Husband vent

GreeBo

Raylee Obedient Rent wrote: »

I have found that over the past 2-3 years on this forum that there's some very incorrect, and frankly, dangerous information on here spouted as fact. There's tons of scaremongering going on when it comes to co-sleeping and it's idiotic to claim that it doesn't work for anyone and it's bad for kids nad every childcare and healthcare body in the world advices against it (where do you come up with such jibberish?)

Co-sleeping may or may not work for you. It can also be dangerous IF there are added risk factors.

Take the advice on this forum with a grain of salt, seriously...

Im not talking specifically about SIDS, I'm talking about the fact that children who sleep on their own fall asleep sooner, sleep longer and wake easier.
Plus the added benefit that everyone else also gets a good night sleep.

Perhaps you could supply a link where some recognized body advocates or promotes co-sleeping?

BarryD2

GreeBo wrote: »

They will scream less on night 2 than on night 1 as they learn you aren't going to cave in...

Frankly, this isn't great advice. Different strokes for different folks but if you want to visit trauma on your kids, that's your business.

GreeBo

BarryD2 wrote: »

Frankly, this isn't great advice. Different strokes for different folks but if you want to visit trauma on your kids, that's your business.

Kids crying isn't trauma, kids left alone crying can be trauma if its for a prolonged period.

I'm not advocating simply shutting the door and ignoring them for the night, I'm talking about being consistent in not allowing them to run the house by simply crying to get what they want.

Seriously, this forum is bizarre sometimes, its pretty basic (although not easy) stuff to get your children to sleep normally, on their own all night, the majority of the time.

GreeBo

seamus wrote: »

The main problem here is that no authority wants to leave some "ah sure it'll be OK, if..." wiggle room because people usually misinterpret this as a green light. This is why "no amount of alcohol is safe when you're pregnant" and every single medication advises that "pregnant or breastfeeding women should consult their doctor", even if when they're only sugar pills.

You are correct, but rather than go into the nuts and bolts, I would advise anyone doing it or considering it to read up on it; https://www.whattoexpect.com/first-year/cosleeping.aspx

We've been very lucky in that neither of our children have ever bed-shared with us. Any time we tried out of desperation, they wouldn't settle. So I have no bias in this matter, and I'm certainly not judging anyone for doing it

"Is bed-sharing safe for my baby?
The short answer is no."

Not sure how that link shows them to be correct?

Monkey2019

Bed sharing is dangerous when you are talking about a new born yes. Baby can fall out, parent could roll over onto baby without realising, could smother if duvet went over their head etc etc i wouldnt argue that and i never had my new born in the bed as i was too afraid of these things.

But in this specific occasion we are talking about toddlers here - i think that's what people mean?

nthclare

I'm 43 and my son's 19 now, been there done that it was stressful especially when one's absolutely wrecked and trying to run a business or do a 40 hour week.

Myself and his mum didn't stay together, looking back now it can see how it can make or break a couple.

Having kids in today's society is much harder, more pressure less money and less leisure time unless you're one of those artisan couples running a garden center or funky cafe with similar friends in your circle.

I see these what you might call bohemian or hippie types of couples who all help each other out, love kids and the family unit.
If you're having an off day maybe you could call to a friend with your kids and let your kids play with their kids and visa versa...

Change of scenery is good for both the parents and kids, or dad's meeting up with other dad's and bringing the kids, to give mum some space.

This was regular enough from 1996 backwards, as far as I remember 1997 was when things changed slowly and gradually up to now where raring kids is hard.

It seems like the really wealthy and the hippie types have a better work life balance than the middle classes to be honest.

seamus

GreeBo wrote: »

"Is bed-sharing safe for my baby?
The short answer is no."

Not sure how that link shows them to be correct?

He's correct that it's "dangerous if there are added risk factors". And to be fair he did talk about co-sleeping not bed-sharing specifically. The problem is that people are very bad at understand risk factors or accounting for them, hence the general advice is that bed-sharing should just not be done. But we're dragging this off-topic, anyone who wants to start a debate on sleeping arrangements should probably start a new thread

GreeBo

seamus wrote: »

He's correct that it's "dangerous if there are added risk factors". And to be fair he did talk about co-sleeping not bed-sharing specifically. The problem is that people are very bad at understand risk factors or accounting for them, hence the general advice is that bed-sharing should just not be done. But we're dragging this off-topic, anyone who wants to start a debate on sleeping arrangements should probably start a new thread

Ah ok, I'm not specifically referring to the dangers, more the negative impacts of bed-sharing with any aged children.

jlm29

GreeBo wrote: »

Ah ok, I'm not specifically referring to the dangers, more the negative impacts of bed-sharing with any aged children.

