one of our few true indigenous exports that can't disappear overnight based on the whims of a foreign corporate executive or foreign government.

And as others have said if we don't produce someone else will, probably someone with much lower standards and environmental responsibilities.

It is like the disingenuous shyte that is now spoofed about how animal farming is evil incarnate and we all need to go veggie.

What people firstly don't realise is that horticulture and cereals production is not some environmental loving alternative.
There are huge amounts of fertiliser, pesticides, insecticides and soil health damaging processes in those forms of intensive agriculture.

Secondly most of that produce has to be imported because we simply do not have the climate or soils to grow enough.

It is like listening to a tofu & quinoa munching and almond milk guzzling vegan loon lecture people about the evils of pollution from meat & dairy and yet their food has to be shipped half way across the world and from farms that were once a wildernesses.

Strumms

Panch18 wrote: »

So you were going the wrong way down a 1 way street and you wonder why the Garda was shouting at you??

I think what the poster is saying is.... the Garda is taking an exception to a person going down a one way street on a bike... but the Gardai as an organization will facilitate and ignore multiple industrial vehicles turning up, committing numerous offenses and doing sweet fûck all about it...apart from helping it..

Panch18

Strumms wrote: »

I think what the poster is saying is.... the Garda is taking an exception to a person going down a one way street on a bike... but the Gardai as an organization will facilitate and ignore multiple industrial vehicles turning up, committing numerous offenses and doing sweet fûck all about it...apart from helping it..

That applies to nearly every protest ever held in Dublin

ooter

they don't want to disrupt people in Dublin but they're travelling along the M50 at 4 MPH.

Strumms

Panch18 wrote: »

That applies to nearly every protest ever held in Dublin

I’d disagree, how many protests do you witness in Dublin with masses of industrial equipment and people in close proximity on the streets, unless you can advise, it only seems to be a farmers thing.

jmayo

I would say there are couple of major reasons why Gardai are not going heavy handed on farmers as some of our cosmopolitan Dubs would like.

Firstly a lot of Gardai themselves come from farming and rural background.
Even though some dubs think we are an urban society, we still have huge chunk of population that is somewhat rural.

Secondly only an idiot of a politician, civil servant or garda would give go ahead to have huge clampdown on protesting farmers.
The Irish have a tendency to galvanise support when really pushed.

Hitting farmers with big fines would result in some farmers doing a Rossport 5 and that would only copper-fasten support across the country.
And only complete morons fail to understand that farmers above all else could bring this country to a standstill.
It wouldn't take much to block every motorway, block every city and major town.
And sooner or later I reckon this is coming down the road.

Some people think Irish farmers are somewhat special in this protesting, but it is on the rise throughout Europe.

Check out how Dutch farmers caused 100 km tailbacks in The Netherlands, a far more urban nation than ours.
Some smart policeman tried to stop them getting into The Hague and the farmers took to the beaches.

Or check out how French farmers screwed with the traffic in one of the biggest cities in Europe or how German farmers brought traffic headaches to some of the biggest cities in the most industrialised state in Europe.

The authorities here are hoping things fizzle out and that the end of it.
Poking the protaganoists will make the situation worse.

All going well on the M50.

Don't try to go southbound today, you wont get home til 9 tonight.

https://twitter.com/ColmHand/status/1217862350327427073

Mr.Crinklewood

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

All going well on the M50.

Don't try to go southbound today, you wont get home til 9 tonight.

https://twitter.com/ColmHand/status/1217862350327427073

Hope they pay their toll charges.

Thelonious Monk

I just saw and heard some of these awful, awful people on the television. They should come with subtitles. I thank my lucky stars I'm a cosmopolitan Dubliner.