Formula 1 2020 - General Discussion Thread (See MOD warning on first post)

ELM327

pjohnson wrote: »

I dont get the part involving Lawrence taking over Mercedes. Is he not basically already in charge of Racing Point/Aston Martin? (The other team Wolff owns shares in).

Unless Stroll plans to have Merc as big team with Aston Martin a junior team? But a factory junior team?

You could have Stroll Racing and Paseo Carreras as the junior team, same setup as RB and TR. With Stroll Jr now driving for Mercedes.


Imagine if he won a WDC

barryribs

Cork Trucker wrote: »

Will it impact the F1 team i wonder.

https://twitter.com/rtenews/status/1266258016858288131?s=20

The team and group are up for sale. Very sad day for F1

https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/52847040

mickdw

LIGHTNING wrote: »

What a sad day for F1 to loose Williams. Probably will become some awful brand name F1 team.

If Bernie was around, a deal would likely be done to keep the team.
I know covid must be causing extreme difficulties but i read the last 2 tax years for williams resulted in 16m profit the year before last and 10 million loss last year. Not bad figures for a team with its worse track performance ever.
Hopefully, some investment will be enough to save it.

Inviere

Realistically, with everything that has happened over the last few months, who would be interested in buying an F1 team who've finished bottom for two seasons in a row? F1 is a money pit, I don't see this ending well for Williams

pjohnson

They might make it.



Latifi Sr. already "loaned" them money so agree to give him shares and maybe do like DAMS in F2 last year and give Sofina and Lavazza prominent spots on the car.


Nissany money is also tied to the team this year (but can't buy a race seat for Roy as he hasn't the licence)


Bleak.

jelutong

F1 is facing a very precarious future I think. Car manufacturers making thousands of workers redundant and closing plants can hardly justify spending hundreds millions on motor racing.

ELM327

Inviere wrote: »

Realistically, with everything that has happened over the last few months, who would be interested in buying an F1 team who've finished bottom for two seasons in a row? F1 is a money pit, I don't see this ending well for Williams

The license and legacy payments as they are in the top 10 constructors would be worth something.

GarIT

Some good news!


Renault has confirmed to Motorsport.com that the cost cap has allowed them to commit to continuing their F1 entry into 2021 and beyond.


I wonder if Mazepin will be interested in Williams now that he can't buy Renault.

HAAS were considering selling last year but committed to staying, I wonder if they are rethinking.

Top Dog

GarIT wrote: »

Renault has confirmed to Motorsport.com that the cost cap has allowed them to commit to continuing their F1 entry into 2021 and beyond.

Meanwhile they're letting go of 15000 staff globally of their 180k staff. :eek:

El_Duderino 09

LIGHTNING wrote: »

What a sad day for F1 to loose Williams. Probably will become some awful brand name F1 team.

It's sad but f1 lost Williams quite a while ago. The team is dead now. They had a season as complete also-rans, miles off the pace and using two pay drivers. One for cheap engines and one as a straight swap for cash. Same this year as nobody is suggesting latifi is more than a pay driver.

Better to let Williams go and see if they can get someone with new ideas to take over.

El_Duderino 09

mickdw wrote: »

If Bernie was around, a deal would likely be done to keep the team.
I know covid must be causing extreme difficulties but i read the last 2 tax years for williams resulted in 16m profit the year before last and 10 million loss last year. Not bad figures for a team with its worse track performance ever.
Hopefully, some investment will be enough to save it.

I wo set was that including the engineering business? In any case the cars they made were crap. And $16m wouldn't touch the sides of the problem they have with the car. Why get into debt when they could just sell and run the family engineering business and be wealthy?

I wish the Williams' well with the future. They ran a great F1 team in the past. But that's the past. Onwards and upwards for f1 and the Williams'

GarIT

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I wo set was that including the engineering business? In any case the cars they made were crap. And $16m wouldn't touch the sides of the problem they have with the car. Why get into debt when they could just sell and run the family engineering business and be wealthy?