Which I suspect are largely based on your opinion, rather than fact, which is how you presented it

margo321

You can't just fix the kids sleeping etc. Kids are kids they are hard work and will be for a long time. It's their nature. Your husband needs to identify his problems and fix them.

GreeBo

jlm29 wrote: »

Which I suspect are largely based on your opinion, rather than fact, which is how you presented it

Actually it's based on quite a lot of research, do you have any that promotes sharing a bed with your kids?
It's love to read it.

Monkey2019

GreeBo wrote: »

Actually it's based on quite a lot of research, do you have any that promotes sharing a bed with your kids?
It's love to read it.

https://www.developmentalscience.com/blog/2015/3/31/safe-cosleeping-is-better-for-babies-development

Here's one example, and there are lots out there if you looked.

But anyway... Everyone parents differently and as long as the kid is loved, safe and happy who cares really

jlm29

GreeBo wrote: »

Actually it's based on quite a lot of research, do you have any that promotes sharing a bed with your kids?
It's love to read it.

There are many many studies to show that it’s perfectly fine to bed share under certain conditions. I can’t link them on my phone, but a quick internet search reveals a lot. It’s dragging the thread off topic though, sorry op, I won’t post again

s4uv3

What the hell is wrong with you all leaving your babies cry alone in their beds? They're babies, they need to be next to their caregivers. They're hardwired to need your affection and closeness.

And before you jump down my throat, I too am a seriously sleep-deprived, near total breakdown mum of a 2 and 1 year old. But I won't sacrifice their security and feeling loved for my own sleep

Hoboo

OP I appreciate you love the outlet work gives you from your family, but you're in an enviable position of being able to spend time with your kids when they are still kids and be fine financially. Keep going you won't have a family by the sounds of it. Guys tend to fire warning shots rather than speak openly, your husband has highlighted the issue, his suggestion to solve it is to become a full-time mum, time for you to provide a workable alternative if that's not for you. Warning shots (cries for help) ignored often lead to drastic results, ie, "I don't know why he left, I just don't get it".

scarepanda

s4uv3 wrote:

What the hell is wrong with you all leaving your babies cry alone in their beds? They're babies, they need to be next to their caregivers. They're hardwired to need your affection and closeness.

Who said anything about leaving babies cry alone? Your being a bit dramatic there. I can tell you my eldest is the most secure confident of girls and she was moved into her own room at 7 weeks old. Everyone, but primarily her slept better once she was moved. My second nursed more during the night for a long time and was only moved into her own room just before she turned 7 months but she's now sleeping far better since she was moved. I'm getting more sleep and everyone benefits from that. Neither of them were left cry on their own in their cots.

Hoboo wrote:

OP I appreciate you love the outlet work gives you from your family, but you're in an enviable position of being able to spend time with your kids when they are still kids and be fine financially. Keep going you won't have a family by the sounds of it. Guys tend to fire warning shots rather than speak openly, your husband has highlighted the issue, his suggestion to solve it is to become a full-time mum, time for you to provide a workable alternative if that's not for you. Warning shots (cries for help) ignored often lead to drastic results, ie, "I don't know why he left, I just don't get it".

I'm a stay at home parent, and I love it. I love being able to be with my kids everyday. But it's not all sunshine and rainbows! It sounds to me that the op is working for her own sanity rather than for financial gain. If that's the case then her giving up work would be the worst thing for her to do both for herself and her family. She wouldn't have the outlet she needs, she would probably feel more stressed and trapped by being stuck at home and her day being a bit like groundhog day, and possibly most importantly her husband will still need to pick up the slack in the evening once he gets home (and probably help in the mornings next year then the eldest will be elegible for ECCE preschool years). It's sounds to me he has a notion that her being a stay at home mother will solve all his issues about trying to juggle living his life and being a father by transferring all the caregiving to her.

