Formula 1 2020 - General Discussion Thread (See MOD warning on first post)

skipper_G

billybonkers wrote: »

IF they finish on 0 points they get less money than if they finish on 1

No they don't, the prize money is based on Championship order

eviltimeban

quokula wrote: »

It would make a bigger mockery of the competition to put a driver that's several years out of practice in the fastest car on the grid.

Would be funny if Vandoorne had hopped in, stuck it on pole, got the fastest lap, and won the race.

quokula

Top Dog wrote: »

Don't get me wrong, I don't really think the situation will arise. I hope George gets a strong top 10 finish, I'll be delighted for him if he can creak the top 5, but I think it's a huge ask or expectation to think he'll end up on the podium.

I'm just curious as to people's thoughts on it given how much analysis is done these days with the various scenarios.

If he doesn't beat Verstappen it will be a failure. He's a solid driver with current F1 experience and the car is comfortably the fastest on the grid. Bottas doesn't lose to Verstappen except when he has punctures, bad starts or other incidents. That should be a minimum expectation for Russell. If he misses the podium purely on pace without it being due to incidents or whatever then it would be a huge setback in his chances for a full time drive.

I would expect him to have a good chance to beat Bottas in the way Hulkenberg showed himself capable of walking in and outperforming Stroll. But if he doesn't beat Bottas he should still come in second at the very least.

ELM327

quokula wrote: »

If he doesn't beat Verstappen it will be a failure. He's a solid driver with current F1 experience and the car is comfortably the fastest on the grid. Bottas doesn't lose to Verstappen except when he has punctures, bad starts or other incidents. That should be a minimum expectation for Russell. If he misses the podium purely on pace without it being due to incidents or whatever then it would be a huge setback in his chances for a full time drive.

I would expect him to have a good chance to beat Bottas in the way Hulkenberg showed himself capable of walking in and outperforming Stroll. But if he doesn't beat Bottas he should still come in second at the very least.

Hulk had driven for the same team a couple of years before.

quokula

ELM327 wrote: »

Hulk had driven for the same team a couple of years before.

I would say current experience would be far more valuable than racing a different chassis for the same team when they were under different owners a few years ago. There's the personnel side of it, having a working relationship with the engineers and the like, sure, but as Russell has always been in the Mercedes stable I would guess he would have some familiarity already.

ELM327

Has he ever been their sim driver or test driver? ie has he driven the car before, virtually even? (I dont know the answer). If "no" it's going to be abig ask to get up to speed quickly but at least for him it's at a simple track where no one has prior experience of the layout.

pjohnson

ELM327 wrote: »

Has he ever been their sim driver or test driver? ie has he driven the car before, virtually even? (I dont know the answer). If "no" it's going to be abig ask to get up to speed quickly but at least for him it's at a simple track where no one has prior experience of the layout.

Russell has been their test driver from 2017 - 2019 when he could be classified as a "rookie". Think he actually made his Merc debut in a 2016 test session.

El_Duderino 09

Top Dog wrote: »

Because they've asked Bottas to move over in the past to help Hamilton in his charge for the championship? Team orders do exist, so it wouldn't be beyond them to have some contingency plan in place.

Don't get me wrong, I don't really think the situation will arise. I hope George gets a strong top 10 finish, I'll be delighted for him if he can creak the top 5, but I think it's a huge ask or expectation to think he'll end up on the podium.

I'm just curious as to people's thoughts on it given how much analysis is done these days with the various scenarios.

I know they could do it. The question I asked was why they would do it.

Harika

AMKC wrote: »

If Russel were to do really well and win the race surely then that could put pressure on both Mercedes and Lewis.
Why would Mercedes bother to resign Hamilton when they could sign Russel for less to do the same job?
I wonder is Lewis worried about that having signed a new deal yet with Mercedes. Might be a mistake waiting so long.
Of course I doubt that scenery will happen but it could.

Race winner and championship contender/dominator are three very distinctly different things. By winning Russell would only proof he can win a race. Salo would have one while substitute without team order, what still made him not in the run for the Irvine replacement

Adamocovic

We already know how good Russell is at qualifying.

If he continues his streak and out qualifies Bottas it will not look good for Bottas at all.

Will be an exciting race!

ELM327

Agree. Gives an interesting reason to watch!

artanevilla

I'd say Bottas is licking door handles in the hope of getting a positive test.

Joeface

Maybe Bottas is awaiting test results as well , then you need both Vandoorne and Russell ...actually that would be more interesting .

El_Duderino 09

Adamocovic wrote: »

We already know how good Russell is at qualifying.

If he continues his streak and out qualifies Bottas it will not look good for Bottas at all.

Will be an exciting race!

Quali is the strongest part of Bottas game. He’s usually competitive with Hamilton in quali but falls away in the race. If Russell could compete with Bottas in quali it would be a huge achievement.

It just happens that Russell is also a good qualifier so could be a good competition.

pjohnson

Alonso has been cleared to do the post season test with Renault.

Kubica (Alfa Romeo) and Buemi (Red Bull) also now confirmed to be taking part.


Ferrari are to ask McLaren to release Sainz.

Adamocovic

ELM327 wrote: »

Agree. Gives an interesting reason to watch!