I wish the Williams' well with the future. They ran a great F1 team in the past. But that's the past. Onwards and upwards for f1 and the Williams'

The Williams family don't own the Williams Advanced Engineering company, they sold most of it last year, held onto around 10%

Cork Trucker

If the Williams name does vanish from the grid it will be a sad day for F1. Oddly what is even more sad is that it's all but certain that an ttetnion seeking, crash prone driver in Maldonado will take his place in the history books as the man to give the team their final win. i'd nearly prefer if it were Montoya now. in 1997 when it was known Renault were parting ways with Williams i didnt expect it would be the final title, i genuinely thought they would do it with BMW, but again even they couldn't do it themselves as a constructor. I can see Ferrari going in 10 years or less with the way the global economy is now changing.

GarIT

Handelsblatt (apparently a reputable german newspaper) are reporting that Daimler (Mercedes) have confirmed Mercedes is staying in F1 as a works team with Toto Wolf as the team Principal.

Harika

Moto GP has cancelled the Silverstone round, not looking good for F1 I would say, but at least they have a plan b with Hockenheim

El_Duderino 09

GarIT wrote: »

The Williams family don't own the Williams Advanced Engineering company, they sold most of it last year, held onto around 10%

Backed the wrong horse there. The engineering business was the better of the two.

El_Duderino 09

Harika wrote: »

Moto GP has cancelled the Silverstone round, not looking good for F1 I would say, but at least they have a plan b with Hockenheim

I'd say the f1 will be grand. Johnson has asked his people to make an exception from quarantine for the f1 teams. So I'd say everything will be fine by the time it comes around (as long as there isn't a second wave or something to cause a second lockdown.

When was the moto gp scheduled for?

flazio

The big loser in all this is potentially Jamie Chadwick. I would have expected Rokit to push to get her some time in the Williams since they now also sponsor the entire W series, which she won. But with the ties to Williams now set to be cut and Williams likely to be trying to cut the wage bill, Chadwick could be left out in the cold.

Harika

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

I'd say the f1 will be grand. Johnson has asked his people to make an exception from quarantine for the f1 teams. So I'd say everything will be fine by the time it comes around (as long as there isn't a second wave or something to cause a second lockdown.

When was the moto gp scheduled for?

30 th of August.
On the other hand, Austria seems to be fixed and will go ahead with 500 visitors on the grand stands. Official announcement incoming

Why did Williams serve notice to cut ties with Rokit? Surely they're an income stream. Doesn't make much sense to me for a company to give up income like that.

For the first time I see F1 on a proper decline over the next while. They have the minimum number of teams possible but they're struggling to maintain them. Would also be concerned about Renault making their "fully committed" statement.

El_Duderino 09

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Why did Williams serve notice to cut ties with Rokit? Surely they're an income stream. Doesn't make much sense to me for a company to give up income like that.

For the first time I see F1 on a proper decline over the next while. They have the minimum number of teams possible but they're struggling to maintain them. Would also be concerned about Renault making their "fully committed" statement.

It's been coming. FE has no problem getting manufacturers because it's the technology the manufacturers want to pay to compete and develop. F1 just doesn't have that. F1 used to be cutting edge tech and now the cutting edge had moved away from f1.

It's just the way things go. F1 was the future for a long time.

donspeekinglesh

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

It's been coming. FE has no problem getting manufacturers because it's the technology the manufacturers want to pay to compete and develop. F1 just doesn't have that. F1 used to be cutting edge tech and now the cutting edge had moved away from f1.

It's just the way things go. F1 was the future for a long time.

FE is also cheap. $10m/$15m will get you running at the front.

El_Duderino 09

donspeekinglesh wrote: »

FE is also cheap. $10m/$15m will get you running at the front.