What they need to do is sit down and have an open and honest conversation about the way they are both feeling and come up with a plan of action where they both compromise to make things work, put in a plan to prep for the morning as much as it possible, can either of them change their start times in the morning? Stuff like that. The mornings are only going to get harder once school starts regardless of whether she quits her job or not

Anne_cordelia

s4uv3 wrote: »

What the hell is wrong with you all leaving your babies cry alone in their beds? They're babies, they need to be next to their caregivers. They're hardwired to need your affection and closeness.

And before you jump down my throat, I too am a seriously sleep-deprived, near total breakdown mum of a 2 and 1 year old. But I won't sacrifice their security and feeling loved for my own sleep

THIS! A thousand times. Solidarity.

Calhoun

scarepanda wrote: »

Who said anything about leaving babies cry alone? Your being a bit dramatic there. I can tell you my eldest is the most secure confident of girls and she was moved into her own room at 7 weeks old. Everyone, but primarily her slept better once she was moved. My second nursed more during the night for a long time and was only moved into her own room just before she turned 7 months but she's now sleeping far better since she was moved. I'm getting more sleep and everyone benefits from that. Neither of them were left cry on their own in their cots.



I'm a stay at home parent, and I love it. I love being able to be with my kids everyday. But it's not all sunshine and rainbows! It sounds to me that the op is working for her own sanity rather than for financial gain. If that's the case then her giving up work would be the worst thing for her to do both for herself and her family. She wouldn't have the outlet she needs, she would probably feel more stressed and trapped by being stuck at home and her day being a bit like groundhog day, and possibly most importantly her husband will still need to pick up the slack in the evening once he gets home (and probably help in the mornings next year then the eldest will be elegible for ECCE preschool years). It's sounds to me he has a notion that her being a stay at home mother will solve all his issues about trying to juggle living his life and being a father by transferring all the caregiving to her.

What they need to do is sit down and have an open and honest conversation about the way they are both feeling and come up with a plan of action where they both compromise to make things work, put in a plan to prep for the morning as much as it possible, can either of them change their start times in the morning? Stuff like that. The mornings are only going to get harder once school starts regardless of whether she quits her job or not

Agreed, i don't believe i read anything that would imply babies should be left cry on their own. More that a bed time routine was needed and a bed for the child.

In our case we have a side-car type of cot that sticks to the side of the bed. Its the best of both worlds keeps her close but she also has her own space. We are getting close to moving her into a cot but she will probably stay in the room for another year or so. We are working on a routine to get her down each night.

I also 100% agree with you on the work issue, if the OP is in a position where she is trapped to suit the husband that is not a fair solution. I would actually be one of the first to say it was fairly misogynistic view of the world to have the issue they are having without thinking how they can solve it together.

I believe all roads in this case lead back to the bed time routine, when everyone is well rested and has clear heads then things become allot easier.

fits

OP. I think everyone knows where I am about sleep issues so I won’t go there again. I just want to say it’s good that your husband has told you he is struggling. His solution is flawed - I think it’s really good to be out at work. Hopefully you can figure something out together. My boys are turning three now and the nights are much much less disturbed than they were a year ago so there is a light at the end of the tunnel fast approaching. Hang in there and do whatever works for you without stressing the kids too much. Separate beds aren’t a bad idea if it means someone is getting sleep.

dreamstar

Hoboo wrote: »

OP I appreciate you love the outlet work gives you from your family, but you're in an enviable position of being able to spend time with your kids when they are still kids and be fine financially. Keep going you won't have a family by the sounds of it. Guys tend to fire warning shots rather than speak openly, your husband has highlighted the issue, his suggestion to solve it is to become a full-time mum, time for you to provide a workable alternative if that's not for you. Warning shots (cries for help) ignored often lead to drastic results, ie, "I don't know why he left, I just don't get it".

I never said that we would be fine financially. This is something I have said to my husband. I was on unpaid leave during my maternity and we struggled. Actually we are still paying back bills for that unpaid period. He seems to think that if I gave up work we would be entitled to FIS payments. Even if we are I doubt it would be much.

I also cherish every single day with my kids and I think me going back 3 days a week was perfect as they were with me for 4 days a week and they are settled with a lovely childminder the other 3 days. This has been great for them socially too as there are other kids there.
So there are many pluses for me to be working - it's not just for selfish reasons. Although having gone through PND I have learned that the whole family benefits from me being ok.