To be fair I thought Mercedes were going to go with the boring safe option of Vandoorne.

Delighted they’ve proven me wrong! Championship wrapped up so this certainly adds some spice into the mix.

Two new drivers on the grid and Russell in a Merc. Just the entertainment value we needed to rope us into another week.

Probably first time I’ve been hoping to see a Merc on the top step of the podium! Do believe a podium would be an outrageous result for Russell. Going to be a big change of pace for him and racing will be completely different. Not languishing in the back, rather hustling it up front with a car capable of defending and attacking.

Sure in his F2 days he was a pro and taking the lead and holding onto it, but this will be a real test of his bottle.

Adamocovic

artanevilla wrote: »

I'd say Bottas is licking door handles in the hope of getting a positive test.

It really is a no win situation for him.

Beats out Russell = should be doing that anyway. Doesn’t prove anything.

Loses out to Russell = how can this happen? Is he the driver they should be moving forward with?

That’s before you mention the fact he will have to battle Verstappen too!

Inquitus

Adamocovic wrote: »

It really is a no win situation for him.

Beats out Russell = should be doing that anyway. Doesn’t prove anything.

Loses out to Russell = how can this happen? Is he the driver they should be moving forward with?

That’s before you mention the fact he will have to battle Verstappen too!

Aye I concur, its lose lose for Bottas, if Russell does well it's bad for Bottas and beating Russell out of the gate is the clear expectation.

quokula

It's not like Bottas really has a reputation to protect though. Everyone already knows he's a poor driver and only in that position because Mercedes don't want a situation like they had with Rosberg.

Mitch Connor

quokula wrote: »

It's not like Bottas really has a reputation to protect though. Everyone already knows he's a poor driver and only in that position because Mercedes don't want a situation like they had with Rosberg.

Poor driver.

FFS.

his 4th and 5ths DriverChampionship finishes for Williams must have been down to sheer luck.

Poor.

ELM327

Yes, the williams was a better car then.
Even Massa was getting performance out of it.

quokula

ELM327 wrote: »

Yes, the williams was a better car then.
Even Massa was getting performance out of it.

This. Williams was the second fastest car on the grid at the time and Bottas was barely ahead of an ageing, post injury, ready to retire Massa.

The point I was making is that if Russell beats Bottas, Mercedes aren't going to suddenly replace him. They've had ample opportunity to replace him with a better driver for several years but they don't want to rock the boat with Hamilton after the turmoil when they had an above average driver like Rosberg in the car.

Bottas has a safe seat there until Hamilton retires, at which point he'll either play number 2 to Hamilton's replacement, or he'll be dumped if they decide to change tack and go with two competitive drivers. Nothing about his performance relative to Russell will change that.

Russell has a lot more to gain or lose, as his performances could play into the decision as to whether or not he becomes Hamilton's replacement, or Mercedes decide to look elsewhere. There is no shortage of very fast drivers in that age bracket right now, Russell is in the best position as he's a Mercedes junior driver, but they have the financial capacity to look outside their own camp at the likes of Leclerc, Sainz, Norris, or even Verstappen.

Adamocovic

Only copped that Russell will be the first member of the Mercedes junior program to actually race for them in F1.

Big milestone for them too so.

H3llR4iser

AMKC wrote: »

If Russel were to do really well and win the race surely then that could put pressure on both Mercedes and Lewis.
Why would Mercedes bother to resign Hamilton when they could sign Russel for less to do the same job?
I wonder is Lewis worried about that having signed a new deal yet with Mercedes. Might be a mistake waiting so long.
Of course I doubt that scenery will happen but it could.

Let's be clear - there's no way Mercedes are gonna "shaft" Hamilton, unless he decides he wants to be a singer/designer/whatever he fancies for 2021. He is an integral part of the team, it's not just an employer-employee relationship where "hey, someone younger and cheaper than you came around, thanks and feck off, please!".

Not only that, but for the brand it would be a spectacular own goal, because the narrative would immediately shift from that of the "perfect winning machine" to an "ungrateful bunch of Krauts" (although there is hardly a German in that team ) in a matter of minutes...

Adamocovic

Went down a rabbit hole for Mazepin yesterday. Then saw this post on Reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comments/k4snkn/nikita_mazepin_and_his_problematic_behaviour_a/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

Doesn’t exactly paint him in a good light.
What would you know I then saw him congratulating Russell on Instagram. All the replies were indicating that Haas have clearly setup a PR team for him now!

Unfortunately his addition probably means exit doors for Kyvat who I do rate.

Will be interesting how Mazepin does but looks like he will be a bit chaotic off track, unless he cops himself on.

Jordan 199

Nikita Marzipan. Ain't that something you put on a Christmas cake?

Frank Bullitt

Delighted for Schumacher, to see that new on the grid again will be nice to see, at least for me.

Frank Bullitt

the_pen_turner

i think the main reason for going with russel is that they still have a decent reserve driver ready to jump in if bottas is out. if they used stofffel then what options have they if needed. could russel drop everything at williams on saturday morning and go to merc

cadaliac

I expect Bottas to get pole and Russell to be in top 5 on the starting grid.
Race? Anyone can guess, but no matter how talented the man is he won't be used to the car.
There surely will be issues, no matter how fast the car is.