That's much more appealing than F1. It's been struggling for a while now. It seems to cost a fortune and the only ones really making money are the broadcasters. CVC made money too of course and that might be one of the reasons the costs are so high.

pjohnson

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Why did Williams serve notice to cut ties with Rokit? Surely they're an income stream. Doesn't make much sense to me for a company to give up income like that.

For the first time I see F1 on a proper decline over the next while. They have the minimum number of teams possible but they're struggling to maintain them. Would also be concerned about Renault making their "fully committed" statement.

Saw a few posts on Reddit about ROKiT and they seems to show the company is actually somewhat like Rich Energy.

They talk the talk and organise plenty of sponsorship but when it comes to actual products more of a ghost town. Plenty of promises and the name is everywhere but products are discontinued or out of stock for years. Plus the main director has been in charge of 7 or 8 previous failed business. And accounts of a previous incarnation of ROKiT showed like $50m in losses.


Theres no actual sign of where the money actually comes from.

El_Duderino 09

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

It's been coming. FE has no problem getting manufacturers because it's the technology the manufacturers want to pay to compete and develop. F1 just doesn't have that. F1 used to be cutting edge tech and now the cutting edge had moved away from f1.

It's just the way things go. F1 was the future for a long time.

Cost is the major thing against new teams and the insistence on not having customer teams didn't help. The move to pay TV left the sport very vulnerable IMO. As sport comes back there'll be an element of needing to re-attract fans. Without exposure on one of a handful of freely available TV channels it'll be harder. It was a short-sighted decision to go with sky.

pjohnson

pjohnson wrote: »

Saw a few posts on Reddit about ROKiT and they seems to show the company is actually somewhat like Rich Energy.

They talk the talk and organise plenty of sponsorship but when it comes to actual products more of a ghost town. Plenty of promises and the name is everywhere but products are discontinued or out of stock for years. Plus the main director has been in charge of 7 or 8 previous failed business. And accounts of a previous incarnation of ROKiT showed like $50m in losses.


Theres no actual sign of where the money actually comes from.

Was wondering about them alright. Their sponsorship of Williams pretty much passed me by but I noticed them sponsoring The Race and some of the SIM racing but couldn't figure out what they did.

pjohnson

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Was wondering about them alright. Their sponsorship of Williams pretty much passed me by but I noticed them sponsoring The Race and some of the SIM racing but couldn't figure out what they did.

- Sell budget non smart-phones that somehow include 24/7 medical and legal support.
- out of stock marula oil
- failed water purification system
- randomly claim to manufacture *something unspecific* for NASA
- claim they created the idea of apps before Steve Jobs did.

And more scatterings of utterly random stuff.

Harika

Rokit was always suspect, when announced at Williams you couldn't get the product, could be startup with cash behind. Still now nothing to be seen except cheap phones with bad reviews

El_Duderino 09

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Cost is the major thing against new teams and the insistence on not having customer teams didn't help. The move to pay TV left the sport very vulnerable IMO. As sport comes back there'll be an element of needing to re-attract fans. Without exposure on one of a handful of freely available TV channels it'll be harder. It was a short-sighted decision to go with sky.

Absolutely short sighted to take it off free to air. (Might be more medium sighted as they would get away with it for a few years).

CVC really are a disease. They arrive, throw some money about and then drain the sport for all its worth. They're buying into rugby at the moment and I'm very sorry to see it happening to another sport I love.

El_Duderino 09

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Absolutely short sighted to take it off free to air. (Might be more medium sighted as they would get away with it for a few years).

CVC really are a disease. They arrive, throw some money about and then drain the sport for all its worth. They're buying into rugby at the moment and I'm very sorry to see it happening to another sport I love.

Could be wrong but I thought it was Bernie who moved it to PayTV. Increase the value in the short-term with cash and sell it while the going's good.
I've been blathering on about it for years but F1 was *the* motorsport for a long time and one of the biggest sports full stop. Race winner would be on Monday's back page, result was on the evening news (and would brag that they had footage) and a Brit winning the WDC usually meant sports personality of the year. It was just "on", and that kind of exposure is priceless.