I am also aware that me and my husband do need to sit down together and sort this out in a way that helps us both. But your post makes it sound like I am the one who needs to do all the compromise or I won't have a family. That's hardly a workable solution.

lazygal

Do not quit your job. Just do not do it. There is a significant cost financially to not working.

I work three days and I am a better parent for it. I would be really angry if my husband put so little value on my work as to suggest I would be better off being at home. I don't need to work financially right now, but I refuse to put myself in a position where I'm completely financially dependent on my husband and what he is able to or wants to earn.

I completely understand the sleep issue. I have a 14 month old and I am like a zombie sometimes. I'm breastfeeding so night time wakes are ok, I feed him and put him back down but it's still broken sleep. I'd be even more down in myself if I thought that all I had in my day was children and school runs and home life though.

Grumpypants

dreamstar wrote: »

I never said that we would be fine financially. This is something I have said to my husband. I was on unpaid leave during my maternity and we struggled. Actually we are still paying back bills for that unpaid period. He seems to think that if I gave up work we would be entitled to FIS payments. Even if we are I doubt it would be much.

I also cherish every single day with my kids and I think me going back 3 days a week was perfect as they were with me for 4 days a week and they are settled with a lovely childminder the other 3 days. This has been great for them socially too as there are other kids there.
So there are many pluses for me to be working - it's not just for selfish reasons. Although having gone through PND I have learned that the whole family benefits from me being ok.

I am also aware that me and my husband do need to sit down together and sort this out in a way that helps us both. But your post makes it sound like I am the one who needs to do all the compromise or I won't have a family. That's hardly a workable solution.

In a similar enough place OP. The lack of sleep is a killer. We tried all the "sleep rules" for the first one and it nearly killed us. We made the smart move on the second and done one night on, one night off. On the night off you get to go to the spare room and get a decent sleep. You can get through a bad nights sleep if you know you are going to get a full 7-8 hours the next night.

If you need to sleep in with the baby, just do it. If the two-year-old wants to sleep with dad, just do it.

Have you factored in that your husband could be suffering from PND too? It impacts about 10% of dads and is much more likely if their partner has also suffered with it. It's horrible for mum's but there is support. But imagine for Dads suffering with it when no one thinks it exists and you just get labelled a grump old B, even though you are running yourself into the ground to keep your family afloat.

You are working for 3 days because it is good for you, then you have 4 days off because it is good for you and the kids. You get time to regroup and get some quality time with the kids. Your husband is going at 100% for 5 days, running on empty and prob feels like he only sees the kids when he is either rushing out the door or rushing them to bed.

Have a look and see if there is something that can be done that is good for the dad?

Loveinapril

lazygal wrote: »

Do not quit your job. Just do not do it. There is a significant cost financially to not working.

I work three days and I am a better parent for it. I would be really angry if my husband put so little value on my work as to suggest I would be better off being at home. I don't need to work financially right now, but I refuse to put myself in a position where I'm completely financially dependent on my husband and what he is able to or wants to earn.

I completely understand the sleep issue. I have a 14 month old and I am like a zombie sometimes. I'm breastfeeding so night time wakes are ok, I feed him and put him back down but it's still broken sleep. I'd be even more down in myself if I thought that all I had in my day was children and school runs and home life though.

This x100.

OP, if you feel like a 3 day working week is what's best for you (therefore best for the family) then this should be as concrete as your husband's job and you look at OTHER factors that can help the running week.

What way are you cosleeping? Could you do one night on/ one night off where you alternate who sleeps in the spare room/ couch? At least one of you would be rested and the person who had a crappy night has a good sleep to look forward to that night.

I am on maternity leave at the minute and definitely have days where things are chaotic. But I come together with my husband to plan how to make the next day easier. Having kids can be a bit mental at times, sometimes you just need to plan for that and get through to the next day. Your husband has been really honest in opening up on his feelings but he has kids, there is an element of him needing to suck it up. Even if you were at home full time he would still need to be doing some level of parenting!

HildaOgdenx

Loveinapril wrote: »

This x100.

OP, if you feel like a 3 day working week is what's best for you (therefore best for the family) then this should be as concrete as your husband's job and you look at OTHER factors that can help the running week. I am on maternity leave at the minute and definitely have days where things are chaotic. But I come together with my husband to plan how to make the next day easier. Having kids can be a bit mental at times, sometimes you just need to plan for that and get through to the next day. Your husband has been really honest in opening up on his feelings but he has kids, there is an element of him needing to suck it up. Even if you were at home full time he would still need to be doing some level of parenting!

+1.
Does he think if you were at home full time that would 'absolve' him from all the grunt work?

Absolutely do keep working. It's important from lots of angles, as you have mentioned and also for the future. I know it's not much consolation right now, but this phase won't last forever. Do whatever works best all around, in relation to sleeping arrangements.

shesty

If you were at home, it would not change the sleeping situation OP.
Don't make excuses for yourself wanting to work.I understand too, I love my kids but my four day work week keeps me sane....and as my kids get a bit bigger and their lives expand, I can see so easily how quickly they would all be off going to school everyday and I would be sitting wondering what I was supposed to do.
You definitely need to have a conversation with him, try and decide how to make things work better.

dreamstar

HildaOgdenx wrote: »

+1.
Does he think if you were at home full time that would 'absolve' him from all the grunt work?

Yeah I think this is exactly what he thinks.
But we've had a good chat about it and we've come up with some fair changes that will help. We've got in this awful habit of getting a bit tit for tat which we need to stop. I think we're just in a difficult phase with the kids at the minute but like everyone said - it will pass.

Calhoun

dreamstar wrote: »

Yeah I think this is exactly what he thinks.
But we've had a good chat about it and we've come up with some fair changes that will help. We've got in this awful habit of getting a bit tit for tat which we need to stop. I think we're just in a difficult phase with the kids at the minute but like everyone said - it will pass.

Very glad you are both working through it, one last thing if this does come back up. We don't live during the times where you could get a job and have it for life. You don't know what will happen 12 months from now and allot of larger companies can let staff go fairly fast.

So you working and keeping your options open is not only for your own mental health but also the well being of your family, including himself as it means you guys have a safety net so to speak.

evil_seed

If he's stressed out, it might not just be the kids. You guys need to have an open and frank conversation about love, life and work.

Mark Hamill

GreeBo wrote: »

Co-sleeping doesnt work for anyone, is bad for kids and every childcare and healthcare body in the world advises against it.

My fiance and I bed-shared with our daughter until about 18 months with zero problems. Night feeds were done in bed, with my fiance on her side so she could fall back asleep quickly. We had a duvet kept low on the bed and separate blankets for each of us so my daughter wouldn't get covered during the night.

At 18 months I put my daughter to sleep in her own bed - 3 or 4 nights of waiting beside her in the dark on the bed until she slept (~ 10 mins), then a night waiting beside the bed until she slept (5-10 mins), then putting her to bed with a story turning off the light when she was settled and leaving the room before she had fallen asleep. She is nearly 3 now and still sleeps every night from about 7.30pm-7.30am (at least).

I know we were lucky in a lot of respects (we are all small people, at first in a double bed and then a king size so plenty of space, not to mention that we pretty much don't move while we sleep), but we had zero issues and our daughter has no sleep issues (she stays with my sisters or parents probably about once a month with no issues either).


At OP:
You say you had resorted to cosleeping with your one year old and your two year old ends up in your bed (presumably with your husband). Are the both of you still not getting enough sleep doing that? Do you spend a lot of night-time fighting them and trying to get them to sleep alone until eventually giving up exhausted? Have you tried not fighting them and just sleeping with them?

The Bishop Basher

GreeBo wrote: »

Co-sleeping doesnt work for anyone, is bad for kids and every childcare and healthcare body in the world advises against it.

That’s simply untrue.

It worked really well for us and ours are now 16 and 21.

They both slept in the bed with us for as long as they wanted and moved into their own rooms once they were ready which was about 3 for both of them.

I can recall many stresses from those early years when we were young, broke and hadn’t a clue about anything but sleepless nights weren’t one of them thanks to a very large bed and an agreement that we’d keep the kids with us so we could all get a nights sleep.

We didn’t know the term “cosleeping” or anything else at the time. It was just something we did to make all our lives easier.

And it did.